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Old 2006-03-01, 04:40   Link #1
Yellow Flash
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Is Kakashi a Hokage lvl ninja?

Spoiler for FACTS:

Last edited by Yellow Flash; 2006-03-01 at 04:55.
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Old 2006-03-01, 04:52   Link #2
Rachy
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Spoiler:


Spoiler:


Quote:
Was compared equally to Kabuto.
Who cares? Kabuto is pathetic.

Quote:
Has never lost a fight (Except against Itachi & Kisame).
And those
Spoiler:


Quote:
Is the strongest Konoha Jounin.
Maybe, Gai might be though.

But yes i think kakashi is hokage level now.
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Old 2006-03-01, 07:52   Link #3
Mr. Johnny 5
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Again this thread?

Anyway after carefull consideration...is Kakashi far from an Hokage lvl ninja...so is Itachi if you ask me.

Every Hokage so far have proven to use high lvl ninjutsu's, genjutsu's and keep on fighting for quite some time.

Perhaps Itachi & Kakashi posses an more powerfull technique within their arsenal but they cant fight for long. Those 2 are only good for 1 on 1.

Every Hokage can possibly take out more then 15 jounins...while Itachi and Kakashi cant or barely fight 5 jounins.

Their stamina & chakra pool is way below an average Hokage. And this factor is very important.. (Sandaime was proof..since he was already old)

To me an Hokage should be able to kill of plenty of shinobi and still stand on top to face another great adversary like elite jounins (Itachi, Kakashi) or kage lvl jounins (Sannin)...

It was nice to see..Sarutobi defeating to zombies (who were probably at elite jounin lvl skill) and then face the beast Orochimaru himself...only his stamina and chakra pool worked against him.
I wonder what happend if those 2 Hokage's were fighting with their own mind and spirit..not being those zombies.
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Old 2006-06-18, 04:52   Link #4
Yellow Flash
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How strong is Kisame, really?

mistake. please delete.

Last edited by Yellow Flash; 2006-06-18 at 05:08.
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Old 2006-06-18, 05:09   Link #5
Blaine
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What is this? some kind of bizarre joke, Yellow Flash talking about a character other than yondaime
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Old 2006-06-18, 05:53   Link #6
ri0
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Wasn't the first fight against Zabuza a loss too? I mean he was captured in the water prison. He admitted that this was over the time he was captured and only Nartuo's trick saved him.
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Old 2006-06-18, 05:56   Link #7
Yellow Flash
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ri0
Wasn't the first fight against Zabuza a loss too? I mean he was captured in the water prison. He admitted that this was over the time he was captured and only Nartuo's trick saved him.
Well, we can't say for sure he would have been captured if he was alone.
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Old 2006-06-18, 06:05   Link #8
Last_Hope
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I donīt think, if I got to appoint the next Hokage after Tsunade, that I would choose Kakashi.

He is a great ninja and he has accomplished lots of things but as I see it he has a pretty big backpack tying him down. And that would be that the eye sinks him completely. You canīt have a Hokage that have to rest a week after the tougher fights.

I would have him high in the command but not as the Hokage.
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Old 2006-06-18, 06:10   Link #9
ri0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Flash
Well, we can't say for sure he would have been captured if he was alone.
Hmm... do you mean alone with Tazuna or all alone?
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Old 2006-06-18, 06:38   Link #10
Sarugaki
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Kishimoto has one thing to do : let him switch off the sharingan and Kakashi is Kage level.

Kakashi is beyond Uchiha or Yuuga level, he's at the same level as geniuses among their clan like Neiji or Sasuke but still behind a genius among geniuses like Itachi.
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Old 2006-06-18, 07:11   Link #11
Mr. Johnny 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Flash
Spoiler for FACTS:
I put with the green color my opinions/facts on this...
You made points why Kakashi is good or great but not why he is qualified to be a hokage lvl fighter..


My point of view a Hokage LvL fighter should have or be able to:
(judged from the previous Hokage's 1-4)

- alot of combat experience (Kakashi passes)
- alot of knowlegde about all jutsu's [nin, gen, tai, kin] (Kakashi passes)
- able to face ANY type of enemy even in the form of demons or demon alike (Kakashi fails)
- posses a large amount of chakra and stamina (Kakashi fails)
- ability to face multiple jounin level shinobi (Kakashi doubtfull, due to stamina-chakra)
- high level tai [offensive-defensive], ninjutsu [offensive-defensive] and genjutsu [repel/defensive] abilities (Kakashi passes, I assume..1000+ jutsu's)
- be an example to every other fellow or shinobi (Kakashi benifit of the doubt, porn reading all the time isnt his strong point)

I say Kakashi is still young and makes a good chance to reach the hokage lvl...but needs to work in the fields where he fails...
His lack of chakra and stamina has only more negative results when using the Sharingan...and Kakashi should use his energy better in my eyes..
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Old 2006-06-18, 07:50   Link #12
Yellow Flash
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5
I put with the green color my opinions/facts on this. You made points why Kakashi is good or great but not why he is qualified to be a hokage lvl fighter.
Of course some of those points are minor regarding Hokage level.
But it doesn't make sense to say all my points are irrelevant,
because it is the grand total of those things that ultimately reveal Kakashi's strength.

