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Old 2006-12-31, 06:51   Link #281
Slayerx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Papaya View Post
I think it's safe to say that Sony is taking BIG hits right now, even from Japanese devs.

Still no word of a full-featured DQ for PS3 or PS2 yet :O
Actually, that doesn't really say all that much...
When you talk about dragon quest your talking about Square Enix, and Square has always pretty much released games for both Sony and Nintendo... they release the games for the system they are best suited for... In the case of DQ for the wii, they seem to be focusing on "fun and interaction" or, as i see it, more innovative gameplay, which is something the Wii is more suited for... However, with FFXIII, the focus there is mostly about making the game looking downright beautiful, which is what PS3 is good for...

DS is also gonna get FFXII: Revelant Wings and a sequel to FFTAdvanced... however, PSP is getting FFVII: Crisis core, and a remake of FF Tactics (the really awsome PSX game)...

So ya, the only reason a DQ game is coming out for sony is not because the square doesn't love sony, it's just that the PS3 and the PSP are just not the right machines for the game they want to make... nintendo is where you go when you want to aim for a innovative gameplay, Sony is where they aim when they want graphical beauty...
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Old 2006-12-31, 08:37   Link #282
Benoit
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Sony's success does not depend on the PS3. That is only a part of their company. They have plenty of other products to float them if the PS3 fails.
Years back they had a really rough time thanks to Matsushita's better performance in the electronics market. They have been reporting losses almost every year.

Then we had the Sony BMG rootkit fiasco, exploding batteries, M$ coming out with a console that had a multi-core CPU, when they thought they had an exclusive on it...

If anything, the Blu-Ray getting integrated to the PS3 is a dead give-away.
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If you didn't know, most of the video game consoles cost money to make when they are initially put on the market.
Not true. It all started with the PS2 or PSX. The Dreamcast, GameCube and the Wii didn't make losses (not sure about the Dreamcast). This "lose on console, gain on games" idea is a recent trend. It wasn't present in the 16-bits, 8-bits or older era.
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Well, the Wii didn't, but it uses a processor that is almost the equivalent of an N64, so, we won't count them
I hope that's a joke, because if not, you're badly misinformed...
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Old 2006-12-31, 08:40   Link #283
Radd
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Not really try, Square and Nintendo were, as far as companies go, quite at odds with each other for a while. For the entire life of the N64, and much of the Gamecube/GBA generation. Crystal Chronicles was Square's first "big" return to the Nintendo camp, and it was more of a grudging token, as Nintendo would not let Square develope for the lucrative GBA market unless they also supported the home console. Since then, Square-Enix's support for Nintendo has almost exclusively rested with the GBA, and the much more profitable DS market. The DS is really the big machine right now, outselling home consoles, and still selling out a few years after its original launch over the course of this holiday season.

On that note, saying that the PSP/PS3 are not the right machines for the games Square-Enix wants to make? Well, that's only true so much as that S-E wants to make games for the consoles they stand to make the most profit off of. This is why the DS is seeing so much more love from them than the PSP or the home consoles.

However, at this time I'd say their support for the Wii is still tentative. Early support in the form of a new Crystal Chronicles game, and DQ:Swords show that they want their foot in the door. We can expect to see much more support for the Wii should it prove that it's popularity is not simply a short lived spurt due to new-console hype.

The shift in Square-Enix support, despite not being absolute, is certainly a sign of the times. Developers realize that the PS3 is a risky investment, as it costs a lot to develope for, and the promise of returns isn't nearly as great as the PS2 showed, and will not likely sell as well as the PS2 due mainly to its price. Nintendo and Microsoft both are bending over backwards to make a friendly working environment for developers, while Sony is acting much as Nintendo did when the Big N thought they could do whatever they pleased.

The 360 is already in homes, and largely successful outside of Japan. The Wii is incredibly popular and is currently leading the PS3 in market saturation, not to mention it is incredibly inexpensive to develope for since Nintendo is in no way asking developers to push MGS4 level graphics. The DS trumps both and is outselling the PS2 as well. Developers see where the money is going here, and that is the primary factor which will shape the generation.

