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Old 2006-06-17, 21:33   Link #61
RX-78GP04G Gerbera
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Funnels would depend on how long they can remain active given limited power supplies and all...Bits...who knows...but considering both can attack from beyond visual range, it must be pretty far (given the best soldiers usually have a very good sense of sight and such)
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Old 2006-06-18, 01:40   Link #62
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some funnels ie Nu/ Hi Nu were actually bits (Gyunei commenting on why they are lasting so long), but for some reason were called funnels and fires what appears MP bursts, and can project beam shields. If thats the funnel the poster is refering to then I would say that Funnel whould be the most advanced and useful. Dragoons were controlled by OS, true you don't need a special pilots but computers are also perdictable, they are no where near as good as a human pilot in CE (then again the CE grunts are idiots but you get the point), or else they won't need MS pilots at all, ie Gundam wings mobile dolls, but even that they needed a human.

Bits and funnels are dependent on pilot, if you have 6 bits/funnels in a suit piloted by say Char, that would mean you are facing 6 weapons piloted by Zeon's best pilot, if Amuro then you face 6 Amuro's plus the suit itself, neither opiton is desireable for even an ace pilot. The only reason I say funnel is better then bits is because some funnels could project a beam field, the advantage of that is self evident.
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Old 2006-06-18, 02:13   Link #63
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By far the greatest advantage the G-Bit have is the coordination involved.

The main pilot is literally an entire squadron by him/herself. They are not limited by other people within the squad, nor limited by individual ability, nor limited by other minds.

Manouvers and commands will be followed to the letter.
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Old 2006-06-18, 03:25   Link #64
Vallen Chaos Valiant
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The only reason I say funnel is better then bits is because some funnels could project a beam field, the advantage of that is self evident.
Don't forget, The Nu Gundam Fin funnels don't just use its beam barrier to defend; the beam barrior also acts as a beam blade. Get three of them surounding you, and next thing you know you are in two pieces.

That's the main difference between CE and UC beam shields; the UC beam shield is effectively a giant beam blade on its own, but the CE beam shield can't cut things.
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Old 2006-06-18, 03:34   Link #65
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if you want to get technical, in a close range situation a system of dolls following the master pilot would work best. dolls do come equipped with beam weapons but when they attack in sequence with beam sabres they become much more powerful.
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Old 2006-06-18, 12:42   Link #66
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Originally Posted by idofgrahf
The only reason I say funnel is better then bits is because some funnels could project a beam field, the advantage of that is self evident.
You're contradicting yourself lol, you made a mistake there

We all know Fin Funnels are bits, including yourself. So you should be saying bits are better than funnels, which has always been a fact.
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Old 2006-06-18, 22:24   Link #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C.A.
You're contradicting yourself lol, you made a mistake there

We all know Fin Funnels are bits, including yourself.
Funnels are not bits, bits are fusion powered where as the funnels are powered by e-caps, which needs to be recharged. I'm saying if the poster is refering to Nu's Funnels, then they are better then bits, Nu's funnels are still called funnels although they are powered by fusion instead of e-cap. Maybe they called them funnels because it can do things that bits can't ie beam shield and they much smaller then bits as shown in Gundam evolve. Don't ask me why, but in CCA many characters including Amuro call Nu's funnels, Fin Funnels not bits.

Quote:
So you should be saying bits are better than funnels, which has always been a fact.
hum, didin't you just proclaim that Fin funnels are bits, so how can bits be better then bits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Potatochobit
if you want to get technical, in a close range situation a system of dolls following the master pilot would work best. dolls do come equipped with beam weapons but when they attack in sequence with beam sabres they become much more powerful.
Dolls are much more expensive then 6 of Nu's funnels, not to mention they take up lot of storage space. The Ra Cailum, flag ship of londo bell can only carry 8 MS, and its escort ships, the clops can accomdate four. in UC, with very few exceptions, most ships can't carry more then a dozen MS at a time and losing an MS is considered very big loss.
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Last edited by idofgrahf; 2006-06-18 at 22:42.
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Old 2006-06-19, 00:14   Link #68
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lol you're terribly confused there.

