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Old 2007-04-12, 13:32   Link #841
Potatochobit
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Nana is definately a girl's show.

as for Moe, yeah, I also dont like it when they try to force Moe on characters. but some characters have true Moe like maybe Nanoha, Fate, and Vita from Nanoha A's, or Kozue from mahoraba, among others.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:33   Link #842
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That aside I'd like to talk about one of the things that bothers me about Kyoto Animation. There seeming need to have every product they do be as emasculating as possible. So if we start with the series that made them huge, Haruhi is loud a loud bossy teenager with breasts that seem to get more shapely with each passing episode, and the men, specifically Kyon the more normal and level headed male and Itsuki who is arguably as level headed are forced to submit to her will. Then we have Yuki who is arguably just as powerful as Haruhi and so yeah, the men are pathetic. Then we move to Kanon where all the girls are like unrealistic angels in terms of their nature and then we have the one male presence in the entire series in Yuuchi who I think has a good shot at winning the annual biggest douche in the universe award. So again Kyoto Animation attempts to show that men suck and we've got men are weak and douches, oh and apparentely always wrong. Then we move on to Lucky Star and I learn from Konata that Foreigners are evil and she proceeds to beat the crap out of a western male. So now we are not only apparently subordinate to women and douches, but now we are evil "Evil Male Gaijin" and need to be taught a lesson by lolis. So my question to Kyoto Animation is.... Why do you hate my demographic so damn much?
Hmm... well, I may be misunderstanding or completely missing your point, but aren't you confusing the work of the animators and the work of the writters/mangakas? Apart from adapting the story from its original media they have little to no hand in the actual content. Some may say that this makes for better adaptations, some may say that this just demonstrates that they don't have any imagination at all, but in either case I don't think you can't blame them for the story and characters of the series they animate. You could contest their taste for choosing series though ^_^
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:34   Link #843
DannoHung
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Hmm, thoughts: It was amusing, but also kinda boring.

The food gags in the first 8 minutes just didn't have really good punchlines. It's the first episode though, so I guess they were going for more "establish character personality" jokes than stuff that was actually supposed to be, y'know, funny.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:36   Link #844
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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Just to destroy the humor... the punch line is Kona doing a discussion loop about choco-cones at the end. Other parallels that come to mind are those rambling jokes George Burns would tell - minutes of mild disorientation while the listener wondered where the hell he was going and then a mild gag that would startle the listener and they'd laugh.
Humor is sometimes thought of as the "execution of the unexpected" that triggers the social bonding experience of shared discomfort release called laughter.

There, now I've killed the specimen and dissected it.
Excellent analysis of the scene. I think there is a bit of teasing the viewer going on here, playing upon the audience expectation that the scene is going to move on and instead it keeps going...until the conversation finally hits the full circle point. That's a really subtle form of humor as it depends partly on whether the audience knows it is being deliberately led on or not.

That said, I still think it's a fun conversation, and my roommate and I often have these kind of talks, so I really empathize.

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As I said, I really *liked* the a.f.k. translation work except for what I'll call "overtranslation" of the food, little of which is alien to anyone who has ever looked at a teriyaki bar menu (sukiyaki, yakitori, etc) (I notice they used "natto" rather than "fermented bean curd" though they used the term "parent child bowl" instead of the japanese term, it got kind of inconsistent). This is PURELY a personal preferential difference though.
Hm, haven't had a chance to look at the AFK version just yet (but am eager to do so), but I'm of a mixed mind on that issue. This is all strictly uber-IMHO, but I personally feel that foreign otaku ought to as a matter of course develop a good knowledge of Japanese cuisine...preferably first hand experience, but otherwise from context in manga, anime, and dorama. However, I know that Japanese food can be really, well, foreign to new fans in particular and even daunting or very "alien".

Generally speaking I think in these cases, the people familiar with the food in question will already know what it is, so beyond that, it's a matter of whether the translator wants to simplify to keep the flow, add liner notes (IMHO preferably after the program so as to not clutter text over the animation), or stick to the literal original "untranslated" names and leave it to the fans to look up the stuff they don't know on their own (wikipedia is your friend!). I think each approach has its own merit, really.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:38   Link #845
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingKnight View Post
Ok, this is going a bit offtopic, but this'll be my last post on the shoujo/seinen stuff.



