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felix · 2011-11-20, 08:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casshern

Well somebody needs to get her to read the manga.

She's not necesarly strong, just unique in her powers. It's pretty ambigous how she would fair against most members in Fairy Tail.

Casshern · 2011-11-20, 09:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by felix

She's not necesarly strong, just unique in her powers. It's pretty ambigous how she would fair against most members in Fairy Tail.

It's only ambiguous because she's the main comedy relief of the series, so she gets some funny fights once in a while. Other than that her power has to be held back with plot devices so that she stays in line with the rest. I don't see any other reason to take Loke from her at the start of the exam. Pledge with Gray lol ok.

Here's a hypothetical example, say she summons all her spirits at the same time like she did with the spirit king, even if it's just for 20-30 seconds it's enough to take out a very strong opponent. She wont be able to beat Erza, but someone like Gray or Juvia is easily within reach. She doesn't even need to summon all her spirits at the same time, if she can keep Leo and Caprico out for a minute she can do it. What if she is losing, or about to die? All her spirits can force-summon themselves and beat up her opponent together.

The only reason I can think of that Hiro hasn't given her any long range attacks or other caster magic is to keep her on a level with the others, and probably the reason why it's better to have some of her fights be comedic rather than serious. He just upgraded her whip so she could somewhat fend for herself. He even teased us with uranometria, just to show what she's capable of in terms of caster magic, and yet she's still considered weak by some.

Anyway, it's not Lucy's role to be a badass. In terms of power she's easily comparable to the others.

Etheral · 2011-11-20, 10:12

Is everyone forgetting her copy summon creature. It basically can copy the opponent and become them. 1 point of a super summon creature

She already has a long range laser summon creature.
She has Loki. 2nd super summon creature

At the beginning of every fight, she should summon two creatures (In the manga she has done it in a fight.). Heck, Loki can summon himself. Which would mean three summons.
1. Loki summons himself
2. Summon creature to copy opponent and fight
3. Use xyz extra summon/Capricorn

How is Lucy not powerful/under utilized? What does she do in the manga? Nothing, she gets her butt kicked and summons her most incompetent useless ones. Then, Leon comes in after she's messed up. Finally a friend comes to her aid, end of encounter.

The only reason would be the times not scheduling, which is simply a bunch of junk when every other wizard apparently has their summon creature on a 24/7 anytime contract.

This stuff should probably be in the Lucy thread. I'm going to stop complaining now, I just have to accept that is how the author wants it.

Edit: Thanks Anh Minh, I got them mixed up and I edited it.

Anh_Minh · 2011-11-20, 10:16

Reminder: Leon: Gray's co-disciple.
Leo = Loki: Lucy's lion spirit.

Etheral · 2011-11-20, 12:23

I'm glad for a training arc, at least there will be a somewhat plausible reason for Natsu to show off a move or two without it being random.

Plus we don't know exactly what Mages do to train their moves anyway, could be interesting if handled right. I think the manga is taking a few steps in the right direction.

Slayerx · 2011-11-20, 13:22

I think the problem for Lucy is the fact that there is a very clear disconnect between her and her magic. I mean who is the REAL source to Lucy's might, is it Lucy herself or are the summons doing all the work. As it stands it feels like its the summons who are doing most of the work for her.

We know that spirit magic has limitations based on the user, but i think Mashima could have made it more obvious and clear. Like maybe the power the spirits themselves could come from Lucy; ergo they are only as powerful as Lucy is able to make them. Also maybe her magic could have been more than just summoning the spirits but actually providing them magical support (she does occasionally provide some physical support).

