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Old 2006-05-13, 16:46   Link #21
OutPhase
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Old 2006-05-13, 16:51   Link #22
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I like the inclusion of Meta-knight, but I hope that Nintendo keeps all the old characters that was in the SSBM.
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Old 2006-05-16, 01:00   Link #23
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This game should have wireless play, too. which should be a blast.
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Old 2007-08-29, 17:00   Link #24
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Why is this thread so dead? There is like a update everyday and yet nobody are taking about the updates. Anyway Pokemon trainer as a character is pretty interesting concept, but I think it could be little hard to balance.
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Old 2007-08-29, 17:17   Link #25
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humm... if they could balance Zelda/Shiek in Melee, i don't see a problem with a "shapeshift" with 3 pokemon.

the problem is most likely the "forced" way to swap, as the stamina is another important thing to micro manage...
i Hope they will put enough difference so they will create a dynamic of it.

i hope they will not add any more pokemon (not that i dislike the franchise by any mean), since instead of adding more and more (much like the useless clone, pichu, and the retarded jigglypuff), they can introduce more characters from different franchises.

I'm a bit sad that Marth and Roy won't make their come back (i assume, as the newcome from fire emblem looks like a mix of the previous swordmen...) but oh well ^^"
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Old 2007-08-29, 17:56   Link #26
Terrestrial Dream
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Originally Posted by Klashikari View Post
humm... if they could balance Zelda/Shiek in Melee, i don't see a problem with a "shapeshift" with 3 pokemon.

the problem is most likely the "forced" way to swap, as the stamina is another important thing to micro manage...
i Hope they will put enough difference so they will create a dynamic of it.

i hope they will not add any more pokemon (not that i dislike the franchise by any mean), since instead of adding more and more (much like the useless clone, pichu, and the retarded jigglypuff), they can introduce more characters from different franchises.

I'm a bit sad that Marth and Roy won't make their come back (i assume, as the newcome from fire emblem looks like a mix of the previous swordmen...) but oh well ^^"
But this time it's with three character so it could be different, and yes it is too bad that Roy and Marth won't be there those two were one of my best characters
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Old 2007-08-30, 04:07   Link #27
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the retarded jigglypuff
Hey, Jigglypuff is a pretty good character! His slap does a lot of damage. When you sing a character that's damaged enough to sleep, you can roll up and bounce him/her out of the arena!
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Old 2007-08-30, 04:22   Link #28
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I know jigglypuff "rest" attack can be really powerful and devastating. (though the "hitbox" of the skill is extremely unconsistant. heck, it is almosy impossible to do it on the ground, except if you recklessly run at the oppenents, who will easely guard)

the problem is mainly the "style" which is clearly not "balanced".
Supposed to be a heavy aerial melee character, it is also its huge weakness.

Not as silly as pichu in term of "suvivability", Jigglygpuff is really not a top tier char. even kirby, who was terribly nerfed from SSB N64 version is a better choice in that regard (losing the "burst" effect, but that's it). let's not mention peach, who has a better air control (her meteor smash, and down smash are extremely efficient)

Falco, Cpt Falcon and kirby offer far more options and decency in that field. (well i can't expect 25 characters being balanced...)
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Old 2007-08-30, 04:50   Link #29
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whoa! This is the only game in the first page of the games subforum that I've actually played before... Last year, that is.

Okay, not exactly, I've not touched brawl before, but I've played melee and vN64, the latter I consider myself more proficient at.

But I found jigglypuff nerfed in melee, contrary to what my friends think. I thought the improved 'versatility' of that character in melee heavily undermined the original style of the character not to mention the decreased defense of the attacks.

