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Old 2008-05-06, 13:28   Link #2441
Vexx
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No, not really --- KS just had trouble tuning out the "extra contaminants" so it ruined the enjoyability of the core show for him. For him, its just like someone took your Favorite Show and inserted product placement (always hold the can so the audience can see the label) and character's saying crap like "Mmmmmm, don't you just love McDonalds and their McPseudoChickenNuggets(tm)?"

Myself, I just spent more time grinding my teeth when they'd veer off. I don't mind anime-only storylines, but when they involve anime-only characters I just see time budget frittering (anime-tenchou...). I initially liked the L*C segment but after about 7 or 8 episodes it became more of a chore to watch than a joy and I saw it as simply "more L*S strips we won't see animated". On the other hand, I don't mind something like the "Initial D" moment in an early ep simply because they're demonstrating something taken from the comic (she drives like a maniac) and icing it with a reference. Konata is an otaku --- so she's going to be surrounding herself with otaku fad items. A person can completely not notice the references because they don't have to --- they just see that she's into "a bunch of otaku stuff". Many of those are more like "easter eggs" rather than distracting.
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Old 2008-05-06, 14:28   Link #2442
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembr View Post
So he's a fad fan, except he hates instead of appreciates.

But that's fine, a lot of the contents are hard to catch for folks over here.
Actually Lucky Star had a pretty good run with me until they eventually just seemed to give up on the social commentary side of things and just went with whatever they knew Otaku wanted to see. This is one of the only series I've ever seen where one episode would earn my respect with a 9/10 and follow it up with an episode that I received very poorly and gave a 2/10 too. Hit and Miss didn't really even begin to describe the show for me.
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Old 2008-05-06, 15:57   Link #2443
Rembr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
No, not really --- KS just had trouble tuning out the "extra contaminants" so it ruined the enjoyability of the core show for him. For him, its just like someone took your Favorite Show and inserted product placement (always hold the can so the audience can see the label) and character's saying crap like "Mmmmmm, don't you just love McDonalds and their McPseudoChickenNuggets(tm)?"

Myself, I just spent more time grinding my teeth when they'd veer off. I don't mind anime-only storylines, but when they involve anime-only characters I just see time budget frittering (anime-tenchou...). I initially liked the L*C segment but after about 7 or 8 episodes it became more of a chore to watch than a joy and I saw it as simply "more L*S strips we won't see animated". On the other hand, I don't mind something like the "Initial D" moment in an early ep simply because they're demonstrating something taken from the comic (she drives like a maniac) and icing it with a reference. Konata is an otaku --- so she's going to be surrounding herself with otaku fad items. A person can completely not notice the references because they don't have to --- they just see that she's into "a bunch of otaku stuff". Many of those are more like "easter eggs" rather than distracting.
Konata liking Haruhi or even having a character like tenchou within an anime like Lucky Star seems a lot more natural than an ancient-race green-haired girl with a funny name that has a fetish for Pizza Hut.

Would they have been more successful sales-wise without them?
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Old 2008-05-06, 16:01   Link #2444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembr View Post
Konata liking Haruhi or even having a character like tenchou within an anime like Lucky Star seems a lot more natural than an ancient-race green-haired girl with a funny name that has a fetish for Pizza Hut.
You can't compare apples and carrots much more than you can apples and oranges.

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Would they have been more successful sales-wise without them?
Likely not.
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Old 2008-05-06, 16:28   Link #2445
Rembr
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You can't compare apples and carrots much more than you can apples and oranges.
I'm just saying, the apple looks a lot redder than the orange.
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Old 2008-05-06, 16:36   Link #2446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembr View Post
I'm just saying, the apple looks a lot redder than the orange.
Not if we started comparing Granny Smiths to blood oranges.

Anyway, enough of that.
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Old 2008-05-06, 23:20   Link #2447
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembr View Post
Konata liking Haruhi or even having a character like tenchou within an anime like Lucky Star seems a lot more natural than an ancient-race green-haired girl with a funny name that has a fetish for Pizza Hut.

Would they have been more successful sales-wise without them?
Interestingly enough it's the exact same concern behind both of those placements. Think about that one for a second.

