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Old 2009-10-02, 12:58   Link #1681
Ascaloth
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Update on my situation:

Just came back from a date with her (probably the last one for some weeks, because you know, school comes first for both of us). So it seems the deal was; she asked me not to even kiss her back then mostly because her mom warned her against "kissing a boy you're not sure you truly love" (I knew about this back then, of course), and she wanted to be a good girl and try to heed her mother's admonitions. At this point though, she's basically gone "fuck it". I should know. XD

That aside, it's been a fruitful date. We've basically come to a number of new understandings;

1) She doesn't want to consider me her boyfriend, because now she equates "boyfriend" with "future husband". So, yeah. Since that's how she sees it, I'm cool not being "official" with her.
2) On another note, remember when I was worrying over the reasons why I should think twice about going ahead and dating her? Seems like she and I are of much the same type; she likes me, but she's hesitant about getting completely "serious" with me because of pretty much the same considerations. Take into context her association of "boyfriend" with "future husband", and it actually makes a lot of sense.
3) Yet either way, right now we're still perfectly happy to date, and even....get physical with one another . We're enjoying our time together now in the mutual understanding that the odds are stacked against us; it would be nice if we can develop a love strong enough to overcome the barriers between us, but frankly, we're both terminally realistic people.

So in short, our relationship is going decent, but we're both aware that our days together is likely to be limited. So is it a fling? I don't really see it that way. I like to think of it as making fond memories for future reminiscence.

Heh. Long story over. I wonder if this is a good way to view this relationship, or whether maybe I should reconsider how I look at it.
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Old 2009-10-02, 13:28   Link #1682
H23
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Originally Posted by Ascaloth View Post
So it seems the deal was; she asked me not to even kiss her back then mostly because her mom warned her against "kissing a boy you're not sure you truly love"
Wat. Is she 12 or something? o_O Bet she's Asian too?! Lawl.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ascaloth View Post
She doesn't want to consider me her boyfriend, because now she equates "boyfriend" with "future husband".
K wait, wat? Holy shit. Maybe she needs some guidance for her to see that that's not clearly the case.
If you guys are happy though then I guess it's all good.
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Old 2009-10-02, 13:57   Link #1683
Wirbelwind8
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Damn I just got pwned. Im not saying self control is good for everything. I know girls like guys who take the initiative, but when a girl says no because "we are going too fast" and you do it anyway, I think a little self control is necessary....

I guess the beginning of a relationship is only hard for me :P (4 of my relationships lasted less than a week)
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Old 2009-10-02, 17:38   Link #1684
Ricksterlau
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Originally Posted by H23 View Post
Negative. The beginning is easier to preserve, as that's when the flame is just burning. Keeping that flame months or years later is what's tough.
Well said. I couldn't agree with you more.
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Old 2009-10-02, 17:42   Link #1685
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Originally Posted by H23 View Post
Other girls also like guys who take control, even if they say otherwise.
Yeah chicks dig being raped
Spoiler for :


Quote:
Originally Posted by H23 View Post
Negative. The beginning is easier to preserve, as that's when the flame is just burning. Keeping that flame months or years later is what's tough.
No the beginning is hard because you have to start the flame, then it gets easy for a little while, then if you're not right for each other, it gets hard again.
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Old 2009-10-02, 18:43   Link #1686
Mystique
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Originally Posted by Gin View Post
Yeah chicks dig being raped
Spoiler for :
If it's a consensual fantasy between the couple and steps are taken for the act to stop if she feels uncomfortable, then yeah, some do like the whole 'being taken again your will'.
There are various levels of it, but a full on 'rape' scene where you are playing with real fear with your partner is a lil into the extreme side that's kinda uncomfy for a lot of people.
Quote:
No the beginning is hard because you have to start the flame, then it gets easy for a little while, then if you're not right for each other, it gets hard again.
Mixing what they mean by why keeping the spark/flame alive is the hardest.
In a sense though, seeing as many members here are young and in that first/second dates/relationship stages, I can see why getting past the 'initial must make steps to get to a place where we're happy and we're not just friends with each other' seems the hardest cause its a lot of work, its new ground and awkward times.

It is not the hardest. It is hard, yeah and nerve-wracking but this is why sometimes when single people run around all angsty, lamenting that they have no gf/bf etc, I wonder why they can’t work on themselves as individuals, enjoy life until an opportunity appears for a potential mate (or you take steps to finding someone)

Cause once you work past the initial stage and get comfy with each other, then the newness of it all, the paths to explore together, the things to learn, the places to see is where the rush and excitement tends to be at is highest.