Spoiler:


Quote:
My point of view a Hokage LvL fighter should have or be able to:
(judged from the previous Hokage's 1-4)

- alot of combat experience (Kakashi passes)
- alot of knowlegde about all jutsu's [nin, gen, tai, kin] (Kakashi passes)
I agree.

Quote:
- able to face ANY type of enemy even in the form of demons or demon alike (Kakashi fails)
Against Kyuubi, anyone would fail (except...read above).

Quote:
- posses a large amount of chakra and stamina (Kakashi fails)
Well, no. It's unique to possess a huge amount of chakra, like Kisame or Naruto.
Kakashi has a good enough amount.

Quote:
- ability to face multiple jounin level shinobi (Kakashi doubtfull, due to stamina-chakra)
Actually, he faced multiple Iwa jounin at age 13. (Kakashi passes)

Quote:
- high level tai [offensive-defensive], ninjutsu [offensive-defensive] and genjutsu [repel/defensive] abilities (Kakashi passes, I assume..1000+ jutsu's)
Agreed.

Quote:
- be an example to every other fellow or shinobi (Kakashi benifit of the doubt, porn reading all the time isnt his strong point)
Kakashi is a good leader. Reading books isn't bad thing.
Tsunade is gambling and drinking.

Last edited by Yellow Flash; 2006-06-18 at 08:22.
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Old 2006-06-18, 09:20   Link #13
Mr. Johnny 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yellow Flash
Of course some of those points are minor regarding Hokage level.
But it doesn't make sense to say all my points are irrelevant,
because it is the grand total of those things that ultimately reveal Kakashi's strength.

Spoiler:


Well, no. It's unique to possess a huge amount of chakra, like Kisame or Naruto.
Kakashi has a good enough amount.
Yes...and it's also a unique thing to BE on Hokage LvL...like i said i judged my opinions and or facts based on the previous 4 Hokages.
The Sannin fully qualify in those fields..and Tsunade/Jiraiya were chosen to replace the 3rd. Both Itachi and Kakashi seem like very good shinobi to face 1-3 top elites at the same time at max...while the previous ones seem to be able to deal with over 10-20 at the same time.


Actually, he faced multiple Iwa jounin at age 13. (Kakashi passes)
Kakashi did a decent job for a kid...but he lost.
During the Sand/Sound invasion he faced some jounins and many chuunins...he faced them with cover of other jounins. So i am still not convinced in this case.




Kakashi is a good leader. Reading books isn't bad thing.
Tsunade is gambling and drinking.
True...but Tsunade has a great history compared to Kakashi. There are plenty of people who look up to Tsunade, Jiraiya 1-2-3-4th hokage's.

There are only a few who look up to Kakashi (except some jounins and his (ex-)teammembers..)
Kakashi should get the respect of more shinobi
I modified your long text again
Also just to tell i dont think that all things were irrelevant it's just that most were irrelevant to make a person qualified to be at hokage lvl.
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Old 2006-06-18, 09:44   Link #14
Yellow Flash
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Spoiler:


Quote:
Yes...and it's also a unique thing to BE on Hokage LvL...like i said i judged my opinions and or facts based on the previous 4 Hokages.
We don't know anything about chakra pool of the previous Hokages.

Quote:
The Sannin fully qualify in those fields..and Tsunade/Jiraiya were chosen to replace the 3rd. Both Itachi and Kakashi seem like very good shinobi to face 1-3 top elites at the same time at max...while the previous ones seem to be able to deal with over 10-20 at the same time.
The Sannin are unique because they can summon huge boss monsters.
But this isn't a requirement to become Hokage or to compete at this level.


Quote:
During the Sand/Sound invasion he faced some jounins and many chuunins...he faced them with cover of other jounins. So i am still not convinced in this case.
He wasn't even serious. He was talking to Gai, and concerned about Hokage.

Quote:
True...but Tsunade has a great history compared to Kakashi.
There are plenty of people who look up to Tsunade, Jiraiya 1-2-3-4th hokage's.
Kakashi can easily compete with anyone's reputation.
He is famous in all countries, and even an Akatsuki considered him a problem.
A lot of people look up to him, even Yamato who is the best Anbu ninja.

Quote:
There are only a few who look up to Kakashi (except some jounins and his (ex-)teammembers..)
Kakashi should get the respect of more shinobi.
No. Even Sai looks up to Kakashi, basically everyone in Konoha.