Note the difference in the stereotypes of the design. Cardcaptor Sakura retains many of the classical shoujo stereotypes (sparkling eyes, wide-shoulder men, bishounen faces for most of men), and they touch subjects that most men (by market's standards) would find unappealing.
Hey, I like Cardcaptor Sakura so far. I've only seen about 3 episodes subbed, but I was quite amused at just how abusive she is to Touya (Such as routinely stomping on his foot or smashing his shins with her rollerblade). Oh and Tomoyo is also very very creepy in her obvious attraction to Sakura.

To me its all in what the material contains. It can be Shoujo and if its well done I'll like it and it can be Shounen Mecha action, but if its not well written then I won't even bother. Everything deserves a fair chance though. And yeah, hopefully that's the end of that subject.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:42   Link #846
cmage
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Originally Posted by Ayu-ayu View Post
Hm, haven't had a chance to look at the AFK version just yet (but am eager to do so), but I'm of a mixed mind on that issue. This is all strictly uber-IMHO, but I personally feel that foreign otaku ought to as a matter of course develop a good knowledge of Japanese cuisine...preferably first hand experience, but otherwise from context in manga, anime, and dorama. However, I know that Japanese food can be really, well, foreign to new fans in particular and even daunting or very "alien".

Generally speaking I think in these cases, the people familiar with the food in question will already know what it is, so beyond that, it's a matter of whether the translator wants to simplify to keep the flow, add liner notes (IMHO preferably after the program so as to not clutter text over the animation), or stick to the literal original "untranslated" names and leave it to the fans to look up the stuff they don't know on their own (wikipedia is your friend!). I think each approach has its own merit, really.
Even with the food names that were translated I was at a loss as to what they are. Unless I see a picture of the food or it shows up a lot in anime in general, I'll just know that the name's familiar and not know what they really are. As far as the humor during the food part, I thought it was amusing just how they were talking about food for so long. It's something like what I'd do with my friends. My sister, though, kept looking at her watch.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:42   Link #847
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semi-off-topic, but brief:
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Originally Posted by cmage View Post
Eh, I always thought NANA was josei....
That's how it feels to me, too, but the manga uses furigana (little characters indicating how the kanji are pronounced) so I guess it's shoujo. Josei manga don't tend to have them, since they're for an age group that is supposed to know how to pronounce most kanji. And it's published in Cookie, which I think is considered a shoujo manga magazine. Anyway, I think NANA the anime (haven't read much of the manga) is a masterpiece, no matter what age or gender it's aimed at.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:45   Link #848
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The funny thing about the food scene to me was how all the food they talk about appears in front of them, which is not very realistic if you think about it.

I wish a group would translate the web radio shows.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:47   Link #849
WanderingKnight
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Hey, I like Cardcaptor Sakura so far. I've only seen about 3 episodes subbed, but I was quite amused at just how abusive she is to Touya (Such as routinely stomping on his foot or smashing his shins with her rollerblade). Oh and Tomoyo is also very very creepy in her obvious attraction to Sakura.
That's why I said "by market's standards". Of course, I've enjoyed my share of shoujo stuff, too (and the CCS manga is a masterpiece in terms of stepping over the sexuality stereotypes of society). I certainly disagree with the intention of selecting a demographics based in gender, but that's how market works today.

PS: Damn, I'm still getting carried away by the offtopic. Last post, this was.
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Old 2007-04-12, 13:55   Link #850
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Originally Posted by Kyuusai View Post
Excellent!
I'm still wondering, though, how Lucky Channel is related to the rest of Lucky Star. Surely there had to be some pre-existing connection--maybe it's omake material in the Lucky Star manga, or the net show had scripts written by the manga author? Or are they totally unrelated and just an example of the amazing power of Japanese marketing?
Akira, Hikage, and a few other characters don't come out in the 4Koma itself until after the DS Game: Moe~ Drill was released (the game is a spoof off Brain Age). Minoru has yet to appear in the manga (well, actually upto Vol3... I haven't got my hands on 4 yet, and he's suppose to appear in the 4koma according to the Lucky Channel at some pt).