Currently we're seeing developers spread out more in expectation of a market shift. If any single console shows a strong lead over the others in the next 12-18 months, expect the gap to widen from there.
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Old 2006-12-31, 08:46   Link #284
Radd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benoit View Post
Not true. It all started with the PS2 or PSX. The Dreamcast, GameCube and the Wii didn't make losses (not sure about the Dreamcast). This "lose on console, gain on games" idea is a recent trend. It wasn't present in the 16-bits, 8-bits or older era.
The way I understand it, this started with the PSX. Which was how Sony as able to deliver the console a full hundred bills cheaper than the $400 Sega Saturn. Feeling the heat, Sega tried to convince retailers to soak the loss for them. This did not win them brownie points, and the retailers declined the suggestion.

I'd say that was the beginning of the end for Sega's console aspirations, however that started earlier. Past Sega trying to push their unrivaled 2D powerhouse as a 3D machine doing them no favours, the rift between Sega of America and Sega of Japan threw them into the downward spiral that ended with them leaving hardware altogether.
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Old 2006-12-31, 15:25   Link #285
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Here's the problem with sony's PS3:
Overpriced. Lack of games. Other than Blu-ray, it's weaker than the Xbox360 (cpu/gpu/os/memory wise, oh wait that's anything related to gaming performance), Blu-ray uses MPEG-2 which is an ancient codec whereas HD-DVD uses VC-1, on many HT forums HD-DVD has much better Picture quality than Blu-ray does.

As of right now Xbox360 > Wii >>> PS3. There is no arguing the facts that the PS3 is NOT selling. And people can say "wait for the games to come out" but if no one BUYS the system what incentives do the publishers have do produce an exclusive for the system? The answer is none. This is why many 'PS3 Exclusives' are now also going to be moved to the Xbox360.
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Old 2006-12-31, 15:43   Link #286
kayos
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Here are the full hardware sales, courtesy of Media Create, for the week of December 18-24.

- Nintendo DS Lite - 485,584
- Wii - 279,277
- PSP - 138,588
- PlayStation 3 - 76,882
- PlayStation 2 - 46,209
- Xbox 360 - 17,213

Got the intel from kotaku.com

EDIT:

Uh... Blu-ray uses mpeg-2 for decoding backward compatibility for dvds, it also support H.264/AVC and SMPTE VC-1 (the latest video codecs). They are also in the process of creating a blu-ray disc that would hold 200gb. Then again I might be wrong, should get a second opinion. Anyone?

Last edited by kayos; 2006-12-31 at 16:41.
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Old 2006-12-31, 17:14   Link #287
Lebron
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I'm too lazy to read through, but why are the Japanese hardware sales being posted? Outside of the Nintendo hardware, the rest of those aren't that great. We all know 360 isn't going to take over nothing, so those sales are expected, but yet higher than they use to be. About 2 weeks prior it sold around 50k in tide with Blue Dragons release, but still, I highly doubt they are trying to win Japan over. As long as they can average around 15k a week, then that will be fine. Considering how its selling outside of Japan, that will still enable them to get more Japanese support.


Then again, this is a PS3 thread not 360, this is already gearing up to head into a console war BS thread. We had a 360 thread a while ago, but of course, it turned into a retarded console fanboy war :P

Still I will say this, 06 was one hell of a year. Who would of thought that the 360 and MS would show that they came to fight, and actually deliver some unexpected surprises. Who would of thought the Wii would have such a strong launch, and seem to have alot of non-gamers talking and interested in buying the console. And who would of thought, the PS3, would have such a terrible showing. Let's face it, they no where met the numbers and claims they talked about at the 2 past E3's.

To me coming into next year, Nintendo needs to keep up its pace. They really need to bring in some more 3rd party support, I mean actually good 3rd party support, so they can keep that train going. Get their online mode fully up and running, not just some parts. MS needs to get out those new 360 systems in early '07, with the new chips, to get rid of the overheating issue and enable the price cut. And Mr. Sony, needs to stop thinking they're all high and mighty and that they don't have to worry because they're Sony, due to the fact that they won the last 2 gens. Don't forget Nintendo had that same type of attitude back in the day, and see what happened? :P They need to get rid of the shipping problems, snatch up some good Exclusives, and actually show they have come to fight. Because right now, I'm not getting that vibe. Both Nintendo and MS, have showed that they are, but Sony, is just high up in the clouds.


