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Old 2006-03-09, 01:28   Link #1
fizzmaister
The Tall One
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Mobile suit Strategies

RULES:

Create a scenario: choose a location, choose the terrain, choose the amount of forces on both sides (please make it aproximately equal or you at a slight disadvantage).

Choose types of forces: Only grunt suits, support ships, older technology (Tanks, infantry, fighters, balls, etc) are allowed.

Organize your forces: describe what the groupings are for your units as well as general tactics (no need to be specific, but you can be. Please don't just say attack the enemy)

WARNING!!!!: No Gundams, yes that's right no gundams. I really want this to be a grunt level strategy thread.


===OR===
Respond to the most recent scenario explaining what you would do differently given the same scenario (you may also choose to use the OpFor).

Please don't act like idiots, or say something like "I'll bring in S-F and beam spam both sides and Orb wins again."

beyond that, happy strategising.

-edit-
clarification: by support ships I do mean spaceships as well (both MS carriers and battleships)

Last edited by fizzmaister; 2006-03-09 at 17:14.
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Old 2006-03-09, 02:47   Link #2
viper
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I'll try first. Hmm well heres a scenario:

Lets see now,
UC0079, days after Op. Odessa, Zeons are trying to escape from Earth. They have taken up a position in a dry creekbed in preparations to escape into space. Lets say fairly rocky terrain, but exposed, very little in cover except for dry river beds streaking through out the area. The Zeons have...hmm oh 3 or 4 Zakus with limited weaponry and ammunition, 6 or so Magella tanks with ample ammunition and say a company of 60 troops, with about 20 of them too wounded for combat. Oh and lets not forget a HLV capsule for escape

Earth Federation forces are trying to prevent them from escaping. At your disposal is a team of MSes (3 plus support stuff), a squad of Type 61s (6) and a platoon of infantry (20). You also have limited airsupport from Core fighters.

Now the Zeons are heavily entrenched and are making their last stand. You must hurry as well since they're trying to escape. What are your strategies/tactics for attacking/defending?

Last edited by viper; 2006-03-09 at 03:00.
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Old 2006-03-09, 15:41   Link #3
Cloud_Nave
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Are u expecting actual laws of physics to apply to these scenerios?

Cause if not, u're gonna have alot of scenarios with CE grunts
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Old 2006-03-09, 15:57   Link #4
freelancer3018
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Throw all my MSes at them and set their reactors to go critical. All will die.
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Old 2006-03-09, 16:02   Link #5
Komataguri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viper
I'll try first. Hmm well heres a scenario:

Lets see now,
UC0079, days after Op. Odessa, Zeons are trying to escape from Earth. They have taken up a position in a dry creekbed in preparations to escape into space. Lets say fairly rocky terrain, but exposed, very little in cover except for dry river beds streaking through out the area. The Zeons have...hmm oh 3 or 4 Zakus with limited weaponry and ammunition, 6 or so Magella tanks with ample ammunition and say a company of 60 troops, with about 20 of them too wounded for combat. Oh and lets not forget a HLV capsule for escape

Earth Federation forces are trying to prevent them from escaping. At your disposal is a team of MSes (3 plus support stuff), a squad of Type 61s (6) and a platoon of infantry (20). You also have limited airsupport from Core fighters.

Now the Zeons are heavily entrenched and are making their last stand. You must hurry as well since they're trying to escape. What are your strategies/tactics for attacking/defending?
Night before the attack I'd take 1 MS from the team, give it the best weapon that we had avalible, and order it to circle around the enemy flank, Giving him all night means he can move far away and carefully to avoid detection, He would also have 3 of the Type 61s with it.



The next day, I would send the remaining 3 tanks, and 1 ms out to engage in a skirmish battle to draw out the enemy forces, and if possible draw them towards the remaining MS thats hidden, if they won't be drawn out, Then that MS comes out to join the attack party as a small bit of shock and aw.


Lets say...5 minutes after the initiation of battle, The mobile suit that circled around the night before would rush in from behind, The 3 Type 61s with it pepering the engines of the HLV while the Mobile Suit took took on targets of oppertunity, Zaku's and tanks and the like. Then when the HLV is disabled, the type 61s take up positions to sohot the Zaku's in the back.
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Old 2006-03-09, 17:07   Link #6
fizzmaister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komataguri
Night before the attack I'd take 1 MS from the team, give it the best weapon that we had avalible, and order it to circle around the enemy flank, Giving him all night means he can move far away and carefully to avoid detection, He would also have 3 of the Type 61s with it.



