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Old 2009-10-11, 17:45   Link #1821
K_Babyy
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I just have to say that being in love is the most beautiful feeling in the world, but at times, it can be nothing but pure hell.

My boyfriend and I have been together for 2 and a half years now and we've been through pretty much everything that a couple could possibly go through. We had a baby, she's 6 months old now and we consider her the best thing that's ever happened to us. My mother hates him, my father doesn't think he's right for me. He's adopted, so I know nothing about his biological family besides the fact that they abused him, so I hate his parents deeply. Back when we were in high school, I just graduated in June and he graduated back in 08, everyone talked about us, making up lies that he cheated or I cheated, because they either wanted to be with one of us, or just couldn't stand us being together. There's just way too many things to even begin talking about that has gone wrong in our relationship, but the entire time, we never lost sight of our future. We are in love, still in love, and have made it through hell together.

Basically, what I'm trying to say is, once you find that true love, when you know it's real, never give up on him/her, never let go. If you are meant to be together in the end, then you will be, no matter what.
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Old 2009-10-11, 18:03   Link #1822
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Quote:
My boyfriend and I have been together for 2 and a half years now and we've been through pretty much everything that a couple could possibly go through. We had a baby, she's 6 months old now and we consider her the best thing that's ever happened to us. My mother hates him, my father doesn't think he's right for me. He's adopted, so I know nothing about his biological family besides the fact that they abused him, so I hate his parents deeply. Back when we were in high school, I just graduated in June and he graduated back in 08, everyone talked about us, making up lies that he cheated or I cheated, because they either wanted to be with one of us, or just couldn't stand us being together. There's just way too many things to even begin talking about that has gone wrong in our relationship, but the entire time, we never lost sight of our future. We are in love, still in love, and have made it through hell together.
Congratulation for being blessed with love. I hope things sail smoothly with your new family, and your parents will change their mind about your partner if you keep being happy

Quote:
This is passed around as common knowledge but it's completely unfounded. There is no "polygamy gene" or "polygamy hormone" - it's stereotyped that men have more difficulty with fidelity than women, but I certainly hear about both happening with a high frequency. I'm very wary of social studies and surveys, but do you happen to have one to draw upon to support that statement?
I'm positive there are loads of research about that, but I doubt they have ever come to a definite conclusion. Genetic is a difficult and controversial topic, after all. And no one in the field wants to assert anything, since they would be labeled as "discriminative."

But if it's not true at genetic level, IMO it's still quite true at social level. We male may want our kids to be carefully taken care of, but just hardly want to take care of the kids ourselves

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Speak for yourself!
Yeah, marriage proposol is just "nuh uh" to them. "You gotta show me your love first." Cmon, if proposing is not love, I don't know what is
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Old 2009-10-11, 18:21   Link #1823
K_Babyy
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Thank you very much! We're trying to keep our heads up!
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Old 2009-10-11, 18:24   Link #1824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_Babyy View Post
I just have to say that being in love is the most beautiful feeling in the world, but at times, it can be nothing but pure hell.

My boyfriend and I have been together for 2 and a half years now and we've been through pretty much everything that a couple could possibly go through. We had a baby, she's 6 months old now and we consider her the best thing that's ever happened to us. My mother hates him, my father doesn't think he's right for me. He's adopted, so I know nothing about his biological family besides the fact that they abused him, so I hate his parents deeply. Back when we were in high school, I just graduated in June and he graduated back in 08, everyone talked about us, making up lies that he cheated or I cheated, because they either wanted to be with one of us, or just couldn't stand us being together. There's just way too many things to even begin talking about that has gone wrong in our relationship, but the entire time, we never lost sight of our future. We are in love, still in love, and have made it through hell together.
Sweet to hear things are working out for you, mostly at least. ^^ Hope everything goes smoothly with your baby, and that in time your parents can accept him for who he is and what he means to you.
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Old 2009-10-11, 18:28   Link #1825
K_Babyy
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Originally Posted by RadiantBeam View Post
Sweet to hear things are working out for you, mostly at least. ^^ Hope everything goes smoothly with your baby, and that in time your parents can accept him for who he is and what he means to you.
Thank you, I really hope they do someday. My dad seems to be getting better about it since Casey(my bf) has been there for our daughter since day 1. Mom, on the other hand, won't give in.
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Old 2009-10-11, 19:54   Link #1826
Quzor
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Originally Posted by Ledgem View Post
This is passed around as common knowledge but it's completely unfounded. There is no "polygamy gene" or "polygamy hormone" - it's stereotyped that men have more difficulty with fidelity than women, but I certainly hear about both happening with a high frequency. I'm very wary of social studies and surveys, but do you happen to have one to draw upon to support that statement?
Interestingly enough, I'm reading a book about this very subject; The Selfish Gene, by Richard Dawkins. Whether you like him or not (most people have a pretty definitive viewpoint about him), the book is quite interesting.

