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Old 2011-06-30, 03:34   Link #9261
Ricky Controversy
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@Ending

I'm going to play Devil's (hah) Advocate here, because I know the easy knee-jerk reaction is to say "oh, the fundie is at fault" because she happens to be a fundie, but the way you articulated the whole thing has me thinking that, honestly, you're as much at fault as she is.

You seem to have little respect for her religion. You refer to her belief in certain elements of it as having bought it, and you say things were 'sorted' because her religion wasn't a regular element of daily life: in short, you didn't have to put up with much of that lifestyle you don't respect. I'm not here to defend fundamentalism or Seventh Day Adventism. Nor am I here to peddle the tired line about respecting everyone's beliefs.

What I will say is that it's a painfully idiotic idea to enter into a relationship with someone whose leanings in such an area cause you grief or 'insult' you, whether they seem to be majorly present or not. This isn't something you can shrug off or grow around, like a difference in musical taste or what have you. This is a thing that peoples' lives can turn around, and you have to be realistic enough to think the ramifications of that possibility through.

When I was younger and still an atheist, I dated a devout Christian girl whom I knew believed certain things that I had a lot of trouble with. I told myself "this won't come up, it's not a problem now," the whole time, and the relationship went great. Then we had a conversation about injustice and everything blew wide open. It's the exact same recipe for the exact same land mine.

If she's guilty of trying to change you, you're guilty of trying to ignore a piece of her into irrelevance. You knew certain things about her, you chose to ignore them, and you act now like the wronged party? No, no. You both messed up. End of lesson.
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Old 2011-06-30, 04:14   Link #9262
Ending
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@ Ricky Controversy

You misunderstand. Religion is a personal matter and we keep it that way. I see it as a flaw, but it's not why I would break up with her. Like said: we keep it to ourselves and focus on the other aspects of life. (Yes, we have had many talks about this.) I'm simply questioning the hint that she is banging some other guy while giving me false hopes, since she really is religious.
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Old 2011-06-30, 04:32   Link #9263
Flinch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
@ Ricky Controversy

You misunderstand. Religion is a personal matter and we keep it that way. I see it as a flaw, but it's not why I would break up with her. Like said: we keep it to ourselves and focus on the other aspects of life. (Yes, we have had many talks about this.) I'm simply questioning the hint that she is banging some other guy while giving me false hopes, since she really is religious.
I've learned to have to bite my tongue a great deal when it comes to religion, but I'll be frank here. I can understand the merits of the few things it proposes, but the moment you try and hide behind it and use it as an excuse, I've found it frustrating. I've always felt that people who would do that were never truly being honest with themselves, and hiding behind something to hide their insecurities or fears.
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Old 2011-06-30, 05:16   Link #9264
Ascaloth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
@ Ricky Controversy

You misunderstand. Religion is a personal matter and we keep it that way. I see it as a flaw, but it's not why I would break up with her. Like said: we keep it to ourselves and focus on the other aspects of life. (Yes, we have had many talks about this.) I'm simply questioning the hint that she is banging some other guy while giving me false hopes, since she really is religious.
Oi oi, it's your fault to begin with. The way you worded your initial post, the idea that your girlfriend pulled the 'no sex before marriage because religion' card out of her ass was a perfectly reasonable conclusion to leap to, you know.

And you know, I think I'm going to join the 'let's pile on Ending' club, too. If you expected religious beliefs to be a purely personal matter that will have no effect on your relationship, then you obviously haven't realized the power of the religion meme on human brains.

I vaguely remember having said on this same thread that 'religion is one of the biggest killers of relationships' or something to that effect, for a very good reason. Beliefs of this kind, once they take root in a person's psyche, pretty much orders that said person's entire paradigm, which includes how that person behaves in social relationship, especially of the romantic variety.

You honestly thought she would put her entire belief system aside just for you? You honestly thought she wouldn't try to change you to fit her beliefs instead? You honestly thought it wouldn't be an issue once you two get married, and even once it comes time to educate the kids? Really?

If so, maybe I can interest you in this prime piece of engineering, which connects the economic powerhouse of Singapore with Malaysia, a nation it shares a great deal of history with...

