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Old 2003-12-25, 08:29   Link #1
gho
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Intelligent Themed ANIME and GREAT STORIES!!!!!!

Hi,

I have been having dificulty finding good anime. I loved Cowboy Bebop (best ever), really enjoyed Lain, GITS and SAC creamed, Shigetsutan Tsukihime, URDA is really cool, Noir is not that great (weak plot and script), but all that I've see after this really sucks.

It is not because I completely disregard childish anime. I love LOVE HINA (specially the manga). But I have seen a LOT OF CRAP recently and I am getting a little lost. Last Exile sucks completely for instance... the production is superb, just like in Read or Die, but what the fuck happened to the history? It all comes to this childish stereotype that I really despise and that crude stupid brother and sister and, oh yes, (done in a girlish voice) "oh we can make it if we try hard" and "sigh"....

I am sick and tired of just watching first episodes and moving on...

Please don't recommend anything like Naruto or anything that would follow that same mental age pattern. I am really moved when I have to waste every single brain cell in my head just to follow the plot or when the script really Innovates ( I LOVE FLCL FOR THAT FLCL RULES TOO!!!).

Grave of Fire Flyes is really another good example.

The good thing about anime is that it is a cheap format that looks really good and, therefore, we can make the most fantastic scripts that would never have the necessary audience to pay for the live movie conversion come to reality or become animated. I want to see more animes that really make justice to that last phrase.
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Last edited by gho; 2003-12-29 at 07:34.
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Old 2003-12-25, 09:20   Link #2
Kaizoku Luffy
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Boogiepop Phantom is one of those anime where you have to think and stay focused to be able to comprehend just what's going on. Judging from your post, you might like it.

You said you enjoyed SE Lain. You might want to check out Haibane Renmei, then. It's not as deep or complicated as Lain, but it's from the same director and it's really good. It has a nice innovating story as well
Another anime from the same guy is Texhnolyze. I haven't seen it yet, but it's supposed be just as, if not more, complicated as SE Lain.

Then of course there are Neon Genesis Evangelion and RahXephon. Both great mecha series known for their well-executed plot and characters.

Berserk is another great series I'd like to recommend. It isn't exactly complicated, but it certainly isn't just a hack 'n slash title. It has very rich characters and it's setting is quite original for an anime. At least it isn't a childisch title.

I hope I've been of help
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Old 2003-12-25, 13:29   Link #3
Rama
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Hmm, I searched for a little info about Texhnolyze but there isn't much..
Do you know where I could find a sample clip? I'm really interrested in that one
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Old 2003-12-25, 15:04   Link #4
Lain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaizoku Luffy
Boogiepop Phantom is one of those anime where you have to think and stay focused to be able to comprehend just what's going on. Judging from your post, you might like it.

You said you enjoyed SE Lain. You might want to check out Haibane Renmei, then. It's not as deep or complicated as Lain, but it's from the same director and it's really good. It has a nice innovating story as well
Another anime from the same guy is Texhnolyze. I haven't seen it yet, but it's supposed be just as, if not more, complicated as SE Lain.

Then of course there are Neon Genesis Evangelion and RahXephon. Both great mecha series known for their well-executed plot and characters.

Berserk is another great series I'd like to recommend. It isn't exactly complicated, but it certainly isn't just a hack 'n slash title. It has very rich characters and it's setting is quite original for an anime. At least it isn't a childisch title.

I hope I've been of help
Really? Then I must have judged to soon. I watched the first two episodes of Berserk, and it seemed just so mind-numbingly stupid that I couldn't bring myself to watch the third, which I had also downloaded. I was disgusted to even have such shit on my disk.

I whole-heartedly agree with the rest of your choices, and now i'm reconsidering watching berserk anyway, since anyone who liked what you say you like here can't have that diffirent a taste from mine.
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Old 2003-12-25, 15:33   Link #5
hunterx
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hrm well I didn't think last exile was that great either. I totally hated rahxephon except for eps 19.