The next day, I would send the remaining 3 tanks, and 1 ms out to engage in a skirmish battle to draw out the enemy forces, and if possible draw them towards the remaining MS thats hidden, if they won't be drawn out, Then that MS comes out to join the attack party as a small bit of shock and aw.


Lets say...5 minutes after the initiation of battle, The mobile suit that circled around the night before would rush in from behind, The 3 Type 61s with it pepering the engines of the HLV while the Mobile Suit took took on targets of oppertunity, Zaku's and tanks and the like. Then when the HLV is disabled, the type 61s take up positions to sohot the Zaku's in the back.
Your strategy seems well thought out but by this point I belive that the ZEON forces would have already escaped.

With ZEON forces, I would set up several booby traps, and order the infantry to take shifts looking for signs of the enemy. I would have one ZAKU always on guard duty and one on 10-seconds alert (in cockpit waiting for orders to attack). I would first load ZAKU #3, then 4 of the tanks. I would then relieve the remaining weapons with my best pilots. I would then have everyone work as fast as they can (minus the look-outs and guards) to secure the loaded weapons, and begin loading the two remaining tanks, and then one ZAKU (which would be immediately secured). close to the end of that I would recall all of the infantry to the capsule and have the last suit board and be secured (all of the available people, actually maximum effective amount, are working to secure the suit it would take little time to do so). The capsule begins take off and the booby traps are detonated. The booby traps were originally dug in underground sideways from the riverbeds so even if the feddies were looking they wouldn't notice the traps being burried. Since the traps forcefully eject so much material, a cloud of dust prevents any accurate fire.

That plan is doomed to fail, not because it's bad but because Murphy said so. At some point the feddies will realize that it's not possible to waste an entire day to set-up the attack and will charge. One suit will probably be lost immediately, but then the two tanks and the 10-second ZAKU will open fire on where it came from. Recon is advised to seek shelter but look out for a flanking attack. The tanks and/or remaining ZAKU would come out of the closet, I mean capsule, and cover the rear and maybe some shots of opportunity. One tank will stay inside to tke opportunistic shots if possible, otherwise it should move away from the combat zone and try flanking the enemy. The suits in battle should cover the tank as it's leaving the allow the enemy to advance untill they reach the booby traps. If a suit gets within range of the explosion of a booby trap, the person who was in charge of laying them would selectively detonate them. The tanks should move throughout the trench network (if the trenches are connected and occaisionally pop out and attack. The ZAKUs should conserve ammo but attack once in a while so that it doesn't look like they're leading them in. If victorious, restart the loading plan, and hopefully no more feddies arrive.

PS. Sorry if it sounded strange I have a hard time communicating on paper (or e-paper) so if it seems a bit jumpy, that's just the way I think.
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Old 2006-03-09, 17:50   Link #7
Komataguri
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If they are deeply entrenched, they wouldn't be taking off anytime soon, waiting for a clearing of orbital debris or repairs, or to intercept a musai are all plausible reasons why it would take a day or two for them to deeply entrench themselves.


If there was nothing to wait for, they wouldn't bother with entrenching, they would just get in and leave.
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Old 2006-03-10, 14:44   Link #8
fizzmaister
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good point, anyone else like to take a shot at attacking or defending this HLV capsule?
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Old 2006-03-12, 00:53   Link #9
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by viper
Now the Zeons are heavily entrenched and are making their last stand. You must hurry as well since they're trying to escape. What are your strategies/tactics for attacking/defending?
This scenario can be won by the Federation without firing a single shot. Establish communications with the Zeon commander and let him know the following: 1) He's surrounded, 2) He's low on supplies and 3) You have heavy support weapons that can destroy their spacecraft as it takes off. The Zeon commander can only respond by either surrendering or by trying to attack the Federation position. If he does attack, he would have lost all the advantages of a fortified position, and his lack of supplies will make it easy to defeat his forces. Any competent commander will realize this, and will probably surrender instead.
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Old 2006-03-12, 01:26   Link #10
fizzmaister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Tran
This scenario can be won by the Federation without firing a single shot. Establish communications with the Zeon commander and let him know the following: 1) He's surrounded, 2) He's low on supplies and 3) You have heavy support weapons that can destroy their spacecraft as it takes off. The Zeon commander can only respond by either surrendering or by trying to attack the Federation position. If he does attack, he would have lost all the advantages of a fortified position, and his lack of supplies will make it easy to defeat his forces. Any competent commander will realize this, and will probably surrender instead.
really good and it fits well with your sig.