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Old 2011-06-30, 07:53   Link #9265
Moczo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
@ Ricky Controversy

You misunderstand. Religion is a personal matter and we keep it that way. I see it as a flaw, but it's not why I would break up with her. Like said: we keep it to ourselves and focus on the other aspects of life. (Yes, we have had many talks about this.) I'm simply questioning the hint that she is banging some other guy while giving me false hopes, since she really is religious.
.... I hate to gang up on you, but I... well, actually, I don't hate it at all.

Your initial post gave the impression that her religion was a fairly new thing, which made it sound like her,'no sex before marriage' stance was an excuse. But now it seems like she's always been very religious and you were just hoping it would never affect you because she was usually good about not throwing it in your face? I'm sorry, but that just smacks of denial. You had to know that the more serious your relationship got, the more her religion would begin to come into play. It's hard to find one that doesn't have some sort of rules regarding sex and marriage, and if she is genuinely devout it was always going to come up...
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Old 2011-06-30, 09:03   Link #9266
DonQuigleone
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Religion is integral to your entire outlook on life, it defines what your philosophical views are.

Even a non-fundy christian and atheist are going to experience problems down the road, particularly as they become closer together. It's very important that two people in a relationship share similiar views on matters of ethics and basic philosophy. If she thinks that at a basic level that belief in god is morally important, that will always be a wedge. When a person is younger they might ignore these things a little, but people tend to become a lot more entrenched in their views as they age, particularly surrounding important life decisions.

And of course, if they're in one of the more religious branches (7th day adventists for instance), then you only have yourself to blame. If the person feels religion is important to them, you have to respect that fact and realise that this is a central part of their life. It doesn't make you or they bad people, I myself have had great religious friends (of various levels of religiousity), but I doubt we could last if we went into a relationship together. Invariably our disagreements on basic ethics would spin out of control. And it's not just the "But I want to have sex thing", it's as much the "But you're going to go to hell! I don't want to see that happen to you!" or "But how do you know what's the right thing to do without gods guidance", and of course these things can end out also pulling in personal squabbles. Ignoring religion is simply delaying a series of inevitable and painfully personal arguments for later.

I'd personally only consider dating a religious person if they were on the edge of going atheist. It creates too many complications otherwise.

If you knew going in that she was very religious, you only had yourself to blame. And if she does try and convert you later, it will be quite logical, as she's trying to help the person she cares about. Of course you won't consider that "helping"...
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Old 2011-06-30, 16:51   Link #9267
Malkuth
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Religion and real world... well, they just do not work together; God, gods, ghosts 'n' goblins, try to enforce an unnatural way of life. Not to be totalitarian, they work as long as you wish to go against your natural urges, but that's it, like a Hollywood film, it works for a couple of hours, religion and stuff do so for a couple of decades

EDIT: Kind of expected religious freaks to neg-rep too much possitive feedback lately feels just wrong

Last edited by Malkuth; 2011-06-30 at 19:49.
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Old 2011-06-30, 20:31   Link #9268
RadiantBeam
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Ending, I'm going to be honest. I think before you go and break up with her, you at least should talk to her about her views on religion, and on yours. It won't be very peaceful, I'm sure, and it will probably be a little painful. But it will clear the air for both of you, let you talk things out, and give you both an idea of where you stand in the relationship, and whether or not you want to continue with it.

That's what I would do, anyway.
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Old 2011-06-30, 20:35   Link #9269
Malkuth
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Hehe, what's up with you guys, gals, and in betweens? I was about to propuse to a pro, everyone despie past or current habits deserves love
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Old 2011-07-01, 00:36   Link #9270
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
@ Ricky Controversy

You misunderstand. Religion is a personal matter and we keep it that way. I see it as a flaw, but it's not why I would break up with her. Like said: we keep it to ourselves and focus on the other aspects of life. (Yes, we have had many talks about this.) I'm simply questioning the hint that she is banging some other guy while giving me false hopes, since she really is religious.
Speaking as a Catholic here, I'll tell you what that translates to:

You see her as flawed.


Nothing more, nothing less. Break up, remain friends if you wish since you seem to get on well. Hearing that from a guy who I would have feelings for would break my heart if not destroy my confidence.
"He sees me as flawed..."
This also:
Quote:
But the good thing is that we had it sorted until now, since it really doesn't show in every day life. She makes her prayers quickly and mutely, and the talk about creation and whatnot has never been important to me.
Nothing was sorted, it sounds like she had to hide it all this time when near ya, she's not free to express a part of who she is, huh...

