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Old 2006-08-29, 12:38   Link #21
Obi-Wan
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Lol the good old "Kira is Newtype!" fan rumor! One of my favorites!

Next season should be called Gundam Seed Eternity (Of Fan Rumors)
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Old 2006-08-29, 12:45   Link #22
shaolo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan
Lol the good old "Kira is Newtype!" fan rumor! One of my favorites!

Next season should be called Gundam Seed Eternity (Of Fan Rumors)

And next season he can even control time to save lacus.
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Old 2006-08-29, 12:49   Link #23
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I heard from a reliable source Kira can also use the dark side powers in the SEED movie. he had so much knowledge of the dark side that he used it to create....life.
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Old 2006-08-29, 13:14   Link #24
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And why not have a title like 'The EA Strikes Back' or 'Return of the SEED' for the movie with Darth Kira in it?
Last thing we need is a Star Wars reference or a rip-off from some other series, which UC/AU fans can use to draw more comparisons, scream foul or wail at what they'd consider as an umpteenth sacrilege. I wonder which one they'll make the next installment a, whatsits - a hommage to... ZZ? CCA? Victory (whose staff Fukuda was part of, btw)?
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Old 2006-08-29, 14:22   Link #25
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What do you know - they have allready added beam countering with beam sabers jedi-style and we allready have masked villains, like Darth Veider, so combine those two and we have Darth Kira with added bits of newtype BS. And the one to beat him will be some up untill unknown spawn of another artificial womb, created from Kiras genes, and he will learn from Athrun.

Other than that - i have to say Kira in GSD for the most part is overpowered, especially considering that he hasnt seen inside of a MS for two years, but his skills seem to have improved from rocking back and forth in his chair and gazing at the ocean
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Old 2006-08-29, 14:37   Link #26
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As much as I hate to admit there are some things we have to take into consideration.

1 - In the first war, Kira was lucky to receive one of the best MS at the time, the Strike, and fell under the guide of the best soldiers of the Alliance, specifically Murrue, Natarle, and Mwu. He survived that long because of them.

2 - By the time Kira receives Freedom he's already a hardened veteran and was pretty much a top ace pilot in the Alliance.

3 - He went up against the best pilots and MS that both ZAFT and the EAF could offer. The Druggies always had least put up a decent fight and Rau tore Freedom apart.

So by the time of the second war Kira is pretty much one of the top guns of the first war considering what he went through. Sure, maybe he hasn't piloted a MS in awhile but then again I'll just use the, "he's a coordinator."

In conclusion, any new pilots fighting against Kira without an extremely powerful suit would pretty much be fighting one of the top guns, if not the best, of the first war. IMO the suit also makes the difference as well.

Look at Rau, he got owned so badly by Kira when he was piloting a GuAiz but then when he was in providence he stood quite well against him.
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Old 2006-08-29, 14:55   Link #27
Skyfall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness
IMO the suit also makes the difference as well.
IMO suit doesnt make THAT much of a difference - look at Athrun and Yzak - kicks extended ass(badly) in mass produced grunt suits. Ofc the suit makes some difference, but not that much - it has been shown that there can be a case where man makes the machine

But then again.....

On the other hand Kira sucks at piloting an inferiour suit - Strike Rogue got scrapped pretty when he got to space in it. Maybe the part of Kira = zomg imba is because he allways gets to pilot one of the best(if not the) suits arround.
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Old 2006-08-29, 15:11   Link #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness
As much as I hate to admit there are some things we have to take into consideration.

1 - In the first war, Kira was lucky to receive one of the best MS at the time, the Strike, and fell under the guide of the best soldiers of the Alliance, specifically Murrue, Natarle, and Mwu. He survived that long because of them.

2 - By the time Kira receives Freedom he's already a hardened veteran and was pretty much a top ace pilot in the Alliance.

3 - He went up against the best pilots and MS that both ZAFT and the EAF could offer. The Druggies always had least put up a decent fight and Rau tore Freedom apart.

So by the time of the second war Kira is pretty much one of the top guns of the first war considering what he went through. Sure, maybe he hasn't piloted a MS in awhile but then again I'll just use the, "he's a coordinator."

In conclusion, any new pilots fighting against Kira without an extremely powerful suit would pretty much be fighting one of the top guns, if not the best, of the first war. IMO the suit also makes the difference as well.

Look at Rau, he got owned so badly by Kira when he was piloting a GuAiz but then when he was in providence he stood quite well against him.
Actually...the only "best soldier" was Mwu....Murrue and Natarle were, more or less, still pretty inexperienced (though Natarle had a small advantage since her family was military and all so she knew the procedures and everything).

The MS could make some difference, but not too great a difference, IMO...proven a lot in the UC era. Despite the, at the time, pretty overwhelming power of the Gundam with the introduction of its beam weaponry, Char put up a pretty good fight in the soon-to-be outdated Zaku II as did some other MS.