The reason the others are saying 'preserving that is the hardest' is because you become used to each other, sometimes take each other for granted or worse, sometimes fall into the 'family' zone. By that I mean, they're just a part of you, someone you know very well, don't sleep with or think sexy or hot, but you do care for them deeply/love them.

Between couples, particularly where sex and sexuality is concerned, is perhaps where the biggest work lays. To have your partner look at you with the same hunger/lust as they used to within the first few years more than often fades with familiarity.
To do simple, nice things that makes each other smile as you may have used to do during the 'courting' stage tends to go as well. Some people think 'we're in a relationship, we're happy, I can relax now'

Nope, you keep on putting the same effort in as you did when you first got together, all the way through.

Now if you think the beginning is the hardest, imagine trying to preserve that energy and effort for 3,4,5+ plus.

If a relationship is a seed at start and the woman is the sun, the man the water, then cultivating it so it grows healthily is important.
But once it's a beautiful plant, if you don't maintain the balance needed for what works in your relationship, that plant is going to wither and die, right?
More often than not sadly, it withers away without the couples noticing (or just one person noticing) and then suddenly, there are issues.
Simple things like not setting time aside to simply talk to each other about their thoughts and feelings as humans and people, tends to be where lack of communication breaks down and people find that they 'don't know their partners anymore'.

And even then, ‘friends with benefits’ or ‘casual partners’ tend to be even harder because you’re playing with set rules and restrictions, so the amount of self discipline that’s needed to preserve the relationship in a certain state while engaging in an intimate act is some serious business.
More times than not again it fails because feelings change (as we are human after all) or drama ensues, sometimes it develops into more and lasts, sometimes it just falls apart, but hard work is needed to keep those kinds of relationships intact.

Anyways, minor digression, but since it's on about dating, that's just the first state per se.
Not all relationships will necessarily grow into the long lasting ones, some people may just enjoy each other company and time together for a year or two, as long as its healthy and both peeps are content, then sure go for it.

Life's too short to lament over, enjoy the time and experiences while you can.
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Old 2009-10-02, 18:45   Link #1687
H23
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Originally Posted by Gin View Post
No the beginning is hard because you have to start the flame, then it gets easy for a little while, then if you're not right for each other, it gets hard again.
If the flame had to even be "started" in a relationship between two people, then those two shouldn't even be "dating"; as more often than not, that "flame" gets started before they even start dating, ie: the "liking" stage - once they start dating, that feeling is just intensified, since their wants are accomodated to by being with one another and everything is perfect (also known as the "honeymoon phase" in the first few months of the relationship).
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Old 2009-10-02, 19:04   Link #1688
Mystique
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Originally Posted by H23 View Post
If the flame had to even be "started" in a relationship between two people, then those two shouldn't even be "dating"; as more often than not, that "flame" gets started before they even start dating, ie: the "liking" stage - once they start dating, that feeling is just intensified, since their wants are accomodated to by being with one another and everything is perfect (also known as the "honeymoon phase" in the first few months of the relationship).
Disagree with you there.

Some of the deepest, long lasting relationships don't begin with a spark/flame. That sounds like lust to me more than likeness to a person. The sparks help give you the intiative to persue someone cause you're acting based of desire.
(Desire is more than what your nether regions are dictacting to you btw...)
But desire != suitable match or even a guarentee for a decent partner.

Perhaps why a lot of non westerners look at us all and look at 'love marriages and relationships' as they call them and wonder why people split or don't commit so easily.
More times than not, when the spark dies down, and the little bad habits and annoyances that everyone has with each other come through and its not so 'starry-eyed and glittery' anymore, then people split or one will break it off and chase another person just for that intial rush again.

"It's not fun anymore, the spark's gone."
Well yeah... so what else is there between you that'll keep you together?
Not to mention, if you're only chasing after sparks and instant chemistry, then yeesh imagine all the other possible potential future, long lasting partners you've instantly shunned from your life just cause initially, there was nothing there.

On the otherhand, some people hang out cause of mutual likes, interests with no purpose to pursue each other as more than friends, but with time and familarity, knowing each others strengths and weaknesses, that 'spark' or 'flame' appears. It's not blazing and wild as two new people meeting up and then dating perhaps, hence when it feels like its burning out or dying, people try to maintain that level of intensity.
It's more a slow, glowing ember, but nonetheless strong and hot and deep.

