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Old 2009-07-21, 12:42   Link #101
velvet nightmare
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some characters so far in the anime from xing are looking for immortality through the philiosopher's stone right, so how come they dont try and copy greed and go for that through transmuting the soul into an object which would appear to be a lot easier than getting the stone
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Old 2009-07-21, 13:02   Link #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by velvet nightmare View Post
some characters so far in the anime from xing are looking for immortality through the philiosopher's stone right, so how come they dont try and copy greed and go for that through transmuting the soul into an object which would appear to be a lot easier than getting the stone
As it ever crossed your mind that the Xing characters don't know about that?
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Old 2009-07-21, 13:44   Link #103
Vicious108
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And even if they did, being in a body unable to eat, sleep or feel is not exactly a situation anyone would want part in, even if it meant immortality. Which it actually doesn't due to the blood seal. (poor Greed had no idea)
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Old 2009-07-21, 14:07   Link #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by velvet nightmare View Post
some characters so far in the anime from xing are looking for immortality through the philiosopher's stone right, so how come they dont try and copy greed and go for that through transmuting the soul into an object which would appear to be a lot easier than getting the stone
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Originally Posted by Shiroth View Post
As it ever crossed your mind that the Xing characters don't know about that?
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Originally Posted by Endless Twilight View Post
And even if they did, being in a body unable to eat, sleep or feel is not exactly a situation anyone would want part in, even if it meant immortality. Which it actually doesn't due to the blood seal. (poor Greed had no idea)
I will add some more.

Apparently, although that method seems easier than getting the stone, it's not so simple either. Ed got the knowledge to do that from crossing the gate once, and the method needs sacrifice too (Ed sacrificed his arm). The Philosopher's stone is the only key to free transmutaion, without the cost of anything!
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Old 2009-07-21, 14:19   Link #105
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Originally Posted by Ziziphus View Post
I will add some more.

Apparently, although that method seems easier than getting the stone, it's not so simple either. Ed got the knowledge to do that from crossing the gate once, and the method needs sacrifice too (Ed sacrificed his arm). The Philosopher's stone is the only key to free transmutaion, without the cost of anything!
Indeed. So in the end that method would just lead them back to searching for the stone.
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Old 2009-07-21, 15:32   Link #106
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Originally Posted by Ziziphus View Post
I will add some more.

Apparently, although that method seems easier than getting the stone, it's not so simple either. Ed got the knowledge to do that from crossing the gate once, and the method needs sacrifice too (Ed sacrificed his arm). The Philosopher's stone is the only key to free transmutaion, without the cost of anything!
Correction: Ed sacrified his leg. He sacrificed hi sarm to get Al's soul back :P
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Old 2009-07-21, 16:26   Link #107
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Originally Posted by Endless Twilight View Post
And even if they did, being in a body unable to eat, sleep or feel is not exactly a situation anyone would want part in, even if it meant immortality.
Greed didn't seem to care much... When the alternative is death, some people may not care about the price that comes along with immortality... not to mention that since there still is a way to die, suicide always remains an option if you can't take it anymore
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Old 2009-07-21, 18:52   Link #108
Vicious108
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Which is why I said it isn't a situation that just anyone would want part in. Greed isn't just anyone, he's freaking Greed, of course he didn't care. When you're as cool as him, you don't bother with the details.
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Old 2009-07-21, 20:55   Link #109
velvet nightmare
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the general feeling i get from people of high power (the emperor of xing in our case) would do anything to live forever so not having any feeling is acceptable when compared to the alternative, but that's just my assumption

in any case did ed really forget how he transmuted al? i can't remember if he told greed he forgot how

assuming he didnt, ed could 'technically' use someone else's body parts as equivalent exchange right? not sure if we're told how the armor guys in lab 5 were made. it assumes the person that created them has seen the truth so was it hohenheim?
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Old 2009-07-21, 23:58   Link #110
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Originally Posted by GaimeGuy View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziziphus View Post
I will add some more.

