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Old 2006-07-26, 21:06   Link #61
srb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syn13
Is the Mobius Zero really that good?
It can't take much damage, but it's only one star and is incredibly difficult to hit properly when a human uses it. It's pure pain playing against it.
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Old 2006-07-26, 21:59   Link #62
M_Flores
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empire

btw: I know a guy who can beat the crap out of you while piloting Moebius Zero. Really. He's invincible in this. I've tried various things on him, from my favourite Sword Impulse, entire GAT-X series, Ginns, Freedom, Providence, Abyss, Chaos, even Astray! Nothing works on him, nothing. Maybe METEOR units will work, I haven't tried those, but still... this will be quite lame :P
If EXASS makes his way into EA vs ZAFT II then I think I'll just won't play with him since I could as well self destruct myself on the beggining.
You didn't seem to mention Justice in that list. Did you happen to try that?
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Old 2006-07-27, 01:51   Link #63
Syn13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by U<3Anime
Holy shit man, i didnt even know this game came out. I totally forgot about it until i saw this thread. Its probably because theres hasnt been any new about this game eversince it was announced. Im suprised to see that the size of Destroy remains as big as ever. I thought they were gonna downsize him. Sucks that hes only controlled by the cpu. Also, Does Destroy cause some massive slow downs? XD
Its doesn't cause much slow down but that level is annoying, you gotta destroy a couple of grunt units before encountering it plus 2 more grunts come out. The Destroy along is easy when teamed up against two players plus it doesn't have the beam invicibility(I-Field) that Psycho has.
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Old 2006-07-27, 06:07   Link #64
Empire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M_Flores
You didn't seem to mention Justice in that list. Did you happen to try that?
Nope because Justice sux hard in my opinion. Sword Impulse is ten times better:
- beam boomerangs are faster than backpack
- it's melee is easier to use, chain and looks good
- backpack riding is useless
- triple shooting beam rifle of SI is damn good on close and short medium ranges
- SI has CIWS which actually has at least SOME chance of hitting Moebius
- SI is 3,5 star and Justice is 4 star -> more respawns!

Syn13 - well, what good can bring you good melee combo if you can't use it? And this is most often the case when playing 1v1 (which is only reasonable option when you want to compete against your friends because playing with AI teammates who just suck... no comments :P), especially against D-Eq Ginn or Buster
in such cases it's firepower and speed that matters - so while Freedom armed with only shoulder cannons and beam rifle (WHY IN THE 7 HELLS they didn't give him hip cannons attack I can't understand...) isn't maybe very good, Providence proved to be quite nice mobile suit, especially at SEED when his dragoon lunching speed is incredible.
So I'm interested in strike freedom as he combines both Dragoons and speed and firepower.
So, again, can somebody here tell me what SF manouvers are?
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Old 2006-07-27, 07:36   Link #65
Syn13
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Specific manuvuers?
I know generally what it can do from playing agianst it...
Double Target/Beam rifle attack
Dragoon - Surround target or multiple shot around the S-Freedom
Double Rifle combination
Spam shot
Beam rifle
Melee
IMO Melee unit against AI is harder than ranged since Seed II, the AI is constantly backing up the computer which is being attacked. In the original Seed VS, the Justice was not balanced with the Freedom while I think the second one, they really speeded up the I-Justice. Backpack riding is better since you can ride it longer(transform i think) and manuvuer(turn) and also launch it whenever you want while on it. Connecting with the jetback with the target is brutal in this one, instead of getting knocked down, the target gets plowed by it(it pushes the target a pretty long distance).

About AI partners, it depends...There are plenty of times where I used an Astray + AI partner against 2 competent players and I've won...If you know how to use the Leadership commands then you'll have a higher chance of winning. But this is only the first Seed VS
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Old 2006-07-27, 12:15   Link #66
Empire
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Well, it's well known that in SEED vs 1 Astray is one of the best mobile suits :P That the reason I'm eager to get Murasame in my hands...

let's throw another question, again about a Big One - any changes in Legend compared to old Providence?
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Old 2006-07-27, 18:59   Link #67
flamingtroll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empire
Nope because Justice sux hard in my opinion. Sword Impulse is ten times better:
- beam boomerangs are faster than backpack
- it's melee is easier to use, chain and looks good
- backpack riding is useless
- triple shooting beam rifle of SI is damn good on close and short medium ranges
- SI has CIWS which actually has at least SOME chance of hitting Moebius
- SI is 3,5 star and Justice is 4 star -> more respawns!

Unless you mean specfically killing Mobeious Zero, which is best done with a GINN Trainer, I think Justice is the cheapest suit ever to exist. You can almost always combo in various way with backpack + boomerang + its rediculously fast melee.

