AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Nanoha

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-06-21, 14:39   Link #10061
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
Sein is gay for everyone, she touched them!
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 15:32   Link #10062
Kaijo
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.
Send a message via AIM to Kaijo Send a message via MSN to Kaijo
I don't care too much whether something is yuri or not, and I like to see more het subtext, but I have to admit there was quite a bit of yuri subtext between Vivio and Einhart. Not so much direct romantic interest (they are only 10!), but similar to what people saw between Nanoha and Fate.

I mean, seriously, you have a bunch of women taking a bath together and Sein groping everyone. Fanservice and Yuri all in one.
Kaijo is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 17:42   Link #10063
00-Raiser
Burst Mode
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Age: 27
Send a message via AIM to 00-Raiser
*Shrug* I look at Vivio and Einhart and see two people who just recently became friends. Vivio is enthusiastic and is perhaps trying too hard to be friendly, while Einhart is socially awkward and doesn't know how to handle such attention.

People can see subtext in anything if they want to. Oh look! I just patted my dog on the head! Beastiality subtext!

__________________
00-Raiser is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 17:45   Link #10064
Kaijo
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.
Send a message via AIM to Kaijo Send a message via MSN to Kaijo
Oh, I agree, a lot of it is what people choose to see. I should clarify my statement more as "if you saw yuri between Nanoha and Fate with S1 and A's, then you should see yuri between Vivio and Einhart."

Statistically speaking, there is a chance for it, but also a chance that it's not there. But it's kinda hard to say there's one and not the other.
Kaijo is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 17:55   Link #10065
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
its not there according to the writers, its there according to us, therefor we are all happy and angry at the same time (well some companies are more angry, like lucas arts declaring there are no homosexuals in KotOR or something)
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 19:18   Link #10066
Kaijo
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow, in a house dropped on an ugly, old woman.
Send a message via AIM to Kaijo Send a message via MSN to Kaijo
Heh, one thing I've learned as a writer, is that the audience will always see things that I didn't intend. And usually they're right. Some writers get really upset that the audience picks up themes that are different that what they intended.

I'm perfectly happy saying that I don't see any yuri between Nanoha and Fate, Vivio and Einhart, and that it's all friendship. But I can admit that I *do* see how people could draw that conclusion.
Kaijo is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 20:23   Link #10067
RadiantBeam
Test Drive
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: USA
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to RadiantBeam Send a message via Skype™ to RadiantBeam
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
I'm perfectly happy saying that I don't see any yuri between Nanoha and Fate, Vivio and Einhart, and that it's all friendship. But I can admit that I *do* see how people could draw that conclusion.
Fan 1: They're in the same room together! It's love, I tell you!

Fan 2: They looked at each other, they looked at each other! They totally want to jump each other's bones!
__________________
RadiantBeam is offline  
Old 2010-06-21, 20:32   Link #10068
Rising Dragon
Goat Herder
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The middle of the Middle of Nowhere
Age: 27
Personally, I think the highest point of possible subtext that I found was between Einhart and Vivio during the tenth chapter, just after Einhart told Vivio about the memories of the war she had. The way Einhart was fretting about how she had made her sad and silent felt like it had the signs of "awkward first date" written all over it.

I don't consider the bit with Sein as subtext so much as I would consider it grab-ass.
__________________
Rising Dragon is online now  
Old 2010-06-21, 21:51   Link #10069
Lord Pertinax
Word Bearers Kommandant
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Cuernavaca, Morelos. Mexico.
Quote:
Originally Posted by itanshi1 View Post
Sein is gay for everyone, she touched them!
That's why she's one of my heroes
__________________
"There is no hope. Just a Galaxy feeded by death, missery, pain and suffering...and of course, the laught of the Dark Gods.".-Kor Phaeron, Master of Faith.

