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Old 2004-10-15, 21:44   Link #1
AG3
Inactive ex-WoW addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Trondheim, Norway
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New system being implemented by G-Collections; V-Mate

In an effort to stifle piracy and lower sale prices, G-Collections is implementing a system called Virtual Mate with their games, starting with Minna de Nyan Nyan. This system requires that the games be registred, and that you log on to the system every time you want to play (not for games before this, of course).

Needless to say, the system isn't welcomed with open arms by a lot of people. Head over to Peach Princess or the G-Collections BBS if you want to see a whining orchestra almost the magnitude of the one you'll see here if Naruto were to be announced licensed tomorrow. Seriously, I've never seen a bigger bunch of "adult" crybabies in my whole life.

As for my opinion the system, I'll reserve it until I've tried it myself. I don't want to judge beforehand.
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Old 2004-10-15, 22:01   Link #2
DarkCntry
Blue Dawn
 
 
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Well, considering I will put down a wager that maybe 5% of the posters at both places have legitimately purchased an ero title from either.

Personally, I cannot blame them...with a market already virtually non-existant it's hard for either place to finally lower their prices to a more acceptable amount and still be able to deal with the rampant piracy.

Personally, I'll admit that I downloaded a few games from G-C to test them...I have a very strict taste when it comes to ero titles I like and I cannot get the opportunity often to plop down the $60 a game for a title that just contains random rape sequences. For my opinion, there's no-harm-no-foul kinda thing there, they do not gain money from my purchase or lose it from me 'pirating' for maybe 5min. This has allowed me to actually purchase other titles, like Kana ~Imouto~, Heart de Roommate, and Crescendo with the money that I did save from seeing that these titles aren't what I want.

Relying on reviews isn't a good way to determine if I like the game because reviews for most titles are almost non-existant...can't download a demo if there isn't one created, so that takes out that equation..only left with two options, buying the title and never playing it and thus losing money to purchase one that I will like, or doing a trial basis...I choose the trial basis.

Now, when it comes to "V-mate", I support it even though it would curtail my trial uses...because in the long run it should lower prices and allow me to get away with maybe getting a game that I wouldn't like and still having the opportunity to purchase one that I would. Sadly, the market is too saturatied with the titles that I don't like and dwarfing the ones I do :P

Can't call many of them adults, because like the legitimate buyers percentage it probably is the same with ages :P However, I fully agree with your take on it AG3.
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Old 2004-10-15, 22:01   Link #3
CalamitiesEnd
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What happens to people that don't have internet? Or are secretly cheating on there wives / girlfriends and have to play away from the internet connection in the attic?
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Old 2004-10-15, 22:10   Link #4
AG3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CalamitiesEnd
What happens to people that don't have internet? Or are secretly cheating on there wives / girlfriends and have to play away from the internet connection in the attic?
Out of luck, it seems, at least so far. Maybe they were going to implement support off-liners later on, but all this is just the initial reactions after the announcement. I've never seen the word "betrayed" so many times in one day before. I mean, cripes, most full-time pirates seem to be taking it better than most of the regular customers.

Maybe because they know there will probably be less official way of circumventing all this sooner or later anyway. I admire G-Collections' effort, but like all copy protections, it's not perfect.
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Old 2004-10-20, 15:49   Link #5
DryMaltExtract
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It will be cracked...things like this have come up before, whether it is the requirement to connect to the internet or own a dongle it's always broken. Besides, I doubt a bunch of lousy H-Game creators could create good copy protection.
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Old 2004-10-20, 15:59   Link #6
TronDD
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These kind of things tick me off. But I don't blame G-Collections. I blame the jerks that steal the games.

I see it having to ask permission to play a game I've purchased and own. The money I spent should let me play it without them having to say so each time. I hate having to jump through any kind of hoop to play a game I've legally aquired. Those stealing it are gonna crack it anyway and they won't have to jump through the hoops. Only the honest ones will.
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Old 2004-10-20, 17:45   Link #7
AG3
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Well, one of the major issues people had with this system has been resolved: What happens if G-Collections someday have to fold. It took them quite a while, but G-Collections has finally made a statement where they resolve it.

Apparently, 1 year after the game's release, they offer a patch that removes the need for logging on to the V-Mate system, and it also removes the hardware check. In Japan, (some?) companies using the system release patches 2 years after, at least according to what the PP message board admin said.
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Old 2004-10-20, 18:12   Link #8
Kyuven
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more power to em
they're probably thinking: "If it'll get us even a FEW more sales, it'll be worth it"
considering their profits are probably piddling at best, and they'll be lowering prices anyway, i don't see a problem
besides, it'll give those hackers something to do between coming up with new ways to piss off people
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Old 2004-10-20, 18:48   Link #9
AG3
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Seems like G-Collections changed their statement *sigh*. NOW they are saying that the patch is released one year after the end of the sale of a particular title. And they of course apologize for the confusion caused.