Theres 2 types of remote newtype weaponary, funnels and the more advanced bits. Bits are better than funnels in a whole range of ways, which have been mentioned dozens of times in this thread.

Amuro named Nu Gundam's bits, Fin Funnels. Fin Funnels are bits, they each have compact fusion reactors, act as I-Field generators and have more fire power than any other single funnel or bit in the UC timeline.

Funnel is not the name of Fin Funnel.

Some MSes that uses Funnels: Quebeley, Quin Mantha, Sazabi

MSes that uses bits: Psycho Gundam MKII, Nu Gundam and all alternate universe Gundams.
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Old 2006-06-19, 01:22   Link #69
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lol I never thought there was a difference besides a fancier name xD. I'm just going to say Akatsuki's DRAGOON's, because they are mirror coated and can make that cool shield as well as functioning as normal funnels. They are also blinged out... how can't they be the best?
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Old 2006-06-19, 02:51   Link #70
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i dont know if i would call psycho gundams reflectors bits.

are those wired type's also called bits?
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Old 2006-06-19, 04:23   Link #71
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Originally Posted by Potatochobit
i dont know if i would call psycho gundams reflectors bits.

are those wired type's also called bits?
Technically, they're bits since they're directly powered by a reactor even if they do not actually produce the beams.

Dragoons are superior, only because they are useable by more people as opposed to bits/funnels, which are only useable by Newtypes. An army of DRAGOON-wielding MS is more powerful than a handful of Newtype-use MS.

BTW, IIRC Super DRAGOONS can function under the Earth's gravity. Is that true?
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Old 2006-06-19, 04:52   Link #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C.A.
lol you're terribly confused there.

Theres 2 types of remote newtype weaponary, funnels and the more advanced bits. Bits are better than funnels in a whole range of ways, which have been mentioned dozens of times in this thread.

Amuro named Nu Gundam's bits, Fin Funnels. Fin Funnels are bits, they each have compact fusion reactors, act as I-Field generators and have more fire power than any other single funnel or bit in the UC timeline.

Funnel is not the name of Fin Funnel.

Some MSes that uses Funnels: Quebeley, Quin Mantha, Sazabi

MSes that uses bits: Psycho Gundam MKII, Nu Gundam and all alternate universe Gundams.
Amuro called them funnels, Char called them funnels, gyuni called them funnels, BITs was never even mentioned in CCA, notice the funnel part, hence Gyuni's comment on why are his funnels lasting so long. When did Amuro in CCA ever call his funnels bits? His comment was that the funnels reacted too quickly to protect Nu. Were you paying attention to CCA at all? Fin funnels and Funnels are the same thing, they are different then bits because they do not have on board fusion reactor.

And Nu's Fin funnels does NOT project an I field, it projects a beam shield, again there is a difference, I field stops energy weapons but not projectile, beam shield stops both.
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Old 2006-06-19, 05:06   Link #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkside
lol I never thought there was a difference besides a fancier name xD. I'm just going to say Akatsuki's DRAGOON's, because they are mirror coated and can make that cool shield as well as functioning as normal funnels. They are also blinged out... how can't they be the best?
They can't be the best as they're not mind controlled. The Fin Funnels on the Nu Gundam can make the very same shield, as well as having greater maneuverability by themselves, as well as being mind controlled.
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Old 2006-06-19, 08:17   Link #74
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Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant
That's the main difference between CE and UC beam shields; the UC beam shield is effectively a giant beam blade on its own, but the CE beam shield can't cut things.
If you're talking about beam shields in general (not only those created by funnels/DRAGOONs), I don't know if CE beam shields can't cut through things, but we know from X Astray that lightwave shields can.

I haven't read this topic for a while, and I don't really want to read it all over again, but has anyone mentionned that a mentally unstable Newtype probably won't be able to controle the funnel effectively? Human mind can be a double edge sword if it's weak or confused, even... especially for a newtype. That makes me believe that, since DRAGOONs are computer controlled, they would be more stable and easier to control.