Of course, I agree that faith is a private affair which is great when friends.
But as a couple, that kinda relationship is anything but platonic.
It's personal, it's deep, you mutually expose and trust each other and if her faith is fairly embedded in her as mine is (or perhaps she's even more devout than me going by the sound of things), that sentence or your thought right there says everything.

I personally wouldn't even try, if there's a guy who I've good chemistry with but they're an atheist or a muslim or wiccan, it doesn't take a blind monkey to know there's no future as a couple/family if both are set in their ways, but I'll definitely be their friend and support them and so on.
The world is varied and diverse, there is someone for everybody but trying to force a relationship on the fear of being 'close minded', to me is hypocritical, far more damaging than anything.
I see it no different to forcing Syn to play 'a man', staying in her original body' or forcing Chey to be monogomous anymore than I can 'switch off' not believing in a Higher Being.

And since those two I've referenced have sure as hell tried to explain their very existance on this website for years, the rest of you will know or gain a sense of how religion can also be part of someone's DNA. (Figuratively)
Yes, it's learnt as are many social norms, but it can be casted off (as many do) if a person didn't truly 'believe' or feel anything of their own accord.

If there's no hate or malice behind an action, it's not racist, fascist, sexist, ageist, etc, etc, etc. That's coming from a person living in Japan where if I was American, I could sue for some 'emotional distress' reason almost every month.
(Very similar to my smoking issue, the bottom line being we wouldn't be able to even coincide peacefully in daily life, WTF are we gonna try for a relationship for that's bound to be filled with strain and tension?)

If you have the time/emotional energy to try and see first (if it's no good, then it's no good), then that's okay however I sense the humans involved would be very practical peeps.

Dating, love, lust and the rest most of the time is anything but practical
(In actuality anyways, in theory, it's always great...)

PS: Malkuth, it's not being a 'freak' but just simply outta shit stirring on something sensitive and important that hurts others, I'll indulge you too.
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Last edited by Mystique; 2011-07-01 at 00:54.
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Old 2011-07-01, 01:30   Link #9271
Ending
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Guess I asked for this when I brought up religion. Like throwing shit into the fan

Anyway, I wouldn't expect anyone to be perfect. Her being zealously religious is a flaw, but then me being an atheist is also a flaw to her. Call it even. Yes, her religion shows, but only every Saturday and when she meets other religious people. Otherwise there is no mention of it and I don't see it as a pivotal point of our relationship. So don't point a finger at our difference in religion and say: "This! This right here is the reason!"
Because it's not. We are morally the same, except that she calls herself an adventist and I call myself atheist.

The problem is everything else that's piling on top of it:
- Long separation and the threat of it becoming even longer, if she wants to keep her job
- Lack of intimacy (she went and changed the rules of our relationship, making it something I wouldn't had gone into if it had been so from the start)
- Her need to be independent (doesn't sound like she is ready to commit)
- Bunking with another guy (gay or not, friend or not). She lives in a poor country, mind.
- Contact with her ex, which to me is kinda no-no, but alone isn't a big deal
...And generally, the feeling that I'm not even in the top-5 of her priorities. She got her family, her school, friends, religion, her aspirations, and soon her job taking priority. It doesn't make me feel too good about my place in her life.

Two years is a long time and I guess what I'm wondering is that should I simply find another woman, who has less objections against coming together after a reasonable dating time.

Quote:
When a person is younger they might ignore these things a little, but people tend to become a lot more entrenched in their views as they age, particularly surrounding important life decisions.
Yeah, this has to be added to the list too, since we had one argument about kids. She actually said that she wants them to love God more than life itself, more than their parents, and them becoming atheists would mean she had failed as a parent. It's slightly irritating, but I could live with it and let her go her way.

Also, she has tried to convert me too, going along the same lines: "I would want you to love God more than anything, more than me." To which I replied that if the Big Guy sends me an angel, in flesh, sure. But since she believes that only dead people can see angels, she blurted that she will be praying for my death. Speaking about a shocker. A mistake, but it did make me wonder.

Last edited by Ending; 2011-07-01 at 01:43.
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Old 2011-07-01, 02:27   Link #9272
Ascaloth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
Anyway, I wouldn't expect anyone to be perfect. Her being zealously religious is a flaw, but then me being an atheist is also a flaw to her. Call it even. Yes, her religion shows, but only every Saturday and when she meets other religious people. Otherwise there is no mention of it and I don't see it as a pivotal point of our relationship. So don't point a finger at our difference in religion and say: "This! This right here is the reason!"
Because it's not. We are morally the same, except that she calls herself an adventist and I call myself atheist.
Hurr, no. Ask her how she determines her moral values, and I'll practically guarantee that her answer will put the lie to that statement of yours.