If you're looking for intelligent anime like the ones you listed above you'll mostly find them in anime movies and ovas. I recently watch Hitsuji no Uta ova and even though the animation isn't that good the story was great, it's vampiric like tsukihime. I also liked the kenshin ovas very much, I heard perfect blue was good too. Patlabor movie 1 is high on the intelligent dialog quota too. Macross plus is another good one, other than GITS/SAC I can't think of any recent animes like that
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Old 2003-12-25, 15:48   Link #6
Kaizoku Luffy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rama
Hmm, I searched for a little info about Texhnolyze but there isn't much..
Do you know where I could find a sample clip? I'm really interrested in that one
I'm sorry, but I couldn't find a sample clip anywhere.
I did stumble upon this site, though, which contains images from the series:

http://www.csusm.edu/anime/texhnolyze/images.htm


Quote:
Originally Posted by Lain
Really? Then I must have judged to soon. I watched the first two episodes of Berserk, and it seemed just so mind-numbingly stupid that I couldn't bring myself to watch the third, which I had also downloaded. I was disgusted to even have such shit on my disk.

I whole-heartedly agree with the rest of your choices, and now i'm reconsidering watching berserk anyway, since anyone who liked what you say you like here can't have that diffirent a taste from mine.
Please do. It might be a hard watch if it isn't the kind of anime you like, but around episodes 12 it really picks up IMO. You really begin to care for the characters and it's great to see how they interact with each other and how they change and all.
A little warning though; if you come to like the characters as much as I do, the ending will tear you apart.
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Old 2003-12-25, 16:45   Link #7
u&t
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Being in a similar situation as the original poster I've since then dedicated most of my must-find-new-stuff efforts towards shoujo anime.

I'm not going to give any specific recommendations (there are plenty of good shoujo suggestion threads in the forum). Just avoid everything with "action" in it and concentrate on stuff with "drama" and "romace" in it and you'll probably be fine.
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Old 2003-12-25, 19:02   Link #8
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Hi y'all,

I am currently and egearly watching Boogiebop Phatom but (specifically on that one I can't really put my finger on wether I like it or not... I couldn't understand most of the story till the 4th eps) but Hitsuji no UTA is also great (I am watching and waiting like hell for the 4th eps) and perfect blue was really something that touched me...

I am going to check haibane hemnei next because it is from the same author of SE LAIN which is marvelous... after it I am going to check Berserk and those other two Mecha animes...

By the way ... I really recommend URDA and I still want more names...

I find it impossible that there are just these series going on that are really worth seeing... there's got to be more!!
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Old 2003-12-25, 21:07   Link #9
Xiandu
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Some other anime that is very good and story implemented and is on Animesuki, is
Hundred Stories aka Kousetsu Hyaku Monogatari
Ayatsuri Sakon
Gunslinger Girl
other anime that you should definitely see is Berserk, the story is deep as hell, just give it a chance.
Haibane Renmei is great, Wolf's Rain is deep and coming to dvd, X tv, RahXephon and Neon Genesis Evangelion, Boogie Pop Phantom(get the prequel movie on animesuki before watching the anime), Jin-Roh Wolfpack Brigade(a movie), and Saikano(soon on dvd too).
I know some of these have been mentioned already, but they are that good to mention again. Well hope this helps and happy hunting.
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Old 2003-12-26, 20:34   Link #10
jir0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rama
Hmm, I searched for a little info about Texhnolyze but there isn't much..
Do you know where I could find a sample clip? I'm really interrested in that one
The group Wizzu on the group list at animesuki, their main site has a lot of detailed information on the series. and probably the clip...and more.


EDIT: I forgot, anyway, I was going to recommend juuni kokki. the plot was flawless, and i think it's in the intelligent genre. i've never paid so much attention while watching an anime. I read a really good review on Animenfo, and i'll just quote it here.


Quote:
Over the past couple of years, I have been extremely bored with the new anime coming out of Japan. This is an exception, and a notable one at that. If I could only watch one anime show from this season, it would be this one. It has developed into something truly remarkable in the 15 episodes released so far, and I hungrily await the next release.