Those kinds perhaps are seriously underated more than people realise. Whatever kind of chemistry is between people, at the end of the day, the hardest work still lays with keeping the relationship alive and healthy between the pair of you over a prolonged period of time.
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Old 2009-10-02, 19:12   Link #1689
H23
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Originally Posted by Mystique View Post
Disagree with you there.

Some of the deepest, long lasting relationships don't begin with a spark/flame. That sounds like lust to me more than likeness to a person. The sparks help give you the intiative to persue someone cause you're acting based of desire.
(Desire is more than what your nether regions are dictacting to you btw...)
But desire != suitable match or even a guarentee for a decent partner.

Perhaps why a lot of non westerners look at us all and look at 'love marriages and relationships' as they call them and wonder why people split or don't commit so easily.
More times than not, when the spark dies down, and the little bad habits and annoyances that everyone has with each other come through and its not so 'starry-eyed and glittery' anymore, then people split or one will break it off and chase another person just for that intial rush again.

"It's not fun anymore, the spark's gone."
Well yeah... so what else is there between you that'll keep you together?

On the otherhand, some people hang out cause of mutual likes, interests with no purpose to pursue each other as more than friends, but with time and familarity, knowing each others strengths and weaknesses, that 'spark' or 'flame' appears. It's not blazing and wild as two new people meeting up and then dating perhaps, hence when it feels like its burning out or dying, people try to maintain that level of intensity.
It's more a slow, glowing ember, but nonetheless strong and hot.

Those kinds perhaps are seriously underated more than people realise. Whatever kind of chemistry is between people, at the end of the day, the hardest work still lays with keeping the relationship alive and healthy between the pair of you.
Totally agree with you - BUT, long term relationships can sprout from either what I just said, and what you said (which essentially sounds as being friends first with someone without pure platonic intentions... but you develop into liking that particular "friend" later on). Falling for a best friend of the opposite sex is a very common scenario, don't get me wrong.
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Old 2009-10-02, 19:18   Link #1690
Mystique
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Indeed, however you can't say 'if there's no spark, they shouldn't be 'dating'.

Why the hell not?
The people will realise that 'okay, perhaps there is nothing that makes them think:
'hmmm hot, we get on so amazingly well, it just works'
but they like each other as people, and take the 'friend, perhaps become partners later' path as I mentioned above or other kinds of relationships, but that will only be figured one after the first date.
(or first few dates)

It's a suss out period, let's say. Gotta mingle in the sea a little to see what fish is kinda tasty or good for you, spark or no spark.
Also involves having an open mind and easy going attitude to dating in itself, I suppose.
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Old 2009-10-02, 22:40   Link #1691
RadiantBeam
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Well, an update on my situation...

So apparently, my guy friend has been running into my grandmother at his workplace (the supermarket) and he's been asking about me. My friend also told me he's been bugging her about me too, asking her how I am and everything because I've gotten to a point where I'm not replying to his text messages.

It doesn't seem like a big deal, but I don't know what to do. A part of me just wants to ignore him and hope he gets the hint, but he's been asking a lot of people about me and they're starting to get really annoyed. Should I talk to him about it, lay it all out for him, or what? I honestly wanted to break away from him, but I want to keep my friends and family out of it if I can.
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Old 2009-10-02, 23:58   Link #1692
Gin
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Originally Posted by RadiantBeam View Post
Well, an update on my situation...

So apparently, my guy friend has been running into my grandmother at his workplace (the supermarket) and he's been asking about me. My friend also told me he's been bugging her about me too, asking her how I am and everything because I've gotten to a point where I'm not replying to his text messages.

It doesn't seem like a big deal, but I don't know what to do. A part of me just wants to ignore him and hope he gets the hint, but he's been asking a lot of people about me and they're starting to get really annoyed. Should I talk to him about it, lay it all out for him, or what? I honestly wanted to break away from him, but I want to keep my friends and family out of it if I can.
Definitely talk to him. Make it clear that you don't like him, and ask him to stop bothering your friends and family. It might be awkward at first, but its better than making your friends and family deal with it instead of you.
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Old 2009-10-03, 10:01   Link #1693
Ledgem
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Originally Posted by RadiantBeam View Post
Well, an update on my situation...

So apparently, my guy friend has been running into my grandmother at his workplace (the supermarket) and he's been asking about me. My friend also told me he's been bugging her about me too, asking her how I am and everything because I've gotten to a point where I'm not replying to his text messages.

