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Old 2011-04-04, 12:18   Link #1481
GundamAce
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I'd recommend Tsukihime, which was my first VN ever. It's got a good story, average playing time, gives you a good idea of what the route system is like, and has a standard number of routes. In short, it has pretty much all of the standards you would get out of a VN.

Clannad's good, but it may be too long for a first VN. Even I'm not done with it yet.
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Old 2011-04-04, 15:02   Link #1482
winkel
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I think Tsukihime would even be too extreme for a good first time. First time should be something simple in genre, pretty and presentable, and short and more ADV-like, imo.
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Old 2011-04-04, 15:40   Link #1483
chaos_alfa
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Maybe Crescendo. It's a very standard visual novel, but maybe because of it not as fun.
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Old 2011-04-04, 19:54   Link #1484
waffo
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And of course 999 is a bad idea because I hear it borrows a lot of stuff from Ever17, right? Then again, with the solving bits, it's not traditional, anyway.
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Old 2011-04-04, 20:07   Link #1485
VDZ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamAce View Post
Clannad's good, but it may be too long for a first VN. Even I'm not done with it yet.
It's long if you clear every single route. But that's the best thing about Clannad as starter VN - from start to story to route end isn't all that long at all. The game is just huge because of the amount of routes it has. It's not like Ever17, where you need to have finished every route to really enjoy it; every route tells a separate story (except for After Story for obvious reasons).
To get an impression of the genre, you only have to clear one route. Then if it's your kind of thing, you'll start trying other routes and learn about the path system. Tsukihime's path system is very vague; you can't even determine whose route you're on without asking people.

When I was new to VNs, I thought Tsukihime was boring (yes, really). It's all walls of text, you have to fiddle with things to even get music, and while I won't call the graphics bad it's nothing to be blown away by. For a newbie, it's rather hard to get into. I would recommend Ever17 over Tsukihime as starter VN (I had read Ever17 before trying Tsukihime).

Quote:
Originally Posted by waffo View Post
And of course 999 is a bad idea because I hear it borrows a lot of stuff from Ever17, right? Then again, with the solving bits, it's not traditional, anyway.
Yes. I'd go as far as saying Ever17 is probably less awesome if you've played 999 beforehand (and vice-versa - 999 disappointed me mainly because I'd already played Ever17).
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Old 2011-04-04, 20:37   Link #1486
Jao
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Kanon was the first visual novel I ever played and I think it's a damn good start point.
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Old 2011-04-04, 21:25   Link #1487
GundamAce
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Originally Posted by VDZ View Post
It's long if you clear every single route. But that's the best thing about Clannad as starter VN - from start to story to route end isn't all that long at all. The game is just huge because of the amount of routes it has. It's not like Ever17, where you need to have finished every route to really enjoy it; every route tells a separate story (except for After Story for obvious reasons).
To get an impression of the genre, you only have to clear one route. Then if it's your kind of thing, you'll start trying other routes and learn about the path system. Tsukihime's path system is very vague; you can't even determine whose route you're on without asking people.

When I was new to VNs, I thought Tsukihime was boring (yes, really). It's all walls of text, you have to fiddle with things to even get music, and while I won't call the graphics bad it's nothing to be blown away by. For a newbie, it's rather hard to get into. I would recommend Ever17 over Tsukihime as starter VN (I had read Ever17 before trying Tsukihime).
I had no problems with that whatsoever- as a first time VN player, I was really intrigued by the storytelling and the characters, and though I admit the graphics were average, I don't think you really need good graphics to tell a good story.

What do you mean by fiddling to get music? My version already had music when I installed it without any problems whatsoever.
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Old 2011-04-04, 21:35   Link #1488
LostHanyou
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I'm going to mention Fate since it is my true love~

Actually Ever 17 is the first VN I've had a problem getting into, so I don't see the problem with Clannad or Tsukihime.
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Old 2011-04-05, 01:07   Link #1489
waffo
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I guess I'll have to give him an option between slice-of-life and supernatural fighting stuff (just generalizing). Oh, if it makes a difference, he really likes the Higurashi anime. But I have no idea if 1. that's fully translated yet and 2. if that visual novel is typical or if it...you know, messes with the player.

And I'm like GundamAce in that hearing Clannad mentioned made me think of him being forced to sit through that 300 hour guide (that I'm actually in the middle of) and forgetting that just a few routes would do just fine.
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Old 2011-04-05, 02:05   Link #1490
Usami_Haru
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The higurashi VN is fully translated so he can try that. Umineko no naku koro ni is also a good starter VN.
But he has to be able to handle the bad art if he wants to read those.
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Old 2011-04-05, 02:35   Link #1491
chaos_alfa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waffo View Post
I guess I'll have to give him an option between slice-of-life and supernatural fighting stuff (just generalizing). Oh, if it makes a difference, he really likes the Higurashi anime. But I have no idea if 1. that's fully translated yet and 2. if that visual novel is typical or if it...you know, messes with the player.

