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Old 2011-12-08, 17:29   Link #9821
Ledgem
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Northeast USA
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
Because I had made a statement ("this doesn't apply to me") and an implication ("I'm calling this stereotyping because it doesn't apply to others") and I was backing those up.
How does explaining yourself disprove anything about others?

I'll also go ahead and say that despite what you wrote, I'm not convinced. I think you're as nerdy as the rest of us, and I say that affectionately

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
Two or three. Statistically, it's 100%. =P
You already see it, I don't need to say anything

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
You're right that many women do not. However, the fact that multiple people had such an experience with a woman, while no one said, "Yeah, but my buddy/boyfriend/whatever did the same thing," combined with my other "irrational" experiences with women IRL, leads me to believe that the problem is more common in women than men.
There's so much I could say here, but today seems to be a rambling day for me... I don't think I could present my thoughts in a manner that links together easily.

I don't disagree that it's a stereotype that women tend to be less rational. The thing is, given that the stereotype exists, it seems likely that we (as members of society that stereotype women as irrational) would be quick to identify women as irrational, whereas a man exerting the same behavior would likely be labeled something else (like "dick," "idiot," and so on). For what ever reason - and this may be specific to me - I have a very easy time thinking up examples of "irrational woman," but "irrational man" doesn't bring as much to mind until I start digging. Yet if I think about it, there are quite a few examples of irrational men; probably enough to rival the number of "irrational woman" examples that I can think of. It's just that the term "irrational" tends to go toward women rather than men.

Not sure if I was clear - does that make sense? Basically what I'm trying to say is that it's an issue of perception. I suppose we can't prove or disprove generalizations off of it, but it's something to think about.
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Old 2011-12-08, 19:03   Link #9822
Mystique
Honyaku no Hime
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Wow Ledgem, how you tempt me to join this, back to the lab with you! xD
I was also getting quite miffed at the last couple of pages noting that it was mainly male views on "dating" and the balance was sooo lopsided I figured 'to hell with it' until I saw Saintess' post and I had to flex my claws just a little.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
Men are more straightforward than women; it's just their personality. Why do you think there's so much conflict in relationships between men and women? It's because each gender sees things differently. That's simply a fact of life, not sexism.
The way you expressed that wasn't very conductive.
Women don't know what they want.
Both know what they want, and while we do perceive life differently what causes conflict isn't the difference but the breakdown in communication or simply not having found a successful way to communicate that encompasses how the man and woman (or boy and girl for this forum) see the same situation from different angles.

When this fails, assumptions are made usually false ones which people based their decisions on and then Hell begins.

I'll read over the lovely debate later but this is an anime forum on the net with a demograpth of as Ledgem metioned, young largely male anime or Japanese culture enthusiasts.
As with most things, you gotta take it with a pinch of salt, while advice here is sincere most times, you make the decision offline to the best of your ability, based on factors what most of us can't see from behind a computer screen.
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Old 2011-12-08, 22:49   Link #9823
Masuzu
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Well this is getting a bit out of hand, now before you start mauling each-other I'd like to remind you that stereotypes are the product of hundreds of years of life experience collectively gathered by the human race, yes, some of them can be bullshit, but still not entirely discredited, now, a label is a label but you can choose to ignore it or be affected by it, neither of which is inherently wrong, the decision is based mostly on how you see our society as a whole, if you think it's not too bad then you might give a bit more credit to the way it labels things, on the other hand if you think it's bullshit then you probably won't give two shits about how it sees you as a person.

Now, how does this relate to dating? Well, men and women are different, this difference exists independent of society's labels, but they do attract labels and stereotypes regardless exactly because of this inescapable difference, if you are able to look past these differences then you're probably a Newtype but you don't have to, you simply need the willingness to accept and respect these differences and maybe we can all just get along fine, and if you're interested enough in eachother for that, then maybe you should be dating, see what I did there?


