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Old 2010-09-04, 16:00   Link #4041
Archon_Wing
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post
I'm having a really hard time dealing with the Zealot Rush as a Zerg player, it just seems kinda fast-foward and the Zerg have almost no time to develop... I just barely got lucky in this match... Is there any tips for Zerg on Zealot Rush?

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/7...delta-quadrant
Make a queen asap after pool, more creep tumors-- you probably want an extra queen solely for tumors and air defense, expand after attack, and pick a better place to expand.
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Old 2010-09-04, 16:47   Link #4042
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Personally I'm having problems with sentry/zealots/stalkers pushes. I kind of can contain it, but im forced to stay on my base and stay on the choke behind some defenses without a chance to expand. And eventually I end up losing when he brings some colossus's and it's gg for me. D: I should try some infestors with mind control but I don't see that working but once in a while. Is there any reliable strat against those pushes.
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Old 2010-09-04, 17:33   Link #4043
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
Make a queen asap after pool, more creep tumors-- you probably want an extra queen solely for tumors and air defense, expand after attack, and pick a better place to expand.
Umm... Did you watch the replay It was true the place I picked for expansion may seem odd, but it would have been destroyed easily if I picked the expansion near my base.
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Last edited by Hooves; 2010-09-04 at 18:10.
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:00   Link #4044
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post

Umm... Did you watch the replay It was true the place I picked for expansion may seem odd, but it would have been destroyed easily if I picked the expansion near my base.
I did. My point is that you could have expanded after you fought off his rush-- in any case your expansion was really late even considering his aggression and you could have lost if he wasn't so deadset on finishing the game The reason why you had trouble is because your queen was so late and you weren't getting enough larva to make units. I'd hold back on making any crawlers until you get queens and some zerglings.

edit: Plus isn't there an expansion behind your base?
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:17   Link #4045
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
I did. My point is that you could have expanded after you fought off his rush-- in any case your expansion was really late even considering his aggression and you could have lost if he wasn't so deadset on finishing the game The reason why you had trouble is because your queen was so late and you weren't getting enough larva to make units. I'd hold back on making any crawlers until you get queens and some zerglings.

edit: Plus isn't there an expansion behind your base?
Well I thought you dint since you involved the "air defense"

Also, the Stalker/Sentry/Zealot combination can be dealt with mass Zerglings right?
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:23   Link #4046
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You'll need some roaches to deal with zealots and lings to deal with stalkers; mass zerglings tend to suck vs ... like everything. It's almost inevitable you'll need to secure an expo and build many many crawlers to handle it. But later on you definitely will need hydralisks to handle bigger numbers.
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:30   Link #4047
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I know I'll get a bad rep in regard to my Banshee Tactic somewhere down the line....




So I ask again, Banshee Rush, fair game or cheese ?
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:30   Link #4048
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
You'll need some roaches to deal with zealots and lings to deal with stalkers; mass zerglings tend to suck vs ... like everything. It's almost inevitable you'll need to secure an expo and build many many crawlers to handle it. But later on you definitely will need hydralisks to handle bigger numbers.
I thought mass Roaches would be able to deal with this combination, but in a recent match, where random picked Zerg once again. I was wrong... The mass Roaches got slaughtered by the Protoss mix...

Quote:
Originally Posted by MakubeX2 View Post
I know I'll get a bad rep in regard to my Banshee Tactic somewhere down the line....




So I ask again, Banshee Rush, fair game or cheese ?
Fair Game.. All you need to do is get detectors, and scout it... The only way people call it cheese is if they dint bother to scout it..
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:30   Link #4049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
Somehow Archon and I managed to win this epic 2v2 game. It was... a little ridiculous.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/7...light-fortress

Lesson of the day. Mass marines > mass stalkers any day.
You guys should have said SPARTAAAAAA! when massing that marine rush.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MakubeX2 View Post
I know I'll get a bad rep in regard to my Banshee Tactic somewhere down the line....




