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Old 2004-10-12, 13:33   Link #1
Shift_
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Gundam X: ending "What is a newtype?" *spoilers*

So I just finished watching Gundam X, there are a few questions that bother me though, that wern't explained clearly.

What exactly is a 'newtype?' DOME stated that newtypes didn't exist and they are an illusion...but how does that explain the 'special powers' that people like tiffa have? Are they just mutants? Because their powers arn't illusions...and the flash system that controls bit-suits isn't one either...

Then the frost brother's only sibliing telepathy...that came from a mutation???

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Old 2004-10-12, 13:41   Link #2
Shouta
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Wish I had my vhs tapes so I can watch the ending again (and the series in general). It was confusing anyway you cut it.
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Old 2004-10-12, 13:47   Link #3
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it was a good series til the end...the end was really REALLY rushed, I mean they compressed like an entire ending in 2 eps...

I would of expected GX to be atleast 45 eps...and work by expanding on things :/
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Old 2004-10-12, 13:58   Link #4
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Originally Posted by Shift_
it was a good series til the end...the end was really REALLY rushed, I mean they compressed like an entire ending in 2 eps...

I would of expected GX to be atleast 45 eps...and work by expanding on things :/
It was actually cancelled near the end of the show. It origionally had like 50ish epsiodes planned (like any other gundam series that spans about a year).
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Old 2004-10-12, 14:12   Link #5
Shift_
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rias
It was actually cancelled near the end of the show. It origionally had like 50ish epsiodes planned (like any other gundam series that spans about a year).
That's what happened :/ Got bad ratings then :/

It wasn't a bad series, it had alot of thinking...but it's still good...
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Old 2004-10-13, 06:25   Link #6
brightman
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OK... In order to understand what DOME means, you need to understand what Newtypes are believed to be...

In UC, and in the AW universe, Newtypes are people who supposedly are either 1) the next step in human evolution, 2) superior humans, 3) religious icons, etc.

And in many ways Tomino in his early UC shows relied a bit too much on the idea of Newtypes being the future of mankind, which is something that he later appeared to changed his mind on.

So the staff of X, in order to put the "final say" in this matter, used DOME as a way of saying, "Tomino was wrong, there are no such thing as the next step of evolution or superior beings, so there are no Newtypes... These psychic mutants are just freaks of nature."


As for X, right, poor model sales and not very good public reception led to sponsors withdrawing, the show being moved to 6 AM Saturdays after Ep 26, and the show being cut short 10 episodes...
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Old 2004-10-13, 06:40   Link #7
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I just finished watching this thru hero and I think it may be my 2nd favorite gundam series after Zeta. Shame it gets ragged on.

and yea it seemed like they were trying to say Newtypes aren't Gods, they aren't the saviors of humanity. All spaceoids aren't going to turn into Newtypes, it's not the next evolutionary step.

They are just rare mutants, one in a million or more humans who's numbers aren't going to increase and make up the majority of the human population.

I liked it. I hate it when everything in the UC got to be Newtypes revered.

BTW, I do have another ending question. How did the Frost brothers survive? Is there a manga that covers the events that would have taken place in the 10 cancelled episodes?

I know there's to be a new AW manga starting in December taking place 8 years after Gundam X... Which I don't really care for, I'd rather the AW universe get their happy ending after all their devestation.
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Old 2004-10-13, 06:51   Link #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyByNite
BTW, I do have another ending question. How did the Frost brothers survive? Is there a manga that covers the events that would have taken place in the 10 cancelled episodes?
Yeah, they survived, you can see Shagia on a wheelchair and Olba behind him just as it fade into the ED song.

And I have no idea about the manga thing because no one seemed to have read the Gundam X manga adaptation.

However, I supposed there would be more with Satryricon (or whatever) and more space episodes if it was never shortened. The Gundam Double X model has quite a few gadgets never seen in the series too, so I supposed they could have devoted some time to them there. And more time to the G-Falcon too.
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Old 2004-10-13, 06:52   Link #9
dreamless
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In UC Tomino had the idea that Newtype is the next evolutionary step for humans... but then that doesn't really work, so in Gundam X they defined it to be a... particular evolutionary mutation that results in a superior kind of psionics... that a lot of people feared/admired this superior ability and some started to worship them...