Yup '07 should be a fun year, so many games, so little time(due to college)
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Last edited by Lebron; 2006-12-31 at 17:31.
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Old 2006-12-31, 17:47   Link #288
kayos
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Originally Posted by Lebron View Post
but why are the Japanese hardware sales being posted?
Lol, sorry I was being lazy as well, just grab some data and threw it in.
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Old 2006-12-31, 17:49   Link #289
Lebron
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Originally Posted by kayos View Post
Lol, sorry I was being lazy as well, just grab some data and threw it in.
haha nice :P
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Old 2006-12-31, 20:10   Link #290
Slayerx
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The shift in Square-Enix support, despite not being absolute, is certainly a sign of the times.
Only real signs i see for certain is that the Wii and DS is best suited for games that are innovative and targeted to an audience of all ages, where as the PS3 and PSP are better suited for games that are generally focus more on looking just really damn good... any signs beyond there are uncertain and FAR too early to make the call... It will be atleast another year before we can make such calls

Quote:
This is why many 'PS3 Exclusives' are now also going to be moved to the Xbox360.
Please tell me more... Seriously i haven't heard much about exclusives moving to the 360...
MGS4, Devil May cry, FFXIII, Resitance fall of man, white Knight story, God of war, Heavenly sword... all of them are PS3 exclusives and show absolutly no sign of crossing over to the 360... i think armor core is the only sony exclusive that is cross platforming... heh, funny thing is that there is also ninja gaiden for the xbox being remade for the PS3... not to mention, that the 360, after a year, doesn't have THAT many more good exclusives itself

I also do recall a story i heard on a blog about a game Wardevil... what was interesting about it was that the game was orginally annouced for both PS3 and Xbox 360... However, it has more recently been changed and the release of the 360 version was cancelled... the UK developer picked the risky PS3 over the early successful 360... i can't help but wonder why they picked THAT platform over the other, only to think that they saw something the PS3 could do that the 360 could not... and i can't help but think that this may become the trend in later years...
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Old 2006-12-31, 20:13   Link #291
Papaya
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Virtua Fighter 5 is going to the XBox360. Not that it'll make much of a difference, since SEGA has already stated long ago that they're never adding in online support.
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Old 2006-12-31, 21:27   Link #292
Radd
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Actually, we're two years into the PSP/DS thing. It's pretty easy to see the trends and make correlations with price, portability, and games. We're also a year into the 360, and with the beginning of this generation (starting at least half a year ago) we've seen some major shifts in developer support that fall right along the lines drawn by predictions (some of which have already been proven true) in production costs, market saturation, and profit potential. Coupled with quotes from developers voicing concerns about things such as those, for anyone paying attention none of what is happening is news so much as confirmation.

Note that I make no decisive conclusions about what will happen this generation, I agree that it is far too early for such judgements regarding the home consoles. We can make suppositions based on what we suggestions of what might happen in the coming year, but there's too many variables for anything more than a truckload of "ifs", tying them to what we know as fact, and what we deduce of the coming months. Whatever actually happens in these next 12 months will make the following years more clear.
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Old 2007-01-01, 09:23   Link #293
Lebron
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White Knight Story is being developed by Level 5, but published by Sony. Heavenly Sword, Resistance and God of War, are also published by Sony, so no duh they won't cross over. As for SE, well no duh *knock on wood*, they will give the 360 that new FF MMORPG they're developing and call it a day, which will also be on PS3 and PC.

Seeing how you want to list canceled games, guess I'll contribute a few canned PS3 ones to be fair,
Killing Day -canceled-
Coded Arms Assault -canceled-
Elveon -360/PC only now-
Thesis -360/PC only now-
Alan Wake -360/PC only now-
Bioshock -360/PC only now-
Endless Saga -canceled-
Condemned -canceled-
Black Blade -canceled-
Dark RPG -canceled-
If you really want to look it up, you'll find the reasons why ranged from Unreal 3 engine issues( Japanese devs seem to be having issues with it, due to low support help), hardware issues, and production costs. Also there have been a few 360 games canceled for some of the same reasons, as well, Frame City Killer, Scarface, and The Sopranoes.


In the end, it isn't the hardware that will win developers, if that was the case Xbox would of had all the best 3rd party games, seeing how it was the most powerful, or PSP would be getting more support than DS. So that argument holds no water.