And I'm like GundamAce in that hearing Clannad mentioned made me think of him being forced to sit through that 300 hour guide (that I'm actually in the middle of) and forgetting that just a few routes would do just fine.
Higurashi is fully translated and you can buy it here:

http://www.mangagamer.com/allages/

Yesterday they even released a trail version.


The Higurashi visual novel is very good with messing with it readers mind, it's one of the things that makes it so good.
But if your friend has already seen all of the Higurashi anime the mindfucks won't work on him anymore so a big part of its charm will go away.

PS Higurashi is my favorite visual novel.

Last edited by chaos_alfa; 2011-04-05 at 09:06.
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Old 2011-04-05, 07:34   Link #1492
GundamAce
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Originally Posted by Usami_Haru View Post
The higurashi VN is fully translated so he can try that. Umineko no naku koro ni is also a good starter VN.
But he has to be able to handle the bad art if he wants to read those.
Not true, he could always use the PS2 patches.
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Old 2011-04-05, 11:37   Link #1493
Blue-kun
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What do you mean by fiddling to get music? My version already had music when I installed it without any problems whatsoever.
I think a lot of people had to extract them from a CD before having them play into the actual game. And a lot of people decided to replace the original score with that arrange album that came out later, because as a whole the general opinion is that the music is very very annoying/bad, and the arranges at the very least made them more bearable.

"On topic", however, I wouldn't recommend Fate to a first time player. It's interesting, but far too big. Back then, I think the first title I ever read was Planetarian, which was very short but easy to get into, not to mention it had a very pretty story which, if played on a rainy day, made it quite atmospheric. Nowadays there are tons of other good (short) titles out there, though. Depending on what sort of person you are, a lot of small games like the Nitro+ ones have been translated and you could probably get into those. The only con I see is that they're usually written in a very mature way and more often than not deal with very touchy subjects such as rape etc.

Anyway, Higurashi seems like it might be a good place to start. If a bit confusing, it can get pretty interesting not too long into it, and since it's divided into the whole different episodes you get a climax early on, without having to read through a "whole" game. Plus, it has all of those club activities to help newcomers get used to the craziness by introducing likeable characters doing funny stuff.
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Old 2011-04-05, 12:09   Link #1494
waffo
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As long as Higurashi doesn't have any twists that ruin some of the fun of Ever17, I'm willing to recommend it. He asks all the time what's so epic about it and why it can't be adapted into an anime or manga and it's so annoying that I can't even give him an example because he'd overanalyze it.
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Old 2011-04-05, 12:34   Link #1495
GundamAce
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Originally Posted by waffo View Post
As long as Higurashi doesn't have any twists that ruin some of the fun of Ever17, I'm willing to recommend it. He asks all the time what's so epic about it and why it can't be adapted into an anime or manga and it's so annoying that I can't even give him an example because he'd overanalyze it.
Sure, that sounds good. Just make sure he installs the PS2 and music patches.
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Old 2011-04-05, 13:45   Link #1496
winkel
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The only reason I'm against recommending Higurashi or Planetarian is because they're visual novels, and not ADVs like Ever 17, so if you want to introduce him to an ADV, they'd be not representative of that at all. But if you want to introduce him to visual novels, then it's fine.
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Old 2011-04-05, 14:29   Link #1497
chaos_alfa
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Originally Posted by waffo View Post
As long as Higurashi doesn't have any twists that ruin some of the fun of Ever17, I'm willing to recommend it. He asks all the time what's so epic about it and why it can't be adapted into an anime or manga and it's so annoying that I can't even give him an example because he'd overanalyze it.
I don't know how long the trial version on Mangagamer's site is, but there's also a translated demo of Higurashi which consist of the whole first chapter.

You can get it here:
http://sonozakifutagotachi.blogspot....-releases.html

P.S.: Every chapter is a story on it self.
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Old 2011-04-05, 16:01   Link #1498
waffo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winkel View Post
The only reason I'm against recommending Higurashi or Planetarian is because they're visual novels, and not ADVs like Ever 17, so if you want to introduce him to an ADV, they'd be not representative of that at all. But if you want to introduce him to visual novels, then it's fine.
I had to look up what ADV was since I was fairly certain you were not talking about the defunct anime distributor. Wow, I don't think I'd like having my text all over the background like that... Now I'm veering back towards Clannad...
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Old 2011-04-05, 16:14   Link #1499
Jao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waffo View Post
I had to look up what ADV was since I was fairly certain you were not talking about the defunct anime distributor. Wow, I don't think I'd like having my text all over the background like that... Now I'm veering back towards Clannad...
Small controlled dialogue and description vs far more complex and sprawling prose.

I don't think I could ever write for an ADV. The format is just far too restrictive.
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Old 2011-04-05, 16:22   Link #1500
GundamAce
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Both have the advantages and disadvantages. But the text in the backgrounds doesn't really bug me. Don't let that influence your choice.
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