It doesn't seem like a big deal, but I don't know what to do. A part of me just wants to ignore him and hope he gets the hint, but he's been asking a lot of people about me and they're starting to get really annoyed. Should I talk to him about it, lay it all out for him, or what? I honestly wanted to break away from him, but I want to keep my friends and family out of it if I can.
I agree with Gin. Confrontations are generally not enjoyable, but the communication is important. I'd imagine that your friend is either confused and/or really wants to talk to you. You want to make a clean break? Then tell him how you really feel. What's the worst that could happen - he gets really upset and decides never to talk to you again? (Actually, I suppose "worst" would be that he gets upset and goes on a killing rampage, but I presume he's a stable guy.)

You have nothing to lose by telling him how you really feel. If anything, by having your thoughts better explained to him he may change his behavior in such a manner that you two could potentially become friends again. Even if you don't want to be friends, I'd guess that he should stop pursuing you in the manner that he currently is. For all we know, your lack of communication with him has him thinking that you're in deep trouble or depressed, and seeing himself as a friend (potential lover?) he'd heighten his efforts to get in touch with you so that he could offer aid.

Better to set the record straight, in any event.
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Old 2009-10-03, 17:03   Link #1694
Shinoto
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Indeed, however you can't say 'if there's no spark, they shouldn't be 'dating'.
That would be a pretty boring relationship or couple then.
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Old 2009-10-03, 18:11   Link #1695
Mystique
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That would be a pretty boring relationship or couple then.
Did you read all of my first reply rather than just quote my lastest sentence?
This is going as far as dating, not necessarilly being in a relationship as a gf/bf.
(Although, now I think about it, I'm hearing my intuition tell me that the level/definition from Americans may be somewhat diff then as I'm seeing it)

To me, its just the start stage when people are sussing each other out, but they're not a 'couple' just yet.
Naturally if it's a real bad date or you didn't get on at all, then its a given that you're not really gonna meet each other again, but didn't think I needed to point that out.

But regardless, there are those who are currently married, engaged that when I ask 'how'd you guys first meet', wasn't always based on instant mutual 'sparks' between the two.
Actually one of my friends, the girl kinda rejected the guy twice at he start (she was not interested, didn't wanna date him) ... and now they're married with 2 kids...
(He didn't easily take 'no' for an answer more than once)

There's a saying that the 'first date is usually the 'worst' cause its the biggest 'lie', since people are trying to make a good first impression and are nervous and aren't really themselves per se, so usually a second or third is needed to get a better idea of potentially where or how a person may fit into each others lives.
Good chemistry isn't always instantenous, more often than not, it's built over time and mutual understanding of each other, thus influencing person perceptions of an individual in time, but you ain't gonna figure that out if you've cut off the person from your life asap cause you weren't 'really feeling that spark' per se.

Eitherway, I've yapped on enough bout it, my 2 pence is done
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Last edited by Mystique; 2009-10-03 at 19:02.
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Old 2009-10-04, 00:52   Link #1696
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Originally Posted by H23 View Post
Negative. The beginning is easier to preserve, as that's when the flame is just burning. Keeping that flame months or years later is what's tough.
I agree, even though I have swung and missed with every girl I've wanted to be with

But maintaining a relationship is the challenge since you gotta figure out a way for the other person to want more without things becoming boring.

Radiant, I think you have to talk to him and set the record straight. The fact he is bringing other members of your family into it by asking them about you is just wrong to me; this whole thing should be about himself and you—that's it. There is no reason for him to drag other people into it.
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Old 2009-10-04, 08:45   Link #1697
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Originally Posted by Ascaloth View Post
Update on my situation:

Just came back from a date with her (probably the last one for some weeks, because you know, school comes first for both of us). So it seems the deal was; she asked me not to even kiss her back then mostly because her mom warned her against "kissing a boy you're not sure you truly love" (I knew about this back then, of course), and she wanted to be a good girl and try to heed her mother's admonitions. At this point though, she's basically gone "fuck it". I should know. XD

That aside, it's been a fruitful date. We've basically come to a number of new understandings;

1) She doesn't want to consider me her boyfriend, because now she equates "boyfriend" with "future husband". So, yeah. Since that's how she sees it, I'm cool not being "official" with her.
2) On another note, remember when I was worrying over the reasons why I should think twice about going ahead and dating her? Seems like she and I are of much the same type; she likes me, but she's hesitant about getting completely "serious" with me because of pretty much the same considerations. Take into context her association of "boyfriend" with "future husband", and it actually makes a lot of sense.
3) Yet either way, right now we're still perfectly happy to date, and even....get physical with one another . We're enjoying our time together now in the mutual understanding that the odds are stacked against us; it would be nice if we can develop a love strong enough to overcome the barriers between us, but frankly, we're both terminally realistic people.

