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Old 2006-07-07, 23:59   Link #1
hanxthre
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Gundam ZZ Discussion

So I finally finished watching zz last night...It was a really good series despite some obvious problems and random deaths...I think this series had the funnest bunch of kids morso than any other G-series...But anyways after Judua defeats Haman (more like Haman killed herself) he punches the hell outta Bright (WHICH I DIDN'T LIKE), reunites with his sis, then apparently him and Loux Luka (who is a awesome Gundam character who was severly underused) are an item now and they travel off into the stars together....(On a side-note apparently Cammile has seemed to regained his awareness as he sprints on the beach with Fah)


First off where are they going (Judua and Loux) and is there any G-manga or future refrences that tells what they are up too and what happens in their futures?? I know Sayla tells Leina he's gonna be gone for 3 years (Gone doing what?)...Secondly, I had heard somewhere that Judua was Char's cousin or something, could that be why Sayla took care of Leina and how did she even find her?? In any event the anime doesn't confirm that Judau had a connection to Char...If it did I missed it...Finally the last scene of the final episode is this:

Spoiler:


What the hell is that? It ain't a cheap-ass Planet Unicron that's for sure, so what is it? And what importance does it hold to the series...I stared at the screen for like 5 mins trying to figure it out...

Overall why the series started off kinda kooky and comical it looks like Tomimo started to get his serious kill em' all itch back near the middle to end and for the most part the series was really entertaining (Everything but Mashima dying, that kinda pissed me off cause he was like strongest pilot )...The biggest yet overlooked jip in the whole series to me is when Rasara (or Sasara//Mondo's girl) died, but the Z'gok or whatever it was didn't even touch her..but she collapsed and died ...I was "WTF, bitch get up nobody touched you.." but she died...musta been a heartattack I guess..

Give me your reflection on how the series was and ended if you can't answer any of my questions...Gimme your opinions because the series obviously had some problem, but it had some unique special qualities aswell and I really enjoyed it anyways...
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Old 2006-07-08, 00:14   Link #2
Shiryuu
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Judau goes off to Jupiter (Jupiter space\energy fleet, where Scirroco came from or something). I don't remember much but I think he did because he didn't like the feddies.

He shows up later in a Victory gundam side story as an old man.

I've never heard of him being Char's cousin. I highly doubt he is.
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Old 2006-07-08, 00:24   Link #3
hanxthre
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Oh so that was planet Jupiter...Damn that was a shitty drawing...It looked like something mechanical...But yeah as evidence of him punching Bright he hated the feddies...but what group does Jupiter belong too?? And what did he talk about in the Victory side story?? (wouldn't he be too old to be alive when Usso was?)

And still what do you think Sayla's (char's sister) connection was to Leina and Judua?
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Old 2006-07-08, 00:30   Link #4
Shiryuu
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Judau didn't actually appear in Usso's timeline. He appeared during Crossbone (or sometime after it), and it's just labeled as a Victory side story.

I think Jupiter Energy Fleet is neutral, since they only transport hydrogen(?) from Jupiter back to earth. There is a Jupiter Empire though, I don't really know much of the specifics about them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hanxthre
And still what do you think Sayla's (char's sister) connection was to Leina and Judua?
Sayla just happened to be around when Judau left Leina in the abandoned house (it must've been owned by Sayla or something).
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Old 2006-07-08, 00:38   Link #5
hanxthre
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Wow Judua is like one of the strongest newtypes in existence and he just wants to transport hydrogen?? Well I guess everybody has to make a living...Is there anything that talks about his and Loux future relationship?/ Do they have kids, fight other wars, etc?

Anyways was ZZ a favorite series of yours...Obviously after just finishing it last night I'd like to really talk about it until my lips fall off...That's the only way I'll get it out of my system and exercise all my feelings toward it...
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Old 2006-07-08, 00:50   Link #6
Shiryuu
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I'm pretty sure he got training since he brought along ZZ with him (which also shows up in the side story). Roux doesn't show up, so that either means she died and didn't have kids\kids weren't important to talk about OR she left him.
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:05   Link #7
hanxthre
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Awwww man Loux just dissapears into oblivion (Well that kinda sounds like the anime where she was huge part of the shows first half and almost a no-count in the 2nd-half)...tell me more what is the side-story about?? Damn the UC is real lenient about people keeping WoMD like ZZ, I mean it isn't a Geo metro it's a Gundam...
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:22   Link #8
Shiryuu
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There's a summary of it here: http://www.animenation.net/forums/sh...ight=crossbone (It's actually a crossbone gundam side story, it might be different for the victory one, or maybe I'm just getting them confused).

There is used to be another one in the Gundam Official forums, but that place got shutdown.

EDIT: more V-gundam side story stuff
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:26   Link #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiryuu
Judau didn't actually appear in Usso's timeline. He appeared during Crossbone (or sometime after it), and it's just labeled as a Victory side story.
Actually, Judau really was in a manga sidestory of Usso's timeline. He appeared as the alter ego he had assumed in the Crossbone Gundam sidestory, Greay Stock
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:29   Link #10
Shiryuu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinji103
Actually, Judau really was in a manga sidestory of Usso's timeline. He appeared as the alter ego he had assumed in the Crossbone Gundam sidestory, Greay Stock
I've only read summaries and that was a long time ago, so I don't remember all the details.
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:33   Link #11
hanxthre
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Well all those stories have him old as hell...I was trying to find out if there was anything more sequential...Like before CCA...Probably asking for too much just wanted to know if him and Loux had any confirmed relationship and whatever other fights he had been in...It seems he turned out to be just a junk man (which is what he started off as a kid), but still that seems a bit trifle for a pilot such as himself, but he did hate war...He finds Amuro's cockpit data huh?
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:35   Link #12
Shiryuu
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There is a manga where he teams up with Amuro in a modified Double Zeta Gundam to fight Ideon. I'm still trying to find more info on it.

http://www.mahq.net/Mecha/Gundam/gigantis/index.htm

I doubt it fits in the UC storyline though.
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Old 2006-07-08, 01:56   Link #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiryuu
There is a manga where he teams up with Amuro in a modified Double Zeta Gundam to fight Ideon. I'm still trying to find more info on it.

http://www.mahq.net/Mecha/Gundam/gigantis/index.htm

I doubt it fits in the UC storyline though.
Yeah, that's in the Victory Gundam sidestory manga. It's in the back of the volume, after the story where he appears in Usso's sidestory.

