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Old 2011-10-22, 18:02   Link #3101
ars89
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So Iri is a homunculus? Does that make Ilya a half-homunculus?
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Old 2011-10-22, 18:09   Link #3102
ReddyRedWolf
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So Iri is a homunculus? Does that make Ilya a half-homunculus?
Still a homunculus. A back up plan.
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Old 2011-10-26, 19:58   Link #3103
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So what's the difference between Saber Lily and the regular Saber? Is it just a costume change or is there a personality change too?
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Old 2011-10-26, 20:00   Link #3104
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Just a costume change
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Old 2011-10-29, 12:50   Link #3105
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One thing I can't help but wonder..... could Berserker use Ea?
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Old 2011-10-29, 13:25   Link #3106
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One thing I can't help but wonder..... could Berserker use Ea?
potentially yes, if he ever get his hands on it.
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Old 2011-10-29, 13:33   Link #3107
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As long as Berserker recognize something with the concept of "weapon" in his mind, it can be wielded, regardless how specific/unique the weapon is.
He can potentially wield both Excalibur and Ea at the same time.
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Old 2011-10-29, 13:37   Link #3108
Haak
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Wow, that would be like major overkill even for Nasuverse standards...
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Old 2011-10-29, 13:42   Link #3109
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Wow, that would be like major overkill even for Nasuverse standards...
of course the prana requirement would probably burnout kariya and berserker would go poof.
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Old 2011-10-29, 19:33   Link #3110
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...Speaking of prana, does it actually differ from "mana" somehow or are they just different terms for the same thing? I keep seeing them being used interchangeably in different translations, so I would assume the latter, but you can never be too sure.
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Old 2011-10-29, 19:54   Link #3111
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They are formally different, although they tend to get mixed up a lot and even I'm not 100% sure of what "prana" means. Mana is magical energy taken from external sources. Prana is, I think, a generic term for all forms of magical energy. However, it might be specifically magical energy that has been processed by the magus and is ready to use.
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Old 2011-10-30, 04:01   Link #3112
Kallen4life
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1) If FSN zerker got hit with ~Ea_lite and still had lives left - would he then be immune even to a fully charged Ea ?

2) God Hand basically means that even a planet-busting attack of rank lower then A will have no effect on him ? Who enforces and supports and provides the energy (prana, mana whatever :P) for this kind of hax ? Akasha ?

3) How exactly are the calculations done to determine how many lives he loses .. from fate route Caliburn is 1 (one) attack, correct ? Although very powerful one. But it takes 7 (or 6 ?) of his lives .. Just because it's really strong ? Would Excaliblast or Ea take all 12 lives then ? Or is there some other mechanic



Quote:
One thing I can't help but wonder..... could Berserker use Ea?
Would Ea retain it's Ex rank ? in fact, would it be any different then when Gilgamesh wields it ?
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Last edited by Kallen4life; 2011-10-30 at 04:11.
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Old 2011-10-30, 05:00   Link #3113
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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
They are formally different, although they tend to get mixed up a lot and even I'm not 100% sure of what "prana" means. Mana is magical energy taken from external sources. Prana is, I think, a generic term for all forms of magical energy. However, it might be specifically magical energy that has been processed by the magus and is ready to use.
As far as I remember Mana is the always avaible energy that's kind of "hanging in the air" and Prana the energy created by your own circuit (so kind of a extended-life-force-thingy), but there was something called "Od" that could've been your own magical circuit energy as wel.. Prana would be the overall term for magic energy then. But yeah, damn confusing all this magic theory stuff (it's nice to know thanks to the World Material that there is a reason behind almost everything, but there is a reason you're only supposed to show the reader the tip of the iceberg I guess)
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Old 2011-10-30, 08:45   Link #3114
Cherry_Lover
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As far as I remember Mana is the always avaible energy that's kind of "hanging in the air" and Prana the energy created by your own circuit (so kind of a extended-life-force-thingy), but there was something called "Od" that could've been your own magical circuit energy as wel.. Prana would be the overall term for magic energy then. But yeah, damn confusing all this magic theory stuff (it's nice to know thanks to the World Material that there is a reason behind almost everything, but there is a reason you're only supposed to show the reader the tip of the iceberg I guess)
No, the magical energy created by your own circuits is called "Od", not Prana. You're right about Mana, though. It's the external source of magical energy.
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Old 2011-10-30, 09:08   Link #3115
Klashikari
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kallen4life View Post
1) If FSN zerker got hit with ~Ea_lite and still had lives left - would he then be immune even to a fully charged Ea ?
Theorically yes, but it is -very- unlikely that SN berserker would survive that.
Quote:
2) God Hand basically means that even a planet-busting attack of rank lower then A will have no effect on him ? Who enforces and supports and provides the energy (prana, mana whatever :P) for this kind of hax ? Akasha ?
it is an innate ability, it doesn't really need any supply, although supply will allow God Hand to regenerate the lives stock.
Quote:
3) How exactly are the calculations done to determine how many lives he loses .. from fate route Caliburn is 1 (one) attack, correct ? Although very powerful one. But it takes 7 (or 6 ?) of his lives .. Just because it's really strong ? Would Excaliblast or Ea take all 12 lives then ? Or is there some other mechanic
Nasu never explained how it is factored, which is the real issue in the pack. Remember that Caliburn did deal more than 1 lives though: it actually killed Berserker 7 times as he described so himself on his death.

