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Old 2006-09-04, 17:05   Link #41
Zu Ra
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Yachiru like Shiro hasnt aged , as in sense to full grown person also. Both are eccentric in their own ways Shiro being angry all the time for no reason and Yachiru being quite immature .. ...similiraties end there.

Yachiru is quite old in comparision to Shiro .if Yachiru is a genius why not Kira Hisagi Renji or even Rukia ?

Yachiru does have a scary looking leatsu ..she may be indeed powerful ...but Madrame is quite powerful and not even a seated officer .

Madrame Yachiru and Zaraki joined Sendai no Gotei at the same time .So if Yachiru is indeed a genius what does that make Madrame A Super Genius ?
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Old 2006-09-04, 17:08   Link #42
Junni
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@ the SS arch yachiru did said to Inoue, Ishida & the others

" i'll clean out the strong ones so you take the small fries "

she's pretty confident of her powers and when she left inoue ishida & others were suprised by her speed. and we all know ishida is already very fast !.

and even ichigo were suprised by her @ kenpachi battle

AND she can move very easy at such a young age to move around freely like with kenpachi's reaitsu around 24/7

... but still her real powers is still a mystery...

maybe it is already known that she's a genius and they all know she wants to be with zaraki...
or maybe she kept her powers hidden so zaraki wouldn't be jelous of her like ikkaku and the pretty boy



Spoiler:
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Old 2006-09-04, 18:36   Link #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junni
@ the SS arch yachiru did said to Inoue, Ishida & the others

" i'll clean out the strong ones so you take the small fries "

she's pretty confident of her powers and when she left inoue ishida & others were suprised by her speed. and we all know ishida is already very fast !.

and even ichigo were suprised by her @ kenpachi battle

AND she can move very easy at such a young age to move around freely like with kenpachi's reaitsu around 24/7

... but still her real powers is still a mystery...

maybe it is already known that she's a genius and they all know she wants to be with zaraki...
or maybe she kept her powers hidden so zaraki wouldn't be jelous of her like ikkaku and the pretty boy



Spoiler:
Ishida had already lost his powers at that time, so he shouldn't be that fast at that time.

Also, she might be (and much) older than many characters there (hitsugaya, for instance); she was in soul society when she was a baby and when Kenpachi was a young man.

Kenpachi does not leak all his power all the time (just like the time when he first met Ichigo), so 24/7 is not an issue there. But, being around Kenpachi (for maybe hundreds of years), she should have at least developed some tolerance to bear his power. That shouldn't look surprising.
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Old 2006-09-04, 22:42   Link #44
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Originally Posted by Sazelyt
Ishida had already lost his powers at that time, so he shouldn't be that fast at that time.
illogical. imagine pete sampras (or any other great athelete) in his prime, suddenly loosing all powers, went to watch a tennise match (or any other sport) and was surprised by a player's powerful forehand.
simple question: is this player any good? well, were pete's eyes damaged? if not then of course yes. on the other hand, though pete can't beat me no more, you think he'll be impressed at all by my skills? after all, you don't even need to be a great athelete to abe to judge, or are you suggesting that ishida's eyesight were severely damaged too?
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Old 2006-09-04, 23:40   Link #45
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Originally Posted by hdx514
illogical. imagine pete sampras (or any other great athelete) in his prime, suddenly loosing all powers, went to watch a tennise match (or any other sport) and was surprised by a player's powerful forehand.
simple question: is this player any good? well, were pete's eyes damaged? if not then of course yes. on the other hand, though pete can't beat me no more, you think he'll be impressed at all by my skills? after all, you don't even need to be a great athelete to abe to judge, or are you suggesting that ishida's eyesight were severely damaged too?
Did you really read the comment or replied just for the sake of replying?

I said, at that time, Ishida had already lost his powers and based on that he shouldn't be very fast. That was mainly a correction to the comment on Ishida's speed.

