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View Poll Results: Which is stronger?
Mobile suits 13 59.09%
Aestivalises 9 40.91%
Voters: 22. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2006-06-07, 04:48   Link #1
Shinji103
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Mobile suits vs Aestivalises

In following with the trend of vs threads in this here fair Gundam forum section, here's a real brain-picker.

The reason I say mobile suits instead of just Gundams is farily simple: We all know that Gundams aren't the ultimate mobile suits in existence, just the most legendary. The Zeong was better than the Gundam, the Qubeley was at least on par with the Zeta Gundam, and the Quin Mantha was probably the strongest MS in all of ZZ.

Let's stay away from any battleship vs battleship debates. Nadesico vs Neir Arghama? Nadesico vs Archangel? Puh-lease. The Archangel and Neir Arghama would be lucky to last 2 seconds. Distortion field + gravity blast. The techonolgy gap due to the alien technology is just too big. But the Aestivalises don't really employ much, if any, of the alien technology, so they're fair game.

Don't know what an Aestivalis is? Go watch Martian Successor Nadesico, you fools! ( that's sarcasm, for all you over-serious people )

EDIT: Let's keep this a strict "which is the better weapon" type debate. No "entire Gundam unvierse vs the five Aestivalises" ridiculousness, please.
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Last edited by Shinji103; 2006-06-07 at 06:17.
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Old 2006-06-07, 05:29   Link #2
SNT1
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Since Turn-A is mobile suit, BAM!~ there goes the neighborhood. ( oh yeah, it takes the Nadesico too for a ride)

If Mobile Fighters are counted as MS, BAM!~ there goes the neighborhood.

If the gundam team can keep the aestivalises busy by throwing millions (Lex Luthor: "BILLIONS!") of grunts while DX, WZC, ZZ, V2AB, Zanneck, Ex-S, Dendro charges up to attack, BAM!~ there goes the neighborhood.
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Old 2006-06-07, 06:15   Link #3
Shinji103
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Okay, I guess I should have stated a few rules to keep this from going to the ultra-ridiculous end of the guage.

1) No Turn A. Seriously, in almost every "Gundam vs" thread I've seen, once people start talking about Turn A, the fun of the debate goes down the drain, because of the Turn A's uber-overpowered-ness with nanomachines. If we're talking about small-scale nanomachines or the Turn A's direct specs, abilities, and performance, then okay.

2) No mobile fighters. Mobile fighters are pretty much super robots what with ki energy attacks and stuff.

3) Let's also stay away from "entirety of Gundam vs the Nadesico's five Aestivalises". That's just a tad ridiculous, don't you think?

4) Let's keep this more on the terms of "which is the better weapon, given any pilot: a mobile suit or an Aestivalis" type debate. Otherwise it'll just get ridiculous, like "Double X + Wing Zero Custom + Full Armor ZZ + V2AB + METEOR + Zanneck + Ex-S + Dendrobium vs the Nadesico's five Aestivalises."
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Old 2006-06-07, 06:23   Link #4
SNT1
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heh heh, I really don't know anything about Nadesico and what the Aestivalises, but since there were no rules, I just had to post the most ridiculous mismatches XD sorry...

I'm more interested on what other will have to say though, so I'll just lurk this thread.
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:00   Link #5
wingdarkness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinji103
Okay, I guess I should have stated a few rules to keep this from going to the ultra-ridiculous end of the guage.

1) No Turn A. Seriously, in almost every "Gundam vs" thread I've seen, once people start talking about Turn A, the fun of the debate goes down the drain, because of the Turn A's uber-overpowered-ness with nanomachines. If we're talking about small-scale nanomachines or the Turn A's direct specs, abilities, and performance, then okay.

:
Dude, you act like Turn-A can go Super Sayian 6 at the drop of a hat to reach Moonlight Butterfly...MB is it's "endgame technique" and IIRC it has to be engaged with it's brother suit to even be awaken...So Turn-A is really just RX-78 minus MB...It should be fair game...

LMMFAO well I guess that's where my debate ends since I don't know jack about A$$tivalises, atleast not enuff to debate it...Nadeisco is deep, deep in the back of my anime cave...
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:13   Link #6
Mr_Paper
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Quick question, can the Black Sarena be used?

