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Old 2006-07-16, 17:02   Link #41
Wolcik
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Rasengan is too complicated for Sasuke, and it's wind move so Fire type bent to Lighting would have some problems in using it

Naruto will blow away Sasuke XD

but why Jiraya didn't think about KageBunshin training? instead of 3 years he could do it in two weeks XD
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Old 2006-07-16, 18:56   Link #42
Spawnblade
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheese4u
I couldn't imagine what the reason would be, I'm still wondering why Sasuke hasn't copied Rasengan yet.

Two reasons:

A. Sasuke already has Chidori, he may see there be no need to copy Rasengan, or may simply be unable to because of the focus/concentration it takes. And Sasuke doesn't seem to have the practice copying jutsu that Kakashi does.

B. As for Naruto's new wind jutsu, I would say that one of the main reasons Kakashi is teaching him an -elemental- jutsu, is specifically so it will be more difficult to copy, since Sasuke isn't magically every element. He is naturally fire by the Uchiha, but it is stated in the manga that he also has elements of electric and therefore was able to use Kakashi's jutsu.


I think it would be cool if a side effect of having strong enough wind jutsus would be the ability to propel yourself through the air and fly, or also the enhanced speed for taijutsu that someone else already mentioned...

Have to wonder why Jiraiya didn't attempt this method of having a thousand clones throughout the last three years though.
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Old 2006-07-16, 18:57   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolcik
Rasengan is too complicated for Sasuke, and it's wind move so Fire type bent to Lighting would have some problems in using it

Naruto will blow away Sasuke XD

but why Jiraya didn't think about KageBunshin training? instead of 3 years he could do it in two weeks XD

Ah missed this post lol... I do agree on all parts... And we haven't even seen 'That' jutsu that Jiraiya taught Naruto yet.
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Old 2006-07-16, 18:59   Link #44
Kotengu
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Originally Posted by Hunter
I kind of wonder if Kishimoto will think about a valid reason to make Naruto's new jutsu uncopiable/usable by Sasuke's Sharingan this time.
If that's the case what would you think this reason would be?
It's not like sharingan can just copy anything. The person has to be able to do it themselves in addition to copying it. Rasengan prolly requires teaching or practice to be able to do, like lee's movement since it's more about control and manipulation ablility than hand seals and chakra use.(not to mention it took yondaime 3 years to learn it properly)
pluss naruto has some serious advantages.
1. more stamina than sasuke (can take more hits AND has at least 4X more chakra)
2. better attitude and determination than sasuke. (makes for overall better results in everything)
3. Hard work. not that sasuke doesn't work hard, but the only person we've seen work harder and longer than naruto is lee. . .

Anyway to be more simplistic, sasuke can't copy something he can't do(like summons) So if naruto finds a loop hole in sasuke's raw ablilites, then he could easily come up with something that couldn't be copied.
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Old 2006-07-16, 19:01   Link #45
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rasengan is uncopiable, it isnt a jutsu with hand signs, its a molding and manipulation of raw chakra and it is wind based.

naruto had to learn control of it in water and earth element form, the water ballon and rubber ball, learning to control it in those methods allowed him to fully release it in a wind based form.
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Old 2006-07-16, 19:25   Link #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eXistenZ
rasengan is uncopiable, it isnt a jutsu with hand signs, its a molding and manipulation of raw chakra and it is wind based.

naruto had to learn control of it in water and earth element form, the water ballon and rubber ball, learning to control it in those methods allowed him to fully release it in a wind based form.
No one said it was uncopyable. Kakashi copied the gates, and lee's movement was eventually copied. Its just that sasuke would prolly have to practice to use the jutsu.
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Old 2006-07-16, 20:00   Link #47
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the rasengan differs from all those, taijutsu can be copied by the sharingan, and it is a release to open the gates, thats how they are copied.

and yes the rasengan prolly be copied, not by the sharingan, but through trial and effort
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Old 2006-07-16, 20:11   Link #48
Kotengu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolcik
Rasengan is too complicated for Sasuke, and it's wind move so Fire type bent to Lighting would have some problems in using it

Naruto will blow away Sasuke XD

but why Jiraya didn't think about KageBunshin training? instead of 3 years he could do it in two weeks XD
oh yea sorry I missed this one, but just cuz your type is on way doesn't make you a pokemon. Kakashi and Sarutobi have done all sorts of elemental jutsu, when I'm sure their 'type' was just one or two.
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Old 2006-07-16, 20:23   Link #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kotengu
actually temari's jonin sensei killed hayate with a wind jutsu using only his fingers during the chunin exam.
I'm Failing to see your point.....

You said something about Temari's Sensai after i commented soley on Temari fighting style =/
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Old 2006-07-16, 20:43   Link #50
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Originally Posted by FireDetei
I'm Failing to see your point.....