For how the Frost brothers survive... while Garrod survived, so I guess they could have survived too...

Yup, they really cut it down a lot... a lot of stuffs are not used... that makes the Double X seem even weaker than X and the G-Falcon is never really used...
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Old 2004-10-13, 07:12   Link #10
FlyByNite
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamless
In UC Tomino had the idea that Newtype is the next evolutionary step for humans... but then that doesn't really work, so in Gundam X they defined it to be a... particular evolutionary mutation that results in a superior kind of psionics... that a lot of people feared/admired this superior ability and some started to worship them...

For how the Frost brothers survive... while Garrod survived, so I guess they could have survived too...

Yup, they really cut it down a lot... a lot of stuffs are not used... that makes the Double X seem even weaker than X and the G-Falcon is never really used...
Yea, I would have liked to have seen the G-Falcon actually join with those other Gundams since they said it was interchangable. The only other gundam it did was Leopard once right? I would have liked to have seen that super-fast Air Master.

Then there's also the weird relationship jump in the last episode with Enil hooking up with Roybea who she like hardly ever interacted with.

I expected her to end up with the Doctor. Although perhaps in the last batch of episodes that were cancelled Roybea ends up saving her life or vice-versa or something.
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Old 2004-10-13, 07:31   Link #11
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Yup, they have some really weird pair-ups done in the last episode, it seems they really go against what has been developed in the previous episodes...
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Old 2004-10-13, 11:30   Link #12
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You can tell it was cut short, and there is some odd stuff at the end.

But if you keep in mind the fact that they had to bring the hseries to completion much earlier then they desired, With little room to work in, It was quite a good series.


and I love Gundam Double X. I orgasm over Satallite Cannons.
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Old 2004-10-13, 15:32   Link #13
Panon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
What exactly is a 'newtype?' DOME stated that newtypes didn't exist and they are an illusion...but how does that explain the 'special powers' that people like tiffa have? Are they just mutants? Because their powers arn't illusions...and the flash system that controls bit-suits isn't one either...

Then the frost brother's only sibliing telepathy...that came from a mutation???

You've interpreted it way to literally.

The word 'Newtype' encompasses more than just the powers. 'Newtype' became more than the people, and became a set of values that people became obsessed with - that they were the next evolution of humanity, that they would be the ones to shape the future, etc.

It wasn't saying that Newtypes didn't exist, just that the image of them created by humanity was false and, as a Newtype forseeing the future meant nothing if people didn't actually work to create that future (as illustrated - Tifa saw the future many times, but because of a person like Garrod having the will to act, all her visions of the future never actually occured).


It's quite the statement on the whole saga of Newtypes, but I don't think it was one intended to say "Tomino was wrong". I think it was more along the lines of saying the original theme of Newtypes was lost and unresolved.
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Old 2004-10-13, 21:25   Link #14
brightman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panon
It's quite the statement on the whole saga of Newtypes, but I don't think it was one intended to say "Tomino was wrong". I think it was more along the lines of saying the original theme of Newtypes was lost and unresolved.
Well, the fact that X's whole emphasis on Newtypes would probably indicate that it wanted to resolve something that Tomino didn't, but I think it's quite clear that the show also pretty much clarified what Tomino did an about-face on. Tomino truly thought that Newtypes would be the future of space, and that's especially true in ZZ when every teenager was turning out to have Newtype potential. But after CCA he seemed to have turned around completely on the concept by emphasizing that Newtypes are more like weapons and mere psychics rather than anything involving the future of mankind.

So basically, what DOME suggests is that Tomino's new idea is right. And his old one is wrong. And Tomino seemed to appreciate that and included many Gundam X references in Turn A.
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Old 2005-12-20, 20:02   Link #15
Zero system
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Gundam X: "What is a newtype?" *spoilers*

This is what I got from google


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
So I just finished watching Gundam X, there are a few questions that bother me though, that wern't explained clearly.

What exactly is a 'newtype?' DOME stated that newtypes didn't exist and they are an illusion...but how does that explain the 'special powers' that people like tiffa have? Are they just mutants? Because their powers arn't illusions...and the flash system that controls bit-suits isn't one either...