And for your tennis-related reply, Sampras was still able to play tennis and have the eyes to clearly see the played tennis, whereas Ishida was not able to use any power and sense any power.
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Old 2006-09-05, 00:12   Link #46
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2. the exception i'm talking about was the narcissist yumichika, he took 5th seat because he thinks the number 4 does not match his "beauty".
hmm...I'd have to check that episode again, cause I could of swore that Yumichka said it differently...he didn't like the symbol of a VC or LT...the spot he wanted belonged to Ikkaku, so he settled for the seat that had a symbol that looked closely like the one Ikkaku has that 'matched' his beauty.

is it me or do you just like using the word 'retard'?
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Old 2006-09-05, 00:19   Link #47
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Originally Posted by DjTrizz
hmm...I'd have to check that episode again, cause I could of swore that Yumichka said it differently...he didn't like the symbol of a VC or LT...the spot he wanted belonged to Ikkaku, so he settled for the seat that had a symbol that looked closely like the one Ikkaku has that 'matched' his beauty.
Not exactly. What Yumichika said was that the number 4 was ugly and he decided not to take the third seat because it belongs to his buddy Ikkaku, so he chose the fifth seat as suited to his beauty.

He never said that there was anything wrong with the Capt or Lieutenant position (seat 1 and 2), so it can be assumed that he didn't take those because he didn't think he could be strong enough without using his shikai. And he wouldn't use his shikai in public. Of course, he probably couldn't beat Kenpachi even if he did use his shikai. His ability to beat Yachiru with his shikai is unknown, but he did beat 8th squad Lietenant, Shuhei Hisagi, with his shikai, so it is possible.
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Old 2006-09-05, 00:30   Link #48
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god I feel like I'm always forgetting something...

isn't his shikai that 3 bladed sickle thing? o.O and his bankai is that green glowie flower that sucks the reiatsu from an opponent? o.o

(I should of kept the episodes and burned em dammit...)
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Old 2006-09-05, 02:38   Link #49
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Yumichika's shikai is indeed that 3 bladed sickle. But we have never seen any evidence that he has a bankai at all.
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Old 2006-09-05, 08:24   Link #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
I said, at that time, Ishida had already lost his powers and based on that he shouldn't be very fast. That was mainly a correction to the comment on Ishida's speed.
Junni said
Quote:
when she left inoue ishida & others were suprised by her speed. and we all know ishida is already very fast !.
this statement in no way contradicts the fact that ishida was in a temporary powerless state at that time. in fact it has little to do with it, and your so-called "correction" was not only wrong but also completely missed the point.

if sampras had an accident recently and became completely paralyzed, wheelchaired to a tennise match and got real impressed by player A's running forehand. what might people who didn't see the match but heard about sampras's reaction say? "wow, A must be real good since we all know sampras is a very good forehand player". this statement has nothing to do with whether sampras had an accident recently or not, unless if he had sustained brain/eye damage.

in ishida's natural state, he is fast, so he most defintely has a high standard when it comes to speed, a standard he most definitely retained during power loss. so, in order to get him impressed, yachiru'd have to be pretty damn fast. is this so hard to understand?

after all, Junni used past tense on yachiru, but referred to ishida with the present tense, so even IF it's just talking about his speed and nothing else, Junni's right: Ishida IS fast, cause his powers are back ATM.

Quote:
whereas Ishida was not able to use any power and sense any power
wow, someone's been really careless. check vol 21 where ishida put up a respectable fight against that modified hollow, using the reiatsu he had left, a hollow which scared the afro shinigami shitless. still someone thinks he can't even judge speed
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Old 2006-09-05, 12:37   Link #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdx514
this statement in no way contradicts the fact that ishida was in a temporary powerless state at that time. in fact it has little to do with it, and your so-called "correction" was not only wrong but also completely missed the point.

after all, Junni used past tense on yachiru, but referred to ishida with the present tense, so even IF it's just talking about his speed and nothing else, Junni's right: Ishida IS fast, cause his powers are back ATM.

in ishida's natural state, he is fast, so he most defintely has a high standard when it comes to speed, a standard he most definitely retained during power loss.
You really don't read, do you? That statement assumes Ishida can judge very clearly since he is very fast (not only now, not only in the past, but also at the time Yachiru showed her speed), whereas without his powers he shouldn't be that fast. If you assume he is, then good luck with your assumption.