The book focuses largely, in certain chapters, on the "resource cost" of reproduction for both sexes. Interesting enough, Dawkins suggests that it would be beneficial for men and women to mate with as many people as possible, so as to give better chance of their genes progressing into the next generation. However, he suggests that this may be easier for men to do, than for women.

I won't go into detail, but he posits that women have a genetic predisposition towards caring for their young because, on a genetic level, they've already committed more to the offspring than the male has. Eggs are the bigger of the two reproductive cells, and so provides more nutrients, or "resources", to the offspring. Because of this, women have a genetic need to make their mate contribute equal resources elsewhere, so that he will have just as much to lose by not caring for the offspring as she currently does.

I realize it's not a "study," and I can't speak for it's validity, but it does offer some interesting insight as to whether polygamy is a genetic predisposition more common to men than women. Take it for whatever you will; it's just another book by another guy.
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Old 2009-10-11, 20:39   Link #1827
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I sure like Richard Dawkins' works, but somehow his face is one that make people just want to smash it when he smiles

Anyway, The selfish gene is but just another in a basket trying to identify the reason why polygamy still underlies our society. The important fact is: polygamy exists. An male still seek a polygamy in one way or another.

Quote:
Thank you, I really hope they do someday. My dad seems to be getting better about it since Casey(my bf) has been there for our daughter since day 1. Mom, on the other hand, won't give in.
Mommy does not give in easily, as suddenly out of nowhere appeared a freaktard imprudent teenager that ruined her dear daughter's future that she had always envisioned since she carried her in the womb. She loves you, and think she's the one who loves you the most in the world, so it's hard to accept that a future where you have to "sacrifice" for Casey can be better than what she had in mind for you. Just constantly remind her of the fact that you are being happy. I ensure you, it is not just a "hope," but a fact that takes time but will definitely happen
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Old 2009-10-11, 21:06   Link #1828
K_Babyy
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Originally Posted by Cinocard View Post
Mommy does not give in easily, as suddenly out of nowhere appeared a freaktard imprudent teenager that ruined her dear daughter's future that she had always envisioned since she carried her in the womb. She loves you, and think she's the one who loves you the most in the world, so it's hard to accept that a future where you have to "sacrifice" for Casey can be better than what she had in mind for you. Just constantly remind her of the fact that you are being happy. I ensure you, it is not just a "hope," but a fact that takes time but will definitely happen
Yea, I understand that. I would probably feel the same way my mom does if that happened to my little girl. I love her so much and want nothing but the best for her.
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Old 2009-10-11, 21:44   Link #1829
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Originally Posted by K_Babyy View Post
Yea, I understand that. I would probably feel the same way my mom does if that happened to my little girl. I love her so much and want nothing but the best for her.
No one loves you quite like your mother. ^^

Just give her time. She'll come around eventually.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:31   Link #1830
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quzor View Post
Interestingly enough, I'm reading a book about this very subject; The Selfish Gene, by Richard Dawkins. Whether you like him or not (most people have a pretty definitive viewpoint about him), the book is quite interesting.

The book focuses largely, in certain chapters, on the "resource cost" of reproduction for both sexes. Interesting enough, Dawkins suggests that it would be beneficial for men and women to mate with as many people as possible, so as to give better chance of their genes progressing into the next generation. However, he suggests that this may be easier for men to do, than for women.

I won't go into detail, but he posits that women have a genetic predisposition towards caring for their young because, on a genetic level, they've already committed more to the offspring than the male has. Eggs are the bigger of the two reproductive cells, and so provides more nutrients, or "resources", to the offspring. Because of this, women have a genetic need to make their mate contribute equal resources elsewhere, so that he will have just as much to lose by not caring for the offspring as she currently does.