"For each hero's song thousands die alone, unsung and unremembered." Anonymous.
Lord Pertinax is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 00:45   Link #10070
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00-Raiser View Post
*Shrug* I look at Vivio and Einhart and see two people who just recently became friends. Vivio is enthusiastic and is perhaps trying too hard to be friendly, while Einhart is socially awkward and doesn't know how to handle such attention.

People can see subtext in anything if they want to. Oh look! I just patted my dog on the head! Beastiality subtext!

I pity the dog . Yeah, fans can see subtext everywhere, even the most impossible ones. What makes me wary is those who see subtext among grade schoolers

What magazine publishes Vivid, anyway? I'm pretty sure its not a shounen one . Did Wings of Yuri dropped this series because it got a little more shounen-ish?
__________________

Last edited by Tiresias; 2010-06-22 at 02:30.
Tiresias is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 01:35   Link #10071
Akiyoshi
The Flame Crussader
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
About ViVid iv'e already read 7 episodes so far(i lost interest but you posted about parts that sounds interesting like a match between teams or something), and yeah, i undertand that some people can see yuri context but, at this point at least, it won't be manage seriously like that. It's more like a complicated close friendship in progress, sure, Einhart has memories and feelings from her Kaiser persona, but that are Hegemon's not hers, because of that memories she was involved whith Vivio and is intrigued by her optimism and humility in spite of being weak(or at least weaker than she is), also has a little hard time dealing with Vivio's kindness towards her because she don't know how to respond to these feelings, it's seem for moments that she's annoyed by the Takamachi girl behavior but also admired of her determination.

If rivarlious at times, their friendship is developing step by step, and pretty much they going to be great trusthfull friends. It reminds me vaguely of Sakura and Syaoran relationship on CCS season 1(with bits of Tomoyo included). I think that an important plot point is how Einhart comprehends that his friendship with ViVio is developing because of her own feelings, not Ingvalt's.

besides, someone knows where i can find "FORCE Dimension" and "Nanoha REBUILD" supplementary materials xD?
Akiyoshi is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 02:21   Link #10072
Dri
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Canada/Montreal
Send a message via AIM to Dri
Suddenly I surface to backtrack the conversation to when people said Signum dying would be bad writing.

Whether or not you consider her death to be bad writing (and for all intents and purposes, if it's not bad writing, it is at least the author not being fair to his fans), it has accomplished what it was meant to.

Each and every one of us wants to see the next chapter to see what they do with Signum. Whether we want her to die to advance the story and the mood, or for her to survive and return with the flames of revenge.

The effect may not be so obvious here, where we download the comics for free, but in Japan, the effect is probably noticeable: everyone's talking about Signum, sales are going up, and the sales for the next volume? Will skyrocket.

The endgame here is that the author has been successful in rousing his audience and creating emotion and feeling in them. If you so much as thought anything of Signum's state, then you've let a work of fiction alter your emotions. And that's what authors strive to do.

So maybe it's bad writing; maybe it's not.

But it made you react, which means it did its job.
Dri is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 02:23   Link #10073
Demi.
Ass connoisseur
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Florida
Age: 28
I'm just surprised some people consider the possibility of Signum dieing. I for one, know it won't happen, lol.
__________________
Demi. is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 02:55   Link #10074
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
o.o but that makes it more likely
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 02:58   Link #10075
Tiresias
Labda Prakarsa Nirwikara
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Pekanbaru (UTC+07:00)
Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Demi. View Post
I'm just surprised some people consider the possibility of Signum dieing. I for one, know it won't happen, lol.
Hey, I kinda actually envy them; They're not genre savvy enough that it would ruin their lives
__________________
Tiresias is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 03:01   Link #10076
Akiyoshi
The Flame Crussader
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dri View Post
So maybe it's bad writing; maybe it's not.

But it made you react, which means it did its job.
You have your mouth filled with reason mister.

