AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2007-10-22, 01:26   Link #161
Aoie_Emesai
♪♫ Maya Iincho ♩♬
*Artist
 
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Unnecessary
Age: 28
Send a message via Yahoo to Aoie_Emesai
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taliesin View Post
Yup only 2 eps l;eft to go. I wasnt overly impressed with the series to be honest, After watching the first episode i kind of had hopes for the series, but it went in a totally different direction. Not sure if its good or bad lol, but it wasnt what i was hoping for
I wasn't too impressed with the anime myself, but like some of the post said. I loved how the music was blended with the anime itself, so that's why I got it. I sorta wish I could read Japanese now >.< (Rosettta Stone SUCKS!, I don't know how anyone can learn from that, my Japanese Grammar book works better ^_^)
__________________

How to Give / Receive Criticism on your work / Like to draw? Come join Artists Alike
Visit my Deviantart Or Blog ~A Child should always surpass his/her parent, Remember.
Aoie_Emesai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-22, 07:21   Link #162
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinji103 View Post
On a related note, I was wondering about where the heck the White and Black games are. I have played this one, which I believe is Crimson, but I can't find Black or White. But is this supposed to be it?
Hmm yeah I was confused in the beginning as well. Ok I'll get this straight for you once and for all... to my utmost understanding. May or may not be accurate.

The game you played first is the PS2 version of Shinkyoku Crimson episode 1 and 2. The other link is episode 3 and 4. All 4 episodes make up the whole of the Crimson game. So far only the Crimson game is ported to PS2, so if you are looking for PS2 games of Black and White, you are looking at the wrong place.

This is the Japanese official page for the Black PC game. And this is the Japanese official page for the White PC game.


Below are short descriptions of the games in order:

Crimson:
4 episodes. The "Student Arc" story that reveals how Corti and Phoron got together. The first of the Polyphonica kinetic novel series written by Sakaki Ichirou of Scrapped Princess fame.

Black:
2 episodes so far. The story of Managa and Machiya. The events of Black and Crimson happen in the same timeline and same country, so the Black protagonists will be seeing a lot of the Crimson protagonists as cameos. I haven't really played the Black games yet (although it's rotting in a box at home).

White:
2 episodes. The story of Blanca and Snow Drop. White story is set thousands of years ago in the past, so it's more about the previous civilization of their world. Since spirits have very long lifespans, we still get to see Blanca and Snow Drop in present time.

Anime:
Actually I haven't really finished it, but from what I see, all 3 game protagonists will be showing up in it but the main focus is still on Crimson. The anime is set during the "Jobholder Arc" of the Crimson series. It's called so because Phoron has graduated and is working in society with Corti at his side.

As to Phoron and Corti's relationship... I believe they are more like "Loving Master and Devoted Servant" where the roles switch every now and then. They are emotionally close to being lovers, but physically I'm not sure.
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-22, 16:20   Link #163
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Yea...pretty good premises, and I was waiting for the whole Crimson Annihilator background to be expounded on, going the typical, but still interesting route, of coming into terms with her more destructive personality and all...but...that disappeared entirely after like the 3rd episode. In the end, the series just didn't have an overarching plot at all, which was disappointing considering how much potential there was in a character like Corti.

I heard that the producer(?) died midway through though - maybe that had something to do with it?
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-22, 19:52   Link #164
FlareKnight
User of the "Fast Draw"
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Age: 28
Send a message via AIM to FlareKnight Send a message via MSN to FlareKnight
Well thought it wouldn't be bad to comment as I run through 9-12.

Guess Phoron like anybody hits a slump now and then. Get a lot of time with Corti trying to solve things and get to understand some of her feelings with Phoron. Again with questions of two groups being different with humans and spirits and the understanding that they try to reach between the two sides.

On the series itself. Certainly came into it not knowing what to expect at all. Was surprised later on concerning how much else there is to it and the background behind that. It's a tight bond between Phoron and Corti. Emotionally tight but not quite at the point of lovers yet though you can feel it could go there in the relative future.
__________________
FlareKnight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-22, 20:00   Link #165
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Corti wasn't bad, but I felt Phoron was kind of...weak.