Also do I detect a hint of hatred instead of appreciation for another Kadokawa sponsored series?
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Old 2008-05-06, 23:43   Link #2448
AVPlaya
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Deepest Apologies

Perhaps not many of you would care, but I'm back on the forums. I used to post these random posts about each Lucky Star episode, but due to dramatic circumstances beyond my control, I have to drop everything for a while. So I had to stop all my work writing strange posts about random Japanese trivial relating to Lucky Star... to anyone who were reading them, 申し訳ございませんでした!

Hopefully one day in this life time I'll finish them.... or at least before Season II begins, then all that Tsundere love come rushing back and my nose start bleeding again.
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Old 2008-05-06, 23:56   Link #2449
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久し振り, AVPlaya.

And although there's no season 2, I'm certain you'd be interested in the upcoming OVA.
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Old 2008-05-07, 08:21   Link #2450
Kinny Riddle
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OMFG!

AVPlaya キタ━━━━(゚∀゚)

It is my utmost pleasure to welcome you back, sir. Now that you seem to have things sorted out your end. Now sit back and relax and await for Kagami-sama to return to melt our brains once again.
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Old 2008-05-07, 08:56   Link #2451
TinyRedLeaf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVPlaya
Perhaps not many of you would care, but I'm back on the forums. I used to post these random posts about each Lucky Star episode, but due to dramatic circumstances beyond my control, I have to drop everything for a while. So I had to stop all my work writing strange posts about random Japanese trivial relating to Lucky Star... to anyone who were reading them, 申し訳ございませんでした!

Hopefully one day in this life time I'll finish them.... or at least before Season II begins, then all that Tsundere love come rushing back and my nose start bleeding again.
Welcome back. You've been missed.
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Old 2008-05-07, 12:30   Link #2452
723
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I don't lie if a say that you are the main reason why I started to post in this thread ad quit posting when you did, AVPlaya...
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Old 2008-05-07, 18:53   Link #2453
Rembr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
Interestingly enough it's the exact same concern behind both of those placements. Think about that one for a second.

Also do I detect a hint of hatred instead of appreciation for another Kadokawa sponsored series?
I actually didn't mind either of the shows. In fact I appreciated them much more so than most shows without such sponsorship and/or deviation from the core story. And I am looking forward to the OVA.

Rather, I'm curious of people who hates those shows because of those aspects, to the point where they feel the need to explicitly or passive-aggressively show their disdain for those shows as if productive discussions can come out of it.
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Old 2008-05-07, 23:18   Link #2454
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rembr View Post
I actually didn't mind either of the shows. In fact I appreciated them much more so than most shows without such sponsorship and/or deviation from the core story. And I am looking forward to the OVA.

Rather, I'm curious of people who hates those shows because of those aspects, to the point where they feel the need to explicitly or passive-aggressively show their disdain for those shows as if productive discussions can come out of it.
That's a good question and I'm afraid I don't have an answer for you. I guess some people just have to.
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Old 2008-05-09, 05:42   Link #2455
Tabris
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Urk, I had an exam yesterday and instead of preparing for it properly, I ended up watching Lucky Star the entire night and morning before the exam.

You'd have thought all the talk about homework and revision would have made me think, oh yeah, I've got to do that too.
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Old 2008-05-09, 17:03   Link #2456
Lucky_Day
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Sadly, I have a number of procrastination rituals. If it wasn't World of Warcraft, or anime, or surfing the internet, it would just be something else. The 24 spoof in Lucky Star comes to mind.
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Old 2008-05-10, 12:56   Link #2457
Tabris
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Yeah, I know what you mean, it's really bad. But it can't be helped, it's so deeply rooted into myself

Sorry for the double post too, my internet was dying at the time it was posted and well, I didn't even know the post ever made it through once, nevermind twice D:

I've also gone to the point where I just ignore the Lucky Channel parts of the show now. They may be good, but I really can't be bothered with them and am perfectly content with the actual main portion of each episode
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Old 2008-05-10, 13:30   Link #2458
Dee Eon
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What Would A Kanata-Raised Konata Be Like??

Hi All!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
What do you think Konata would be like? Probably more serious and less of an otaku, but she'd still be her father's daughter. Maybe it'd be confined to fighting games and RPG rather than ero-games, though...

I think her mother would have encouraged her to play sports, even if the sports in question are martial arts. Maybe especially so. So she'd still be friends with Tsukasa and Kagami...