Whenever the result is, that move on the story has caused some kind of reaction on a large portion of the fanbase, maybe positive, maybe negative(that's me xD!), i think Signum is moderatly popular with the occidental fanbase but i don't know how popular she's in japan, at first i was thinking she's not very popular because how she's treated in the plot(less screentime, low battle record, etc...) and by how people are always talking about Nanoha and Fate ....or Vita for that matter. As much as i love Signum, i must admit that she lacks some of the traits that made her comrades so stunningly popular(lolis, subtext, Crowning moments of Awesome, backstory, strong love interest to fight for), but then it came the StrikerS Special Chapter showing her going toe to toe with the White Devil herself, it gave me the feeling that she gained some respect and popularity among japanese fans, then came FORCE EP.7 and after seeing how quickly they disposse of her i think again that meybe she's not so popular after all if she was chosen to be smashed so soon in the story, and then i read your post and realized that maybe she's indeed popular enough and this move is made to messing with the audience's feelings.

So yeah, this event devastates me and made me angry, but after finally relaxing a little(it takes me about 3 or 4 days to stop feeling frustration xDU) and realizing that my opinion has little to no effect on what the writers will do i finally came to my senses and feel comforted that at least, this course of events means that Signum is a beloved and popular character on the franchise and the authors acknowledge that(not in the way a character normally deserves but they acknowledge at least xDU).

....and i repost the question of my last post, has anyone know of a site where i can read/download "FORCE Dimension" and "Nanoha REBUILD" supplementals o.o?
Akiyoshi is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 03:02   Link #10077
itanshi1
Writer, Jester, MtG nerd
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Nanoha Used Car Dealership. RERISE!
Send a message via AIM to itanshi1 Send a message via MSN to itanshi1
well in one week we'll know better
__________________
For those that belittle their favorite characters, complain about pairings, complain about oversexed images. Stop, thank you.

Fear Anxiety Doubt is but a fad. The life of a fad depends entirely on the willingness to support it. Difficulty is a choice. Determination is a path. Your next great idea after your destination is the true goal.
itanshi1 is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 06:43   Link #10078
prescience
Friendly Satanist
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaijo View Post
I'm perfectly happy saying that I don't see any yuri between Nanoha and Fate, Vivio and Einhart, and that it's all friendship. But I can admit that I *do* see how people could draw that conclusion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RadiantBeam View Post
Fan 1: They're in the same room together! It's love, I tell you!

Fan 2: They looked at each other, they looked at each other! They totally want to jump each other's bones!
"Two girls within spitting distance of each other? They must be gay!"

The trouble, of course, is when fans forget that they are in fact exaggerating what's there (or seeing something that's not there at all). But to assume that something is true just because you want it to be true is all too human a mistake...

(EDIT: Which isn't to say that all yuri that isn't clearly and unambiguously canonical is a figment of overenthusiastic shippers' imaginations. I *do* see yuri between Nanoha and Fate, but I accept that other people do see it differently)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
What magazine publishes Vivid, anyway? I'm pretty sure its not a shounen one . Did Wings of Yuri dropped this series because it got a little more shounen-ish?
Comp Ace, a bishoujo seinen magazine. Hence the high fanservice levels >_<

Wings of Yuri haven't officially said that they're dropping the series (that I'm aware of, anyway), but in the post for chapter 12, Winterbraid said that he (she?) wasn't finding the story very interesting anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
besides, someone knows where i can find "FORCE Dimension" and "Nanoha REBUILD" supplementary materials xD?
As far as I know, only the first Force Dimension chapter has been translated, and I haven't even seen raws of anything past chapter 2. A cursory google didn't turn up any English explanations of what Nanoha Rebuild is, except the TVTropes Nanoha page (which seems to have confused it with Force NEXT). Anyone here knows what it's about?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dri View Post
Suddenly I surface to backtrack the conversation to when people said Signum dying would be bad writing.

Whether or not you consider her death to be bad writing (and for all intents and purposes, if it's not bad writing, it is at least the author not being fair to his fans), it has accomplished what it was meant to.

Each and every one of us wants to see the next chapter to see what they do with Signum. Whether we want her to die to advance the story and the mood, or for her to survive and return with the flames of revenge.