You said something about Temari's Sensai after i commented soley on Temari fighting style =/
Ah sorry I should have been more specific. I was really illuding to the fact that just cuz you have a fan doesn't really effect your ability to learn/teach wind based jutsu, as Temari obvioulsy had to learn from somewhere, and her sensei was using a similar style of attack (if not toned down a bit).

Also I think I confused the origonal meaning of the topic a bit.. I was prolly thinking that you ment that naruto couldn't learn wind jutsu cuz he didn't have a fan, but that would be a litlle silly on my part .
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Old 2006-07-16, 20:54   Link #51
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lol no, I was just pointing out that Naruto wouldn't find much guidence from Temari as he doesn't seem to carry a giant fan around as from what we have seen from Temari, you need a fan to do her techniques.

Obviously the basic princaple of the jutsu, being wind based attacks from distance like Tornados and such could be taken.
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Old 2006-07-16, 22:14   Link #52
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kishi has got me stumped. wind is generally a sorry element used by sidekicks like pidgeotto . this is gonna be some badass wind jutsu if it makes naruto better than Kakashi. maybe its not an attack like most people are guessing. it could be a wind reflecting jutsu or somethin. u know, giant chakra tornado sucks in attacks then naruto molds chakra to send it back to his opponent. kinda like a kaze kaiten or something who knows.
Kakashi needs to teach Naruto some different moves besides this ultimate jutsu. i wanna see him do Itachi's exploding shadow clones(kakashi saw it, he might be able to teach it). Naruto's clones suck!! All they do is get hit and poof. kamikazi their asses and do some damage dammit
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Old 2006-07-16, 22:28   Link #53
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I dont know if anyone thought of this
I think the 4th's flash flip?? might be a wind type jutsu
using the wind chakra to move real quick (and that is a kick ass jutsu )

so is naruto finally gonna be like the yellow flash now??
and do we have proof that sharingan can catch yellow flash?
=p
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Old 2006-07-17, 02:44   Link #54
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but there is still one think to that training method
Naruto can do like: Chakra controling, Lee hard way training or something like that and get 1000 times effect from one day
it's not like he have to only try to find his own jutsu
and Naruto needs one night sleep to recover so each day's a batte

I would want to see some more badassed KageBunshin 3tailed Kyuubi x2 or something XD
Yondaime was wind user and he was consider the strongest
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Old 2006-07-17, 04:19   Link #55
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Wind is quite possibly the most versatile of elements you have, actually. It can be used offensively (Temari is immediately the first example, since she's our most known wind-based character, but then you have attacks of the nature that Shukaku made), defensively (to parry attacks, and both Neji and Temari have done this several times, Neji being the poster-boy of this particular tactic), and then there are special applications we have not seen at all.

For instance, vacuums. No one ever mentions the sudden removal of air from a specific place. Whether to suffocate or to immediately rip someone to shreds due to the sudden change in air, a vacuum-type attack is powerful in its own right.

Control the air, control breathing... gg.

Furthermore, unlike fire-type jutsus, wind does not have to be created to be used, and unlike most water-type users, wind-based jutsus wouldn't suffer from requiring the element to be nearby, since air is pretty much everywhere a ninja would plan to fight... unless you're Sasori, but he's dead so that doesn't matter, does it?
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Old 2006-07-17, 06:52   Link #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheese4u
I couldn't imagine what the reason would be, I'm still wondering why Sasuke hasn't copied Rasengan yet.
It's simple : because while the Sharingan can break-down the principles of the Rasengan and copy it for its user, it doesn't mean the user is able to use it.
The Sharingan doesn't copy body capacity like chakra control.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eXistenZ
rasengan is uncopiable, it isnt a jutsu with hand signs, its a molding and manipulation of raw chakra and it is wind based.
The Sharingan copy ability isn't about hand seal, regardless of whether its chakra molding or seals forming, all the under lying physics of the jutsu will be copied and remembered by the user in an instant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spawnblade
As for Naruto's new wind jutsu, I would say that one of the main reasons Kakashi is teaching him an -elemental- jutsu, is specifically so it will be more difficult to copy, since Sasuke isn't magically every element. He is naturally fire by the Uchiha, but it is stated in the manga that he also has elements of electric and therefore was able to use Kakashi's jutsu.
Possibly more difficult but we saw Kakashi copying and using on the spot water-based jutsu so it's no real issues.