I think we have a winner. Time for a new scenario.

If someone doesn't do it first I'll probably put up a scenario tomorrow (it's too late right now and I don't want to mess up writing it.
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Old 2006-03-12, 01:31   Link #11
SoldierOfDarkness
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: From the deepest abyss in the world, where you think?
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Tran
This scenario can be won by the Federation without firing a single shot. Establish communications with the Zeon commander and let him know the following: 1) He's surrounded, 2) He's low on supplies and 3) You have heavy support weapons that can destroy their spacecraft as it takes off. The Zeon commander can only respond by either surrendering or by trying to attack the Federation position. If he does attack, he would have lost all the advantages of a fortified position, and his lack of supplies will make it easy to defeat his forces. Any competent commander will realize this, and will probably surrender instead.
What happens if the Zeon has some giant MA (with a giant laser as usual) hidden deep inside the fortress being prep for battle?
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Old 2006-03-12, 03:57   Link #12
true_cricket
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I think yhe better is to use a wargame to simulate the attack.

Does anyone has a gundam tactical wargame? (Or want to devellop one, if no one has?)
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Old 2006-03-13, 19:11   Link #13
fizzmaister
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Space lots of large debris (mostly large pieces of warships) with some metal plates slightly larger than an MS and some small debris floating in a ring (earth orbit debris belt)

ZEON: 3 ZAKU II's (element of surprise)

Federation: defending minor outpost with 5 GM's, Shuttle full of replacement personel heading toward earth shuttle has one ball, but is sufficiently far away that it cant be used immediately (it takes time for it to travel to the fight).

Hint: The surprise attack will knock out 1-3 GMs. The large debris is useful for hiding and defending, The small debris can damage the suits (especially if it hits something delicate like the cameras.
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Old 2006-03-13, 22:42   Link #14
4Tran
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I've got a few questions: what kind of outpost is it? What is the Zeon objective - to capture the outpost or to destroy it? Are the Zeon troops aware of the number of Federation GMs? Are they aware of the shuttle and its Ball?
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Old 2006-03-13, 23:49   Link #15
fizzmaister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Tran
I've got a few questions: what kind of outpost is it? What is the Zeon objective - to capture the outpost or to destroy it? Are the Zeon troops aware of the number of Federation GMs? Are they aware of the shuttle and its Ball?
Sorry I had to rush because I was about to leave.

The outpost's only value is convenience (one of several outposts in low/medium debris areas) safer than going through high debris areas and also helpful in low key missions/unarmed like the shuttle.he

ZEON's ojective is to test the new ZAKU IIs in a real battle. They want no survivors so the tech wont leak but battle data is more important than covertness since the ZAKU II is about to enter the production stage. ZEON is unaware of the shuttle since it is behind the debris belt and heading toward Earth. (it's also at such an angle that the gap in the belt is not colinear with the shuttle and the outpost. The only reason the shuttle occupants are aware of the battle is because of the explosions.

For those of you didn't notice the signifigance, this is my variation of the first episode of 08th MS Team.
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Old 2006-03-14, 00:36   Link #16
Komataguri
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I'd just position my moble suits on unique vectors, use verneir bursts to push the suita long with large bits of debris infront of it onto a convergence point onto the base, and bust out from behind the debris just as everyone entered the base to land, Then light it up.



Altho, if they are testing the Zaku IIs, which were introduced before the GM, Why are there GMs?
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Old 2006-03-14, 01:04   Link #17
4Tran
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Given the scenario, the Zeon's primary objective is not to combat test the Zaku II, but to avoid letting it be seen by the Federation forces. There's no real reason to attack the Federation outpost, so I would do what Aina should have done: retreat, and wait for a more opportune chance to combat test the prototype. After all, you're going to get lots of chances to test it out, but only one chance to guarantee its secrecy.

However, this answer is sort of aesthetically unsatisfactory, so I'm going to change the scenario. Here, the Federation outpost is an unarmed forward listening post so its destruction would greatly boost the Zeon effectiveness in this sector. Since the Zeon troops have scouted out the outpost in advance, they are aware of its defenders. They also know about the advantage they could gain by using the debris field and that the GMs don't know that they are in the area. The Zakus detect the shuttle's approach, and determine that it's at most a lightly-armed opponent.