So I ask again, Banshee Rush, fair game or cheese ?
You got a replay?
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:34   Link #4050
MakubeX2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
You got a replay?
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/7...istering-sands
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:38   Link #4051
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MakubeX2 View Post

So I ask again, Banshee Rush, fair game or cheese ?
Banshee rushing is really just punishing the enemy for being negligent and/or greedy. Protoss really shouldn't lose to it, and a terran would have to be retarded or asleep to lose to it. I guess it's bit harder for zerg to find out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post
I thought mass Roaches would be able to deal with this combination, but in a recent match, where random picked Zerg once again. I was wrong... The mass Roaches got slaughtered by the Protoss mix...
Stalkers are strong vs roaches due to their higher range and bonus dmg vs armored.
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:40   Link #4052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MakubeX2 View Post
Well.. He did see a Banshee... Also could have built atleast some Spore Crawlers to detect them...

I mean.. He could have built Spore Crawlers straight away right? Instead of slowly building up the Hydralisk Den and slowly pump Hydras out.
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Last edited by Hooves; 2010-09-04 at 18:53.
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Old 2010-09-04, 18:46   Link #4053
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Yep, it's supposed to be

1.) See starport
2.) Build another queen and evo chamber
3.) Build 2 spores
4.) ???
5.) Profit

Instead it was
1.) Not see Starport
2.) Build roaches to counter air
3.)Fail
4.)???
5.) Insult the opponent.
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Old 2010-09-04, 19:01   Link #4054
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
Yep, it's supposed to be

1.) See starport
2.) Build another queen and evo chamber
3.) Build 2 spores
4.) ???
5.) Profit

Instead it was
1.) Not see Starport
2.) Build roaches to counter air
3.)Fail
4.)???
5.) Insult the opponent.
Well he did see the Starport Or was he looking somewhere else at that time?

Also dont you all think Void Rays need some kind of nerf? I mean every single Protoss player always picks Void Rays in many situations, and Void Rays basically pay off.
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Old 2010-09-04, 19:06   Link #4055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post
Well he did see the Starport Or was he looking somewhere else at that time?

Also dont you all think Void Rays need some kind of nerf? I mean every single Protoss player always picks Void Rays in many situations, and Void Rays basically pay off.
He might have seen it, but he certainly didn't act like it.

It's not a bad idea imo to get an evo chamber quicker as it's not a very expensive building and you can upgrade out of it too.

Void rays are fine. If they were nerfed, Protoss could never do shit against Brood lords (or battlecruisers for that matter). Yes they are powerful but they are also very expensive and slow (unless you get the spd upgrade which is also pretty expensive)
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Old 2010-09-04, 19:22   Link #4056
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hooves View Post
Well he did see the Starport Or was he looking somewhere else at that time?

Also dont you all think Void Rays need some kind of nerf? I mean every single Protoss player always picks Void Rays in many situations, and Void Rays basically pay off.
Check the replay. He did after rushing his lings in - the map was panned right over Mak's base.

I guess it was getting greedy. Must remember about this.

Funny that he built roaches to counter air. First time SC2 Zerg player?
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Old 2010-09-04, 19:29   Link #4057
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At a certain point it is no longer a rush as it is countering your enemy's army. Which happened to have no anti air or detection
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Old 2010-09-04, 21:22   Link #4058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archon_Wing View Post
At a certain point it is no longer a rush as it is countering your enemy's army. Which happened to have no anti air or detection
So your saying a rush is something a person does by quickly building units and sending them to the enemies' base without even knowing what they are building.

If they look at the enemies' army they are mostly finding a counter to it, not becoming a rush?
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Old 2010-09-04, 22:04   Link #4059
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^ A rush is something you do asap to catch your opponent off-guard in the early game. I'd personally say the term rushes are only valid within the first 10 minute of the game or so. If you tech straight to banshee's send them over to your opponent asap with cloak, that would be a rush. But if halfway during the game, you notice all your opponent has is just ultras so you plot down a few extra techlabbed starports and pump them banshees, that's countering your opponent.

Bancheese is fair-game. It's apart of the game and isn't totally game-breaking. There are ways to deal with it, people are just sore losers when they die to something gay
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Old 2010-09-04, 23:17   Link #4060
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Today I learned that going 8-pool and making 1 or 2 pairs of zerglings can make your opponent flip out and get all defensive while you expand without distractions.
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