Quote:
Have to wonder why Jiraiya didn't attempt this method of having a thousand clones throughout the last three years though.[/I]
Well in defense of Ero-Sennin he didn't have Yamato with him to control the Kyubi's chakra and stop Naruto going berserk which is required for this training.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kotengu
Anyway to be more simplistic, sasuke can't copy something he can't do(like summons) So if naruto finds a loop hole in sasuke's raw ablilites, then he could easily come up with something that couldn't be copied.
The Sharingan would copy it regardless of Sasuke being able to use it or not, just like when he copied Lee's Taijutsu whereas his body wasn't trained enough yet to use the moves.
But like you said he wouldn't be able to use it.
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Old 2006-07-17, 07:05   Link #57
Wolcik
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter
Possibly more difficult but we saw Kakashi copying and using on the spot water-based jutsu so it's no real issues.
we don't know when he learn that jutsu, he might have already be able to use it but he wanted to schock Zabura
Quote:
Well in defense of Ero-Sennin he didn't have Yamato with him to control the Kyubi's chakra and stop Naruto going berserk which is required for this training.
that's true, but Naruto still has x2-4 Kakashi's chakra and hell lot of stamina, so this training would be still possible, it would be x2-4 faster instead of x1000
Quote:
The Sharingan would copy it regardless of Sasuke being able to use it or not, just like when he copied Lee's Taijutsu whereas his body wasn't trained enough yet to use the moves.
But like you said he wouldn't be able to use it.
the thing that is perfect to see chacra movment and molding is Byakyuyan
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Old 2006-07-17, 07:19   Link #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolcik
we don't know when he learn that jutsu, he might have already be able to use it but he wanted to schock Zabura
It is directly stated during the explanation of what Kakashi did with the Sharingan that Kakashi copied this jutsu on the spot.
He also did that to counter Kisame jutsu.

Quote:
that's true, but Naruto still has x2-4 Kakashi's chakra and hell lot of stamina, so this training would be still possible, it would be x2-4 faster instead of x1000
Well not really, without Yamato to supress the Kyubi's chakra Naruto would naturally uses it.
But yeah even a single KB would drastically increase Naruto's growth, Jiraiya probably never thought about that.
Hey or maybe that's with this kind of training he ended up awakening 4-tails Naruto ^^

Quote:
the thing that is perfect to see chacra movment and molding is Byakyuyan
The Sharingan also sees chakra but anyway in the case of the Rasengan you don't need neither the Sharingan nor the Byakugan. It's plain visible, heck even Naruto understood what the Rasengan was about.
There is just one hell of a difference between understanding how it works and being able to do it.
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Old 2006-07-17, 09:04   Link #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jounin101
kishi has got me stumped. wind is generally a sorry element used by sidekicks like pidgeotto . this is gonna be some badass wind jutsu if it makes naruto better than Kakashi. maybe its not an attack like most people are guessing. it could be a wind reflecting jutsu or somethin. u know, giant chakra tornado sucks in attacks then naruto molds chakra to send it back to his opponent. kinda like a kaze kaiten or something who knows.
Kakashi needs to teach Naruto some different moves besides this ultimate jutsu. i wanna see him do Itachi's exploding shadow clones(kakashi saw it, he might be able to teach it). Naruto's clones suck!! All they do is get hit and poof. kamikazi their asses and do some damage dammit
As long as we are pulling from other shows... What about Jin from YuYu Hakasho? As I recall he had very formidable offense and defense capabilities and was even the Leader of his group. Apparently Wind is not merely for sidekicks like pidgeotto.

On another note, it seems like we aren't grasping the full potential of wind. Wind has the ability to match and very well exceed many of the other elements. For example with Fire, without air to fuel it the flames will die out. I'm not sure if the same principle applies for a chakra-based flame, but since I'm on this subject, if you fully master the power of the Wind element, could you not have a sort of manipulation of the particles that make up the air. With that you could also have a technique similar to Colonel Mustang the Flame Alchemist from FMA. Or even in the case with water, you have the ability to wield hurricanes and the such. The strength of wind is only limited buy the imagination.
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Old 2006-07-17, 11:08   Link #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter
It is directly stated during the explanation of what Kakashi did with the Sharingan that Kakashi copied this jutsu on the spot.
He also did that to counter Kisame jutsu.
Kakashi said that? cause I thought that he could say this just to suprise Zambura (can't remember his name)... if he didn't say it after the fight than I dunno

Quote:
Well not really, without Yamato to supress the Kyubi's chakra Naruto would naturally uses it.
But yeah even a single KB would drastically increase Naruto's growth, Jiraiya probably never thought about that.
Hey or maybe that's with this kind of training he ended up awakening 4-tails Naruto ^^
I thought about that when reposting, but than again, Naruto would already know about this kind of training

Quote:
The Sharingan also sees chakra but anyway in the case of the Rasengan you don't need neither the Sharingan nor the Byakugan. It's plain visible, heck even Naruto understood what the Rasengan was about.
There is just one hell of a difference between understanding how it works and being able to do it.
Naruto is pretty dumb, maybe it's because of enlish translation, but everything is plain simple after the first explanation XD



there is only 5 'hidden' villages?

there were also sound ninjas, maybe it was mix of wind or something, but they didn't use wind but trully sound that was traveling throuh air XD
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