The Ideon fight actually does fit in the UC storyline, it takes place in UC 0091. It just doesn't really affect too much outside of that sidestory, despite Char also having appeared.

I've got the manga of both his Crossbone Gundam appearance and his Victory Gundam/UC 0091 appearance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hanxthre
He finds Amuro's cockpit data huh?
No, not exactly.
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Old 2006-07-08, 02:28   Link #14
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Well any other opinions on this series or how it ended?? Anyone dissapointed in how Haman died?? Or another aspect?
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Old 2006-07-08, 02:41   Link #15
Scorch
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I had mixed feelings about this show. One of my favorite characters got horribly mangled during it. How could they do that to Yazan?
Haman felt like a shadow of her Zeta self to me in ZZ. She was too obsessed with Judau, she never let her feelings for Char get in the way to the same extent in ZZ. In the end, she seemed to just give up. I felt like Bright had lost his touch too. What was he thinking, letting a crew of kids run his new ship?

I did like seeing the huge change in Mashimar. I thought they were going to kill him when the show turned serious, but instead they brought him back as a good villain. Judau punching Wong was awesome. On the other hand, I couldn't believe they brought back the MoonMoon colony later in the show. The MoonMoon episodes were just... awful. They deserve to be deleted from Gundam.

My understanding of why the series changed drastically in tone is that Tomino did a rewrite to make it match up with what he was planning for CCA.
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Old 2006-07-08, 02:52   Link #16
hanxthre
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Well atleast Yazan didn't die or did he^^?

I wish Char's counter attack would have been a series as orginallty planned though..It would have been great to flesh out his change in persona and relationship with Amuro..You could have had visual updates on characters like Cammille and Judua too...

Anyways I agree with you on turning Mashima to Brolly...He was insanley powerful in the end...Shit it would have been better for him to be the endboss...and Haman did feel too much for Judua...she left for that final battle thinking she would without a doubt return with him, but she just gave up when it really wasn't decided..The fight was pretty good though until the end...What did Judua help her understand exactly? In the end she said "To have met such a good boy..." then basically kills herself...All he did was fight for peace like any other main g-pilot....

I hear alot of people crap on the whole MoonMoon stuff...wasn't great, but it wasn't a huge deal to me..I mean it didn't get a bigtime negative rise out of me...Futhermore the events in Turn-A gundam kind of validate it's existence...
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Old 2006-07-08, 07:48   Link #17
Shinji103
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I thought the series ended pretty well.

The only real problem I have with ZZ is one that I'm sure we can all agree with: Moon Moon. Seriously, that arc was just "WTF??!!".

Everything else...well, most of everything else....was just fine with me, and I even liked how the beginning episodes were lighthearted and comedic. Although it certainly got a bit too comedic and lighthearted, and even some "WTF??!!", at times :

That guy eating an orange (or whatever it was) while the rest of the docking bay was in chaos in episode 1, when Yazan, Judau, and co. "attacked." If I were that guy on the phone next to him, I'd have beaten him upside the head with the nearest blunt object I could find.

Mashima treasuring the rose he got from Haman: perfectly fine. Spraying it with a preserving solution: ok. Worshipping the flower and kneeling before it: somebody drag this guy onto the street and shoot him. Please. It'll do everyone some good. Thankfully that was only one scene, so I didn't actually get to hate his character. Just the flower-worshipping.

Those three pilots with the smokescreen tactic. They had some pretty good skills, what being able to draw that rose in the sky with the colored smoke (that stuff isn't easy to pull off), but never realized they'd be blocking their own view of the enemy with the smoke. WTF??!!

Yazan in episode 1: his usual self. After episode 1: wth happened to him? Final episode he appeared: he regained his wrathful self, but did he survive or what???

Chara: in the earlier parts of the series, I would understand her looniness if she had been mentally altered to bring out her Newtype abilities, but there's no evidence that she had any mental modifications back then.

Anyway, there's my two cents.
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Old 2006-07-08, 07:53   Link #18
Obi-Wan
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I dunno Shinji the crossdressing episode was pretty bad too.

And actually I think Yazan appears again in episode 26 or 27, not sure on the episode number. He doesn't die in ZZ.
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Old 2006-07-08, 07:57   Link #19
Shinji103
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Originally Posted by Obi-Wan
I dunno Shinji the crossdressing episode was pretty bad too.
I totally forgot about that. >.> Although the cross-dressing was reasonable, given the situation and how they had to get in there.........................reasonable to a degree, anyway.

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Originally Posted by Obi-Wan
And actually I think Yazan appears again in episode 26 or 27, not sure on the episode number. He doesn't die in ZZ.
Really? O.o I gotta get my ZZ discs back from my friend and check that, I never noticed.

Oh, and there was one single thing I liked about Moon Moon: I really got a kick out of those guys worshipping the ZZ Gundam. Bow before your god!!!
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Old 2006-07-08, 09:14   Link #20
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I gotta say episode 1 is the best recap episode of all Gundam series. It's weird but amusing.

Also, call me evil if you want but I wished Kamille never recovered from his state. His absence in CCA would have made a lot more sense.
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