For those of you unfamilar with what an Aestivalis is:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nadesico: Project Schiaparelli

The general name for the mecha designed by Nergal Heavy Industries and utilized aboard the ND-001 Nadesico. Aestivalis frames are highly advanced machines and capable of operating in a variety of fields. The basic unit is fully equipped with a multitude of gadgets including rocket forearms connected with high-tension cables, high-speed treads on the rear of their feet, and hand-to-hand combat weapons.

Aestivalis are exceedingly light-weight and maneuverable, due in large part to battle frames lacking an onboard engine. Aestivalis use slave generators which siphon power directly from the ND-001. While drastically cutting down on weight and augmenting agility, Aestivalis frames must remain inside a certain distance from the Nadesico. If passed beyond the energy transfer point, the power supply is cut off and the machines become inactive. Their feather weight and speed are also due to their composition of hardened ceramics and ultra-hard resins. No metal is found anywhere in their chief frame.

Aestivalis typically use propulsion systems based on a two main engine model with multiple apogee motors. Depending on the specific unit, additional thrusters may be added. All Aestivalis are modular, capable of being stripped down and outfitted with mission-specific gear. They are incredibly tough and versatile machines.
Being roughly the same size (refering to the standard 'Aestivalis Main Battle Frame') as a stardard mecha from the Patlabor universe, an Aesitivalis is little more than 10m tall with some frames easily exceeding the 20m range (these are rare and are usually custom creations).

The power and strength of an Aestivalis lies in its near completely modular design, entire frames can be replaced/swapped on the fly and damaged components can easily be ejected. The core component of an Aestivalis unit is the cockpit block consisting of the head and the pilot compartment, everything else is contained on the various battle frames. All parts are stardardized with the only differences between custom and mass-production units being armour shape and color (armour frames excluded, aka. the Black Sarena).

Stardard weapons used on all frames except for the artillery, Lunar and Aesti-X frames are a machine gun/beam pistol, ceramic knives, rocket fists and grenades.

For more info on Nadesico tech and mecha, visit: http://nadesicops.cjb.net/
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:14   Link #7
Obi-Wan
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I voted for MS because I have no clue what an Aesti-whatever is. Sorry I have nothing to add to this discussion other than a vote.
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:18   Link #8
duotiga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan
I voted for MS because I have no clue what an Aesti-whatever is. Sorry I have nothing to add to this discussion other than a vote.

same with me....
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:26   Link #9
Sety
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wingdarkness
Dude, you act like Turn-A can go Super Sayian 6 at the drop of a hat to reach Moonlight Butterfly...MB is it's "endgame technique" and IIRC it has to be engaged with it's brother suit to even be awaken...So Turn-A is really just RX-78 minus MB...It should be fair game...
Where did you get the idea it can only use it when Turn X is around? It was using it against Agrippa and also on earth when Marybell took control of it, the Turn-A simply 'forgot' how to use it and seeing Turn X made it remember. Secondly its no RX-78, the thing would be more comparable to V2 Assault Gundam in terms of fighting ability.


Okay on topic.......

Battleships vs battleships........Nadesico would win hands down, heck if you've played SRWA they actually had a story based confrontation where Nadesico took out the Arghama in one shot and Arghama couldn't even scratch the thing.

Now heres the problem comparing Aesties to MS, MS run on their own power source and Aesties NEED Nadesico to run. You can't have a fight without bringing Nadesico into it unless they're packing the Lunar Frames. In which they'd get pretty easily brought down without their full maneuverability, plus they'd lack their strongest attack the distortion punch. So basically if it was Aesties on their own they'd get brought down like flies. But with the Nadesico supporting, they're pretty much unstoppable.

Only Aestie you could possibly fairly compare to a MS is the Black Serena.
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:43   Link #10
wingdarkness
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Quote:
Where did you get the idea it can only use it when Turn X is around? It was using it against Agrippa and also on earth when Marybell took control of it, the Turn-A simply 'forgot' how to use it and seeing Turn X made it remember. Secondly its no RX-78, the thing would be more comparable to V2 Assault Gundam in terms of fighting ability.
You just said it yourself, it didn't remember until it interacted with Turn X...that was my point and i did say IIRC...Turn-A minus MB basically reminds me of the no frills RX-78 in alot of ways...I'd say that's fair to a degree...
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Old 2006-06-07, 07:55   Link #11
SNT1
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27000 kW of power isn't really a 'no frills' type of power though o_O
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:01   Link #12
wingdarkness
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^Hehe...I was morso talking about the old skool movements and asthetics (minus the stash ofcourse)...It's simplicity in design and functions...not it's power...It simply reminds me off that old skool RX-78 in some ways..I don't see how that's so unimaginable...
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:01   Link #13
Sety
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Originally Posted by wingdarkness
You just said it yourself, it didn't remember until it interacted with Turn X...that was my point and i did say IIRC...Turn-A minus MB basically reminds me of the no frills RX-78 in alot of ways...I'd say that's fair to a degree...
But thats not what you said......you said it has to be fighting Turn-X for it to work and thats just BS.