Maybe this all just sounds like me talking to myself, but the topic of debate was pretty damn interesting, though slightly diverging from the subject of the thread, granted I feel that the whole argument was probably over before I made this post anyway.
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Old 2011-12-09, 03:25   Link #9824
Kafriel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dextro View Post
If you believe you can't be "branded" outside of school life then you're in for some serious disappointment in life. Every social circle any one person gets involved in throughout his life will brand people one way or another, it's just that school life is such a common event that involves so many different kinds of people that it ends up being where such branding can take a larger toll on people.
I am already part of many social circles, all with different kinds of people...and yet we don't stick labels on each other, regardless of behaviour. To give some examples, I know many people with dyslexia, but that didn't stop them from assisting me in tutoring the rest of my class last semester. When I went to the casino the other day, most of my friends followed a more formal dressing code than me, but that doesn't make me anything but a member of the group.
The only time I was given a nickname was during my time in the army, simply because we were 40 people in one room, and that was only till we got to learn each other's names. When people can understand each other, I believe that they can see others for what they are, not just what they seem to be.
To get back to dating, it's an act of communication and an attempt to understand another person, get to know someone better, so I don't think anyone would split after one date because of an unfortunate event that could make someone look bad or different in some way.
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Old 2011-12-09, 08:49   Link #9825
Mystique
Honyaku no Hime
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: In the eastern capital of the islands of the rising suns...
Aaaaw reading the above debate takes me back to the "good ol days".
It also reminded me of what I like to call:

"The Stereotype Act"
That's when someone who is either new to Asuki or to the GC forums gets into a debate and snipes a poster for not stating the bloody obvious and calls foul on it based on generalisation.

A: So yeah the demography on Animesuki seems to be made up of male nerds who're into a subculture of Japan...
B: What?! how dare you!? We aren't all nerds here. some of us aren't even into moe contests, use Japanese otaku lingo such as Tsundere and have life sized pillows!
And also nerds aren't all men, there are females too!
Also, whose to say that we can't get girls!? We can get girls too!
And besides, who the hell can define what a nerd is in normal society?!
Speaking of which, what is "normal"?!
Please stop wasting your time polluting us with your narrow mind bound by the limitations of stereotypes!

Reminded me that short of writing a disclaimer stating the bloody obvious (I'm aware this does not apply for everyone, etc), somedays you're setting yourself up for a world of pain.
(Or fun)

<Mystie Disclaimer for the newbies> And yes, I did (and do) deliberately use stereotypes for the sake of taking the piss and a little fun. It has its place in a debate as long as we’re all intelligent to know (and I’m sure we are) that it’s not the be all and end all in Life.
There are always exceptions.</disclamier>

Woman: I love chocolate but it makes me break out in spots ><;;
Man: Then try eating less or avoid chocolate all together. (Totally rational, males are probably thinking)
Woman: WTF?! Are you calling me a fat, ugly cow!!?

(He actually meant to say was: )
"Try eating some every few days to see if that'll help lessen the outbreak. If you find a good balance, you can enjoy choccie and your skin should be okay, too!"
This would be a female answer, don't ask me how or why we know to answer like this, we just do
So try to learn a little here, boys

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
This forum is a place to alleviate boredom, not a surrogate social life, and I have difficulty believing I'm the only one here who feels that way.
Perhaps others share your view but you'd be surprised especially in this GC section how much one can learn, sharpen their writing skills and broaden their views and knowledge through the interaction of other members from all walks of life via here.
Boredom has very little to do with it when we write fiction, ask for translation help, look up Japanese culture, share pictures and advice or keep up with the latest current events around the world
Quote:
I want a woman who's able to communicate openly about what she expects and how she's feeling.

See? That wasn't so tricky.
The thing is us women do say what we want or how we feel.
Just more times than not, the guy just doesn't catch on, especially when it comes to sensitive topics.

To put it in a reeeeeally super summarised manner:
Men: Words
Women: Words and body language and sometimes intuitive sensing.

Instead of "I want a woman who's able to communicate openly" how about:

"I want to learn and gain skills to be able to understand and communicate with women well, especially when it comes to my own future partner"
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Old 2011-12-09, 09:06   Link #9826
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
Do you know the expression "expect the worst, hope for the best"? The people on this forum are, by and large, "nerdy." I'm not necessarily talking about physical appearance - I'm talking about hobbies, social mannerisms, and so on. Society doesn't exactly place people in that category on a pedestal. The glum outlook may partly come from that stereotype that "nerds" aren't desirable and rarely get the girl.

HAHAHAHAHAHA oh God... you're joking, right? Please, say yes? Are you really trying to say that you're more rational for having chosen fantasy relationships than those of us who pursued the real thing? I'm not judging your choice, but I'm very close to wanting to fight with you over that thought.
I am being goofy! Read my reply to Ascaloth and you can see that I am just messing around and being 9.
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Old 2011-12-09, 09:12   Link #9827
Mystique
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
I am being goofy! Read my reply to Ascaloth and you can see that I am just messing around and being 9.
Somedays Saintess with the years you've been here and the way you do go on and on about 2D > 3D females after all this time, it does make me wonder...