I think a lot of people preferred their first statement...
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Old 2004-10-20, 19:10   Link #10
TronDD
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That doesn't help if they fold. Even if it was a year after release of the game. You think a company that didn't make any profits and is laying everyone off in a week will put out a patch?
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Old 2004-11-02, 06:12   Link #11
Italicus
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Play it with V-Mate and be happy in the hell you granted yourself, AG3. :fingers:

I'm glad because G-Coll used this V-mate. Because i've realized how poor translated their games are.

Why complaining about a naked Susano-o when you can admire Amaterasu Omi-i Kami in her full splendor?
The hell with Susano-o, long live Amaterasu!!!


Nanta assutaredo! :fingers: :fingers: :fingers:
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Old 2004-11-02, 12:22   Link #12
AG3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
Play it with V-Mate and be happy in the hell you granted yourself, AG3. :fingers:

I'm glad because G-Coll used this V-mate. Because i've realized how poor translated their games are.

Why complaining about a naked Susano-o when you can admire Amaterasu Omi-i Kami in her full splendor?
The hell with Susano-o, long live Amaterasu!!!


Nanta assutaredo! :fingers: :fingers: :fingers:
Well, well, look who's here.

About V-Mate, I won't be trying it anytime soon. My economy is rather strict due to what I had to pay to attend school, so I have to conserve money until April next year (more school money, plus ADSL bill). In addition to that, I doubt I'll buy Minna de Nyan Nyan, simply because the artwork is rather poor, and the gameplay looks pretty shallow.

But when it comes to the V-Mate system, it doesn't bother me at all. I played FFXI for a few months, and I have a broadband, so V-Mate is no inconvinience for me at all. Just because it's "hell" for you doesn't mean it's the same for everyone.

I doubt G-Collections' games will get any better or worse by using V-Mate, so I don't see the big deal about it. Anyway, there's a 25 page thread about it on the Peach Princess boards, and we both know our respective views on the case, so please try to avoid the flaming you saturated the PP boards with.
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Last edited by AG3; 2004-11-02 at 17:31. Reason: Removed a redundant "Anyway". Use far too many of those at times...
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Old 2004-11-02, 23:54   Link #13
Italicus
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Flaming? Me flaming?

Nobody has seen me when i'm really flaming yet.... that on PP boards was just an appetizer. Anyway, my thoughts on V-Mate haven't change at all.

Hentai games' market is a niche. Crack the niche, and there's no market. IMHO, they sealed their fate, and i doubt anyone will buy Minna de nyan nyan just to try it - V-Mate, i mean.

They did this to stop piracy? Weeellllll, wrong!

Non V-mated titles had a queue on illegal rounds of 30 people or so, before this V-Mate thing. Now, the queue is of 300 people or so....
And if before many of them were russians and koreans, now they are mainly europeans...
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Old 2004-11-03, 01:36   Link #14
AG3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
Flaming? Me flaming?

Nobody has seen me when i'm really flaming yet.... that on PP boards was just an appetizer.
I think Lamuness doesn't agree with you there, but whatever...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
i doubt anyone will buy Minna de nyan nyan just to try it - V-Mate, i mean.
I don't think V-Mate is supposed to be a selling point for G-Collections games, but I think making it just that is the only way to have V-Mate accepted, at least until people can see that it's not so bad as they think it is (unless it is, of course). The $10 price cut on their products weren't enough, so G-Collections should try to offer bonus content that makes using the V-Mate system desireable. Of course, that won't help people who don't have access to internet connections at home (like you), but then again, they weren't the largest group of vocal protesters either.
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Old 2004-11-03, 09:31   Link #15
Italicus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AG3
I think Lamuness doesn't agree with you there, but whatever...

I don't think V-Mate is supposed to be a selling point for G-Collections games, but I think making it just that is the only way to have V-Mate accepted, at least until people can see that it's not so bad as they think it is (unless it is, of course). The $10 price cut on their products weren't enough, so G-Collections should try to offer bonus content that makes using the V-Mate system desireable. Of course, that won't help people who don't have access to internet connections at home (like you), but then again, they weren't the largest group of vocal protesters either.
Everyone has his own level to perceive whatever.... i can assure my level to flame someone is far higher than Lamuness' one.

Anyway, since he asked so , i obey.

