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View Poll Results: Suzumiya Haruhi Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 235 66.01%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 79 22.19%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 27 7.58%
7 out of 10 : Good 7 1.97%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 0.28%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.28%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.28%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 5 1.40%
Voters: 356. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2006-06-21, 02:21   Link #241
Anime Online
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamui4356
I think you're defining intelligence too narrowly. It doesn't just refer to human level and above. Even among actual species living on earth, self awareness and intelligence aren't unique traits to humans. Dolphins, chimps, gorillas, and even dogs have demonstraited what many would consider self awareness and intelligence. The difference is the degree those species possess.

It was clear from Yuki's statement that while intelligence was common, it was not on the same level as humans. If that level of intelligence was common, she wouldn't have said humans were the first to develop a higher order.

Further, Yuki said the development of that higher order of intelligence made humans something of interest to the data entities even before Haruhi. If it was common, why would that be? Humans would be just another insignificant species, not one that could possibly be of help in furthering the evolution of the data entities.

If you wish to discuss this further, perhaps we should take it to the episode 5 thread?

If Yuki is only referring to Earth's inhabitants developing self-awareness and intelligence, why would she used terms such as "universe" and "maldistributed organic life form"? Afterall, she already said Data Life Forms have no physical body and are inorganic life forms. Put them together and it clearly says organic intelligent life forms are not limited to one tiny planet in the entire universe.
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Old 2006-06-21, 02:27   Link #242
Aiya Kasai
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Originally Posted by Anime Online
When Haruhi talked about making a new band near the end of the episode, she mentioned how she'll do the lyric-writing, songwriting, producing and choreography.

I'm beginning to have a vague sense of where the dancing ED comes from.
O____O! My god I never thought of that! *blink* That would fit pretty well with Haruhi's character xD.
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Old 2006-06-21, 02:33   Link #243
Major Kerina
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I enjoyed this episode quite a lot. It was a mellower Haruhi but on the whole I think it was fun for all it suggested rather than directly showing.
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Old 2006-06-21, 02:46   Link #244
ShadowrazoR
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I haven't read through this entire thread, so please don't blame me if this is a repeat post.



HAADO GEI!!!
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Old 2006-06-21, 02:53   Link #245
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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3
[...] being all too humble about it? [...] Maybe it was better explained in the novel, but as far as the anime stands, there is no logical reason for her change of heart and no motivation for her doing so.
I felt that she was being humble because to Haruhi, she had gained much much more than what she gave of herself to the band. She finally got that good feeling that comes from helping others. And you can't deny that she enjoyed herself during the concert. More happiness in giving then in receiving right?

About her motivation to help others, you are right, it was explained far better in the novel, I'm sadden that they condensed so so much for this part in the episode. But generally, its still there. "They've been frantically practicing for this day" (16:30) is reflected in:

Spoiler for Novel:

Also, the sheer determination of the band leader, evident in the episode (in coming down - or rather, up - to school, attempting to play, and having to be stopped by the Executive Commitee member), touched Haruhi.

Yes, it was a kind of sympathy. But as others have mentioned, Haruhi is human, and she does have sympathy. In this case, her sympathy showed because the issue at hand really came close to her heart: Haruhi is the kind of headstrong person who thinks anything can be done with enough determination -- she could put herself in the band leader's shoes. She saw that it was really impossible for the band leader to perform, and she hated to let all the determination and hard work go to waste, and so she volunteered (pretty much in the heat of the situation too, so she didnt do much thinking; tho she rarely does).