Can't remember too much about a game I played last year though. =O
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Old 2007-08-30, 05:42   Link #30
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well they've updated with a new skill called "gliding".
Its only use for Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard (one of Pokemon Trainers choices of Pokemon).
Pretty interesting new skill and it will add new ideas and styles of fighting in Brawl.
But the biggest update in Brawl to date is the Subspace Emissary in the Adventure mode. Sounds like the creator of Brawl has come up with a huge idea for this new adventure mode that will affect every character in Brawl. Anyone seen the videos of the Subspace Emissary on the website?
The characters new looks are really good. They all have good details to their clothing and over all expression that expresses the character that their supposed to be.
December 3 is the date of release, until then I can't wait to play this game...it sounds pretty epic with all the updates and third party characters that are trying to make the cut.
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Old 2007-08-30, 12:33   Link #31
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Originally Posted by Ultima_Rasengan05 View Post
well they've updated with a new skill called "gliding".
Its only use for Pit, Metaknight, and Charizard (one of Pokemon Trainers choices of Pokemon).
Pretty interesting new skill and it will add new ideas and styles of fighting in Brawl.
But the biggest update in Brawl to date is the Subspace Emissary in the Adventure mode. Sounds like the creator of Brawl has come up with a huge idea for this new adventure mode that will affect every character in Brawl. Anyone seen the videos of the Subspace Emissary on the website?
The characters new looks are really good. They all have good details to their clothing and over all expression that expresses the character that their supposed to be.
December 3 is the date of release, until then I can't wait to play this game...it sounds pretty epic with all the updates and third party characters that are trying to make the cut.
Speaking of third party, how come there is zero update on Snake? There should be at least some info seeing how popular he is. New adventure mode seems really nice, Melee's adventure mode was pretty fun, but it was really repetitive to beat it again and again for those damn trophies.
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Old 2007-08-30, 12:41   Link #32
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They might have problem about how they will design him.
basically, they need to pull his "leet" skills, without being overpowered, or completely OOC / ridiculous.

much like samus, who her lethality is greatly toned down for SSB series, i believe they are doing some extra care in design but also faithfulness with Snake.
I guess ideo kojima helps in it as well.
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Old 2007-08-30, 19:21   Link #33
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I know jigglypuff "rest" attack can be really powerful and devastating. (though the "hitbox" of the skill is extremely unconsistant. heck, it is almosy impossible to do it on the ground, except if you recklessly run at the oppenents, who will easely guard)

the problem is mainly the "style" which is clearly not "balanced".
Supposed to be a heavy aerial melee character, it is also its huge weakness.

Not as silly as pichu in term of "suvivability", Jigglygpuff is really not a top tier char. even kirby, who was terribly nerfed from SSB N64 version is a better choice in that regard (losing the "burst" effect, but that's it). let's not mention peach, who has a better air control (her meteor smash, and down smash are extremely efficient)

Falco, Cpt Falcon and kirby offer far more options and decency in that field. (well i can't expect 25 characters being balanced...)
Kirby is one of the worst characters in SSBM. Jigglypuff is way better. Jiggly has just as good recovery (actually better, thanks to Pound), and way better smashes and specials. Kirby can't combo as well, and has no easy way to get kills. As much as you bash rest, there are ways to land it on a consistent basis. I will agree that it is hard to land on a grounded opponent, but Jiggly has easy ways to to get the opponent off the ground with throws, Pound, or even up tilts. Learn how to use Jiggly's good aerials and you can see just how much better she is than Kirby.
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Old 2007-08-30, 23:31   Link #34
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Why are people worried about Marth not being in? There hasn't been any indication that he's been removed (and considering the symbol for all FE-related things in Brawl is the Falchion, I'm more inclined to believe that he's still in). Roy is another matter though, seeing as he was only added in Melee to increases the sales for his game.

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Originally Posted by hyperlion
Speaking of third party, how come there is zero update on Snake?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klashikari
They might have problem about how they will design him.
basically, they need to pull his "leet" skills, without being overpowered, or completely OOC / ridiculous.
I'd say there's another reason for that. The unlockable characters in Melee weren't featured in the official website until after the game's release. Sakurai has stated that the 3rd party characters will be unlockables, so I imagine we won't be seeing Snake's profile for a long while.

Huh, should someone put up a list of all the updates for Brawl for those who don't visit the site?

Well, if anyone still doesn't know about it here's the official Brawl page.

Oh yeah, what's everyone's thoughts on what's been revealed for The Subspace Emissary so far? I for one am definitely liking it. Though I'm kind of worried that it seems like we'll be forced to start out with Kirby.
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Old 2007-08-31, 01:58   Link #35
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Kirby has really been watered down in recent versions of SSB. In the original 64 version, I could raelly pwn with him. But now, he just has little to no attack power.

And Roy is the best character in the game, IMO. I can pwn ANYONE with him. I Beat the 100-man melee with him in SSBM. His target test was ridiculously difficult, though.