The effect may not be so obvious here, where we download the comics for free, but in Japan, the effect is probably noticeable: everyone's talking about Signum, sales are going up, and the sales for the next volume? Will skyrocket.

The endgame here is that the author has been successful in rousing his audience and creating emotion and feeling in them. If you so much as thought anything of Signum's state, then you've let a work of fiction alter your emotions. And that's what authors strive to do.

So maybe it's bad writing; maybe it's not.

But it made you react, which means it did its job.
Well said. Of course, the issue with writing the story to boost your sales is that the author is less likely to actually kill off well-liked characters, which could lead to it becoming a habit to nearly kill characters off, only for them to miraculously survive. And that would be bad writing. But there's no point in speculating that far down the line, I guess...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
i think Signum is moderatly popular with the occidental fanbase but i don't know how popular she's in japan
I wonder. Someone posted a Japanese character popularity poll somewhere on this forum quite a while ago. Maybe I should start digging...

Quote:
Originally Posted by itanshi1 View Post
well in one week we'll know better
I hope so. Let's pray that they don't leave us on a horrible cliffhanger about Signum's fate.

Last edited by prescience; 2010-06-22 at 06:54.
prescience is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 06:46   Link #10079
00-Raiser
Burst Mode
*Author
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Windsor, Ontario
Age: 27
Send a message via AIM to 00-Raiser
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akiyoshi View Post
....and i repost the question of my last post, has anyone know of a site where i can read/download "FORCE Dimension" and "Nanoha REBUILD" supplementals o.o?
'Nanoha REBUILD' was renamed to Force Next, which has 3 images that have been posted. Force Dimension is a 4koma, with the first installment tranlated.

Is anyone planning on doing the 2nd one? If I could get a translation I'd do the editing myself.

Page claim for half-ninja'd!
__________________
00-Raiser is offline  
Old 2010-06-22, 09:59   Link #10080
Koveras Alvane
Mastermind Rational
*Author
 
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Karlsruhe, Germany
Age: 28
Send a message via ICQ to Koveras Alvane Send a message via MSN to Koveras Alvane
Quote:
Originally Posted by 00-Raiser View Post
*Shrug* I look at Vivio and Einhart and see two people who just recently became friends. Vivio is enthusiastic and is perhaps trying too hard to be friendly, while Einhart is socially awkward and doesn't know how to handle such attention.

People can see subtext in anything if they want to. Oh look! I just patted my dog on the head! Beastiality subtext!

Unfortunately, too many people treat Freud's teachings as universal and go overboard with it. ^^

That said, I do ship NanoFate and will ship ViviEin when it leaves the dry dock. :P This has less to do with me being a yuri fan and more with the respective pair's mutual emotional compatibility. There are just some people who fit each other perfectly and those four are two such pairs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RadiantBeam View Post
Fan 1: They're in the same room together! It's love, I tell you!

Fan 2: They looked at each other, they looked at each other! They totally want to jump each other's bones!
Quote:
Originally Posted by prescience View Post
"Two girls within spitting distance of each other? They must be gay!"
Yes, the Spitting Distance Rule. There's also Yuri Goggles™.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dri View Post
But it made you react, which means it did its job.
Disregarding the fact that doing things like that is plain cruelty towards the fans, I consider declaring the manga non-canon (at least, for myself) and dropping it, if Signum dies. Would do so even more readily if I actually paid for it. Boosting the sales for one chapter at the expense of at least a fraction of the readership dropping all the following ones is not a particularly effective business plan...

Quote:
Originally Posted by prescience View Post
I hope so. Let's pray that they don't leave us on a horrible cliffhanger about Signum's fate.
Heh, I remember the ending of Dreamfall, which concluded with one protagonist presumed dead, another about to be executed, and the third in coma. It's been four years since then and no news... It doesn't help any that the presumably ex-protagonist was female and stabbed in the stomach.
__________________
Koveras Alvane is offline  
Closed Thread

Tags
adventure, manga, nanoha, seinen

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 17:46.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.