Then the frost brother's only sibliing telepathy...that came from a mutation???
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shouta
Wish I had my vhs tapes so I can watch the ending again (and the series in general). It was confusing anyway you cut it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
it was a good series til the end...the end was really REALLY rushed, I mean they compressed like an entire ending in 2 eps...
this is what I could get from google


I would of expected GX to be atleast 45 eps...and work by expanding on things :/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rias
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
it was a good series til the end...the end was really REALLY rushed, I mean they compressed like an entire ending in 2 eps...
I would of expected GX to be atleast 45 eps...and work by expanding on things :/

It was actually cancelled near the end of the show. It origionally had like 50ish epsiodes planned (like any other gundam series that spans about a year).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rias
It was actually cancelled near the end of the show. It origionally had like 50ish epsiodes planned (like any other gundam series that spans about a year).

That's what happened :/ Got bad ratings then :/

It wasn't a bad series, it had alot of thinking...but it's still good...
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Old 2005-12-20, 20:09   Link #16
Zero system
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and the continuation of the thread


Quote:
Originally Posted by brightman
OK... In order to understand what DOME means, you need to understand what Newtypes are believed to be...

In UC, and in the AW universe, Newtypes are people who supposedly are either 1) the next step in human evolution, 2) superior humans, 3) religious icons, etc.

And in many ways Tomino in his early UC shows relied a bit too much on the idea of Newtypes being the future of mankind, which is something that he later appeared to changed his mind on.

So the staff of X, in order to put the "final say" in this matter, used DOME as a way of saying, "Tomino was wrong, there are no such thing as the next step of evolution or superior beings, so there are no Newtypes... These psychic mutants are just freaks of nature."


As for X, right, poor model sales and not very good public reception led to sponsors withdrawing, the show being moved to 6 AM Saturdays after Ep 26, and the show being cut short 10 episodes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyByNite
I just finished watching this thru hero and I think it may be my 2nd favorite gundam series after Zeta. Shame it gets ragged on.

and yea it seemed like they were trying to say Newtypes aren't Gods, they aren't the saviors of humanity. All spaceoids aren't going to turn into Newtypes, it's not the next evolutionary step.

They are just rare mutants, one in a million or more humans who's numbers aren't going to increase and make up the majority of the human population.

I liked it. I hate it when everything in the UC got to be Newtypes revered.

BTW, I do have another ending question. How did the Frost brothers survive? Is there a manga that covers the events that would have taken place in the 10 cancelled episodes?

I know there's to be a new AW manga starting in December taking place 8 years after Gundam X... Which I don't really care for, I'd rather the AW universe get their happy ending after all their devestation

Quote:
Originally Posted by brightman
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyByNite
BTW, I do have another ending question. How did the Frost brothers survive? Is there a manga that covers the events that would have taken place in the 10 cancelled episodes?
Yeah, they survived, you can see Shagia on a wheelchair and Olba behind him just as it fade into the ED song.

And I have no idea about the manga thing because no one seemed to have read the Gundam X manga adaptation.

However, I supposed there would be more with Satryricon (or whatever) and more space episodes if it was never shortened. The Gundam Double X model has quite a few gadgets never seen in the series too, so I supposed they could have devoted some time to them there. And more time to the G-Falcon too

Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamless
In UC Tomino had the idea that Newtype is the next evolutionary step for humans... but then that doesn't really work, so in Gundam X they defined it to be a... particular evolutionary mutation that results in a superior kind of psionics... that a lot of people feared/admired this superior ability and some started to worship them...

For how the Frost brothers survive... while Garrod survived, so I guess they could have survived too...

Yup, they really cut it down a lot... a lot of stuffs are not used... that makes the Double X seem even weaker than X and the G-Falcon is never really used...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyByNite
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamless
In UC Tomino had the idea that Newtype is the next evolutionary step for humans... but then that doesn't really work, so in Gundam X they defined it to be a... particular evolutionary mutation that results in a superior kind of psionics... that a lot of people feared/admired this superior ability and some started to worship them...

For how the Frost brothers survive... while Garrod survived, so I guess they could have survived too...

Yup, they really cut it down a lot... a lot of stuffs are not used... that makes the Double X seem even weaker than X and the G-Falcon is never really used...
Yea, I would have liked to have seen the G-Falcon actually join with those other Gundams since they said it was interchangable. The only other gundam it did was Leopard once right? I would have liked to have seen that super-fast Air Master.