In the end, its the system that which will enable for the biggest profit, meaning who has market lead. As it stands right now 360 is hovering around 8million sold, Wii 3.6million( off to a great start), and PS3 around 1.2million. However, like Radd said, its too early to be calling things. This year, '07, will decide on how things will most likely turn out in the coming years.

But, expect more 3rd party developers to bring their games to multi-platforms. So it's a good thing for actual gamers, I guess maybe bad for console loyalists.
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Old 2007-01-02, 11:07   Link #294
wsheit
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Originally Posted by Lebron View Post
But, expect more 3rd party developers to bring their games to multi-platforms. So it's a good thing for actual gamers, I guess maybe bad for console loyalists.
You bring a very balanced, healthy perspective to this forum, but I have to disagree on this point. Having more developers go multi-platform is NOT a good thing for gamers. When games are made for multiple platforms, they aren't as well optimized for the individual pieces of hardware they're running on. Even if a game is spectacular on one console, there's a pretty good chance that it ends up being watered down on consoles with different capabilities. Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory is a good example.

And when I look at my favorite games on my shelf, I realize that most of them are exclusives (from a variety of consoles).
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Old 2007-01-02, 11:29   Link #295
Lebron
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Yeah, I agree in some way. Maybe I should of refrained my actual statement, maybe not actual gamers, but for those who may not have the luxury of being able to buy all 3 consoles.

For instance since VF5 was brought up, lets say someone really wanted to own the game. They've played it at the arcades and really love it. However, they can not afford to purchase a PS3 for it, since its being out of their price range. Normally they would be out of luck. But now that its coming out on the 360, and lets say they can actually scrape some money to be able to purchase a core 360. So now they can get to enjoy the game in the comforts of home, w/o paying arcade prices or trying to shell out $500+ for a PS3. Pretty much giving every fan of the series a chance to play and own the game. Thats what I was trying to get it.

I think its kind of up in the air with multi-platform games, though. Some games I wouldn't mind going multi, but then there are others I wish would just stay on one console. Not being a fanboy of the console, but of the game. I would rather them focus their efforts on one console. I think its a lot easier for certain genres to go multi-platform, but for others they really need be on one console. Sports, fighting, and *some* shooter games, for instance, actually make the multi-platform transition pretty good. Then there are others like *other* shooters, RPGs, Action Adventure, etc, that wouldn't make that transition so well, and would be better if they stayed on one console. Also, glad you pointed out SC4 DA, thats one franchise I wish they just focus on with one console. Which is why I'm glad SC5, will be exclusive to one console, plus a PC version. I could care less if it was on 360, or PS3, just as long as it's on one. So they can focus the game for that particular hardware, and design it to that hardwares strengths.

Also, I hate downgraded ports with a passion. If they ever have to dumb down a game in order to bring it out on to another platform, then they might as well not even bother. It's mostly the lazy developers fault, not the actual hardware. Take Farcry for instance, the PC version still remains one of the best FPS ever, and easily one of my favorites. However, the ports they released on the consoles, were freaking terrible and should of never been released in the first place if they were going to half-ass them like that. Those were a major slap in the face to the original.

So yea like I said, its kind of a mix bag with me with multi-platforms. Guess I should of explained that better.
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Last edited by Lebron; 2007-01-02 at 11:41.
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Old 2007-01-03, 01:20   Link #296
Cloud.Final.Fantasy
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Naww..I Played it in a Future shop..Still Has Rumble..! Which is pretty Good..I guess..
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Old 2007-01-03, 01:59   Link #297
Papaya
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I think you played a PS2.
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Old 2007-01-03, 06:14   Link #298
Onizuka-GTO
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yeah, it's quite understandable to mistaken a ps2 rumble pad with a wireless ps3 controller.

except....do they even have wireless rumble pads for ps2? I don't remember seeing any....
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Old 2007-01-03, 09:05   Link #299
kayos
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I don't recall seeing a ps3 controller that rumble. There's sony ps3 and logitech controller for the ps3 so far but neither rumbles.
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Old 2007-01-13, 20:07   Link #300
Lebron
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wow this thread has been kind of dead, sooo, here's a amazing Heavenly Sword Tech demo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Z3lI...related&search

:P
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