Eitherway get a few scars and grow a rugged beard and when you come outta the army, I'm sure you'll be having females swoon and bow to your feet
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Old 2011-12-09, 09:15   Link #9828
DonQuigleone
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Join Date: Dec 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
I am being goofy! Read my reply to Ascaloth and you can see that I am just messing around and being 9.
I assumed so myself. I've often done the same thing. Given the fandom we're in, well, the fact he thought you were serious isn't suprising.

I don't think there's many of the 2D>3D crowd outside Japan, to be honest. And even they're a subculture of a subculture there. I'd say the Anime that feature those types are as much subtly mocking them as sympathising.
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Old 2011-12-09, 10:18   Link #9829
SaintessHeart
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Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
Somedays Saintess with the years you've been here and the way you do go on and on about 2D > 3D females after all this time, it does make me wonder...

Eitherway get a few scars and grow a rugged beard and when you come outta the army, I'm sure you'll be having females swoon and bow to your feet
Scars? I have one on my right hand - got burned while cleaning a still-hot heavy machine gun. It is my male pride of pure willpower.....and stupidity.

And I am already out. And I don't think I want to have a female on me - at least not my local type. As a good friend of mine would put it in the general context of local girls, "Only know how to do nails but not a meal".

I wouldn't want a girl who can't cook or clean - they have a tendency to be rather self-centered, bitchy (not the complaining type who attempts but fails to achieve something, but rather, someone who doesn't look for alternative solutions or even do anything about a problem at all) and too gossipy; they make lousy, myopic companions and always want us guys to give in to them.

Getting laid by them is another issue though.

Actually I am more focused on my career now. My waifus will do fine for now......RL girls can wait till I earn a 5-digit income per month.
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Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2011-12-09, 14:08   Link #9830
DonQuigleone
Knight Errant
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Age: 25
Not so fussed on the cleaning thing (wouldn't want to go out with a girl who's a neat freak), but cooking, a girl who can cook well is damn fine in my books .

It's not that I dislike cooking, but I don't derive great enjoyment from it, I'm more of a sous chef then a chef. I can do most of the basic tasks cooking requires, I'm just not great at assembling dishes.

However, it would be fairly important that any girl I go out with have interests beyond that, an appreciation for politics and international affairs, and intellectual activities, for starters. She'd have to be on "my level" so to speak. I expect as much as I am capable of when it comes to housekeeping, which isn't terribly high, but not low either.
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Old 2011-12-09, 14:13   Link #9831
Tsuyoshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintessHeart View Post
I wouldn't want a girl who can't cook or clean - they have a tendency to be rather self-centered, bitchy (not the complaining type who attempts but fails to achieve something, but rather, someone who doesn't look for alternative solutions or even do anything about a problem at all) and too gossipy; they make lousy, myopic companions and always want us guys to give in to them.

Getting laid by them is another issue though.

Actually I am more focused on my career now. My waifus will do fine for now......RL girls can wait till I earn a 5-digit income per month.
That may not always be the case. I wouldn't prejudice a girl who can't cook or clean as someone who is bitchy. If I know someone who can't do either of those things, I never automatically think that's how they are. I'll find that out later as I talk to her. But I do agree that girls who don't bother finding a solution to a problem, gossip too much and so on are a bore. Tho I wish you luck with finding someone not like that. Girls like so are becoming more and more frequent
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Old 2011-12-09, 22:29   Link #9832
Ledgem
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Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonQuigleone View Post
I assumed so myself. I've often done the same thing. Given the fandom we're in, well, the fact he thought you were serious isn't suprising.

I don't think there's many of the 2D>3D crowd outside Japan, to be honest. And even they're a subculture of a subculture there. I'd say the Anime that feature those types are as much subtly mocking them as sympathising.
I was ready to believe it based on other things Saintess has said in the past, and the personality type I've pegged him for. I'm glad it was a joke.
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Old 2011-12-09, 22:46   Link #9833
SaintessHeart
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
I was ready to believe it based on other things Saintess has said in the past, and the personality type I've pegged him for. I'm glad it was a joke.
If men were wholly rational, the Duke from 12th Night wouldn't have existed.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2011-12-10, 20:19   Link #9834
zebra
❙❙❙❙❙❙❙❥
 
 
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I skipped a lot through the pages, so excuse me if I missed an important part to what I'm replying ..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paranoid Android View Post
"Will you go out with me?"
"... .. I'm moving to Singapore! :3"

^ An extremely cut-down version of one of my personal 'i just got pwned in the face' experiences.
That is SO sad I feel really bad I laughed so hard at it
I'm really sorry, but the way you put it ... XDD

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamer_2k4 View Post
Now, here's my problem. She's a great person, she likes a lot of the things I do, holds similar religious beliefs, etc. She fits in well with my group of friends, and we can have a lot of fun together. As a friend, I think she's fantastic. Unfortunately, I'm not attracted to her at all.