I also never cared much for the over use of the golden keys... they are supposed to be rare and yet Lucy has most of them now and only ever uses them in a fight. Frankly i think Mashima should have thrown more silver keys into the mix. This could have also helped better illustrate the limitations of Lucy's magic... for instance noting that maybe should could summon silver spirits 5 times per battle, but gold spirits only twice per battle... also noting that Lucy gets much more quickly exhausted when using the gold keys instead of the silver. We know that after enough summons from the gold keys Lucy gets tired, but we lack sufficient comparisons to actually illustrate how great or how limited her power is. Using the silver keys she might have to change spirits more often and show flexibility and breaks out the gold when things get bad and needs a quick end. Overtime we would notice how she uses the gold more than the silver and thus get a better feeling her growth in strength

immblueversion · 2011-11-20, 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Reminder: Leon: Gray's co-disciple.
Leo = Loki: Lucy's lion spirit.

I really doubt that has much to do with anything.

"Leon" is officially spelled "Lyon" and "Loki" is "Loke" (that is the Norse spelling) Yet they're still pronounced the same.

haegar · 2011-11-20, 21:25

not to make things unnecessary complicated, but THIS is Leon, and once she can summon him she is DF level

Spoiler for OT:

Casshern · 2011-11-21, 06:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by haegar

not to make things unnecessary complicated, but THIS is Leon, and once she can summon him she is DF level

Spoiler for OT:

Give Loke another 30 years or so and maybe... nah.

felix · 2011-11-21, 07:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casshern

Give Loke another 30 years or so and maybe... nah.

At least 50, but yeah.

Etheral · 2011-11-21, 17:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by haegar

not to make things unnecessary complicated, but THIS is Leon, and once she can summon him she is DF level

Spoiler for OT:

Haegar are you spamming the professional or just Van Damme

Krono · 2011-11-21, 21:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Casshern

Lucy is already very strong, the only character in the series to successfully land a kick to the groin of a guild master and former wizard saint. Dunno why people still don't recognize how strong she is.

Mainly because she spends all her time around Natsu, Gray, and Erza. By contrast she looks weak. That's added to her being a summoner, meaning people tend to credit her summons instead of her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slayerx

I think the problem for Lucy is the fact that there is a very clear disconnect between her and her magic. I mean who is the REAL source to Lucy's might, is it Lucy herself or are the summons doing all the work. As it stands it feels like its the summons who are doing most of the work for her.

The summons are powered by Lucy. As she gets stronger, they get stronger. If Lucy was weak, they'd be weak as well. So the "real" source of Lucy's might is Lucy herself.

felix · 2011-11-22, 04:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krono

The summons are powered by Lucy. As she gets stronger, they get stronger. If Lucy was weak, they'd be weak as well. So the "real" source of Lucy's might is Lucy herself.

Well not quite.

Leo and the crazy water women should be a good example.

If they were powered simply powered by Lucy, then you'd expect all of them to be around the same "power level".

Kafriel · 2011-11-22, 10:58

Golden keys are stronger, so they require more magic to use, else the user would collapse. Cue Lucy herself summoning all of her spirits, almost dying(?) in the process. Shouldn't this all be moved to the Lucy thread btw?

cloak_and_dagger · 2011-11-22, 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etheral

I'm glad for a training arc, at least there will be a somewhat plausible reason for Natsu to show off a move or two without it being random. .

THIS. That was annoying me very much up until now.

kk2extreme · 2011-11-22, 23:53

I hope they skip straight to the tourament

immblueversion · 2011-11-23, 10:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by kk2extreme

I hope they skip straight to the tourament

I also hope that, for non-manga-related reasons.

Krono · 2011-11-23, 16:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by kk2extreme

I hope they skip straight to the tourament

They'll likely more or less do that, unless we get some other arc before hand. In any case I doubt we'll get a training arc as such.

Etheral · 2011-11-23, 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krono

They'll likely more or less do that, unless we get some other arc before hand. In any case I doubt we'll get a training arc as such.

I think a quick one chapter training arc would be fine and just the right length.

White Silver King · 2011-11-23, 20:20

I find it unlikely Mashima will pull out another time-skip.