Heck, he managed to put up a pretty good fight against Ramba Ral in his Gouf with the Guncannon. That's gotta be skill right there considering if you put equal level pilots in them, the Gouf would have a pretty good advantage over the slower Guncannon (unless the pilot had very good aiming skills)

And even when more advanced MS/MA came out that were equal to, if not greater than, the Gundam came out (mostly MA given the circumstances at the end of the war), Amuro's own piloting and Newtype abilities allowed him to destroy them (of course, unlike CE, he still got damaged a bit).

As shown by the end of the OYW, you can't just throw a rookie into the best MS and expect them to be godly pilots, lol.
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Old 2006-08-29, 15:15   Link #29
Empire
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Kira overpowered? No way. Besides what have already been written... :

1) Kira isn't just a Coordinator. He's Ultimate Coordinator, never forget that. And we can't be sure just how much his abilities were tweaked up.

2) Newtype flash he experiences while piloting the Strike Freedom for the first time is undeniable. Moreover, he can detect Rau and Rey in the way Mwu does. He IS a newtype, albeit probably a weak one.

3) Logic in argument about two years between GS and GSD is flawed. He got his time to warm up in the battle with the assasins sent to kill Lacus. And probably even more in the time he isn't shown in the show before he appears to stop Minerva from firing it's positron cannon. We don't know what he did during this time and it's at least probable that he fought for at least one time.

4) Freedom in GS is far much powerfull than standard grunt MS. It is not only because of firepower which is impressive, it's also because of nuclear reactor AND HiMAT which give him agility and speed far beyond Dagger's, Astray's or GuAIZ's. Heck, even beyond Forbidden, Raider and Calamity's.

5) While it isn't said in the show, it's highly probable that Kira tweaked and customized Freedom and Strike Freedom's OS to better fit him. He did customs to Strike, why wouldn't he do the same with his next MS?
I doubt many pilot's did the same. Hell, I can't point even one who is very probable (except MSV's Red Frame pilot of course ).

6) For anyone surprised that Shinn and Rey got their *** kicked in not very long time - rewatch first ten episodes of GSD. See again the surprised Shinn's face when he says "so this is the power of those who survived Yakin Due". By the time main GSD cast was still green, all the old GS cast, not only Asuran and Kira but Yzak and Deakka too, were black-belt masters and piloting legends. And as Shinn, Luna and Rey skills grew through GSD, so did the rest's.
In other words: if Shinn or Rey had fought Kira or Asuran at the beggining of GSD, they would probably got defeated in the same way.

7) Kira as a pilot has a serious flaw. He relies on his sense of rightness and justice and his emotions way too much for a pilot. He was downed by Shinn because of that. Overpowered Emo pilot? XD
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Old 2006-08-29, 15:36   Link #30
Tak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Obi-Wan
Lol the good old "Kira is Newtype!" fan rumor! One of my favorites!
Not really. It was neither confirmed nor denied. Technically, he did have a new type reaction in GSD.

Then again, I meant it as half a joke, I don't know why you insist on nitpicking every little thing. Lighten up, man!

Speaking of overpowered Kira, yeah, for the last 2 years, he spent most of time either looking at beaches, children or Lacus. You'd think he got rusty, but those commandos were unfortunate enough to give him 'practice'!

With that, also worth noting is the fact that according to official materials, he is not only the ultimate coordinator, but a 'hacker'. Yes, hacking being his hobby. Any suit he touched cannot be piloted by any other individual, unless he says otherwise. Moreover, he appears to have the capacity in figuring out the configurations of other pilots, just by looking at how they fight. Hell, Athrun was so confident in Kira's abilities that he left the I. Justice completely up to Kira, with Meryin there going "WOW!"

Now that I think about it, the reason why Kira performed less-than-satisfactory in the Strike Rouge might be due to the fact that he had not the time to set it up to his personal configurations.

- Tak (Oh, and Kira's 抜刀術 has no peer, period. Its quite obvious FATkuda wanted to make him: WOOHOO JAPAN!)
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Old 2006-08-29, 17:13   Link #31
SoldierOfDarkness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyfall
IMO suit doesnt make THAT much of a difference - look at Athrun and Yzak - kicks extended ass(badly) in mass produced grunt suits. Ofc the suit makes some difference, but not that much - it has been shown that there can be a case where man makes the machine

But then again.....

On the other hand Kira sucks at piloting an inferiour suit - Strike Rogue got scrapped pretty when he got to space in it. Maybe the part of Kira = zomg imba is because he allways gets to pilot one of the best(if not the) suits arround.
Because those extendeds suck. In comparison, the previous druggies were far more deadlier.