What do I do?
I think many great things have already been said, but I'll just add my opinion. If it were me I'd simply look where it goes for a while. You've only seen each other two times after all. But you shouldn't feel bad about having doubts. There are two things you can do:
You either tell her now it's no use or give her a chance.

If you notice that nothing changes on your side and she starts to get seriously invested - than you have to tell her that.

You don't have to lead her on or anything, you could even say "I'm not sure about what I want yet, can we get to know each other better before defining anything?" ... if you feel the need to make it clear you don't already have the engangement ring in your pocket

At least that's how I do it. Granted, I'm a scaredy cat when it comes to serious commitment, but that line has proven handy in my personal experience. It's still a question of how you roll and what YOU WANT in the end.

Affection can grow, but it is not definite they will.

I don't think you're obliged to make a decision on the spot. Your girl seems worth a shot since you say she has a good personality, so why not give it a little more time?
You can't force yourself into getting attracted to her, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Endless Soul View Post
Endless "In the Middle" Soul
XD
I still like KoIP better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paranoid Android View Post
We've been already officially together for almost a year:
Me: I'm really booked and busy this winter holiday, are you free on the 28th? We should spend the entire day together.
Her: Sorry I have plans on that day.
Me: Aw that sucks, that means we only have new years eve and new years together

AFTER the 28th:
Her: Do you not want to see me that much?
Me: What? Of course I wanted to see you.
Her: Well when I told you I'm busy on the 28th, I wasn't. But you didn't seem to care at all or ask me to reschedule.

^ It went to hell from there and we broke up before new years eve. But to me it's like "what the fuck?"
Honestly, I think she was just looking for a reason to break it off. Consciously or subconsciously. If it wasn't that ... she's simply crazy.
In a long relationship it often happens that you start to bicker about things that shouldn't matter; but if these are presented as fundamental and the provoking party isn't a drama queen - it's more often symptoms of a different, deeper crisis than not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonQuigleone View Post
Not so fussed on the cleaning thing (wouldn't want to go out with a girl who's a neat freak), but cooking, a girl who can cook well is damn fine in my books .

[...]

However, it would be fairly important that any girl I go out with have interests beyond that, an appreciation for politics and international affairs, and intellectual activities, for starters. She'd have to be on "my level" so to speak. I expect as much as I am capable of when it comes to housekeeping, which isn't terribly high, but not low either.
Funnily preparing food seems to be a general cheat in winning a guy's affection. Must be that underlying message of "I can take care of you <3~" At least it seems to always give you +100 respect or affection.
Then again: I think it's really attractive if a guy is a handyman, even so I'm more than capable of doing the usual stuff myself (I grew up with tools and axes and worked in an work shop for electro technics part time).
I'm no good with cars though, so whenever I have problems there I'm the usual "maiden in distress"
I guess it's just nice to know if the other is able to support you, no matter the means.

I also think that it's a pretty common thing (and kind of a no brainer) to look past appeareance and skills and look into common interests as well. Specially if you are someone who needs the input and wants to share things that you are passionate about.
Don't necessarily have to be the exact same hobbies and interests, but it's always a bonus for me. A general curiosity for new stuff can balance the lack of similar hobbies out imo. Or you know, the other inviting you to broaden your horizon. At least it works for me, since I'm a very curious person and don't have real traditional hobby, aside from travelling maybe. But I love to try out new things, so it's still great if you have someone by your side who is willing to accompany you.

Long post is long sorry.
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Old 2011-12-10, 21:24   Link #9835
Endless Soul
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zebra View Post
XD
I still like KoIP better.
Heh thanks.

They are very interesting photos worth keeping
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Old 2011-12-10, 22:02   Link #9836
ChainLegacy
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Massachusetts, US
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystique View Post

Woman: I love chocolate but it makes me break out in spots ><;;
Man: Then try eating less or avoid chocolate all together. (Totally rational, males are probably thinking)
Woman: WTF?! Are you calling me a fat, ugly cow!!?