And I already said, Turn-A is more like V2 Assualt with the twirling double beam sabers and packs the nanomachine beam plus the bombs too.
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:07   Link #14
wingdarkness
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IIRC = If I remember Correctly(Read my first post again)

Which I didn't...but my point was that in Turn-A Gundam it had to come in contact with Turn-X to remember and that it couldn't jump to SSJ Moonlight mode at the drop of a hat in that series(Which is why I was telling Shinji it was fair game in the debate with that in mind)...Have I made myself clear??..I agree with what you said OK...

As for the rest why in God's name can't Turn-A slightly remind me of RX-78??(In it's old skool look and design) Is that against the law or something...It's my personal opinion.....sheesh...
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:08   Link #15
SNT1
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so how would it go down, how are they unstoppable with Nadesico around? Lets pair 2 aestivatsisvatslises against, say, the ZZ Gundam and Nu teamed up?
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:09   Link #16
Mr_Paper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sety
Now heres the problem comparing Aesties to MS, MS run on their own power source and Aesties NEED Nadesico to run. You can't have a fight without bringing Nadesico into it unless they're packing the Lunar Frames. In which they'd get pretty easily brought down without their full maneuverability, plus they'd lack their strongest attack the distortion punch. So basically if it was Aesties on their own they'd get brought down like flies. But with the Nadesico supporting, they're pretty much unstoppable.
Second Gen. Aesti frames do have a limited indepentant power supply. It's nothing to write home about but it does out perform that of the first generation Aesti frames. Ryoko was able to penetrate deep within the colony for an extended time without suffering power loss from a blocked power signal.

Quote:
Only Aestie you could possibly fairly compare to a MS is the Black Serena.
In all honesty, any Gundam facing the Black Serena is going to get beat... badly. >.>; A transformable frame with a power supply capable of independent boson jumping (time warping movement) with dual beam cannons, battleship grade distortion shielding, twin gravity cannons (those guns that took down the Arghama in one shot from SRWA) and a fully armed highly customized (one of the true custom frames in the series) battle frame lurking beneth all this.

This Aesitvalis frame devistated entire fleets of battle ships, Aestivalises and regions of space single handed with it eventually taking ten specialized Aestivalis frames with Anti-Distortion field spears in an all out 10 vs. 1 attack against it to make it shed its outer armour... Nothing 1 vs. 1 is going to touch this thing. ^^:

Last edited by Mr_Paper; 2006-06-07 at 08:25.
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Old 2006-06-07, 08:27   Link #17
physics223
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I think I'm going to watch an episode or two of Turn A Gundam just because Moonlight Butterfly sounds just so darn cool. Do many agree it's the most powerful Gundam - the Turn A, that is? But wow - turning all technology into sand + nanomachines = sure-win, I think.

I can't vote since I don't know much about Gundams, but it's always good to observe.
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Old 2006-06-07, 09:02   Link #18
nightbringer360
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physics233 - why not watch all of Turn A while you're at it? Most here consider it the best Gundam series they have watched, despite the mustache on the Turn A.

Turn A banzai!
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Old 2006-06-07, 09:45   Link #19
physics223
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Do most of the people in this thread believe that Turn A is the best Gundam series they've seen? Was there a poll, by any chance, proving this?
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Old 2006-06-07, 09:51   Link #20
Aidan
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I'll go for the Aesti's. When you go into all the details the Aesti's might not be very powerful offensively, but they would have a perfect defense against MS using beam rifles, as the standard distortion field will bend away any energy beams. Their maneuverability is also superior to MS because all Aesti's have an IFS which enable those that got a Nanomachine Injection Treatment (Akito) to use it as if it's part of their body, plus they are very small.

Aesti's are grunt suits mind you. If you go into the custom MS and Gundams you move to the Black Serena class Aesti.

As for the size of an Aesti,

The Aesti is the small one in the center.

Last edited by Aidan; 2006-06-07 at 10:17.
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