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Originally Posted by cmage View Post
Isn't there a man ogling school girls in the OP?
He's the one responsible for Kyo~da~i~n
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:09   Link #851
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I was about to say a few words about ccs myself. but its offtopic.
Watched a subbed version of Lucky star. I actually tried to watch it raw at first but couldnt understand much except for when they were discussing where's the head part.
liked everything here.
may i ask. will it be the only thread dedicated to the series? it would be nice to make a section in the current series part with episode discussion. after the end of kanon 2006 i feel a bit out of place
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:12   Link #852
cmage
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Originally Posted by nikorai View Post
may i ask. will it be the only thread dedicated to the series? it would be nice to make a section in the current series part with episode discussion. after the end of kanon 2006 i feel a bit out of place
It'll probably get its own forum if you give it a while. The fall shows got forums a few weeks after airing, right?
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:28   Link #853
Ashlotte
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Wow...Im amazed at how big this thread is with only one episode out.

Hah but that aside it was a pretty cute episode. The food bit at the start ill admit felt more then alittle weak, but by the end it felt like things were clicking more. I especially loved the LS Channel bit at the end.
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:37   Link #854
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Originally Posted by Kimichi View Post
Wow...Im amazed at how big this thread is with only one episode out.

Hah but that aside it was a pretty cute episode. The food bit at the start ill admit felt more then alittle weak, but by the end it felt like things were clicking more. I especially loved the LS Channel bit at the end.
It's probably because every Kyoto Animation show is an instant hit no matter what it is. They don't really have to do anything to begin with other than have their name on it, kind of like Bones and to a lesser extent Sunrise and and Gainax. The company honestly needs their own forum along with Sunrise, Gainax and BONES. I'm starting to wonder if that's how it should go from here on out. Just have a forum for each big company and empty it out once a year.

Really though its just me and a bunch of the same guys posting over and over again. If you look at it its actually only about 10-15 people posting all that frequently. Thank me for the long ass thread.
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:43   Link #855
cmage
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin_Sama View Post
It's probably because every Kyoto Animation show is an instant hit no matter what it is. They don't really have to do anything to begin with other than have their name on it, kind of like Bones and to a lesser extent Sunrise and and Gainax. The company honestly needs their own forum along with Sunrise, Gainax and BONES. I'm starting to wonder if that's how it should go from here on out. Just have a forum for each big company and empty it out once a year.
Not every Bones show is popular. Jyu Oh Sei and Ayakashi Ayashi didn't have many viewers, even if they were well animated. Though I do wonder sometimes why there aren't forums for the major animation studios. More often than not in KyoAni threads it gets off topic on the studio, just like now.
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:46   Link #856
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Originally Posted by cmage View Post
Not every Bones show is popular. Jyu Oh Sei and Ayakashi Ayashi didn't have many viewers, even if they were well animated. Though I do wonder sometimes why there aren't forums for the major animation studios. More often than not in KyoAni threads it gets off topic on the studio, just like now.
Well they are the best studio of all time so its no wonder.
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Old 2007-04-12, 14:54   Link #857
kenjiharima
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You know the saying these guys are now legends on their own right LOL
Just made this...

Spoiler for 4koma:
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Old 2007-04-12, 15:05   Link #858
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Originally Posted by Maids! Maids! Maids! View Post

You gotta be kidding me.....
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Old 2007-04-12, 15:07   Link #859
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Originally Posted by kenjiharima View Post
You know the saying these guys are now legends on their own right LOL
Just made this...

Spoiler for 4koma:
Where did those guys come from. God I hate that picture. That and the Galaxy Angel Rune thing that people keep doing. The former can be funny as it makes fun of the predictability of Otakus, but I can't stand to look at those same people anymore, and the later I never thought was funny at all. I can only assume that one was at one point used to make fun of mass produced Sugar Pop openings, but now they just use it for every new series that comes out. Then again this is all coming from my very bizarre and often jaded literal point of view.

@Blood Nightingale: I can virtually guarantee you that came from 2chan, its very original like the rest of the things that come from that board. That's another one I'm getting tired of. Of course the thing about meme pictures is that they are posted long after people stop laughing or caring, kind of like the Jon Benet and O.J Stories in your local supermarket tabloid.
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Old 2007-04-12, 15:09   Link #860
Shiroth
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Originally Posted by cmage View Post
Not every Bones show is popular. Jyu Oh Sei and Ayakashi Ayashi didn't have many viewers, even if they were well animated. Though I do wonder sometimes why there aren't forums for the major animation studios. More often than not in KyoAni threads it gets off topic on the studio, just like now.
Ayakashi Ayashi didn't have mass appeal. Still, it was a show i loved to pieces. As for Lucky Star, i think that any studio could get away with animated it, sure it looks pretty with Kyoani, though that doesn't make an adaptation from a 4-koma manga.
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