Not to mention 4 star armor is a class away form 3.5 ones.

SI doesn't ahve a beam rifle (besides its tripe beam shot, which is really just a better "CIWS") , it means all the difference when you are down with 10 health and try to take down a dying enemy that is half a map away.
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Old 2006-07-27, 21:28   Link #68
Syn13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empire
Well, it's well known that in SEED vs 1 Astray is one of the best mobile suits :P That the reason I'm eager to get Murasame in my hands...

let's throw another question, again about a Big One - any changes in Legend compared to old Providence?
Because of the arcades always being loaded up with people playing, I'm not one to experiment...From what I've seen the Legend seems to be exactly the same as Providence except for a minor changes I think...The only thing I've really noticed was the Dragoon spikes/melee attack...I didn't notice the sword attack where it charges towards you swiping you with it's beam saber.
The Murasames are common units used too, sub weapon are missiles, and it has a transformation move where it does barrel rolls and attacks the target with a couple of shots from its beam rifle and missiles.

Goufs have it's insane melee attack involving it's whip and sword.

If I have a chance to use the top MS, I would love to try the Destiny, looks awsome!!
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Old 2006-07-28, 00:12   Link #69
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From my arcade I've rarely seen people use the Infinite Justice (my favourite suit in Destiny)....I wonder what are the changes? Since its suppose to be "Melee King" with all the new melee upgrades it has (Double beam sword, Boomerangs, Shield Hook, Shield Beam Sabre, Leg beam sabres, Beam sabres on Back pack). I saw the video with Infinite Justice that was posted earlier in this board but it doesnt seem to show much of its melee moves....unless its true that it didnt change much from Justice in terms of melee moves

Aw dam.
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Old 2006-07-28, 01:10   Link #70
U<3Anime
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O yea, im also wondering if step cancel still works in this game or has it been completely taken out?
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Old 2006-07-28, 03:58   Link #71
Empire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flamingtroll
Unless you mean specfically killing Mobeious Zero, which is best done with a GINN Trainer, I think Justice is the cheapest suit ever to exist. You can almost always combo in various way with backpack + boomerang + its rediculously fast melee.

Not to mention 4 star armor is a class away form 3.5 ones.

SI doesn't ahve a beam rifle (besides its tripe beam shot, which is really just a better "CIWS") , it means all the difference when you are down with 10 health and try to take down a dying enemy that is half a map away.
well, but that "better ciws" beam rifle is far much better than standard beam rifle :P There aren't many better non-charged weapons, except maybe Freedom's shoulder particle cannons and Saviour's hip ones. And even at a 10hp I wouldn't try to take down enemy from as far as half of the map. In such situation I would try to outmanouver him and triple shot him from the rear/side so that he won't evade.

And I see no difference between how much HP a beam shot takes from 4 and 3,5 class mobile suits. It's only that 4 stars sometimes have little more hp, but that's still only for... one beam rifle hit?

As I've said earlier, backpack is useless because it's damn easy to evade, and at that moment comes either my beam boomerangs or triple shot which break your charge into melee.
And that's only sword impulse, taking Saviour or Buster instead and Justice is dead :P


Other things:

Well, I hope that they'll give Providence ability to shot his dragoons from backpack like he did in the anime.
Murasame doing barrel rolls? Lool of the day goes for them :P I hope they still got their CIWS...
I wonder if there is someone playing with LaGowe or BuCue. AI is doing quite well with them but I've never seen a human player that mastered them.

Gouf with insane melee you say? Hmm... that's nice, I'm going to avenge Heine's death I've never liked Gaia and Stellar anyway :P
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Old 2006-07-28, 14:31   Link #72
Gevurah
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Do any of you live in the Southern California area, because I'm dying to know if there's an EA vs ZAFT II machine over here. >.<
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Old 2006-07-28, 15:40   Link #73
flamingtroll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empire
well, but that "better ciws" beam rifle is far much better than standard beam rifle :P There aren't many better non-charged weapons, except maybe Freedom's shoulder particle cannons and Saviour's hip ones. And even at a 10hp I wouldn't try to take down enemy from as far as half of the map. In such situation I would try to outmanouver him and triple shot him from the rear/side so that he won't evade.

And I see no difference between how much HP a beam shot takes from 4 and 3,5 class mobile suits. It's only that 4 stars sometimes have little more hp, but that's still only for... one beam rifle hit?