Quote:
Actually...the only "best soldier" was Mwu....Murrue and Natarle were, more or less, still pretty inexperienced (though Natarle had a small advantage since her family was military and all so she knew the procedures and everything).
If I recall correctly, the Eurasian commander of Artemis noted that the crew of the AA were some of the Alliance's best soldiers.

Of course Mwu was the one who helped Kira out the most.
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Old 2006-08-29, 17:15   Link #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyfall
On the other hand Kira sucks at piloting an inferiour suit- Strike Rogue got scrapped pretty when he got to space in it. Maybe the part of Kira = zomg imba is because he allways gets to pilot one of the best(if not the) suits arround.

There is no Strike Rogue. This is Strike Rouge (ie red strike).
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Old 2006-08-29, 17:15   Link #33
Skyfall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness
Because those extendeds suck. In comparison, the previous druggies were far more deadlier.
So the extendeds suck more than the grunts Kira was fighting in Strike Rouge ?
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Old 2006-08-29, 17:23   Link #34
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Aces or one-of-a-kinds are meant to be pwned harder and harsher than mere grunts who do nothing but suffer a quick, clean and painless death.

So it's normal that when they die or get owned, people will say 'he sucks' or 'she sucks' in comparison to the cannon fodder that have all of our compassion - while aces hold a lot of expectations from our part.

As for the grunts Kira fought in Strike Rouge, well, they were ZAFT Reds so they are barely one step away from exiting the status of grunt-pilot and walking bulls-eye...and I guess Strike Rouge's shield was at fault when Kira got disarmed. I dunno if that'd have happened with Freedom knowing that Justice's (which is exactly the same as Freedom) withstood a point-blank salvo from Calamity and didn't vaporize, only melted (and still resisted against those Bio CPUs' shots when Athrun went to protect the damaged Freedom). Had it not yielded against the Gunner ZAKU Warrior, I dunno if the outcome would have still been the same as with EA grunts. Kira was, on top of that, flying an inferior MS, therefore changing the standards set for our judgment.

But, yeah, the usual excuse...plot holes, plot holes, plot holes.
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Old 2006-08-29, 18:09   Link #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by true_cricket

There is no Strike Rogue. This is Strike Rouge (ie red strike).
Yes, of course, it always take a French to correct us in their inifinite wisdom of the French language

- Tak (No, don't push me, or I will start speaking French with a German accent! HAH!)
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Old 2006-08-29, 18:54   Link #36
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I think that Kira's skills not decaying in two years is more believable than the speed with whichKira acquired those skills in the first place in GS. But then, can't the same be said of Amuro and a boatload of other pilots?

And how come nobody makes the same complaint about Athrun? He's probably haven't set foot in a MS in two years, he certainly never piloted a Zaku before GSD, but that doesn't keep him from performing real well in the first few eps of GSD.
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Old 2006-08-29, 19:00   Link #37
Tak
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

And how come nobody makes the same complaint about Athrun? He's probably haven't set foot in a MS in two years, he certainly never piloted a Zaku before GSD, but that doesn't keep him from performing real well in the first few eps of GSD.
Thats a good point. As far as I am concerned, Kira knows the Freedom like the back of his hand, but Athrun and Zakus? He hopped into the cockpit, and next thing you know, hes out there shooting things.

And speaking of Kira, it is possible that, during his two year retirement, he spent part time helping ORB configuring mobile suits for his sister and the military (hey, someone's gotta pay the rent) . After all, he pretty much singlehandedly configured all of the ORB MS in the previous war.

Therefore, it shouldn't be all that surprising if he can still pilot a Freedom after all those years...

- Tak
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Old 2006-08-29, 19:06   Link #38
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Originally Posted by Tak
Thats a good point. As far as I am concerned, Kira knows the Freedom like the back of his hand, but Athrun and Zakus? He hopped into the cockpit, and next thing you know, hes out there shooting things.

- Tak
Well the man did pilot the Justice and the Aegis I would think after piloting high performance suits like those you could handle just about anything especially a grunt suit like a Zaku and well Athrun is just a great pilot how can he not own in something like a zaku.
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Old 2006-08-29, 19:12   Link #39
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^ Yeah, thats the point I think. If Athrun can pilot a Zaku out of the blue, I don't see why Kira couldn't pilot the Freedom after two years, considering the fact that he knows the Freedom as much as he knows himself.

- Tak
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Old 2006-08-29, 19:18   Link #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
Well, except nobody in the UC universe can intercept artillery shells in mid-flight with rifles!

And Kira is not only a new type, but a coordinator as well, which... explains lots

- Tak

ZOMG Kira is a newtype coordinator? what's the oldtype coordinator?

ZOMG Kira after not piloting for 2 years, still has his skill even when the whole world has newe weapons. ZOMG

ZOMG FREEDOM PWNS ZOMG ZOMG..

Watch the damn show again, if you guys think Kira was good, watch it again and see for yourself how damn close he came to dying in both GS/D
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