I realize it's not a "study," and I can't speak for it's validity, but it does offer some interesting insight as to whether polygamy is a genetic predisposition more common to men than women. Take it for whatever you will; it's just another book by another guy.
I for one strongly disagree with his view point. I certainly wouldn't want my future husband going around impregnating other women And I think the risk of getting STDs would be nice too
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:37   Link #1831
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Originally Posted by Cinocard View Post
Yeah, marriage proposol is just "nuh uh" to them. "You gotta show me your love first." Cmon, if proposing is not love, I don't know what is
Not everyone takes marriage seriously. There are better chances of ensuring that a marriage would be successful if there is love first.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:46   Link #1832
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More actual love in a marriage could *probably* result in fewer divorces.

The divorce rate in America is pretty ridiculous.

Flora, there are some others (I can't name any specific names as these people are just fellow posters on another messageboard) who also believe that humans are naturally inclined towards polygamy because they want to insure their bloodline and genes can progress through generations.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:49   Link #1833
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Originally Posted by FragrantFlora View Post
I for one strongly disagree with his view point. I certainly wouldn't want my future husband going around impregnating other women And I think the risk of getting STDs would be nice too
He doesn't actually suggest it as a way to live; it's simply a genetic examination. Genes are inherently "selfish"; they wish to survive for as long as they're able. By exacting an open sharing mentality from their "survival machines" (his words for humans), they increase their chances of survivability.

I don't know if he actually supports polygamy or not (I suspect he doesn't, since he's married to only 1 woman) but, again, this isn't his point of view on how people should live their lives. It's merely an examination of the behavior of genes as they try to survive through the generations.
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Last edited by Quzor; 2009-10-12 at 01:00.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:53   Link #1834
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That is my problem. I take this commitment thing too seriously. While i like a person, i could never convince myself i will like the person forever nor vice versa. Therefore, i never commit myself. I know i am probably thinking too much about this things. I know tons of people break up and move on to another relationship but i just can't help thinking like that.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:54   Link #1835
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Originally Posted by whitepearl View Post
More actual love in a marriage could *probably* result in fewer divorces.

The divorce rate in America is pretty ridiculous.

Flora, there are some others (I can't name any specific names as these people are just fellow posters on another messageboard) who also believe that humans are naturally inclined towards polygamy because they want to insure their bloodline and genes can progress through generations.
Haha how cute. Dietrich is a Yankee fan

Well I don't think people would be that obsessed in spreading their seed and reproducing lots of children. There are even some people who don't even want children.
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Old 2009-10-12, 00:59   Link #1836
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Originally Posted by FateAnomaly View Post
That is my problem. I take this commitment thing too seriously. While i like a person, i could never convince myself i will like the person forever nor vice versa. Therefore, i never commit myself. I know i am probably thinking too much about this things. I know tons of people break up and move on to another relationship but i just can't help thinking like that.
I'm sorry you feel that way FateAnomaly. Commitment can be a wonderful thing. But it takes 2 people to make a commitment to each other to make it happen. It doesn't only work one way
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Old 2009-10-12, 01:02   Link #1837
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Originally Posted by FateAnomaly View Post
That is my problem. I take this commitment thing too seriously. While i like a person, i could never convince myself i will like the person forever nor vice versa. Therefore, i never commit myself. I know i am probably thinking too much about this things. I know tons of people break up and move on to another relationship but i just can't help thinking like that.
Entering a relationship under the notion that it will eventually end is a recipe for failure. You never give yourself an opportunity to open up to the other person, because you know that it will be a fruitless endeavor.

As weird as this sounds, and as hard as it may be, make an attempt to go into your forthcoming relationships with no expectations about them whatsoever. Maybe they'll end, and maybe they won't, but you have no way of knowing that from the very beginning. If you eliminate the idea that your relationship will fail from your mind, you may be more inclined to open up to your partner, and thereby be surprised at what you receive in turn.
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Old 2009-10-12, 01:10   Link #1838
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Originally Posted by Quzor View Post
He doesn't actually suggest it as a way to live; it's simply a genetic examination. Genes are inherently "selfish"; they wish to survive for as long as they're able. By exacting an open sharing mentality from their "survival machines" (his words for humans), they increase their chances of survivability.

I don't know if he actually supports polygamy or not (I suspect he doesn't, since he's married to only 1 woman) but, again, this isn't his point of view on how people should live their lives. It's merely an examination of the behavior of genes as they try to survive through the generations.
Yep, we're only talking about his viewpoint You said he "suggested" it though.