As I've said earlier, backpack is useless because it's damn easy to evade, and at that moment comes either my beam boomerangs or triple shot which break your charge into melee.
And that's only sword impulse, taking Saviour or Buster instead and Justice is dead :P
For Justice, what I often do is to trick a person into evading with the backpack, then boomerang him or just out right shoot at him when he is too far, which usually hits, becuase unless you "walk-evade" the backpack (this is impossible at close range) , you will probably be at the cool down of the evasion/out of boost . If it does hit, then the enemy is stunned and you can basically rip it up. The problem with tirple shot IMO is the airtime. When you do the triple shot, any suit can just shoot at you instead beucase you will be in mid-air. And it almost never hit anything far. Sword Impulse would be good if you have another person as distraction so you can get closer. But as far as one on one, it really can't do jack as long as people keep their distance. I have seen matches in the arcade where in the entire game SI didnt' do anything beside getting hit by beam shots, jsut beucase it can't get close enough to do anything.

It seems to me that like in the old vs games. There is some difference between the "armoring" between the suits (I.E how Hambrabi in Zeta is weaker than Gathbley even though it has 520 hp) Although this is completely based on the "feeling" I get when I play and not directly from testing it out. For example, it seems like Gaia is particulary weak. Even though it has the same HP as the 3.5 suits it seems like it dies much more easily than others. And to me 4 star suits are much harder to die than 3.5 ones even though is only about 90 HP more.

And honestly I dont' think Buster can take anything. It is only good when one is distracted by another person and laid its combiner load on that person. It can't do anything one on one. As for Savoiur, it would probably do better against Justice, depending on the skill of the 2 sides. Just beucase one is using Justice doesnt mean he has to go on melee. It has a pretty good beam rifle already. Not to mention in the old Saviour, you can't shoot at somethign properly while dashing.
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Old 2006-07-28, 16:32   Link #74
Empire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flamingtroll
For Justice, what I often do is to trick a person into evading with the backpack, then boomerang him or just out right shoot at him when he is too far, which usually hits, becuase unless you "walk-evade" the backpack (this is impossible at close range) , you will probably be at the cool down of the evasion/out of boost . If it does hit, then the enemy is stunned and you can basically rip it up. The problem with tirple shot IMO is the airtime. When you do the triple shot, any suit can just shoot at you instead beucase you will be in mid-air. And it almost never hit anything far. Sword Impulse would be good if you have another person as distraction so you can get closer. But as far as one on one, it really can't do jack as long as people keep their distance. I have seen matches in the arcade where in the entire game SI didnt' do anything beside getting hit by beam shots, jsut beucase it can't get close enough to do anything.

It seems to me that like in the old vs games. There is some difference between the "armoring" between the suits (I.E how Hambrabi in Zeta is weaker than Gathbley even though it has 520 hp) Although this is completely based on the "feeling" I get when I play and not directly from testing it out. For example, it seems like Gaia is particulary weak. Even though it has the same HP as the 3.5 suits it seems like it dies much more easily than others. And to me 4 star suits are much harder to die than 3.5 ones even though is only about 90 HP more.

And honestly I dont' think Buster can take anything. It is only good when one is distracted by another person and laid its combiner load on that person. It can't do anything one on one. As for Savoiur, it would probably do better against Justice, depending on the skill of the 2 sides. Just beucase one is using Justice doesnt mean he has to go on melee. It has a pretty good beam rifle already. Not to mention in the old Saviour, you can't shoot at somethign properly while dashing.
Unless of course if he is evading by jumping over the backpack or hiding behind a building?
I also tend to attack while dashing, shooting with beam rifles or throwing boomerangs with suits like Sword Impulse, so we would be probably both hit :P
Well, I don't see a point discussing it further, we would just have to check in the real fight.

Well, from older vs I've only seen AEUG vs Titans and I bored me to hell within fifteen minutes, so I couldn't really notice such subtle differences :P

Lol? I seriously think Buster is damn good MS, few I value higher than it. Let's see. His rockets are crap, okay, but still manage to hit something from time to time and just work well as a distraction. Beam rifle is okay, it has nice supply of ammo. Charged rifle is like with all moves that makes you stand in place - you have to choose a moment and position very carefully. If you do, it work miracles.
Last thing is his shotgun. While rather short ranged, it does decent damage and either stuns or knocks down opponent. It can be even charged, making it even more crazy. With point-blank shotgun fire I've stoped quite nice number of hotheads charging at me in hope to chop Buster with melle combo. Only D-Eq Ginn does it better but he has only four shots while Buster has around seven or eight not to mention his other weapons.
But not duels is where Buster excel, it's 2 on 2 battles or 2 on 3 campaign battles where he shows its potential. With quick target changing it can keep enemies busy dodging his fire and unable to take any more serious offense, while second suit can pick opportunities to use it's potential, be it Freedom/Abyss/Providence beam spamming, Sword Impulse/Sword Striker/Astray/Assault Shroud Duel crazy melees, Aegis/Saviour particle cannons and melle attacks or just anything. And there is nothing more annoying than to be destroyed while still having 200hp just because Buster charged shoot got you.