And really, I'm not buying this, because of what you said afterwards;

Quote:
Yeah, this has to be added to the list too, since we had one argument about kids. She actually said that she wants them to love God more than life itself, more than their parents, and them becoming atheists would mean she had failed as a parent. It's slightly irritating, but I could live with it and let her go her way.

Also, she has tried to convert me too, going along the same lines: "I would want you to love God more than anything, more than me." To which I replied that if the Big Guy sends me an angel, in flesh, sure. But since she believes that only dead people can see angels, she blurted that she will be praying for my death. Speaking about a shocker. A mistake, but it did make me wonder.
The first point? A minor irritation now, but once you two are of age to have children, it will become a major issue, practically guaranteed.

The second point? Pretty much an obvious indication of the priority she's putting on the relationship, as well as a major underlying reason for it. You're concerned about how important you are to her? You'd be right, and this would be why.

Quote:
The problem is everything else that's piling on top of it:
- Long separation and the threat of it becoming even longer, if she wants to keep her job
- Lack of intimacy (she went and changed the rules of our relationship, making it something I wouldn't had gone into if it had been so from the start)
- Her need to be independent (doesn't sound like she is ready to commit)
- Bunking with another guy (gay or not, friend or not). She lives in a poor country, mind.
- Contact with her ex, which to me is kinda no-no, but alone isn't a big deal
...And generally, the feeling that I'm not even in the top-5 of her priorities. She got her family, her school, friends, religion, her aspirations, and soon her job taking priority. It doesn't make me feel too good about my place in her life.

Two years is a long time and I guess what I'm wondering is that should I simply find another woman, who has less objections against coming together after a reasonable dating time.
You know what, at this point, I'm questioning why you're even feeling the need to consult us. Clear as day, open-and-shut, you two are utterly incompatible, and I'm sure you know this in your heart. Really, the only justification I can think of for your apparent last-ditch attempt to save your relationship, is if she's got a hot piece of ass (and knowing how Christian churches seem to attract hot pieces of ass by the dozen, it's a fairly decent bet. ). Really, you emphasise the LDR a great deal, but to me it's almost an afterthought at this point compared with all the other negative points you've written up about her.

So, yes. You're better off doing the hot potato thing, or if you're not the natural jerkass that I am, letting her down gently. To be honest, this kind of thing should have been over long ago.
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Old 2011-07-01, 02:35   Link #9273
Tsuyoshi
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To be brutally honest, friend? I honestly don't believe this would end well if you two commit to something more long term. With all these issues you mention, it sounds more like she's distancing herself from you, be it intentional or not. The same exact thing happened with my ex, what with me being agnostic and her being a Muslim. Now, the problem wasn't the fact she was overly religious, but her family is made of hardline Muslims, and that made it really hard for me and her to commit to something, especially when she was very devoted to them from the start. Add to that the fact she was studying in China at the time made things worse. Because of all these things, and the fact I was becoming less and less of a priority to her, we had to break up and I tell you now, it was painful.

Your situation sounds very familiar to me so I need to tell you, if you plan on something more solid with her, like having kids, it's gonna be rough. My advice is this: break up with her, take some time to yourself, and when you feel ready, seek out another girl who is more open to possibilities, someone you can have easier discussions with and not worry about these differences and worries. This thing about her wanting her kids to love God more than life itself, more than themselves, would be slightly irritating even to MY parents, and they're pretty devout believers so that's saying a lot. A future with this girl, I find it pretty hard to swallow.

P.S. If I sounded rude, I do apologize for it was not my intention. I'm just trying to lay out what I make of your situation as clearly as I could.
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Old 2011-07-01, 03:29   Link #9274
Ending
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Quote:
Really, the only justification I can think of for your apparent last-ditch attempt to save your relationship, is if she's got a hot piece of ass
Ha, not really. But she is physically a good match never-the-less. Sadly, I'm one of those guys who would rather go through all options and stick to it before making the final call, because once I bend my mind over it, there won't be "us" ever again.