Just my two cents...
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Old 2006-06-19, 09:02   Link #75
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Originally Posted by J_Ridden
If you're talking about beam shields in general (not only those created by funnels/DRAGOONs), I don't know if CE beam shields can't cut through things, but we know from X Astray that lightwave shields can.
That was only because of creative thinking on his part and the way that the Armure Lumiere system worked - he simple redirected the energies from the Armure Lumiere from an area to a point.

I'm quite sure that Amuro's fin funnels are easily capable of the same thing.
So-called"beam shields" in CE are simply miniaturised versions of the lightwave barrier that functioned as the defensive net around the Artemis base.
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Old 2006-06-19, 09:11   Link #76
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Originally Posted by nightbringer360
That was only because of creative thinking on his part and the way that the Armure Lumiere system worked - he simple redirected the energies from the Armure Lumiere from an area to a point.

I'm quite sure that Amuro's fin funnels are easily capable of the same thing.
So-called"beam shields" in CE are simply miniaturised versions of the lightwave barrier that functioned as the defensive net around the Artemis base.
Although a few more things must be kept in mind...

The CE beam shield, though can't generally be used offensively, is physically tougher than a UC beam-shield. The fact that most could withstand a capital-ship positron blast means a lot.

Comparatively, a UC beam-shield could be overwhelmed by a sufficiently powerful attack, as shown in Crossbone Gundam.

Then again, the idea of throwing your UC beam-shield at your enemy as a spinning ring of death is surprisingly attractive.
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Old 2006-06-19, 09:22   Link #77
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Hmm.... I see, so there's no difference between lightwave shields that equip Hyperion and those EAF mobile armors in GSD, and beam shields that have Destiny, Legend, S-F, I-J and the DOMs? Because visually, they look kinda different.
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Old 2006-06-19, 12:50   Link #78
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I belive there were two kind of shields in CE mentioned, lightwave and positron shields.
If there are any real difference other than maybe the way they look(are produced?) I don't know...
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Old 2006-06-20, 00:32   Link #79
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Originally Posted by idofgrahf
Amuro called them funnels, Char called them funnels, gyuni called them funnels, BITs was never even mentioned in CCA, notice the funnel part, hence Gyuni's comment on why are his funnels lasting so long. When did Amuro in CCA ever call his funnels bits? His comment was that the funnels reacted too quickly to protect Nu. Were you paying attention to CCA at all? Fin funnels and Funnels are the same thing, they are different then bits because they do not have on board fusion reactor.

And Nu's Fin funnels does NOT project an I field, it projects a beam shield, again there is a difference, I field stops energy weapons but not projectile, beam shield stops both.
From MAHQ:
Quote:
Along with the psycoframe, the n Gundam was also equipped with six "fin funnels," a new evolution in Newtype-controlled remote weaponry. Although they were technically "bits" and not "funnels" (since the fin funnels had their own onboard reactors for power), they were far more advanced than normal bits or funnels in that, in addition to serving as remote beam weapons, they could also be used in geometric formations to create a "beam barrier", offering a target 360 degrees of protection against most weapons fire.
The Fin Funnels are technically bits, I've been stressing that throughout the entire thread.

They are called funnels because of these reasons:

1. Amuro named the bits, Fin Funnels.
2. Funnels should be standard name for psycommu remote weaponary, but a bit is the name of an advanced funnel.
3. Tomatoes are called vegetables but they're actually fruits.
4. Eel skin wallets are actually not made of eel skin, but skin from a fish called the hagfish.

I'll admit that I was messed up by SRW, because Nu Gundam's barrier is always an I-field in the SRPG series.
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Old 2006-06-20, 01:48   Link #80
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The Nu Gundam's beam barrier is actually better than an I-Field since, not only does it withstand standard beam attacks like a regular I-Field (unless they're much more powerful like the Alpha Azieru's mega particle cannon), but it also is able to (like the newer beam shields made later) deflect physical attacks as well (as shown when the Azieru's funnels kept bouncing off and the various times machinegun fire and grenades deflected off of beam shields in F91 and such.
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