I will not even bother to read your example, cause the point has already been made. If you didn't already get it, my next try will not succeed either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdx514
wow, someone's been really careless. check vol 21 where ishida put up a respectable fight against that modified hollow, using the reiatsu he had left, a hollow which scared the afro shinigami shitless. still someone thinks he can't even judge speed
Ishida also says I've lost all of my quincy powers (similarly, when he was caught, when he talks about the handcuffs, he also uses a similar expression). You might have forgotten that Ishida also failed to notice that blind captain until he sees the captain a few meters away from him after he lost his powers. And, lastly, that hollow scared Kon shitless (your expression, not mine), which adds up to nothing at all.
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Old 2006-09-05, 23:07   Link #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
You really don't read, do you? That statement assumes Ishida can judge very clearly since he is very fast (not only now, not only in the past, but also at the time Yachiru showed her speed), whereas without his powers he shouldn't be that fast. If you assume he is, then good luck with your assumption.
First judgeing speed has nothing to do with Ishida haveing powers at the time, all it requires is that he is able to see. He saw her take off and comented that she was fast, just because he can't move at those speeds any more does not mean that what he considers fast has been lowered, and if you claim she was moveing too fast for him to see her doesn't that still mean she is very fast?

Quote:
I will not even bother to read your example, cause the point has already been made. If you didn't already get it, my next try will not succeed either.
Ishida also says I've lost all of my quincy powers (similarly, when he was caught, when he talks about the handcuffs, he also uses a similar expression). You might have forgotten that Ishida also failed to notice that blind captain until he sees the captain a few meters away from him after he lost his powers. And, lastly, that hollow scared Kon shitless (your expression, not mine), which adds up to nothing at all.
Ishida failing to notice a captain does not mean much as it has been stated in many places that most captian level shinigami are able to mask thier powers to make them hard to detect, Ichigo and kenpachi are the only ones I can think of who have a hard time doing so.

The hollow thing is to point out that even though he lost his Quincy powers he still could feel hollows at a distance, meaning he still had some powers left, he could also see Ichigo when they returned to Earth adding even more proof that he still had his ablity to sence things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DjTrizz
god I feel like I'm always forgetting something...

isn't his shikai that 3 bladed sickle thing? o.O and his bankai is that green glowie flower that sucks the reiatsu from an opponent? o.o

(I should of kept the episodes and burned em dammit...)
I belive he said the green glow was his shikai's power.
Spoiler for manga:

Last edited by kagato3; 2006-09-05 at 23:19.
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Old 2006-09-05, 23:41   Link #53
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Originally Posted by kagato3
First judgeing speed has nothing to do with Ishida haveing powers at the time, all it requires is that he is able to see. He saw her take off and comented that she was fast, just because he can't move at those speeds any more does not mean that what he considers fast has been lowered, and if you claim she was moveing too fast for him to see her doesn't that still mean she is very fast?


Ishida failing to notice a captain does not mean much as it has been stated in many places that most captian level shinigami are able to mask thier powers to - make them hard to detect, Ichigo and kenpachi are the only ones I can think of who have a hard time doing so.
- I believe after some speed level, it becomes hard to see for the normal eyes. Hence, the person needs to rely on his powers to make a more accurate estimate. I am not saying she is slow. But, that observations on her speed should not make her seem special, as it might be turtle-fast compared to the captains' speed. And lastly, cannot be able to move at high speed means at that time he shouldn't be able to move at that speed, nothing more. The observation is related to Ishida's powers to sense the spirits, not his speed.