Apparently, although that method seems easier than getting the stone, it's not so simple either. Ed got the knowledge to do that from crossing the gate once, and the method needs sacrifice too (Ed sacrificed his arm). The Philosopher's stone is the only key to free transmutaion, without the cost of anything!
Correction: Ed sacrified his leg. He sacrificed hi sarm to get Al's soul back :P
Ed sacrificed his leg to see the Truth, and factoring in the loss of Al's body gives you the balance of Al seeing the Truth and the failed Trisha transmutation. Ed did sacrifice his arm to get Al's soul back, but also to put it into the armor, which is "the method" Ziziphus was referring to.
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Old 2009-07-22, 02:48   Link #111
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Originally Posted by velvet nightmare View Post
some characters so far in the anime from xing are looking for immortality through the philiosopher's stone right, so how come they dont try and copy greed and go for that through transmuting the soul into an object which would appear to be a lot easier than getting the stone
Spoiler for Al:
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Old 2009-07-22, 03:37   Link #112
Ziziphus
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Originally Posted by velvet nightmare View Post
in any case did ed really forget how he transmuted al? i can't remember if he told greed he forgot how
Ed remembered that very well, he just didn't want to tell Greed or anyone.
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Old 2009-07-22, 08:46   Link #113
Vicious108
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assuming he didnt, ed could 'technically' use someone else's body parts as equivalent exchange right? not sure if we're told how the armor guys in lab 5 were made. it assumes the person that created them has seen the truth so was it hohenheim?
You mean Slicer and Barry the Chopper? Why would Hohenheim help in making them?

And they obviously must've used one of their philosopher's stones as the fee for the human transmutation.
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Old 2009-07-22, 09:27   Link #114
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I'm not so sure...

Remember that Ed only gave up his body parts to:

#1: See the truth
#2: Retrieve Al's soul

The blood crest was an alchemic array that bounded Al's soul to the armor...

I don't think anything in particular needs to be sacrificed if you already have the soul and are just transferring it to a different body. You give up one body in exchange for the other, basically.
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Old 2009-07-22, 09:47   Link #115
Vicious108
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But it is still human transmutation, so for it to work they probably would have to see the truth first, and thus they'd be required to sacrifice something.
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Old 2009-07-22, 10:15   Link #116
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Endless:
Spoiler for Manga:
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Old 2009-07-22, 10:23   Link #117
velvet nightmare
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Endless Twilight View Post
You mean Slicer and Barry the Chopper? Why would Hohenheim help in making them?

And they obviously must've used one of their philosopher's stones as the fee for the human transmutation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Endless Twilight View Post
But it is still human transmutation, so for it to work they probably would have to see the truth first, and thus they'd be required to sacrifice something.
so which is it, it's either father or hohenheim if you need to see the truth

as far as i know, the stone allows you to bypass any exchange fees but do you need to have the knowledge to do the transmuting in the first place

ie, if a kid picks the stone, they wouldn't be able to do anything with it correct?
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Old 2009-07-22, 11:17   Link #118
Vicious108
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Yeah, of course you need the knowledge. And it's probable that that knowledge can only be obtained through seeing the truth.

So as Gaime said, it's likely that

Spoiler for Manga:
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Old 2009-07-22, 12:13   Link #119
velvet nightmare
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and another thing, why was all of al's body taken as exchange for seeing the truth compared to ed and their master who only lost a limb/organs?

also, is there a limit on how much a real philosopher's stone can be used? kind of like in the first series if you use it for something big enough it'll deplete it?
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Old 2009-07-22, 12:24   Link #120
Vicious108
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The first question is an unknown. It could be that the truth simply decided on its own to give Al more knowledge, and thus he had to pay the biggest fee for the equivalent exchange.

As for the second, a philosopher's stone can be used for as along as there are souls left in it. This is why homunculi eventually die after you continuously deplete their stone. When the number of souls reaches zero, the stone shatters.
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