I kinda think it's a bit silly how he personified genes
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Old 2009-10-12, 01:12   Link #1839
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Well I don't think people would be that obsessed in spreading their seed and reproducing lots of children. There are even some people who don't even want children.
Seconded, I have a few friends who feel better not having children, and I myself can only love one person (at least so far, but I don't think it will change in the future )
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Old 2009-10-12, 01:28   Link #1840
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Originally Posted by Quzor View Post
Interestingly enough, I'm reading a book about this very subject; The Selfish Gene, by Richard Dawkins. Whether you like him or not (most people have a pretty definitive viewpoint about him), the book is quite interesting.

The book focuses largely, in certain chapters, on the "resource cost" of reproduction for both sexes. Interesting enough, Dawkins suggests that it would be beneficial for men and women to mate with as many people as possible, so as to give better chance of their genes progressing into the next generation. However, he suggests that this may be easier for men to do, than for women.
I've never read the book, so to be perfectly honest I can't refute any statements directly in good faith because I don't know the whole story. However, I've heard The Selfish Gene referenced a few times before, and it always makes me feel that the book takes a very simplistic view of genetics and then tries to put a spin on it to explain some aspect of life/society. Whether it's the book itself or just what people are coming away with I can't say for certain. I'd love to refute the ideas from the book that you mentioned here but in light of the fact that it isn't in the full context I guess I can't, really. Either way, whenever you read another passage from that book, know that I'm probably in disagreement

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Originally Posted by FateAnomaly View Post
That is my problem. I take this commitment thing too seriously. While i like a person, i could never convince myself i will like the person forever nor vice versa. Therefore, i never commit myself. I know i am probably thinking too much about this things. I know tons of people break up and move on to another relationship but i just can't help thinking like that.
I'm the same way, sort of. I never dated with the idea that it'd be temporary - it was an evaluation and an attempt to make something that would last. Obviously you try to stack the odds in your favor by going for girls that you find attractive and suspect would be compatible with you, but the only way to find out for sure is to take the dive.

Will you be attracted to them forever? Male wisdom that's been passed around dictates that you won't. You can date the absolute hottest girl, but within a few months you'll be used to it and other girls will seem more attractive to you. Anyone who says otherwise is probably lying, because this stems from a general trait of human nature (I suppose); that we take for granted what we have once it becomes normalcy. It's the "grass is greener" mentality - at best you can be content with what you have, but you'll always wonder whether things might be better on the other side.

I think that this is partly where the notion that "relationships require work" comes into play. It seems to me that many people expect that love just pops up and that once it appears it makes everything easy. Love does make things easy, but it's sort of like growing a plant - even the hardiest of plants require that you ensure that they get enough sun and give them water here and there. What I mean is, aside from making sure that you're still attractive to your mate and are meeting her needs and desires, you need to keep focused on her, too.

As a personal example, I live with my fiancee. In truth, we began cohabiting very early on in the relationship. We spent and still spend copious amounts of time together. Those days of not knowing each other's presence disappeared very quickly. It would have been very easy for me to take her for granted and start looking around at other girls. However, I actively cultivate my love, admiration, and respect for her. It's partially a state of mind - I remind myself each day how lucky I am to be with such a wonderful, beautiful person (and I verbalize it to her many times a day, which of course she appreciates). Physically, I appreciate all aspects of her and find beauty in all traits. Sure, it helps that she's naturally beautiful, but don't fool yourself into thinking that you could stare at the same beautiful girl day in and day out and not get bored. I didn't find her particularly physically attractive the very first time that we met, yet with time she only becomes more beautiful. There are many reasons for that (she was a big nerd who didn't care much for her appearance before she met me ) but I'm fairly certain that my mindset contributes.

Of course, to write it all out makes it sound like a chore of some sort. It isn't at all. Those sorts of things come naturally and easily to me. Do I occasionally take her for granted? I'm sure I do. But ultimately I'm in this relationship to make it last (that's a bit obvious now given that we're engaged). You won't last long if you don't actively respect and care for each other, at the very least. The fact that I receive loads of love and affection back each day definitely makes it very easy for me to keep reminding myself of how lucky I am and all, too.

The point I'm trying to make for you, specifically, is to worry a bit less about what's far off in the future. Know yourself, know your nature, and then figure out how to deal with it. It's fine to enter a relationship expecting that this might be the big marathon, but keep evaluating it and keep evaluating yourself. Don't get married after a month, of course, but work with yourself and with your mate. Yes, work at it. If it begins to feel like a burden then you're either putting in too much effort, you're not putting in the effort properly, or it could be that your partner isn't giving back on the same level. If that's the case, talk about it - communication is also critical to a relationship.
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