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Old 2008-10-21, 08:50   Link #2161
Droplet
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
@Droplet
i'll except that we agree to disagree
and i like the fact that your being mature about it unlike most posters
so long for now then
Thank you. And so are you. At the end of the day, we're both anime fans so we're bound to find other things to agree on anyway.
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Old 2008-10-21, 08:57   Link #2162
Train Samurai
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Well that was pointless and a waste of time, moving on......
Anyone expecting something for the upcoming picture dramas, for one thing I hope they do one during the one month Lelouch and Suzaku were together to see how they actually came up with the decision that they made or something like an epilogue of sorts that takes place after episode 25 since the upcoming ones don't look as interesting.
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Old 2008-10-21, 09:06   Link #2163
bladeofdarkness
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i want an answer about what lelouch's actions concerning kallen in ep 22 were about (he basiclly made sure she would be against him in the final plan)
he had no problem letting suzaku and C.C in on ZERO-R
he also had jeremia sayoko Lloyd cecile and nina as part of the plan
but he made it a point to exclued kallen from it
there are several theories as to why he did that but i hope we get the final answer if they make a "planning ZERO-R" pic drama
the question must have been raised during the planning stage (either by C.C, or suzaku) of whether or not tell kallen about it and try to get her to join (it would have made it much easier to pull off)
but lelouch deceided to keep her out of the plan (not only out of the plan, but didnt even tell her that there even IS a plan at all) and his actions in ep 22 show that he is not happy about it (it the only thing he does during ZERO-R that he actually seems sad about except the thing with nunnaly)
i hope they answer that one if they do make such a pic drama
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Old 2008-10-21, 09:09   Link #2164
ZeroSama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
i want an answer about what lelouch's actions concerning kallen in ep 22 were about (he basiclly made sure she would be against him in the final plan)
he had no problem letting suzaku and C.C in on ZERO-R
he also had jeremia sayoko Lloyd cecile and nina as part of the plan
but he made it a point to exclued kallen from it
there are several theories as to why he did that but i hope we get the final answer if they make a "planning ZERO-R" pic drama
the question must have been raised during the planning stage (either by C.C, or suzaku) of whether or not tell kallen about it and try to get her to join (it would have made it much easier to pull off)
but lelouch deceided to keep her out of the plan (not only out of the plan, but didnt even tell her that there even IS a plan at all) and his actions in ep 22 show that he is not happy about it (it the only thing he does during ZERO-R that he actually seems sad about except the thing with nunnaly)
i hope they answer that one if they do make such a pic drama
They'll probably waste the picture EP's with bloody useless comedy skits, just like their doing with the sound "dramas".

Don't get your hopes up.
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Old 2008-10-21, 09:39   Link #2165
Train Samurai
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They'll probably waste the picture EP's with bloody useless comedy skits, just like their doing with the sound "dramas".

Don't get your hopes up.
Exactly instead of getting answers we're getting a dress-up game and a slumber party

Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
i want an answer about what lelouch's actions concerning kallen in ep 22 were about (he basiclly made sure she would be against him in the final plan)
he had no problem letting suzaku and C.C in on ZERO-R
he also had jeremia sayoko Lloyd cecile and nina as part of the plan
but he made it a point to exclued kallen from it
there are several theories as to why he did that but i hope we get the final answer if they make a "planning ZERO-R" pic drama
the question must have been raised during the planning stage (either by C.C, or suzaku) of whether or not tell kallen about it and try to get her to join (it would have made it much easier to pull off)
but lelouch deceided to keep her out of the plan (not only out of the plan, but didnt even tell her that there even IS a plan at all) and his actions in ep 22 show that he is not happy about it (it the only thing he does during ZERO-R that he actually seems sad about except the thing with nunnaly)
i hope they answer that one if they do make such a pic drama
Suzaku and C.C. witness his parents about to destroy humanity because of their selfish means more or less Suzaku and Lelouch planned Zero's Requiem together not solely Lelouch. Lloyd doesn't give a shit since he's an already broken human being and Cecile follows Lloyd wherever he goes so they being there was a sure thing. Jeremiah and Sayoko are just loyal and respect their master's wishes nuff said. So to answer your question why didn't he let anyone in on it Kallen isn't the only exception you know, in short why waste time explaining what's happened at this point when it would turn the world into disarray over what Britannia was planning let everyone live their lives knowing that their dictator is dead and the world can move on and let the people who knew him the most thank him and live on to honor his memory. More or less I just want a picture drama to put some clarity into some of the blantant plot holes left beind. Also whatever happened to Picture Drama 2's released? So far GG only realesed to first one for R2.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:25   Link #2166
bladeofdarkness
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Originally Posted by Train Samurai View Post
Kallen isn't the only exception you know
isnt she
she came right up to him and asked him what he's up to
she also made her feelings for him rather clear making sure he knows she still believes in him
he kept many people out of the plan as he was never in a position to tell them about it (or that telling them about it would ruin the plan, kaguya or xing-ke)
kallen is the only person on earth who he litterally makes it a point to keep out of the plan (he even looks like he's biting his lips when she asks him what he's up to)
and it makes no tactical sense
so why do it (i have my theory but i want conffermation)
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:41   Link #2167
Train Samurai
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
isnt she
she came right up to him and asked him what he's up to
she also made her feelings for him rather clear making sure he knows she still believes in him
he kept many people out of the plan as he was never in a position to tell them about it (or that telling them about it would ruin the plan, kaguya or xing-ke)
kallen is the only person on earth who he litterally makes it a point to keep out of the plan (he even looks like he's biting his lips when she asks him what he's up to)
and it makes no tactical sense
so why do it (i have my theory but i want conffermation)
blade it's quite obvious your a Kallen fan so anything I say won't make you change your stance on the significance as a whole but your definitely overanalyzing everything to prove a point. Zero's Requiem was a promise between Lelouch and Suzaku to make sure the world can see through tomorrow. Kallen significance as a whole wasn't a contributing factor in a way Lelouch wanted her to live to see the tomorrow he and Suzaku would create along with everyone else. It was quite obvious Lelouch knew Kallen's feelings after the kiss but it was the same thing with Shirley in that matter at that point Leouch wanted to protect the people he had left so he pull on his charade. Your arguement is that he Kallen was th only one he kept from the plan which is false he let the whole world out. In a way Lelouch was confident in Suzaku's abilities to kept Kallen at bay since he knew what kind of character she was as a whole he knew that his actions would cause everyone to hate him which would make Zero's return as a true hero more relevant then say if she were to stop him.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:49   Link #2168
bladeofdarkness
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again your ignoring the fact that unlike rest of the world kallen was in a position where he could ask her to help him
no one else would have even listened to him (while she came out and asked him about it)
and lelouch had tried to keep sherly out of his world from the start (even erasing her memory)
kallen was a part of that aspect of his life since day one
and since she is the only one of the four main characters to be kept out of the plan
he had no logical reason to do so
and the question would have came up (C.C would have at least asked him if he doesnt mind having kallen as his enemy)
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:52   Link #2169
Ruvixur
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
again your ignoring the fact that unlike rest of the world kallen was in a position where he could ask her to help him
no one else would have even listened to him (while she came out and asked him about it)
and lelouch had tried to keep sherly out of his world from the start (even erasing her memory)
kallen was a part of that aspect of his life since day one
and since she is the only one of the four main characters to be kept out of the plan
he had no logical reason to do so