One of the most effective plans in this scenario, is the classic divide and conquer. Keep two Zakus in hiding and send off the last one to attack the shuttle, and let the outpost see you sortieing. Done properly, the Federation will assume that there's only one Zaku, and that it's attacking a defensiveless friendly.

If they take the bait, they'll probably send 2-3 GMs to protect the shuttle. Once those mobile suits have travelled too far from the outpost, the other two Zakus will spring their trap. A surprise attack while the outpost's attention is riveted in a different direction will probably bring down the remaining GMs (maybe with one survivor to finish off). With the mission accomplished, the seperated Zaku will break off the attack and go to the rendevous point with the rest of the squad.

If the GMs don't take the bait, and don't send anyone, the lead Zaku will finish its attack on the shuttle (likely destroying it), and the other two will remain in hiding. They can try for the main prize later.
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Old 2006-03-16, 00:57   Link #18
SWPIGWANG
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4tran, you are too clever for stuff like this

Well, I guess I'll have try a few thing at this
Quote:
3) You have heavy support weapons that can destroy their spacecraft as it takes off.
The Zeon commander might be able to call your bluff depending on the exact sistuation involved. If this is before deployment of things like GM sniper, it might not be believed. The fact that their front isn't not being hit very hard by heavy weapons is an good indication this might be a bluff. If they have good recon, which may involve infilitrating infantry or magellen top tanks, it might clear all possible firelanes to the HLV. That said, this is an fine plan since it doesn't involve anything on your side, but an backup plan is needed just in case.

Personally, if it is possible one can just blow up the HLV with core fighters and that ends it.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Okay, new scenario:

Force Recon:

Environment: Space, High Minovsky Jamming Environment

Force:

Zeon: 3 Zaku IIF armed with standard 120mm and heat hawk in Tight formation. No heavy weapons is avaible.

Federation: Local area forces in the way of the Zaku: 2 GM, together 5 spacefighters in highly scattered formation. Support forces: (behind the front) 2 Salamis Kai, with 1 GM ready to launch.


Objectives:
Zeon: Breakthrough the Federation screen and try to find the force that launched this force and return that information to the main force.

Federation: Destroy the enemy Zakus while suffering the minimum casualities. (attrition) Due to the Zaku being based on an astroid fortress with large MS holding capacity, deep pursuit is not allowed. Stealth is not a massive concern according to higher command.

----note that objectives are not mutually known, and completion of your ownside's objective comes ahead of denying the enemy. Assume enemy intension as unknow in this scenario.

Sistuation:
Zeon: spotted enemy picketing space fighter at close to maximum viewing range before losing contact.

Federation: Picketing space fighter have reported enemy MS contact and is now retreating towards the main force.
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Old 2006-03-16, 01:37   Link #19
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWPIGWANG
4tran, you are too clever for stuff like this
Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SWPIGWANG
The Zeon commander might be able to call your bluff depending on the exact sistuation involved. If this is before deployment of things like GM sniper, it might not be believed. The fact that their front isn't not being hit very hard by heavy weapons is an good indication this might be a bluff. If they have good recon, which may involve infilitrating infantry or magellen top tanks, it might clear all possible firelanes to the HLV. That said, this is an fine plan since it doesn't involve anything on your side, but an backup plan is needed just in case.
Actually, it doesn't have to be a bluff at all. The "support" specified may well include the kind of weapons that can take out a HLV. After all, the Federation could be threatening with anything from heavy artillery to fighters. The HLV is especially vulnerable on take off since it seems like it can only go straight up. The Federation would be able to get a clear shot at it from just about anywhere, so there are effectively an unlimited number of potential firelanes.

SWPIGWANG, if you've ever looked at games theory, you'd see why the Zeon commander simply cannot assume that it's a bluff. The likelihood of it not being a bluff is simply too high, and the consequences are too severe to ignore. Meanwhile, assuming that the Federation does have the weapons is much less risky. Incidentally, this is the same kind of risk/gain outcomes Aina Sakhalin should have weighed. I can't help but feel that she made a poor decision.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SWPIGWANG
Personally, if it is possible one can just blow up the HLV with core fighters and that ends it.
That's not a bad backup plan.

I'll try to work on your scenario later.
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Old 2006-03-17, 22:45   Link #20
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWPIGWANG
Okay, new scenario:

Force Recon:
I've got a couple of questions, what was the Federation unit's mission before encountering the enemy? How many enemy mobile suits did the pickets pick up?
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