@ Tsuyoshi

Not rude. Almost like my case, word-to-word. Her family is hardline and she is very loyal to them. I have met them, though, and they have given their blessing. Interestingly, it's me who is heading to China

We agreed to have a month off. No contact at all and see how we feel after having a fresh start. That's when I gotta say would I go into this again or not. By the sound of the comments so far, I have every reason to say 'no.' Except for the feelings part, which is all 'yes' >.>
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Old 2011-07-01, 04:03   Link #9275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
Not rude. Almost like my case, word-to-word. Her family is hardline and she is very loyal to them. I have met them, though, and they have given their blessing. Interestingly, it's me who is heading to China

We agreed to have a month off. No contact at all and see how we feel after having a fresh start. That's when I gotta say would I go into this again or not. By the sound of the comments so far, I have every reason to say 'no.' Except for the feelings part, which is all 'yes' >.>
Circumstances may change in a month, could be on your end, could be on hers. I can understand that you feel so strongly for her, t'was the same for me. As ironic as it may sound, tho, feelings only take you so far. As far as I'm concerned, it ought to be otherwise, wherein if one feels for the other and vice versa, nothing else matters, and yes, not even religion. I give you credit for standing by that type of idea since you don't seem to mind her religion. It's more to do with her and her family (kudos to you that her fam is ok with you, I know my ex's fam would not, so you're in luck there at least ), but by the sound of it, she pays more tribute to God than the love she has for you.

Only recently, I attended a marriage where a couple did exactly that and you may as well have gone to Sunday mass for what it was worth. They were the type for that so all blessings and fortune to them. Your girl seems to be the type for that as well, tho I'm fairly certain you aren't, which is why I say that a future with her, if possible, is going to be really rough and sketchy. It's your call in the end, but take this from someone who'se pretty much been in your same position: either choice won't be easy, but staying by her will be much, much harder for you in the long run.
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Old 2011-07-01, 05:31   Link #9276
Dextro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
Speaking as a Catholic here, I'll tell you what that translates to:

You see her as flawed.


Nothing more, nothing less. Break up, remain friends if you wish since you seem to get on well. Hearing that from a guy who I would have feelings for would break my heart if not destroy my confidence.
"He sees me as flawed..."
Everyone's flawed, nobody's perfect. Get used to and deal with it. I may love a person a great deal but I won't delude myself to think she's perfect cause that's simply not true, she'll just be the closest thing to perfect in my mind.

As for the whole religion subject I won't touch it out of fear of triggering a storm of off-topic that might go into flame mode in this thread. I have very strong belief in my lack of belief (pun intended).

However I'll add this: while it's not unusual for couples to have different religious ideals and, unless one or both are fundamentalists, it can workout given smart enough people to accept each others conflicting views. In your case Ending it seems like your mind is made up and honestly it would be better for both of you to break up but especially to you since you've made it pretty clear that she, unlike you, isn't apparently fully committed to the relationship.
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Old 2011-07-01, 15:44   Link #9277
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My fiancee is Buddhist. I am an atheist and scientific naturalist. A full third of my closest friends are Jewish.

None of us argue about religion. We only laugh at stupid fundies together.
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Old 2011-07-01, 19:15   Link #9278
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
We agreed to have a month off. No contact at all and see how we feel after having a fresh start. That's when I gotta say would I go into this again or not. By the sound of the comments so far, I have every reason to say 'no.' Except for the feelings part, which is all 'yes' >.>
Tsuyoshi and Saintess more or less summed up what I'd like to have replied.
You're taking the month break and your heart is tugging at it's strings, what you gonna do for yourself in the meantime to get back on track in life?

You mentioned more issues than religion (On her end, I guess at some point she'll ideally wanna convert you) - distance, lack of intimacy and the rest, it's so strained, it sounds like you're just staying together for the sake of doing so but it's making you both miserable at present. Friends and keeping in touch is always fine if you get on otherwise but 2 years and it's feeling this dire, sometimes shutting one door opens another to something better that's waiting for the both of ya, take your chances.

And mentioning religion doesn't automatically equal flaming unless people start trolling just to piss others off for no reason, otherwise there's no way on earth that the religion thread would have survived on Asuki all this time. It is sensitive though, so it's only natural that you'd get a few heated replies, take them in your stride as I have to do so with others
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dextro View Post
Everyone's flawed, nobody's perfect. Get used to and deal with it. I may love a person a great deal but I won't delude myself to think she's perfect cause that's simply not true, she'll just be the closest thing to perfect in my mind.