Considering it took that much with only -traced- Caliburn, Excalibur and other NP of the same rank could potentially nearly one shot him.
Quote:
Would Ea retain it's Ex rank ? in fact, would it be any different then when Gilgamesh wields it ?
Yes. Unlike Archer's Unlimited Blade Works, Zero Berserker doesn't create anything: he basically control the said weapon, and wield it as if he was the owner and accustomed to it.
So Ea would keep its EX rank.

Last edited by Klashikari; 2011-10-30 at 09:28.
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Old 2011-10-30, 10:06   Link #3116
Cherry_Lover
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Theorically yes, but it is -very- unlikely that SN berserker would survive that.
Gil used a low-power version of Ea on Saber in Fate to defeat her without killing her. I see no reason why he couldn't do the same to Berserker.
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Old 2011-10-30, 13:22   Link #3117
Kallen4life
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yeah, that's what I thought .. except Bers would become immune to it and Gil is screwed .. except not really, cuz he still has lol_Enkidu and at least 12 A-rank NP's in GoB


2Klashikari : thank you


more q-s :

1) Towards the end of the fate route in the game - how exactly did the confontation on the date between Shirou/Saber & Gil go ? In the anime they used Avalon to reflect Ea back at Gil, he was kinda roasted and made a tactical retreat .. but afaik, that's not how Avalon really works - it protects the user by transporting him/her to magical promised utopia fairy land of happiness and bunnies and NOTHING can interfere (well, maybe the VOID personality of Ryougi, since she's basically channeling Akasha and can unmake the Nasu-multiverse, but I dunno), but it doesn't reflect anything .. so what happened in the game ? Gil ran w/o getting damaged ? They used Caliburn/Excaliblast ? Saber slashed him ? He broke a nail ?


2) Gils shiny original golden armor - it's not just there to look pretty, right ? It can take some hits. What are the extents ? Obviously not NP's, but regular strikes ? From ~Saber (Invisible Air), Lancers (no NP's), Assassin ?


3) Gil has ALL NP's in GoB, right ? That means prototypes of ~Caliburn, Excalibur, Gae Bolg, Arondight etc. ? If he chooses to stop being an ass and actually take and wield one of them - can he use their specific effects ? For example Gae Bolg's 'lol_bend_spacetime_to stick_it_in_the_heart' thing ? Or anything else like that ? Not talking about his proficiency in swinging them (it's probably awful), but using the effect .. For that matter - maybe he can do that w/o taking them ? Like shoot Gae Bolg, not like an arrow (which he usually does), but using it's effect mid-flight and have it hit someone's heart ?
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When we hunt, we kill
No one is safe
Nothing is sacred
We are Blackwatch
We are the last line of defense
We will burn our own to hold the red line, it is the last line to ever hold

Last edited by Kallen4life; 2011-10-30 at 14:23.
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Old 2011-10-30, 14:07   Link #3118
ProfileOF
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Originally Posted by Kallen4life View Post

3) Gil has ALL NP's in GoB, right ? That means prototypes of ~Caliburn, Excalibur, Gae Bolg, Arondight etc. ? If he chooses to stop being an ass and actually take and wield one of them - can he use their specific effects ? For example Gae Bolg's 'lol_bend_spacetime_to stick_it_in_the_heart' thing ? Or anything else like that ? Not talking about his proficiency in swinging them (it's probably awful), but using the effect .. For that matter - maybe he can do that w/o taking them ? Like shoot Gae Bolg, not like an arrow (which he usually does), but using it's effect mid-flight and have it hit someone's heart ?
He cannot. It is given that some of the collections in GoB is even out of his cognition. It's just anything in the world is his pocession, no matter he knows it or not.
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Old 2011-10-30, 14:40   Link #3119
GDB
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Originally Posted by Kallen4life View Post
3) Gil has ALL NP's in GoB, right ? That means prototypes of ~Caliburn, Excalibur, Gae Bolg, Arondight etc. ? If he chooses to stop being an ass and actually take and wield one of them - can he use their specific effects ? For example Gae Bolg's 'lol_bend_spacetime_to stick_it_in_the_heart' thing ? Or anything else like that ? Not talking about his proficiency in swinging them (it's probably awful), but using the effect .. For that matter - maybe he can do that w/o taking them ? Like shoot Gae Bolg, not like an arrow (which he usually does), but using it's effect mid-flight and have it hit someone's heart ?
He doesn't have all Noble Phantasms. It only contains ones that he collected while he was alive. So, for example, he does not possess Excalibur because that is not a weapon of man, so it was never possible for him to obtain it.

On that same note, if a weapon later became strong because it became cursed, but it wasn't originally cursed, then the version that Gil has won't be cursed.

As far as using them goes, he is merely an owner. I don't believe he can use "ultimate abilities" or whatever of the weapons besides the ones that he's proficient in, which is only Ea.
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Old 2011-10-30, 15:28   Link #3120
Cherry_Lover
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He cannot. It is given that some of the collections in GoB is even out of his cognition. It's just anything in the world is his pocession, no matter he knows it or not.
Not true.

Gil has every NP that was around when he was alive, which means the original versions of most NPs. However, there are some which he does not possess (such as Excalibur, because it was made by the fairies for Saber specifically) and some for which he does not have all the possible techniques (Gae Bolg, for instance, because one of the two possible NP uses was actually added by Lancer himself, ands thus Gil's prototype does not have it).
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