I haven't played this latest version yet, but I plan to at the earliest opportunity. I'm in college, though, and I'm not sure I can afford to waste money on "frivolous" objects of entertainment.
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Old 2007-08-31, 04:21   Link #36
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Originally Posted by Spectacular_Insanity View Post
Kirby has really been watered down in recent versions of SSB. In the original 64 version, I could raelly pwn with him. But now, he just has little to no attack power.

And Roy is the best character in the game, IMO. I can pwn ANYONE with him. I Beat the 100-man melee with him in SSBM. His target test was ridiculously difficult, though.

I haven't played this latest version yet, but I plan to at the earliest opportunity. I'm in college, though, and I'm not sure I can afford to waste money on "frivolous" objects of entertainment.
O_O Roy's target test was hard??? I though Dr. Mario's was the hardest (or even Marth's is a little harder than Roy's, but that is just IMHO)

Mm frankly I think Marth is a better character than Roy since his regular attacks are WAY stronger (if you know where the part of the sword that hits that is )

@Klash- IMHO, I would have to say Jigglypuff is a better character than Kirby. Not only are her attacks stronger but also with Pound (as mentioned b4) you can get back to the stage easily. And with certain amount of practice her Down+B move would be almost automatic hit (well, rephrase, a lot of practice, it was like 2 minutes for my friend but I still cant get it ). 30~40% and Rest and you're a goner


The addition of the Pokemon trainer adds a certain diversity to this new generation. Wonder how the pokemons differ from each other and from those that appear from the pokeball

Man i can't wait until this game is released but hey i gotta get a Wii first
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Old 2007-08-31, 04:58   Link #37
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Speaking of third party, how come there is zero update on Snake? There should be at least some info seeing how popular he is. New adventure mode seems really nice, Melee's adventure mode was pretty fun, but it was really repetitive to beat it again and again for those damn trophies.
well maybe the reason why they don't update anything on Snake is because he's a third party character and he'll be a secret character from the start.
I guess the creator might fear that he might be spoiling way too much on secret characters, especially if its a third party character.
Anyways, if I remember correctly, the creator of Smash bro. just wanted up to 2 or maybe 3 more third party characters, excluding Snake.
Many want Sonic in the game...and I think thats already a given, since there is a game called "Mario and Sonic at the Olympic games" videogame coming out later this year.
The Wario Ware stage in today's update looks really interesting...reminds me of mr.game and watch's stage in melee.
And I'm sure that Snake's move set will be pretty unique...they gotta avoid the use of guns and him smoking, since this is a NINTENDO game and Nintendo always appeal to all audiences of age.
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Old 2007-08-31, 06:21   Link #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spectacular_Insanity View Post
Kirby has really been watered down in recent versions of SSB. In the original 64 version, I could raelly pwn with him. But now, he just has little to no attack power.
That's true, Kirby was more likely toned down for its attack power and some of his velocity.
Quote:
And Roy is the best character in the game, IMO. I can pwn ANYONE with him. I Beat the 100-man melee with him in SSBM. His target test was ridiculously difficult, though.
It is of course a matter of opinion. However, I favour Marth much more.
As a matter of fact, Marth is faster and heavier. (i don't get how Roy is so light... i mean, he is even lighter than Luigi)
I favour way much how a character can be versatile and avoid unecessary skirmish. An for that matter, Marth's falshion is much better for my tastes.
In general, while Roy most likely deal more damage with the middle of the sword, Marth has a more safe way to deal them, and the knock effect is constant, and already high on slight damage char. To be quite accurate, Marth smash/shield breaker (B) can knock down 80% (60% for jiggly, kirby and pichu) char with the tip of the sword on "usual" medium sized stages

As for Roy's blazing sword, i must say that the balance of his blade is completely unconsistant. Somestimes, he just deal knocking blow more powerful than anyone and sometimes... it is regular (both when the target is hit with the middle of his blade). i believe the hitbox is extremely awkward.
another problem with his weapon is the fact he has 2 weak spots : the tip, but also in proximity. If you are sticking your oppenent, it will be a silly dull blow.

This is extremely annoying for the foward B, especially the first 3 combo dance. Basically, the "dance" range is short, as Roy use his blade in bias, and even thrust with it. Only the last move, the fourth one, is effective, and the problem is : Roy is MUCH SLOWER than marth in general, even in execution of move. thus, when he is spinning for the fourth blade slash, he is vulnerable.

As both FE characters suck in air, Roy suck even more, as hitting with the middle of the sword is much harder, and doesn't deal substancial damage/knock either. Much worse, Roy doesn't have a Meteor smash, unlike Marth.