What do you mean by "old' saviour?
And show me a mobile suit that can hit while both he and enemy is dashing. Moreover I tend to rely rather on non charged particle beam shots and quick transformations, using beam rifle more to keep enemy busy than believing it will do any huge damage (except for seed-mode fast hit-and-run raids when increased firing rate gives much better chance of hitting the enemy and then dealing heavy damage)
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Old 2006-07-28, 17:36   Link #75
Syn13
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The new Savoir has a serious speed problem...I think they did that because it was toned down in cost so it can match impulse, and the three other gundams. First thing you'll probably notice is it's run speed.
The new Blast Impuse was much improved because they did some minor weapon changes. B+C(I think) is it's melee attack and A+C is it's Spear toss which Shinn used against Abyss in the anime...it basically stuns the target.
I consider the Force Impulse unbalanced compared to the new Gundams, its a little slow pulling out melee attacks and really I rather use Gaia which offers more and feels the same compared to Strike Rouge and Force Impulse.

What special do you guys use?
To me:
Speed - More for units like Nuclear pack Windam and Blast Impulse since they generally lack in speed attacks
Rush - VS mode or a generally special...
Power - VS, single or Co-Op mode, takes off about three quarter off of a MS.
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Old 2006-07-28, 18:10   Link #76
flamingtroll
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Empire
What do you mean by "old' saviour?
And show me a mobile suit that can hit while both he and enemy is dashing. Moreover I tend to rely rather on non charged particle beam shots and quick transformations, using beam rifle more to keep enemy busy than believing it will do any huge damage (except for seed-mode fast hit-and-run raids when increased firing rate gives much better chance of hitting the enemy and then dealing heavy damage)
I mean how you would transform when ever you double tap jump. I find that extremely annoying. The "new" savouir is the one in EA vs zaft II. All MA in that game now transform by jump + double foward like in the Zeta. While double jump just flys faster like any non transformable suits.

The new Blast impulse sound even cheaper than it already is :P.
Stun + charge shot? , sound like somethign freedom would do
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Old 2006-07-28, 20:39   Link #77
vblaze101
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Hmm......I figured that they wouldn't make Savior as powerful as Freedom the way they did in the 1st AvZ. Still, I thought they would have placed Saviour above the other 2nd Generation MS. And what's this about Force Impulse? Hmm.......I thought they would have balanced Force Impulse out by giving it more boost time and/or more beam rifle ammo. Heck, I was hoping they would've added in Force Impulse's ability to deflect and redirect beam attacks with its shield (guess that might've been a bit difficult to do). Meh, guess we'll see what cost changes are made with either a home release of this game or just a 3rd release.
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Old 2006-07-29, 01:01   Link #78
U<3Anime
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I actually got to try this game today. I walked by the machines without noticing it at first because it still had the gundam vs zeta banner at the top :P. Then i when i took a closer look, i was OMG SEED 2!!! MUST PLAY!!!!! Both me and my friend got owned by this guy pretty badly because i wanted to try inifinite justice and he wanted to try strike freedom Then later my friend kept on trying to beat me with strike freedom while i was using destiny. Its pretty awesome that destiny can actually connect his combo with palm blast, but i still dunno the correct timing for it yet
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Old 2006-07-29, 11:16   Link #79
Empire
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flamingtroll
I mean how you would transform when ever you double tap jump. I find that extremely annoying. The "new" savouir is the one in EA vs zaft II. All MA in that game now transform by jump + double foward like in the Zeta. While double jump just flys faster like any non transformable suits.

The new Blast impulse sound even cheaper than it already is :P.
Stun + charge shot? , sound like somethign freedom would do
Well, that is annoying at the beggining. You just have to get used to it. Transforming MS like Aegis or Saviour requies different combat style.
Now, after playing for some time with Saviour I must say I love this option. It allows you to increase od decrease distance with the enemy in incredible short time, thus allowing you to put Saviours veryy good melee into good use. And firing particle cannons in mobile armour mode doesn't make you stand still like a duck on target practice.
It's even better in seed mode, when you can make three shots one by one You just can't miss so after hitting just retransform into mobile suit, switching you target and firing an artillery-like barrage from you beam rifle :P Then your partner seeds too and melees the guy into hell :] Ore wa sadamesa! Ha ha ha ha ha! (yes, I play with Raul as a pilot :P)

Well, I don't like Blast Impulse in AvZ 1 so I'm glad they did something about him. Maybe now it'll be worthy some playing time.
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Old 2006-07-29, 12:07   Link #80
Gevurah
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Where are you guys located at because I really want to find an arcade with an EA vs ZAFT II machine. >.<
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