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Old 2008-09-01, 18:21   Link #1401
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
Two possible reasons:

a) Tanigawa hated the ending he wrote and decided to rewrite it;
I might understand that. The 2 continuity writing really slowed things down, and the presence of Saski as a "God" being similiar to Haruhi, really brings into question the plausibility of Kyon being important to both those individuals.
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Old 2008-09-01, 18:34   Link #1402
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
I might understand that. The 2 continuity writing really slowed things down, and the presence of Saski as a "God" being similiar to Haruhi, really brings into question the plausibility of Kyon being important to both those individuals.
How so?

Haruhi is clearly in love with him, but doesn't understand why, and Sasaki is also probably in love with him, but doesn't understand love in the first place.
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Old 2008-09-01, 19:11   Link #1403
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
How so?

Haruhi is clearly in love with him, but doesn't understand why, and Sasaki is also probably in love with him, but doesn't understand love in the first place.
Just pointing out the statistical improbability of Kyon having met God A years prior and developing a close friendship, then going right on to the next school and meeting God B and doing the same thing. I can accept him meeting one of them as plausible without anything else going on, but both makes it very suspicious. It comes off less as Kyon walking into a bizarre scenario, as more of Kyon being part of the bizarre scenario from the beginning.

Think of it as being the difference between someone wining the lottery, and someone winning the lottery twice in a row. One is rare but possible, but when it happens a second time you assume that something besides chance is at work.
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Old 2008-09-01, 21:22   Link #1404
typhonsentra
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I think as they become less similar the parallel stories could be interesting, although it is hard to keep track of which story is which even when reading it through the first time. I imagine I'll have to reread the whole thing if we ever get Volume 10.

One thing though, if he really is so unsatisfied with the way the story is going, I think I could forgive him retconning the whole thing and writing a new, unrelated "Volume 9" (Say, in Volume 10 it's all said to of been a dream in the prologue.... or something.). It's better than his publisher forcing him to write something he isn't happy with, right?
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Old 2008-09-01, 23:06   Link #1405
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Just pointing out the statistical improbability of Kyon having met God A years prior and developing a close friendship, then going right on to the next school and meeting God B and doing the same thing. I can accept him meeting one of them as plausible without anything else going on, but both makes it very suspicious. It comes off less as Kyon walking into a bizarre scenario, as more of Kyon being part of the bizarre scenario from the beginning.
Are you starting to value Kyonism?
( I am not taking position, just speaking of options)
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Old 2008-09-01, 23:36   Link #1406
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
Just pointing out the statistical improbability of Kyon having met God A years prior and developing a close friendship, then going right on to the next school and meeting God B and doing the same thing. I can accept him meeting one of them as plausible without anything else going on, but both makes it very suspicious. It comes off less as Kyon walking into a bizarre scenario, as more of Kyon being part of the bizarre scenario from the beginning.

Think of it as being the difference between someone wining the lottery, and someone winning the lottery twice in a row. One is rare but possible, but when it happens a second time you assume that something besides chance is at work.
It's certainly a possibility that Kyon is responsible for their powers, but I think Kyonism is a stupid theory.

It's more likely that Sasaki is the way she is because of Haruhi's powers, not the other way around like Kyoko believes. To be precise, that since Haruhi desired a rival, Sasaki was made one in every way possible, not just in the way Haruhi intended...
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Old 2008-09-02, 00:08   Link #1407
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I think I would like that (Haruhi created a rival). Kyonism would be sooo stupid. I don't think it would be possible to hate Haruhi (as in the series), but if this is the case I don't think I can hold much good will toward it.

But more importantly, I just want this arc to be resolved ASAP, because the mirror team is lame. Hopefully there will be a satisfiying ending, hopefully with the mirror team going away.
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Old 2008-09-02, 00:30   Link #1408
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I agree on the rival idea. Haruhi decided that what she needed was an opponentl who could be her equal--hence Sasaki, who was probably already a potential rival for Kyon's attention, got endowed with Haruhi-like powers (possibly retroactive back to July 7). And to make it more interesting, Sasaki was endowed with her own mirror-SOS-dan, complete with attendant alien, esper, and time traveler factions.
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Old 2008-09-02, 00:36   Link #1409
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraploy View Post
I think I would like that (Haruhi created a rival). Kyonism would be sooo stupid. I don't think it would be possible to hate Haruhi (as in the series), but if this is the case I don't think I can hold much good will toward it.

But more importantly, I just want this arc to be resolved ASAP, because the mirror team is lame. Hopefully there will be a satisfiying ending, hopefully with the mirror team going away.
The mirror team is not "lame". They're evil, and have potential as characters. They can't be "lame".

Besides, Fujiwara is Magnificent Bastard quality. He needs to do more evil laughs and take over more small, poor countries.
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Old 2008-09-02, 07:03   Link #1410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
It's certainly a possibility that Kyon is responsible for their powers, but I think Kyonism is a stupid theory.