After all PP is not G-Coll. At last, unlike G-Coll, they answered people.
But believe me underground is going fair worse then in surface.

Listen, kid, i'm into commerce since i was 15 years old. My experience came directly from the field. The first way to get wipped out from the market is to displease customers. They displeased a lot ( sixty or so ) according to the boards. Add to this number 45 i convinced ot to buy and multiply by 40 US dollars.
Nani desu ka And since when forcing someone to do something he displease is a good way to make hin accept something? How naive of you, LOL!!!!!!!!

And please remeber not everyone is willing to be monitored when starting a b-game. Enjoy yourself, LOL!!!!!!!!!
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Old 2004-11-03, 12:30   Link #16
AG3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
Listen, kid[...]
Kid? How old are you, 70?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
And please remeber not everyone is willing to be monitored when starting a b-game. Enjoy yourself, LOL!!!!!!!!!
I seriously doubt G-Collections care to record when each and every person is playing their games, if they even have access to that info (as V-Mate is third-party software) or the manpower to do so. They have better things to do with their time, and time/date you are playing your games is fairly useless information. What good would that info do? You don't seriously think G-Collections would sell it, do you? Or that anyone on this whole planet would find such info useful or valuable to their business? That's paranoia, if you ask me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
My experience came directly from the field. The first way to get wipped out from the market is to displease customers.
You don't need to be a business major to know that. But while displeasing your customers is one way to go out of business, letting your products get distributed for free while you don't get a cent from them is another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
And since when forcing someone to do something he displease is a good way to make hin accept something?
You missed my point. What I said was that if G-Collections are going to use the V-Mate system, they have to change it. They have to make it something more than just product verification, something that might make people WANT to use it. Sure, they can dislike the whole "connecting to play" thing, but if the bonus you get with it is good enough, it will be more accepted, because you have something to gain from it. I hate paying taxes, but having free schools, hospitals, a good social security system etc. makes up for that.

Now, if you could please discuss the issue without calling me things like "kid", "naive" and constantly laughing out loud while you do it, I would appreciate it. If you're going to pretend you're the adult one here, try to act like it.
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Old 2004-11-03, 14:06   Link #17
DarkCntry
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But calling people names is essential to debates....everyone does it...

As it stands, VM is an experimental thing...people that use it get priority support and patches and extra information, it's that simple. G-C has also stated that after a couple months there will be a patch to option VM's requirement for internet access to play.

If they do have access to date/time information, and that's a big if, it would only be useful to see how many people are on the 0-day scene with it and then it won't do much except tell them how many people are pirating the software.
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Old 2004-11-04, 10:44   Link #18
Italicus
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@ AG3

a) I'm old enough to call you that way.

b) It's not paranoia, since everything that run on the Net can be tracked, no matter how protected it is. How do you think i track pirates IPs?

c) That's the point. They didn't ask anythiong to their customers, thinking to them as their personal sheeps' herd. And you wonder why that fuss came out? Hell, they could have found a less invasive method to dether pirates from copying their games, and instead they preferred to harrass their customers!

d) Read the thread on PP forum better, AG3. From what i've understood all you can get from that V_Mate additional service is a bunch of spam, nothing more nothing less. If this is the additional service....
Anyway, i want to play it OFFLINE. They care about their customers? Why don't they care about the OFFLINE players, huh?

@ DarkCntry

Still no news about that patch, and i seriously doubt we'll ever get it. For me, this is only a bait to make rumors die down. Once V-Mate is settled, hasta luego a los patches!!!!!!!!
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Old 2004-11-04, 14:44   Link #19
zalas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Italicus
c) That's the point. They didn't ask anythiong to their customers, thinking to them as their personal sheeps' herd. And you wonder why that fuss came out? Hell, they could have found a less invasive method to dether pirates from copying their games, and instead they preferred to harrass their customers!
Using an online verification system is harassment? O_o;; It might be annoying to use but harassment?? I'd hardly consider Steam, dongles and network license servers to be harassment...
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Old 2004-11-04, 16:19   Link #20
Italicus
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Unhappy

Quote:
Originally Posted by zalas
Using an online verification system is harassment? O_o;; It might be annoying to use but harassment?? I'd hardly consider Steam, dongles and network license servers to be harassment...
If you usually play on a disconnected laptop, then yes it's an harrassment to your rights to play your legit purchased game in the form you prefer. They said "... we need a fair distribution...", but this doesn't seem fair to me at all.
To be honest, my main concern is not for LMMW, it is for
Hitomi....

Last edited by Italicus; 2004-11-04 at 17:22.
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