Last edited by Yellow Flash; 2006-06-18 at 13:38.
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Old 2006-06-18, 09:52   Link #15
Yogi
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Kakashi is a competent fighter, but he exhausted himself against a one-armed Deidara who had just spent three straight days doing a sealing technique. Plus he thought that it would be suicide fighting Orochimaru, whereas the other Sannin/Hokage class people at least though they had a chance. He has never had any clean win over a Sannin/Hokage level opponent. Plus he has shown himself to be a horrible mentor. Hence, no.
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Old 2006-06-18, 16:11   Link #16
Mr. Johnny 5
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I will make this short since the quotes are starting to tire me (no offence YF)

- Yamato was a former (ANBU team member or collegue) of Kakashi

- It was Gai who was concerned about the Hokage...Kakashi was confident in his abilities.

- Like i said all previous Hokages were able to deal with strong enemy's without getting "that" tired...3rd Hokage was simply too old...

- In your posts you clearly made your opinions on Kakashi's potential...and I..WE know that he is a awesome genius...but there are plenty genius shinobi who still eventually become only a jounin.

- Haku defended Zabuza the 2nd Time...the 1st time...like i said if it werent for Sasuke and Naruto...he'd die...at that point it's save to say...Kakashi lost.

- As for Jiraiya...he gathers information for Konoha, he protects Konoha, he fights for Konoha. Only he doesnt go on (official) missions...there is a possibility that Tsunade kindly asks him to do something (spying or so...) and Jiraiya might accept it. He is absent alot afterall.

- Kabuto...he made full use of Tsunade's weakness...good..but right now...as konoha's 5th Hokage...he will surely lose in a re-match..

Also that fight was never fully decided..Tsunade was the one to stand up straight eventually.

But this is based on to many "if's"
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Old 2006-06-18, 16:24   Link #17
vampiro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ri0
Wasn't the first fight against Zabuza a loss too? I mean he was captured in the water prison. He admitted that this was over the time he was captured and only Nartuo's trick saved him.
does that make kakashi less strong? or was Zabuza just a DAMN strong opponent?

Guess we'll never know becouse we dont know how strong zabuza really was (other then his skills against kakashi)
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Old 2006-06-18, 16:53   Link #18
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The chakra pool is a huge must for Hokage.

Just look at the signature moves the 1-2-3-4th Hokage's use. Jutsu intensive combat. The Sannin also proved to be jutsu intensive in combat. Great example would be the poisoned Jiraiya, not properly able to mesh chakra but still was able to create the swamp (although he comments its not as good as when he's healthy)
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Old 2006-06-18, 17:31   Link #19
Souten no Seigyoku
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Saw the topic today and decided to add my 2cents.

No Kakashi isnt a kage level ninja. Its true that at the beginning they revealed he knows over 1000 techniques, which seems to be a prerequisite. However, hes not kage level. He runs out of stamina too fast due to his sharingan.

He's one of the strongest Jounin along with Mite Gai.

Kage level are: Tsunade, Jiraiya, and if you've read the manga....
Spoiler:
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Old 2006-06-18, 22:13   Link #20
Killuahxh
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I think Kakashi is easily Hokage acceptable... I think if J-Man and Naruto had not found Tsunade or something else, I think Kakashi would have been right their to
except his crown for Hokage. Yellow Flash has valid points, it isn't irrelevant in the
fact to be Hokage lvl anyway... Being a HOKAGE is different than being considered
Hokage Level, which is what Orochimaru and J-Man, Itachi-ect are considered....
Also, I think he'd be a great leader, as for facing enemys, I think it's true that the
Hokage should be able to summon something HUGE to protect the whole village,
but Kakashi could manage... Kakashi could handle at least 5-10 Mid-Level Jounin's
at once with his speed, jutsu and taijutsu alone, but MS and Chidori only add to
his strength... Also, I think he could handle Orochimaru for some strange reason,
their speed is quite equal, strength also... Both tons of jutsu, Chidori can cut through almost anything... Plus I think Orochimaru would wigg out when Kakashi
suddenly blew his face off into another dimension(wait, how did Diedra go and pick up her arm?), I guess just blow it off... But that would be last resort, like he
Orochimaru summoned Manda or something. I'm rambling, but gotta add one more
thing... I'll try and make it short.

On Itachi...
What is this bs about Itachi having a low chakra/stamina? And he can only take
on 1-3 elite ninja at a time... The only thing is, MS-TSUKOYMI(sp) and AMATERSU(sp) take a lot of chakra... But we still saw him easily own Asuma, Kurenia(sp) and
Kakashi all at the same time... Then use Tsukokmmomimilol and waiste a shit load
of chakra and still be moveable... It's a fact, that Itachi is just a regular ninja who is very, very fast, very, very, strong and has tons of jutsu, then you add sharingan, which can copy and predict movement ... then you add MS...

SO:

1000+ Ninjutsu, ect.
1000+ Genjutsu/Doujutsu I expect also.
Probably a big base of Kinjutsu also, I'd bet MS would be one.
Faster than Gai and Kakashi, very very fast.
Stronger than Gai and Kakashi, lets say about as strong as Kisame.
Mangekyo Sharingan, elite techniques, with sacrifice of lots of chakra.
Sharingan--Blood related-- so he can use it easily, copies and predicts.
Smart, a true genius...
Cool...
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