Roy's counter attack is... geh... short, but like his smash/blaze sword (B) moves, completely unbalanced in scale of knocking back. But usually, if you don't counter a severely damaged oppenent (80+), it won't be effective...
Marth's counter move is much longer, and doesn't suffer of the sword issue. of course, he doesn't have the ability to knock afar out of proportion, but the knock is very constant, even against undamaged/slightly damage char (<40)

finally, but not the least, Roy's upwards B attack is fine, and can be annoying, but doesn't knock or deal substancial damage.
Marth is much more tricky to hit properly with dolphin strike, and can leave you extremely vulnerable if you miss. but on the other hand, even if it is not perfectly done, the oppenent is somewhat flying. The execution of the move is so fast that it is hardly possible to avoid it.

i still can see how roy can be favored for his very high brutal abilities. (when i begun Melee, i favored much more Roy and he was ma favourite contestant, until i "mastered" Marth some weeks later, and i see the abyssal differences)
Just to me, Roy has only that thing, and Marth is much more versatile and efficient.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ice Climbers View Post
@Klash- IMHO, I would have to say Jigglypuff is a better character than Kirby. Not only are her attacks stronger but also with Pound (as mentioned b4) you can get back to the stage easily. And with certain amount of practice her Down+B move would be almost automatic hit (well, rephrase, a lot of practice, it was like 2 minutes for my friend but I still cant get it ). 30~40% and Rest and you're a goner
Stronger, i don't believe so. As Jiggly is supposed to be a aerial queen, her aerial combo is plain weak (as it was rather good in N64). Let's not mention the ridiculous "knock" effect on pound.
Kirby has a much better move set, though the lack of raw power is a problem, he doesn't have range issue unlike jiggly.

To be quite honest, i don't get the usefulness of pound, considering the usual structure of the arena : in advanced play, people usually want you to be down quick, so they use meteor smash on your face. That means you need to recover HEIGHT and not distance.
As result, many character favouring distance are screwed (especially DK and Bowser, who REALLY suck to recover height)
and even if we take "usual" skirmish, arena are rarely very wide. that mean that it is very unlikely that you need to cover lot of distance. either you are already dead, or you are safe without that many. As far as i could play on Melee, i rarely saw Kirby unable to recover from a knock back if he is still alive.

frankly, Rest doesn't worth the risk, and you have to perform it while mid air, which require much more attention, timing, and if the oppenent is slower than you. This is even more reckless in a true melee, with 4 players. It is impossible to use rest, or the 3 others are just slowpokes.

Quote:
The addition of the Pokemon trainer adds a certain diversity to this new generation. Wonder how the pokemons differ from each other and from those that appear from the pokeball
as far as i can see, they will most likely use pokemon from Gol/silver/ruby/saphirre/diamond/pearl, to avoid any confusion with the "first" generation. sole exception is of course goldeen
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Old 2007-08-31, 09:44   Link #39
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i wonder if they'll keep shieks transformation through zelda..i hope they do! shes one of my best.
Same with Dr. Mario =T

But if they are keeping guys like Dr.Mario or Gannonorf or falco or w/e..im guessing theyr gonna have thier own set of moves. unlike being the "stronger" or more "faster" version of those almost the same characters. i.e. gannondof and cpt. falcon, falco and fox, marth and roy..etc etc..
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Old 2007-08-31, 10:00   Link #40
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That really depend. there are very interesting "clones".
Ganondorf and Cpt Falcon playstyles are EXTREMELY different, despite the blunt "Speed-Strength" difference.

the same can be applied with Roy.

but indeed the rest is extremely disappointing considering the "slight change", or even downgrade. (obviously, pichu. then Young link doesn't worth the loss of weight, strength and range, for the simple speed and jump abilities...)

Interestingly, some "original" characters are also joke (or even worse than "side grade clones"):
Ness (utterly nerfed from N64), Mr Game and Watch (erratic playstyle, not efficient mindgame), Mewtwo (goofy "supposed" heavy ranged char), jigglypuff and in a certain extent, Kirby and Pikachu.

of course, this is only my personal tastes, but i hope they will be able to balance the game more like N64 version than melee. (to be fairly honest, the damage scale and knock back aren't constant in melee. too much luck factor in some cases (Roy/bowser/ganondorf UBER knock out coming twice each 10-15 tries, etc)
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