If her mother was successful in making her care about grades, she'd probably be even better than Kagami.
In lieu a "Character Topic" or anything more suitable I'm planting this here if it's alright.

Well, to imagine what a Kanata-raised Konata would've been like, it helps to understand her mom. Of course, it'd all be speculation since we know zit about Kanata's background and family, but borrowing from my feelings, family, friends, school, community service experiences and drawing from environmental hints from the series and Kanata;s own words and her mood uttering them, I think my summations wouldn't be too off base. These are my off-the-cuff assumptions and assessments (not fact!) not set in stone or certified. The fun's seeing how close you can get! I eat the flames!!

First, it will sound ironic, but Kanata (before Miyuki) is my fave Lucky Star character because she's a quaint and indelibly innocent but tragic figure and a kind of throwback to when Japanese women were expected to have an almost totally subservient and obliging attitude towards men. In a sense, she would've made a perfect geisha wife in another age, but it's not all bad marks against her. There a gentleness and polite tolerance to the faults and flaws of others in her that's sadly missing in today's world. I can't imagine her laughing at anyone's misfortune or passing up a beggar on the street. She seemed the type who sips life, not throws it down, and was very trusting of people - which might've been her greatest flaw.

By her demeanor, expression and dress, I imagine Kanata was mostly likely raised in a very traditional family in the country. I have the feeling she's been sheltered and never harshly challenged by city life. Her voice and words are so docile and forgiving that it makes Miyuki sound like Rosie O'Donnell. I'd hate to say Kanata was "weak willed" or cluelesly stupid, but rather raised extremely modest and naive to a fault in her pre-marrage years. Doubtlessly a lot of that would've come not only from her conservative ("pampered by sickness"?) upbringing but greatly from her frailty and stunted growth (apparently a hereditary defect); it would've been rough dating during high school if at all and I can imagine the peer teasing she got. That's two knocks against building self-esteem during the most critical years, so I'll sum that as a recipe for becoming withdrawn, which means you scarcely get a chance to hone your street-smarts and temper your spine. In that, I'll throw in that she had few if any friends in high school; if there were she would've been warned by their keener senses about Sōjirō or even put out of his target altogether by other boyfriends. That she likely had none to hide behind from Sōjirō's open season scope is kind of telling. Not to be stereotypical, but I think of Kanata as a naive farm girl who's been wooed by a silver-tongued city slicker with pedophile fantasies/designs.

I can't think of Kanata as being anything more than a high school grad shopgirl (not an office worker or co-ed) when Sōjirō spotted her (I also dispute his age when he first laid eyes on her; I think he was WAY older than the unconfirmed numbers Wiki gives us. Besides you can be someone's childhood friend without being a child yourself, right?). You really wouldn't want to associate yourself with a Sōjirō in real life. A lot of people minimize Sōjiro's loli inclinations, but I can tell you that there are jobs where just the notion of it can get you fired and you'd be persona non-grata at schools and churches and political meetings. Would you want one as the next door neighbor to your four to ten-year-olds? Even if all he does is peep it's creepy enough! If a daughter's dad caught her boyfriend (much less fiance!) ogling deep underage schoolgirls on the street like Sōjirō does in the OP, well, her butt's like beam me up Scotty as far as most dads goes. It seems Kanata's parents are either dead or AWOL during her engagement with Sōjirō because I'm sure they would've had a thing to say about that, so it suggests she was living alone at the time, making the bunny even more vulnerable to the wolf. What's worst is it seems she eventually senses Sōjirō's flakiness long before the first ring day, yet she's either too cow-eyed by being "respectfully" wooed by a guy or simply too timid to dump him. Or maybe love's not just blind but stone deaf too. She seems to go along with most anything Sōjirō asks of her (he even admits "dragging her around" somewhere) as though she's that proverbial ultra obliging girl who doesn't say "no" all the way up to the altar. You can sense in Kanata's voice in her hospital bed when she was holding Konata that she felt the end was coming and very overtly rued of Konata picking up Sōjirō traits like an omen. I sense she was in the midst of really wisening-up to what the implications of his idiosyncrasies meant for their child when she wouldn't be around to check him. (remember, we don't know the extent to which their "courtship" went, but I find it hard to believe Sōjirō long kept his pre-nupital paws off her). I think she would've been a little happier had Konata been a boy. Even her spiritual visitation in 22 isn't all that thrilled over the way Konata turned out - or Sōjirō's moves. Outside severe wife beating, I doubt Kanata would've summoned enough spine to go for a divorce, even if she had bad vibes of what might happen to Konata.