Then there's also the weird relationship jump in the last episode with Enil hooking up with Roybea who she like hardly ever interacted with.

I expected her to end up with the Doctor. Although perhaps in the last batch of episodes that were cancelled Roybea ends up saving her life or vice-versa or something.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamless
Yup, they have some really weird pair-ups done in the last episode, it seems they really go against what has been developed in the previous episodes...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komataguri
You can tell it was cut short, and there is some odd stuff at the end.

But if you keep in mind the fact that they had to bring the hseries to completion much earlier then they desired, With little room to work in, It was quite a good series.


and I love Gundam Double X. I orgasm over Satallite Cannons

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shift_
What exactly is a 'newtype?' DOME stated that newtypes didn't exist and they are an illusion...but how does that explain the 'special powers' that people like tiffa have? Are they just mutants? Because their powers arn't illusions...and the flash system that controls bit-suits isn't one either...

Then the frost brother's only sibliing telepathy...that came from a mutation???
You've interpreted it way to literally.

The word 'Newtype' encompasses more than just the powers. 'Newtype' became more than the people, and became a set of values that people became obsessed with - that they were the next evolution of humanity, that they would be the ones to shape the future, etc.

It wasn't saying that Newtypes didn't exist, just that the image of them created by humanity was false and, as a Newtype forseeing the future meant nothing if people didn't actually work to create that future (as illustrated - Tifa saw the future many times, but because of a person like Garrod having the will to act, all her visions of the future never actually occured).


It's quite the statement on the whole saga of Newtypes, but I don't think it was one intended to say "Tomino was wrong". I think it was more along the lines of saying the original theme of Newtypes was lost and unresolved

Quote:
Originally Posted by brightman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panon
It's quite the statement on the whole saga of Newtypes, but I don't think it was one intended to say "Tomino was wrong". I think it was more along the lines of saying the original theme of Newtypes was lost and unresolved.
Well, the fact that X's whole emphasis on Newtypes would probably indicate that it wanted to resolve something that Tomino didn't, but I think it's quite clear that the show also pretty much clarified what Tomino did an about-face on. Tomino truly thought that Newtypes would be the future of space, and that's especially true in ZZ when every teenager was turning out to have Newtype potential. But after CCA he seemed to have turned around completely on the concept by emphasizing that Newtypes are more like weapons and mere psychics rather than anything involving the future of mankind.

So basically, what DOME suggests is that Tomino's new idea is right. And his old one is wrong. And Tomino seemed to appreciate that and included many Gundam X references in Turn A.
well at least page 1 has been retrieved
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Old 2005-12-20, 20:22   Link #17
Shiryuu
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Obviously for something to evolve, something has to change\mutate. So just calling them mutants isn't really going to change what NTs already are. In Victory, there were about 20,000 psychichers\NTs, that has to say something about the NTs future.

I don't really get what so hard to understand about this and the need for so many questions.
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Old 2005-12-20, 21:16   Link #18
brightman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiryuu
Obviously for something to evolve, something has to change\mutate. So just calling them mutants isn't really going to change what NTs already are. In Victory, there were about 20,000 psychichers\NTs, that has to say something about the NTs future.
The 'psychickers' used for Angel Halo were NOT Newtypes. They were just normal people that were part of Queen Maria's cult and were brainwashed. But amassing the brain waves of so many people was strong enough to power the Angel Halo, especially with Maria/Shakti's extremely powerful NT abilities added to them.

It was mentioned in Victory that Newtypes are a legend... And that Usso was special because he was a "true Newtype". That means that as far as the timeline's concern, these "true" Newtypes aren't exactly as common as they used to be.

Plus the fact that the depiction of other pilots in the show greatly differs from how they were depicted in earlier ones, most notably Gundam ZZ, where seemingly everyone could get some type of Newtype reaction. In Victory, the only pilots who get these types of reactions are Usso, Shakti, and not really anyone else (Fuala? Don't remember). So I think its pretty clear that Tomino was trying to imply something there.

But anyway, like I said a year ago, Tomino's views on Newtypes as being a higher level of humans who all understand each other changed as time went on and it was quite obvious. In MSG it seemed as if he actually believed in the idea, and even based the whole moral of the show around it, but eventually, he abandoned it for other things.
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