2011-11-20, 10:12	Link #6903
Etheral Member Join Date: Nov 2011	Is everyone forgetting her copy summon creature. It basically can copy the opponent and become them. 1 point of a super summon creature She already has a long range laser summon creature. She has Loki. 2nd super summon creature At the beginning of every fight, she should summon two creatures (In the manga she has done it in a fight.). Heck, Loki can summon himself. Which would mean three summons. 1. Loki summons himself 2. Summon creature to copy opponent and fight 3. Use xyz extra summon/Capricorn How is Lucy not powerful/under utilized? What does she do in the manga? Nothing, she gets her butt kicked and summons her most incompetent useless ones. Then, Leon comes in after she's messed up. Finally a friend comes to her aid, end of encounter. The only reason would be the times not scheduling, which is simply a bunch of junk when every other wizard apparently has their summon creature on a 24/7 anytime contract. This stuff should probably be in the Lucy thread. I'm going to stop complaining now, I just have to accept that is how the author wants it. Edit: Thanks Anh Minh, I got them mixed up and I edited it. __________________ Last edited by Etheral; 2011-11-20 at 12:12.

2011-11-20, 12:23	Link #6905
Etheral Member Join Date: Nov 2011	I'm glad for a training arc, at least there will be a somewhat plausible reason for Natsu to show off a move or two without it being random. Plus we don't know exactly what Mages do to train their moves anyway, could be interesting if handled right. I think the manga is taking a few steps in the right direction. __________________

2011-11-20, 13:22	Link #6906
Slayerx Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005	I think the problem for Lucy is the fact that there is a very clear disconnect between her and her magic. I mean who is the REAL source to Lucy's might, is it Lucy herself or are the summons doing all the work. As it stands it feels like its the summons who are doing most of the work for her. We know that spirit magic has limitations based on the user, but i think Mashima could have made it more obvious and clear. Like maybe the power the spirits themselves could come from Lucy; ergo they are only as powerful as Lucy is able to make them. Also maybe her magic could have been more than just summoning the spirits but actually providing them magical support (she does occasionally provide some physical support). I also never cared much for the over use of the golden keys... they are supposed to be rare and yet Lucy has most of them now and only ever uses them in a fight. Frankly i think Mashima should have thrown more silver keys into the mix. This could have also helped better illustrate the limitations of Lucy's magic... for instance noting that maybe should could summon silver spirits 5 times per battle, but gold spirits only twice per battle... also noting that Lucy gets much more quickly exhausted when using the gold keys instead of the silver. We know that after enough summons from the gold keys Lucy gets tired, but we lack sufficient comparisons to actually illustrate how great or how limited her power is. Using the silver keys she might have to change spirits more often and show flexibility and breaks out the gold when things get bad and needs a quick end. Overtime we would notice how she uses the gold more than the silver and thus get a better feeling her growth in strength __________________ My Deviantart

2011-11-20, 21:25	Link #6908
haegar mangaviking Join Date: Jun 2009	not to make things unnecessary complicated, but THIS is Leon, and once she can summon him she is DF level Spoiler for OT: __________________

2011-11-22, 10:58	Link #6914
Kafriel Senior Guest Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Athens (GMT+2) Age: 24	Golden keys are stronger, so they require more magic to use, else the user would collapse. Cue Lucy herself summoning all of her spirits, almost dying(?) in the process. Shouldn't this all be moved to the Lucy thread btw? __________________

2011-11-20, 10:16	Link #6904
Anh_Minh I disagree with you all. Join Date: Dec 2005	Reminder: Leon: Gray's co-disciple. Leo = Loki: Lucy's lion spirit.

2011-11-22, 23:53	Link #6916
kk2extreme Your wife is hot... Join Date: May 2008 Location: At your house fixing A/C	I hope they skip straight to the tourament

2011-11-23, 20:20	Link #6920
White Silver King The Isley Join Date: Oct 2011	I find it unlikely Mashima will pull out another time-skip. __________________ "Wake up laughing like a prostitute." ...Win...