So what would Konata been like raised by Kanata had she made a "miraculous" recovery? Without any fan favoritism or any axe to grind, my gut feeling is that escaping death would've tempered Kanata some, made her more firm and "relatively" more assertive. Prompted by her dying frets of the effects of Sōjirō's unseemly proclivities on their child, I can see Kanata becoming even more protective - almost passionately so - of seeing that Konata doesn't end up as Sōjirō junior. Kanata will want to mold Konata more in her image but more worldly so as to avoid the grief her innocence received. It will be easier to do this in Japan than the U.S. because of the parental sex-role model expectancy is deeper there, so it'd be easier to keep Sōjirō at bay from her upbringing. I think we would see a crash self-education on Kanata's part to help advance Konata's intellect to make up for her height and self-esteem and play the same excessive mentor role Yukari had with Miyuki. I think Kanata will try to kill off as much Sōjirō-appearing "tomboy"traits in Konata as possible (why I nix even judo, hard video games and manga - as loathingly hinted in Kanata's Next Episode announcement in Ep 22) and cultivate her femininity by her doing civic services a'la Girl Scouts and such and even ending up in a “ladies’ school.” Yea, I know it sounds wild and very unKonata, but it's not Konata running the show here; it's Kanata, and she's going pump up as many of her virtues in Konata and prune Sōjirō's vices from affecting her as she can. Also, the late eighties of Konata's early youth was the time when human growth hormone became available to (U.S.) doctors and requested by parents, so it's not at all inconceivable Kanata would've given Konata this therapy (she's as bitter about her height as she was dismayed by Sōjirō's traits as she voiced in the hospital room). In fact, my gut says it's a slam dunk she would've requested it - not just to pump Konata's height and self-esteem and given her a more normal social life, but to also derail Sōjirō's pedophile fantasies or more.

So, when I imagine the Konata of a Kanata-reared universe, I think of a mixture of Miyuki and Kagami; as brainy, polite, refined (and willowy?) as Miyuki but without whose klutz and bad eyes and teeth, and as assertive and worldly as Kagami but more temper toned-down and athletic. (Actually, this wouldn't be such a bad character to create!)

Anyway IMHO! It was a fun away to burn a cab. Take care all!

Dee
"Kanata" Totally Dead??", "Kanata's Dream", "Kanata Thawed", "Miyuki's Spaced-Out Secret"

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Old 2008-05-10, 14:08   Link #2459
Anh_Minh
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I... don't have the same vision of her relationship with Soujirou as you do.

For one thing, I don't think an otaku like him would use the term "childhood friends" if they weren't childhood friends. They probably grew up together, so they're either both from the country, or both from the city.

I also think Soujirou's more outrageous hobbies (like photographing real little girls) came after his wife's death.

The visit made it look, to me, like she did have a soft spot for Soujirou. She was touched by his love for her, and was glad that he and Konata got along and played together (even as she was alarmed by what they were playing...) And the her comment after Konata's birth, as well, as Soujirou's tactic of "I became like that because you won't go out with me" make me think she never had a problem criticizing his otaku ways, but forgave him anyway.

All in all, I think that, as much as she couldn't say "no" to his pushiness, he couldn't say "no" to her either. It's not like he was totally dominating her.


I don't think Konata's tomboyishness would have bothered her. She wanted Konata to grow up strong and healthy, so sports would have been been great for that. Martial arts would have meant that as short as she was, Konata wouldn't lose to even tall men. I think Kanata'd be damn proud of Konata's taking down a full grown foreigner. Or at least, that she was able to do so. The fact it arose from a misunderstanding and Konata's impulsiveness would have been less thrilling.

But Kanata looked more serious than Soujirou, so she'd have been a lot more likely to put her foot down at Konata's laziness. So Konata's grades would be a lot better...
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Old 2008-05-14, 03:07   Link #2460
The Real Nemo
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So... Why is it that Kagami looks like a younger version of Asuna from Negima when she's actually older than her? Gah, it doesn't make any sense!
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