(He actually meant to say was: )
"Try eating some every few days to see if that'll help lessen the outbreak. If you find a good balance, you can enjoy choccie and your skin should be okay, too!"
This would be a female answer, don't ask me how or why we know to answer like this, we just do
Those words would be tantamount to heresy for my younger sister (a health nut) So I'm not so sure I agree on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
Ah, it was rather callous of me to write what I did - I'm secure in being regarded as "nerdy" or awkward in various ways (who isn't?) but I should have figured that people would be insulted by that statement and probably kept it to myself. For the record, I did not say that the social life was "glum" but that people here have a "glum outlook" on their chances with girls as a result of society's stereotypes. I also did not say that nerds are not desirable - I find you all desirable enough to converse with, and have for many years - I was remarking on society's stereotypes.

What, do you disagree with me? Has society changed its tune? I'll admit that I've been cooped up in research labs and other places of academia for a few years, and I'm not the most up to date with these things. Are "nerds" now desirable, or has anime become such a mainstream hobby that you're not a "nerd" for engaging in it?

As to your last statement, I'm talking to a bunch of men at the moment, so I'm addressing males specifically. Of course nerds can be girls. I don't keep up with modern movies or television shows, but from what I can tell, "the nerdy girl" is now something that is being brought into them - how does society portray those types of girls? The last time I saw something relating to that, it was "nerdy girl undergoes transformation to become a popular girl." Have they changed that around so that the "nerdy girl" remains as she is, and is still desirable?
Once you're secure in being awkward it ceases being as awkward. Especially in adult life. Hell, if anything a secure unorthodox person can be more endearing for their unique character.

Last edited by ChainLegacy; 2011-12-10 at 22:15.
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Old 2011-12-11, 08:22   Link #9837
SaintessHeart
Ehh? EEEEHHHHHH?
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Age: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChainLegacy View Post
Those words would be tantamount to heresy for my younger sister (a health nut) So I'm not so sure I agree on that.
If you get scolded, pat your chest and say, "Yeah, I am not growing boobs. I am still a guy, therefore I don't understand you girls. I am afraid you have to tell me what did I do wrong here."

Disclaimer : The advisor is not liable for any physical or relationship damage thereafter. Use at your own risk.
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When three puppygirls named after pastries are on top of each other, it is called Eclair a'la menthe et Biscotti aux fraises avec beaucoup de Ricotta sur le dessus.
Most of all, you have to be disciplined and you have to save, even if you hate our current financial system. Because if you don't save, then you're guaranteed to end up with nothing.
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Old 2011-12-12, 09:30   Link #9838
Kaijo
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Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.
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Worst e-mail you could ever receive after a date?

Thought I'd post this here to get some reactions. At first, you may be thinking the guy is crazy, but some of the comments hit upon an interesting interpretation: what if the guy has Aspergers? Having known a few in my time, it certainly sounds like some of the people I've known with Aspergers(and I confess, a bit too close to how I've come at times). He's trying to navigate the social rules without really understanding them, and it comes across as a bit creepy. And yet, as you can see from the tone of the article, mainstream still doesn't understand it or recognize it, and derides people for it.

Granted, this is just a possible interpretation. But it highlights the issues some people have with the dating scene.
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Old 2011-12-12, 11:02   Link #9839
Endless Soul
Megane girl fan
 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Diagonally parked in a parallel universe.
Age: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
Worst e-mail you could ever receive after a date?

Thought I'd post this here to get some reactions. At first, you may be thinking the guy is crazy, but some of the comments hit upon an interesting interpretation: what if the guy has Aspergers? Having known a few in my time, it certainly sounds like some of the people I've known with Aspergers(and I confess, a bit too close to how I've come at times). He's trying to navigate the social rules without really understanding them, and it comes across as a bit creepy. And yet, as you can see from the tone of the article, mainstream still doesn't understand it or recognize it, and derides people for it.

Granted, this is just a possible interpretation. But it highlights the issues some people have with the dating scene.
Uh..wow! You're right, he does come off as creepy and he also sounds like he's a pain in the ass to be around. However, as he stated in his opening paragraph, it's difficult to determine the emotions going through the writer since e-mails and such are rather cold.

But chasing down her e-mail using Google?
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Old 2011-12-12, 14:31   Link #9840
Kafriel
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Too bloody long! Besides, the probability of it going straight to the spam folder is high, so why type out 1600 words that are highly unlikely to be read, especially if it's named "Hey, it's Mike", or something?
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what if the guy has Aspergers?
He wouldn't make it so long...or so I think. Having met a few people irl and quite a few over the net, neither kind is chatty, although that doesn't make them easier to misunderstand or anything.
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