As for the Computer Society Members, she showed no sympathy because they (and Mikuru) were just means to an end.
~~~~~~~~

Another thing: Its funny, in the Novel (or at least the Translation), there were only three members of the band, and it was the leader who both had tonsilitis and broke her wrist. edit: Ah, i see, they had to come up with 4 members because of the name ENOZ. Hmm. Hmmm. *feeling a bit cheated*

sorry to keep posting spoilers for the novel. i'll stop now.

Last edited by Lost; 2006-06-21 at 03:40.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:07   Link #246
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A perfect 10.
We always say Haruhi rocks, and now she just proved it!
Definately one of the best episodes in the series.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:08   Link #247
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lost


This one?


No, the other one, where he was staring at Haruhi with a dazed look. Alot like when you stare at a girl you like. I think it was in the middle of the first song.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:09   Link #248
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowrazoR
I haven't read through this entire thread, so please don't blame me if this is a repeat post.



HAADO GEI!!!
LOL! Too bad we didn't get to hear the "SEI SEI SEI"! I'm practically laughing my head off when I saw that.

Alright, back to topic. I don't know anything about the novels but seriously, if I were Kyon, I would have fallen in love with Haruhi in this episode. She seems more humane in this ep and I kinda like that side of Haruhi after all the god thingy.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:16   Link #249
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It was a great episode. That music part came as a total surprise and I really enjoyed the first song.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:22   Link #250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth-kun
No, the other one, where he was staring at Haruhi with a dazed look. Alot like when you stare at a girl you like. I think it was in the middle of the first song.
Yep. That look struck me too. I honestly think Kyons starting to notice Haruhi. You know.. in that way...
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:25   Link #251
Kamui4356
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Originally Posted by Anime Online
If Yuki is only referring to Earth's inhabitants developing self-awareness and intelligence, why would she used terms such as "universe" and "maldistributed organic life form"? Afterall, she already said Data Life Forms have no physical body and are inorganic life forms. Put them together and it clearly says organic intelligent life forms are not limited to one tiny planet in the entire universe.
I never said she was only referring to earth. It was clear she wasn't. I was using examples of other intelligent life which currently exists on earth. I did so to make the point that intelligence doesn't equal human level intelligence, there are varying degrees.

Like I said, Yuki specificly referred to humans as the first to develop higher order intelligence. Why say higher order if that level of intelligence was common? That's a pretty clear sign that intelligence of that level among organic entities is unique to humans.
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Old 2006-06-21, 03:43   Link #252
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I loved the Rosencrantz & Guildenstern Are Dead appearance. Its themes fit so very well with the show. It has existentialism and questions of "why are we here?"; Free Will vs. Determinism. The two are trapped within the play...fated to die...what choices do they really have? Search for value - what is important? What is not? Does anything matter? (Haruhi wrestles with this a little herself). Futility of language too.

On the whole -
Wow ^^ this show is like an intricate puzzling design which now matter how you look at it keeps growing in intricacy yet it can still be enjoyed on a basic level even without trying to dig deeper.
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Old 2006-06-21, 04:32   Link #253
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I rated this a Perfect 10. It was brilliant.
Those 2 songs sung by Haruhi were just so awesome. I'd love to get ahold of them. I don't suppose anyone knows the titles to those songs do they? I can officially say, that i'm in love with this series. Before i thought it was great and now its love.
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Old 2006-06-21, 04:35   Link #254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MihawkXGP
I rated this a Perfect 10. It was brilliant.
Those 2 songs sung by Haruhi were just so awesome. I'd love to get ahold of them. I don't suppose anyone knows the titles to those songs do they? I can officially say, that i'm in love with this series. Before i thought it was great and now its love.
lol I guess this means you've finally become a Haruhist? Its never too late to become a Haruhist

The first song = God Knows...
2nd = Lost My Music
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Old 2006-06-21, 04:36   Link #255
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Those songs ruled! Just what I'd expect from a divine entity like Haruhi.
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Old 2006-06-21, 04:37   Link #256
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Without a doubt I call episode 12 as the best one the series offered so far (along with episode 2, but this one has - due to time passed - a bit more).
There are many reasons for my choice:

- General character development, we're near on the late part of the series, many months have passed since the beginning, and we can see characters well fitting into their roles now. Mikuru is so cheerful, kind and lovely as a maid, Kyon is so calm on his explanation, yet more acknoweledged on the events - hence: more comprehensive --> sort of more tolerant --> more brilliantly analyzing what he sees - Yuki keeps her role of smart yet necessary silent companion. And also the "minor characters" as Tsuruya or Koizumi, do create a good team all together now. The interactions are a sweet touch.