It's more likely that Sasaki is the way she is because of Haruhi's powers, not the other way around like Kyoko believes. To be precise, that since Haruhi desired a rival, Sasaki was made one in every way possible, not just in the way Haruhi intended...
So Haruhi retroactively made one of Kyons friends an "Ex god"?

That's possible.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
The mirror team is not "lame". They're evil, and have potential as characters. They can't be "lame".

Besides, Fujiwara is Magnificent Bastard quality. He needs to do more evil laughs and take over more small, poor countries.
We don't really know about any of the factions to say one way or another.
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Old 2008-09-02, 07:24   Link #1411
ganbaru
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
Besides, Fujiwara is Magnificent Bastard quality. He needs to do more evil laughs and take over more small, poor countries.
For taking ''more small ,poor countries'' fujiwara would need to be a''Powerful Magnificent Bastard'' Without power, the ''Magnificient Bastard''s are just like annoying moron.
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Old 2008-09-02, 09:57   Link #1412
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Originally Posted by ganbaru View Post
For taking ''more small ,poor countries'' fujiwara would need to be a''Powerful Magnificent Bastard'' Without power, the ''Magnificient Bastard''s are just like annoying moron.
Magnificent Bastard
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Old 2008-09-02, 12:14   Link #1413
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Hedd View Post
Jinnai really isn't a good example. Lelouch Lamperogue, on the other hand...
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Old 2008-09-02, 15:12   Link #1414
Roger Rambo
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The idea that Haruhi wished the entire Saski situation into existence does seem a bit improbable when you consider it...

Has Haruhi ever used her powers to do something that would make her unhappy? Prior to Kyon meeting Saski she had been extremely happy relative to before she met Kyon (Measured in number of closed spaces), but afterwords the level had fallen back to pre SOS levels. It seems a bit odd that Haruhi would subconsciously wish for a situation that would make her miserable.
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Old 2008-09-02, 16:54   Link #1415
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Well whatever the case may be, the guy wrote himself into a hole that would be difficult to get out of.
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Old 2008-09-02, 17:38   Link #1416
Kaisos Erranon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
The idea that Haruhi wished the entire Saski situation into existence does seem a bit improbable when you consider it...

Has Haruhi ever used her powers to do something that would make her unhappy? Prior to Kyon meeting Saski she had been extremely happy relative to before she met Kyon (Measured in number of closed spaces), but afterwords the level had fallen back to pre SOS levels. It seems a bit odd that Haruhi would subconsciously wish for a situation that would make her miserable.
You have a point, but does anything Haruhi does really have to make a lot of sense?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Miraploy View Post
Well whatever the case may be, the guy wrote himself into a hole that would be difficult to get out of.
Please explain how that constitues writing himself into a hole. We don't even know the conclusion yet.
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Old 2008-09-02, 19:20   Link #1417
ganbaru
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Rambo View Post
The idea that Haruhi wished the entire Saski situation into existence does seem a bit improbable when you consider it...

Has Haruhi ever used her powers to do something that would make her unhappy? Prior to Kyon meeting Saski she had been extremely happy relative to before she met Kyon (Measured in number of closed spaces), but afterwords the level had fallen back to pre SOS levels. It seems a bit odd that Haruhi would subconsciously wish for a situation that would make her miserable.
The number of closed spaces is the same as pre-SOS level, but the activity in the closed space is different, and not born from the same kind of feeling.
The first were born from her dissatisfaction towaard the world ( how boring the world is), and the news are born from her inconfort created by the discovery fo Sasaki ( and her ''relation'' with Kyon).
The only way I could see than Haruhi would want ( consciouslu or inconsciously) to ''battle'' Sakaki would be for making her dissapear ( at least from her live).
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Old 2008-09-02, 19:49   Link #1418
typhonsentra
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When will the Escape from School book he's working on come out?
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Old 2008-09-02, 20:17   Link #1419
Roger Rambo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
You have a point, but does anything Haruhi does really have to make a lot of sense?
To an extent it does.

Manipulating the method for rearranging seating so Kyon's always behind her
-Desire to be close to Kyon because she likes him

Attempted new world attempt, and dragging Kyon along
-Desire to abandon the old world as part of her disappointment with the SOS brigade not finding anything, and her anxiety over Kyon

Various random world changes during the movie filming
-Haruhi's EXTREMELY overactive imagination in response to the movie.


It seems odd that she'd purposely create a situation where there was was even a hint of Kyon paying attention to another girl.
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Old 2008-09-02, 20:31   Link #1420
Miraploy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
Please explain how that constitues writing himself into a hole. We don't even know the conclusion yet.
Well it's just speculation. I assumed that something of the sort happened because he hasn't released anything yet, and several people here agree with me.

Plz not another argument.
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