- Ishida's powers were special and I believe his sensitivity to other's presence was at a very high level compared to the Shinigamis. At the time when the intruders were considered as nothing but bugs, I don't see a reason for a captain to try to completely mask his power. From another point of view, if we need to assume that captain was masking his power (that should be the case not only for the captains but also for the vice captains), the same can be said for Yachiru. That brings us to the above argument. As long as you cannot use your power to make the observation, then your observation will not prove a highly extraordinary situation, at least at a level to make her genius.
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Old 2006-09-06, 01:11   Link #54
hdx514
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
whereas Ishida was not able to use any power and sense any power.
and yet,
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
Ishida's powers were special and I believe his sensitivity to other's presence was at a very high level compared to the Shinigamis.
what POWERS are you talking about? ishida couldn't use ANY power, remember? how could a human who can't sense or use ANY power be able to sense presences better than shinigamis and put up a fight with a powered up hollow?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
after some speed level, it becomes hard to see for the normal eyes. Hence, the person needs to rely on his powers to make a more accurate estimate.
true, but you see, ishida isn't normal:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
Ishida's powers were special
I believe his sensitivity to _(presence/power/speed...)_ was at a very high level compared to the Shinigamis.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
At the time when the intruders were considered as nothing but bugs, I don't see a reason for a captain to try to completely mask his power.
forgotting that tousen was a traitor who knew everything from the start

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
From another point of view, if we need to assume that captain was masking his power (that should be the case not only for the captains but also for the vice captains), the same can be said for Yachiru.
an exhausted ishida wasn't able to sense the only blind captain, the only captain who had lost one of his primary senses, a captain whose zanpakutou has everything to do with loosing senses, right after battle --> he shouldn't be able to sense any Captain or even VC's power after he's physically healed, not even members of the kenpachi division. brilliant logic. yet you contradict yourself by saying ishida's powers are special and has high sensitivity...
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Old 2006-09-06, 01:20   Link #55
kagato3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt
- From another point of view, if we need to assume that captain was masking his power (that should be the case not only for the captains but also for the vice captains), the same can be said for Yachiru. That brings us to the above argument. As long as you cannot use your power to make the observation, then your observation will not prove a highly extraordinary situation, at least at a level to make her genius.
First I am not trying to prove she is a genius. I feel she lacks the skill and control over her powers to be one, but this maybe because she, like kenpachi, has never had any formal training. But I do feel she is most likely stronger then the rest of the squad.

It has only been stated that in most cases a captian level shinigami has control enuff to compely mask themself, we do not know if a VC can do it.

Well, we know Tousen had reason at the time that he might not want to be tracked , he had been going in and out of a restricted area off and on for around a week, and it might raise questions if he kept droping off the radar for a few hours everyday. He also seemed to be hideing when he went after Kenpachi so it's not realy out of question. Add to this Ishida was about to fall over on his own. I'm not sure if you have ever been working on something so long your about to passout but I can tell you when you get to the point he was I bet he would have walked right passed a captian and not noticed.
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Old 2006-09-06, 01:47   Link #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdx514
and yet,

what POWERS are you talking about? ishida couldn't use ANY power, remember? how could a human who can't sense or use ANY power be able to sense presences better than shinigamis and put up a fight with a powered up hollow?
Didn't you know? Ishida is originally a Quincy and he had "Quincy Powers". If you didn't know, what a great miss!

Anyway, after his fight with that freak captain, he had lost his powers, remember "quincy powers", as said at least two times in the manga by at least two people in parts where you have forgotten to read, incidentally. Without his quincy powers, he shouldn't even be good enough to be considered as a low level shinigami. If you think otherwise, go ahead, but don't expect others to do so. And, yes he was putting a really great fight that has lasted maybe 30 seconds just before he was saved from getting evaporated.

Quote:
true, but you see, ishida isn't normal:
I believe his sensitivity to _(presence/power/speed...)_ was at a very high level compared to the Shinigamis.
Before he lost his quincy powers. If you think otherwise, go back a few lines to read the remaining comments.

Quote:
forgotting that tousen was a traitor who knew everything from the start
Yes, and I am sure Tousen was assuming that bugs were powerful enough to achieve bankai in 2 days, to heal at a level comparable to one of the captains, simply be able to compete with the captains. I guess, in your opinion, Aizen camp had also a psychic to learn how strong those intruders really are, before they become so. What he did at that time would not have changed whether he is a traitor or not, he was on official duty.