- Though the character with most development is Haruhi, nevertheless. Her changes from "The world is mine, you idiots!" attitude of first episodes, to the "what am I doing with my life?", not mentioning her kindness and caring for the other attitude. Sure, a bit of the tsun side is kept good for Kyon-kun ^^ , but all in all this is the Suzumiya Haruhi I've always dreamt to see ^^ ... Never sweet as in this episode.
Many things have happened, many - I guess - have still to be explained, in Melancholy V and VI , but if there was an astonoshing character development that I had to prize in a current/recent anime that I can remember, sure I'd went with Haruhi.

- The slice of life is very well done this time, much better - imho - than in the episode "Someday in the Rain" (which failed in some points, not only for the 3 minutes of nothing with the reading Yuki). This episode goes ahead smoothly, is pleasurable throughot the whole road, and I actually felt sorry watching the time of my dvd-player running so fast to the 22:00, which means the end. I'd go ahead two hours with episodes like this.
The cure of details, such as the bad sky, then the rain, hence the crowd where they were playing, hence the huge success, hence, hence, hence... all brilliantly thought and put on screen. As a lover of the details, I highly approve these renderings.

- This was a sort of "musical episode". And I always like the musical episodes inserted in series which is not musical. I like them even more when they singers are of such an high range. I must admit that I literally loved the two performance of Hirano Aya / Suzumiya Haruhi, in "God Knows.." and "Lost my Music". If I have to choice, I prefer the second one, pity that they cut it on the middle ^^ , but besides they actually spent enough for music performances, and the episode needed a bit of room for the remaning of the story too. So well done.

- If in "The day of the Sagittarius" Kyoto Animation undoubtfully astonished me for the greatness in rendering such complex situations - as the "star wars" - with such unbelievable results, this time I have to applaud the awesomeness on how they did the slice of life part, facial expression, general body movements, I had the impression that not a single frame was left out.
And what about the musical part? They spent a lot on it, and the results are out of imagination. Just watch how many gifs are born about this episode, and especially on those sequences, and you'll find out once more why KyoAni was so amazing this time.

- Very simply ^^ ... The last scene. In my book, I'll keep it, as for now, as the best Haruhi-Kyon interaction we've had so far ^^ . Though I might say the same about the other interactions between them on this same episode. Heartwarming, at least for me

It's the third time I give 10 to a SH episode (previous ones were ep.2 and ep.10), though I actually feel like saying this one surpass the aforementioned. Ten is a rate that I rarely use (1 time out of 24 in Fate/stay Night , 1 out of 12 in Kashimashi, 0 out of 11 in Higurashi, just to state as my tendency is not to award tens easily).
What an episode needs to get a 10, besides the undoubt general quality it must have, is how much I should be able to remember it in the future.

Q. So basically, was this episode unforgettable ?
A. Well, yes, as never before.

10/10
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Old 2006-06-21, 04:38   Link #257
MihawkXGP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C.A.
lol I guess this means you've finally become a Haruhist? Its never too late to become a Haruhist

The first song = God Knows...
2nd = Lost My Music
Yes, pretty much. This day my obession starts. Oh and thanks for thet song titles.
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Old 2006-06-21, 05:01   Link #258
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pellissier
- The slice of life is very well done this time, much better - imho - than in the episode "Someday in the Rain" (which failed in some points, not only for the 3 minutes of nothing with the reading Yuki). This episode goes ahead smoothly, is pleasurable throughot the whole road, and I actually felt sorry watching the time of my dvd-player running so fast to the 22:00, which means the end. I'd go ahead two hours with episodes like this.
The cure of details, such as the bad sky, then the rain, hence the crowd where they were playing, hence the huge success, hence, hence, hence... all brilliantly thought and put on screen. As a lover of the details, I highly approve these renderings.
I agree to most of your post, this section I quoted as well.

I think Someday in the Rain is a little too normal lol, but somehow its great to see SOS-dan spend such a normal day.

Live A Live is probably the single aired episode in anime history to have the most animation and detail.
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When I say 'My god...', god refers to Haruhi-sama.

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Old 2006-06-21, 05:15   Link #259
Anime Online
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Originally Posted by Kamui4356
I never said she was only referring to earth. It was clear she wasn't. I was using examples of other intelligent life which currently exists on earth. I did so to make the point that intelligence doesn't equal human level intelligence, there are varying degrees.
So you admit that, according to Yuki, there are already other organic intelligent life forms in the universe beside humans, which was the original point you contested (i.e. there are no aliens except the data life forms at your post #210)?

In the interest of keeping the discussion focused on the point that was under contention, I have little more to say.
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Old 2006-06-21, 06:04   Link #260
Kamui4356
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Originally Posted by Anime Online
So you admit that, according to Yuki, there are already other organic intelligent life forms in the universe beside humans, which was the original point you contested (i.e. there are no aliens except the data life forms at your post #210)?

In the interest of keeping the discussion focused on the point that was under contention, I have little more to say.
No, my point was those couldn't have been aliens because, according to Yuki, humans were the first organic entities to develop higher order intelligence. Without intelligence at least on par with humans, they couldn't get to earth.Though arguing about this minor point is rather silly.
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