From the start, I realized that this show would be something different, since the opening featured classical instrumentation set to a pastoral landscape and tapestries. I was pleasantly surprised, as it was not the pop synth beats and pop vocals featured in most anime openings. The ending song is not quite as good, but I still like it; it has a rustic, unprocessed tone to it that I appreciate. Anyway, as to the first episode--to tell you the truth, I was a bit disappointed. I saw the rather pathetic main character Yoko get thrust into the thick of the action without any explanation whatsoever. It was all beautifully animated, but I was left with a somewhat ambivalent feeling. I made a mental note of this show and waited for more. Then came episodes two and three. The monster battles almost disappeared (the ones that did happen were not animated). The show took on a quieter, more introspective style, and the viewer began to learn more of the main character (there is a reason why she is so pathetic, so I won't be too hard on her). There were hints of a political conspiracy, and in addition I was impressed by the richness of the world that was presented. The mythology was interesting, but more importantly I was struck by how much the show was rooted in history. The architecture and dress is that of ancient imperial China. There are also historical symbols as well. For example, the false empress of Kei was named Joei, after the Joei Codes, the first codified warrior law (issued in the Kamakura period). This represents the idea of a military usurper supplanting a 'rightful' bureaucratic regime. Taikas in the anime are people from the fantasy world who were born in the real world, a few of whom had returned to provide benevolent administration. This obviously refers to the Taika Reforms during the Nara period of Japan, in which Prince Naka and Nakatomi no Kamatari (later Fugiwara) seized the government and reorganized it under Chinese Confucian principles.

But I digress a bit. You'll enjoy it whether or not you catch the historical references. I'll try not to completely spoil the show, but I will say that there is plenty of character development; Yoko eventually breaks out of her shell of helplessness and paranoia, while her companion (a bit unstable to begin with) goes off the deep end when introduced to the fantasy world."
- 3line
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Old 2003-12-26, 20:38   Link #11
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Watch the first 3 of Narutaru. Its a mistake to stop at the first eps.
It gets dark real fast. Hope you enjoy it.
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Old 2003-12-27, 04:20   Link #12
Zoya
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I would suggest both Narutaru and Kimi ga Nozomu Eien. Both are amazingly different in many ways, but they both contain a depth of story-telling that is gripping.

You cannot judge either series by the first episode alone either. Narutaru starts off with an upbeat song and the first episode plays like some kind of Pokemon spinoff, but it changes dramatically in episode 2. KimiNozo starts off like a simple love story, but once again, the drama takes off in episode 2. Both focus on a more mature subject matter which seems to be what you are looking for (or perhaps a more maturely told tale.)
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Old 2003-12-27, 10:32   Link #13
hunterx
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problem is, there is nothing intelligent about narutaru or kgne
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Old 2003-12-27, 14:14   Link #14
Zoya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hunterx
problem is, there is nothing intelligent about narutaru or kgne
While I agree that neither "takes every brain cell to understand," I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree. I have found both series to be thought provoking because of the subjects they address. Narutaru touches on some very Machiavellian themes dealing with the corruption of power as well as the emotional/psychological effects of bullying. Kgne deals with some pretty deep emotional problems. My personal opinion is that a story does not need to be mind-numbing to be intelligent or thought provoking. YMMV of course.
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Old 2003-12-27, 15:30   Link #15
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Narutaru

I agree to disagree with the part about Narutaru... I've seem all the 13 episodes and all I could take from them was the absolute schizophrenia of the script, that's all. I don't know if the manga is this way but the story in the anime version is completely lacking a sense or storyline. There is no point in anything any of the characters do. There is never a connection even between the episodes where they are just out to make a point (like the one they go out fishing). It was a completely waist of my time. I just saw some little disturbing images with eye-candy design (maybe that's the plot = making cute things become monsters and kill). It is like watching normal people going amok for no reason...

But I must say that I LOVED THE INTRO of Narutaru... it has a very funny song and pictures. that's a strong point of that anime...
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Old 2003-12-28, 13:06   Link #16
Lain
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True, true. I really liked Narutaru, but there certainly was this feeling like it needed another 13 episodes to atcually sort out the things that happened in the first 13 and make them connect and MATTER.
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Old 2003-12-28, 15:13   Link #17
Kamui4356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gho
It is not because I completely disregard childish anime. I love LOVE HINA (specially the manga). But I have seen a LOT OF CRAP recently and I am getting a little lost. Last Exile sucks completely for instance... the production is superb, just like in Read or Die, but what the fuck happened to the history? It all comes to this childish stereotype that I really despise and that crude stupid brother and sister and, oh yes, (done in a girlish voice) "oh we can make it if we try hard" and "sigh"....