As for the whole religion subject I won't touch it out of fear of triggering a storm of off-topic that might go into flame mode in this thread. I have very strong belief in my lack of belief (pun intended).
^
*scratches her head in mild frustration* (-_-#)
Get used to it and deal with it, uh huh, like I didn't know that human beings are a messed up species by default but our imperfections are what make us interesting and unique however.
Where in my post which you failed to also quote did I harp on about wanting the 'perfect guy'?
The point was to stress out that certain levels of strain and conflict for things that are deeply enrooted in people (if they're set in their ways) are a source for distress and misery concerning relationships. He was relating the flaw aspect to her faith,
(to give Ending a break tho, he did follow up saying that she also sees the same in him since ideally I guess she'd want him on a similar level to her) which as we find out now is just one issue among others between him and his girl but that alone usually can make or break things, as in Tsuyoshi's case and with a close friend of mine, even if the couple somehow get around it, family can be another issue.

Just note that to find flaws with one faith is as integral as their race, gender, sexuality as well. Since for many atheists (not all before I get another reply for not stating out the obvious) cannot see or sense that importance, is why I point it out from time to time.
It's not so trivial as to say you find flaws with someone who is a stubborn ass, lazy or quick to temper or has other bad points that can be supported within a relationship.
(since it should ideally be bringing the good out of both people while they cover each other's backs).

In Endings' cause that doesn't seem to be the case at all sad to say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by synaesthetic View Post
My fiancee is Buddhist. I am an atheist and scientific naturalist. A full third of my closest friends are Jewish.

None of us argue about religion. We only laugh at stupid fundies together.
See, friend wise it isn't an issue.
We also don't have this whole 'fundie fundie' thing which probably as with a lot of things on Asuki, sticks me on a diff platform from Americans, cause you guys are frustrated with a lot more religion wise that what I'm used to or grew up with in London.

Fianceť wise, depending on which sect of Buddhism, most I know follow it in a similar way to the Japanese, they say their daily chants (some have alters) and have a liking for it's stance rather than devoting to any particular being. In that sense, it demands hardly anything, there's very little room for conflict.

Since most are letting sleeping dogs lie, I better do so too on the religion note. I've no issues with faiths around the world, I love researching, discussing the differences (debating doesn’t always mean “arguing”) and looking into some of the mythology and lore that comes with them.
But as with most things I see a + or - for in a thread that I feel strongly about, I will play devil's advocate and take up a stance on the other side just to toss both sides of a coin in a debate.
You can call that a ‘flaw’ with me on the way I debate on forums
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Old 2011-07-02, 03:46   Link #9279
Ending
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Join Date: May 2004
Quote:
by the sound of it, she pays more tribute to God than the love she has for you.
Pays more tribute to her own life than our life, would be the correct way to say it. The more I think about, the more convinced I become about what she needs to do. Simply put it: she isn't ready to be in a serious relationship. She is in her early 20's, so naturally she'll want to be single before marrying off someone -when she is nearer to her 30's. She wants to become a missionary in Korea and she wants to have a job of her own. She wants to be independent and experience life on her own terms. So I think I'll just have to let her do that.

I have no doubt that she would had relaxed quite a bit about the religious issues if she had come to me now, since when we were together, it wasn't a problem at all. She is a social person and sucks in all the influence around her. With me, she was less zealous. With her family, she became like an old-time crusader. I'm not kidding: that part of the world is still warring a guerrilla war with muslims, since they are treated as second-class citizens. Openly declared non-believers would be hung in front of the church if the priests gave even a slightest suggestion of it. It's a 3rd world country with a reason.

When she is nearer to her 30s, I think she has truly become a hardline adventist.

Quote:
You're taking the month break and your heart is tugging at it's strings, what you gonna do for yourself in the meantime to get back on track in life?
I found someone else. Took whopping two days. Today is our first date. The real kicker is this: she is also very religious Hopefully only moderately so.
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Old 2011-07-02, 07:51   Link #9280
DonQuigleone
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ending View Post
I found someone else. Took whopping two days. Today is our first date. The real kicker is this: she is also very religious Hopefully only moderately so.
Maybe you should consider changing where you hand out to meet girls?

Like the fact that it's a church run singles event might start tipping you off
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