and the question would have came up (C.C would have at least asked him if he doesnt mind having kallen as his enemy)
He didn't want her to be known as enemy of the world. She wouldn't be able to live normal life if she would join Lelouch. Lelouch cares for his firends.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:55   Link #2170
bladeofdarkness
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He didn't want her to be known as enemy of the world. She wouldn't be able to live normal life if she would join Lelouch. Lelouch cares for his firends.
thats one theory (except it does discount the fact that nina was dragged into it)
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:56   Link #2171
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
thats one theory (except it does discount the fact that nina was dragged into it)
Nina was needed for his plan, Kallen was not. That is the best way I can put it without going overboard with my extreme Anit-Kallen opinions.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:57   Link #2172
Ruvixur
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thats one theory (except it does discount the fact that nina was dragged into it)
But he wouldn't be able to stop Schneizel without Nina.And Nina herself wanted to atone for creating FLEIJA.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:58   Link #2173
Eliarine
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
again your ignoring the fact that unlike rest of the world kallen was in a position where he could ask her to help him
no one else would have even listened to him (while she came out and asked him about it)
and lelouch had tried to keep sherly out of his world from the start (even erasing her memory)
kallen was a part of that aspect of his life since day one
and since she is the only one of the four main characters to be kept out of the plan
he had no logical reason to do so
and the question would have came up (C.C would have at least asked him if he doesnt mind having kallen as his enemy)
Lelouch didn't need Kallen on his side for his plan to work. He thought Suzaku would be enough, and he was right. He probably wanted to involve as little friends as possible.
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Old 2008-10-21, 10:59   Link #2174
bladeofdarkness
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she almost killed him becouse of it
almost killed suzkau as well
would have kinda killed off the whole plan
she also almost died herself
so if the idea was to protect her the whole thing falls kinda flat
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:01   Link #2175
Eliarine
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she almost killed him becouse of it
almost killed suzkau as well
Well, Suzaku's fake death was kind of part of the plan...
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:02   Link #2176
Ruvixur
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Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
she almost killed him becouse of it
almost killed suzkau as well
would have kinda killed off the whole plan
she also almost died herself
so if the idea was to protect her the whole thing falls kinda flat
Would it be better if she joined him? And be known as enemy of world?
She could have died even then.
It's her own problem she almost died. She knows where she was going when she fought Lelouch and Suzaku. Lelouch isn't Kallen's babysitter.
Oh, and Suzaku had to fight someone strong
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:03   Link #2177
bladeofdarkness
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Well, Suzaku's fake death was kind of part of the plan...
his very nearly real death wasnt
and he couldnt have planned on kallen faking his death, she wouldnt normally have made it past the blaze luminus
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:20   Link #2178
youngde
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Well, Suzaku's fake death was kind of part of the plan...
Lelouch isn't one to make plans that count on something so incredibly uncertain as 'Kallen (who isn't going to know about the plan) needs to defeat Suzaku so it looks like he dies w/o actually killing him.' There would be too many things that could go wrong. To be certain, once it happened, they were able to make use of it, but I doubt that was part of the original plan. I don't think Lelouch realized just how far Kallen would be willing to go to stop him; he was surprised when she just busted in the hanger of the Avalon.

As far as keeping Kallen out of the plan goes, at the very least, he wanted to keep her from getting villized in the eyes of the world like himself and Suzaku. Also, I'm pretty sure he at least knew her feelings for him and likely had strong feelings for her as well. She wouldn't have gone along w/ a plan that involved his death (or, if it did happen, him disappearing forever).

youngde, signing off.
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:29   Link #2179
bladeofdarkness
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also
once he had control of the damocles he would have won the war already
the OOBK would have had to surrender at that point
he couldnt have planned on kallen getting past the shield just in time to fight suzaku and fake his death (without actually killing him, and being left in a position to see him die but no longer be able to stop lelouch)
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Old 2008-10-21, 11:44   Link #2180
Eliarine
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Lelouch couldn't have planned when, where and how exactly (though let's not forget we are talking about the guy who managed to guess Schneizel's every answer to his recorded video ), but I'm pretty sure "Kallen will turn up at some point and try and stop Suzaku" was part of the plan. He probably thought things would go a bit more smoothly, though.
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