So in short, our relationship is going decent, but we're both aware that our days together is likely to be limited. So is it a fling? I don't really see it that way. I like to think of it as making fond memories for future reminiscence.

Heh. Long story over. I wonder if this is a good way to view this relationship, or whether maybe I should reconsider how I look at it.
Good luck to you both!! It sound like she's a bit immature, I've never known a woman who thinks bf=husband, most women date a few guys before they get to bf=fiance, at that point you can consider him a future husband. At least she's not listening to her mom in regards to kissing, you don't necessairly have to love someone to kiss them, but well, it does help if you have feelings for them for some long kissing action..lol.
Finally, it's good you guys are focused on school, but any real realtionship is going to need to have some meetups in real life, no matter how busy, there's always time to sneak in a meal or two, date, some sort of meeting.
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Old 2009-10-04, 10:11   Link #1698
Narona
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Originally Posted by Lonestar9 View Post
Good luck to you both!! It sound like she's a bit immature, I've never known a woman who thinks bf=husband, most women date a few guys before they get to bf=fiance, at that point you can consider him a future husband.
I don't see in which way it is immature. Nor why a girl (or a guy) has to have a few BFs (or GFs) before considering one a future husband (or wife).

What's important is to say it clearly. It would be not good to hang around talking about your BF as your future hisband, without having talked about it with him. But if you stated to your BF how you see him, and if he feels ok [if not happy] to be seen as that, then there's no problem and it doesn't mean that the relationship will fail or not.

Had to say it since I know girls who thought/think as their first BF as future husband, and since for example one is now married and mother of a little girl, I call bullshit on this "immature" thingy

Quote:
At least she's not listening to her mom in regards to kissing, you don't necessairly have to love someone to kiss them,
True, but it depends on the person, and so, you don't have to do what the others do just because the majority do something.

In the case of this girl, she was somewhat restraining because of her mother. But it's up to her to do what she wants to do.

Now if another girl is not ok to go on a kissing rampage because she chose it that way, there's nothing to criticize. So, the opposite is also true. You don't necessarily have to kiss someone you don't love.

So it really depends on the girl. For example, while Ascaloth's GF didn't mind at all how he was "dangerous" about kissing, another type of girl would have [tried to] avoid[ed] his kiss, kicked him in the ball and eventually would have dumped him (for example: Me ). As Ascaloth said it, He's a dangerous guy, but then he has to face the consequences of his behaviors What's good is that his character seems compatible with his GF's, so no big problem so far

Last edited by Narona; 2009-10-04 at 12:23.
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Old 2009-10-05, 00:15   Link #1699
Throne Invader
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Originally Posted by H23 View Post
Wat. Is she 12 or something? o_O Bet she's Asian too?! Lawl.
*Ahem* Some of us in this forum happen to have Asian blood and also happen to have mothers who give advice like that and if you think about it, you'd might just consider that you would have been lucky if ever you had a mother like that keeping you from letting you prance around smothering your lips to every guy you're unsure of your feelings for.

12 years old would be in grade school right? That does not look nice, well for me

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dating really depends on how you were raised and with whoever you were around with while growing up. There are people especially present in the Asian culture who will just begin dating with someone they feel would be a good potential partner. Religion plays a part in dating too but only for some people.

I'll just wish Ascaloth and RadiantBeam good luck with their relationships and with whatever choices they're gonna make. And hopefully they are the right ones

And you too whitepearl
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Old 2009-10-05, 00:55   Link #1700
H23
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Originally Posted by whitepearl View Post
I agree, even though I have swung and missed with every girl I've wanted to be with
Just gotta keep swinging man.

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Originally Posted by FragrantFlora View Post
*Ahem* Some of us in this forum happen to have Asian blood and also happen to have mothers who give advice like that and if you think about it, you'd might just consider that you would have been lucky if ever you had a mother like that keeping you from letting you prance around smothering your lips to every guy you're unsure of your feelings for.
Lul, I'm asian too; and I'm aware of how asian parents are strict towards their daughters especially, BUT her mother's point of view and advice is just a little too wild (for me at least). Let her live her life to some extent - experience is what people learn from.
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