Quote:
an exhausted ishida wasn't able to sense the only blind captain, the only captain who had lost one of his primary senses, a captain whose zanpakutou has everything to do with loosing senses, right after battle --> he shouldn't be able to sense any Captain or even VC's power after he's physically healed, not even members of the kenpachi division. brilliant logic. yet you contradict yourself by saying ishida's powers are special and has high sensitivity...
Well, since you seem to be not capable of reading the posts completely, let me repeat this again, and one last time.

Ishida's high sensitivity/special power does only matter when he has his powers. It may mean almost nothing after he lost his quincy powers. And at that time, he had lost his powers (by the way, quincy powers, since it might be difficult to go back to the first part of the post).

Even though I think as above, I gave two possibilities on what Ishida can do after he lost his quincy powers:

- Being able to sense the spiritual power: If he had any power remaining to make him capable of sensing spiritual presence - at that time -, he failed to do so against Tousen. If that is a result of Tousen hiding his spiritual presence, then the same should be valid for Yachiru. What does that mean? His observation of Yachiru's speed "may not be" an accurate observation, since it does only based on his eyes.

- Not being able to sense any spiritual power: That case immediately proves the same result as above: His observation of Yachiru's speed "may not be" an accurate observation, since it does only based on his eyes.
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Old 2006-09-06, 06:28   Link #57
Zu Ra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DjTrizz

isn't his shikai that 3 bladed sickle thing? o.O and his bankai is that green glowie flower that sucks the reiatsu from an opponent? o.o

There is a slight confusion here about Shikai ..Shikai has two stages

Materialisation

Application


In the first stage the the zanapkuto materializes into the form which is suitable for user i.e 3 Bladed Sickle

In the application stage the shikai has various uses say extension or sheilds etc etc i.e Leatsu Sucking form


A Zanapakuto shikai and bankai greatly depends on whether the zanpakuto is Kido based or Zanzutsu based.

If indeed it is Zanzutsu based there wont be a major change as such in the application form its attacks will be restricted to zanapkuto manifestation .

Eg Renji Madrame Gin etc etc

If indeed the Zanpakuto is Kido based then there will be a major change during manifestation and application .

Eg Byakuya Rukia Tosen etc etc

Yumichika who belongs to Juichi-banatai or 11 th squad which due to its taicho Zaraki prides itself on Zanazutsu skills. And frowns or looks down upon users who do indeed use Kido or Kido based zanapkuto .So Yumichika rarely shows the true form or application of his zanpkuto

It would wrong to speculate that the Leatsu sucking application is indeed Bankai
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Old 2006-09-06, 10:13   Link #58
Junni
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well anyway i dont think a weak VC wouldnt say leave the strong ones to me and you take on the small fries...

and everyone in 11th squad loves fighting.. even yachiru she enjoys when ken-chan fights with a strong enemy..

if she dislike fighting its like dislike kenpachi
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Old 2006-09-09, 09:31   Link #59
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Yachiru is the strongest female in Squad 11..... I think she can fight like Yoda from starwars.
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Old 2006-09-10, 23:38   Link #60
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Yachiru is much stronger than anyone gives her credit for. She is Captain level. There are no doubts in my mind that she is on par with Ikkaku. I personally think that she is stronger. The 11th division is made up of people who love to fight, so why should she be any different? She has monstrous reiatsu and she is completely able to mask it. Her speed is very good. Ishida does not give out praises very easily and he gave it to her. Hell, everyone that was present gave out their praise. Also, she was pretty confident that she could take any of the strong opponents that would be in the groups path without any worries. She was fully aware that a few captains and vice captains could have been her opponents, but she wasn't worried in the least. Yachiru may not be a genius, but her powers are on level with any captain.

On a side note, I think Hitsugaya is very powerful. He is an all arround capable fighter. He just seems to have bad luck when it comes to getting opponents.
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