I am sick and tired of just watching first episodes and moving on...
Have you only seen the first episode of Last Exile? The story does get more interesting. I usually watch the first 4 episodes before making my mind up about a series. The first episode rarely gives a feel for the series. You may be missing out on a lot of series you'd enjoy by just watching the first episode. For other series I suggest Nadesico. You said you liked FLCL so give Abenobashi Mahou Shotengai a chance. It may not be the most intelligent series, but it's a lot like flcl in style.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gho
I am going to check haibane hemnei next because it is from the same author of SE LAIN which is marvelous... after it I am going to check Berserk and those other two Mecha animes...
For a real fun time watch Evangelion and Rahxephon on 2 tvs right next to each other. Some scenes are almost idential frame for frame. Rahxephon is just an eva ripoff. Still, it's a very good eva ripoff and worth watching.
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Old 2003-12-28, 15:46   Link #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamui4356
Have you only seen the first episode of Last Exile? The story does get more interesting. I usually watch the first 4 episodes before making my mind up about a series. The first episode rarely gives a feel for the series. You may be missing out on a lot of series you'd enjoy by just watching the first episode. For other series I suggest Nadesico. You said you liked FLCL so give Abenobashi Mahou Shotengai a chance. It may not be the most intelligent series, but it's a lot like flcl in style.
I did see Last Exile till the 14th episode and the plot in the story just got too boring. I am not saying that if it is not fun for younger ages to watch, in fact I endured till the 14th only because it had a marvelous production (the art is amazing) but I couldn't take any more onii-chans from that anime.

It is a book with a great cover, incredible printing, real easy on the eye, but there's nothing to read in it... for me it is empty.

It was the same thing with Wolf's Rain... I watched it till the 10th episode. I was so much moved by that fact that it was from I.G. that I didn't care about the story till it was unberable. Another story that is made for an average age of 15-16 or so. But I LOVE I.G Studios!!!!!

I really wished that something as good as Cowboy Bebop was released... maybe they will make another 26 ep anime telling the story of Spike before he quarreled with his brother.
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Old 2003-12-28, 23:39   Link #19
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I tend not to keep up with older animes but often searching among the older titles, especially those with good reviews or even the qualities to become classic. So what I talk about here may be a bit dated.

Speaking of Nadesico, Excel Saga sort of came to mind being a parody it is. You will probably fry your mind trying to figure out the references though many would not be caught by any other than long time fans of anime. Also be warned that the whole show (at least the first half) is enough to kill with excessive bouts of laughter...

If you have nothing against mecha anime, Macross Plus would be nice.

Also other recommended anime that I have are:
Seraphim Call
Wings of Honneamise (debut work by Gainax)

I would not define Love Hina as a "childish" anime, more of a harem type aka "tenchi clone"; mixing humour (often slapstick), 1 guy + many girls formula and tons of fan service). True, too much of them makes one sick but occasionally 1 or 2 might be ok.
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Old 2003-12-29, 01:00   Link #20
corp20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gho
I really wished that something as good as Cowboy Bebop was released... maybe they will make another 26 ep anime telling the story of Spike before he quarreled with his brother.
Face it nothing will be as good as Cowboy Bebop. Wait a minute.... what do you mean by "his brother"? Do you mean Vicious? If you do mean Vicious then they aren't brothers. Spike was a mentor to Vicious. Or am I wrong...... if thats the case I have to sit on my ass all day tomorrow and watch every episode of the series. Which I really wont mind too much. As for more suggestions I would go with Gunslinger Girl and maybe Full Metal Alchemist. FMA is just good. Not really "an intelligent (You misspelled intelligent by the way ) themed Anime" but its has a good storyline. I hope you enjoy them.
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