Throughout most of the series, he never really got any development. I mean, yea, we know he has a pretty good bond with Corti, and there was a little episode about how he was reunited with Corti, but other than that he's a nice guy with a good commandia, he has absolutely no development for...10 episodes out of 12!

The slump was...interesting...in a way, but it never really went anywhere. Really the episode was more about Corti than Phoron, which was a bit of a waste of such a good opportunity to flesh him out a bit more.

What really got me annoyed was at the end where Phoron starts going, "what if we never met, this would never have happened..if only this...if only that...if only spirits and humans..blah blah"...
What kind of weak character starts indulging in "what ifs"? This sort of behavior is almost acceptable (only in fantasy ) at the beginning of a series as the character has time to mature - not in the very last episode.
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-22, 20:21   Link #166
FlareKnight
User of the "Fast Draw"
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Age: 28
Send a message via AIM to FlareKnight Send a message via MSN to FlareKnight
A good point that Phoron felt kind've static. Didn't feel a lot of change concerning him through the series. Even episode 9 and the slump was about Corti and her dealing with her feelings. Phoron just kind've found a new song without all that much going on.

With episode 10. I'm a little lost on the big deal with why Mailreit didn't say the sister was already dead. Unless the sister set the fire why say nothing all that time? Though why she didn't grab the orchestra and the body was odd. She seems pretty strong to handle both. They have this guy as the enemy and I just never understood it.

Tossing in 11 and 12. They did deal with a plot to cause hell with a berserk spirit. But still felt like just another mission and not a conclusion to a whole series. At the end they are all there. Toss in some cameos for characters who appeared in earlier episodes and that is about all. Agree Phoron and his mutterings about spirits and humans and if they had never met stuff seemed poorly placed there. No point indulging in that stuff there. This wasn`t a bad series by any stretch. But it could have been a lot better and just didn't do the things necessary for that.
__________________

Last edited by FlareKnight; 2007-10-22 at 21:55.
FlareKnight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 04:19   Link #167
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by taelrak View Post
Corti wasn't bad, but I felt Phoron was kind of...weak.

Throughout most of the series, he never really got any development. I mean, yea, we know he has a pretty good bond with Corti, and there was a little episode about how he was reunited with Corti, but other than that he's a nice guy with a good commandia, he has absolutely no development for...10 episodes out of 12!

The slump was...interesting...in a way, but it never really went anywhere. Really the episode was more about Corti than Phoron, which was a bit of a waste of such a good opportunity to flesh him out a bit more.

What really got me annoyed was at the end where Phoron starts going, "what if we never met, this would never have happened..if only this...if only that...if only spirits and humans..blah blah"...
What kind of weak character starts indulging in "what ifs"? This sort of behavior is almost acceptable (only in fantasy ) at the beginning of a series as the character has time to mature - not in the very last episode.
Well like I said, the anime is more for fans of the original games and novels than new viewers to the series. Whatever character development there is has already been done in the games. If the anime was supposed to be a adaptation of the games then I agree it's shoddy but apparently it's more of a sequel. Something like FF7AC where you have to play the game first to really 'appreciate' its plot (or lack there of).

If you think Phoron is weak in the anime... then Phoron in the game is worse. But Phoron and Corti really went through a lot to be together in the game and when he kicks ass, he really kicks ass. But most of the time he's just spineless and very laid back with Corti prodding him along the way. Well according to some comments from the Japanese, the anime is quite a disappointment to the fans of the games. I haven't finish watching the anime yet, but all that "What-ifs" have always been bugging Phoron throughout the games.
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 08:06   Link #168
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
How did Corti get sealed beneath the school anyway?
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 10:49   Link #169
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by taelrak View Post
How did Corti get sealed beneath the school anyway?
To be honest, I only skimmed through a few eps of the anime, so I don't really know what goes in the anime.

But here's a little summary of the premise for the game.
Spoiler for game spoilers:
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 11:07   Link #170
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Interesting. Thanks for the summary! Whatever happened to Reitos and Aleindus?
Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
To be honest, I only skimmed through a few eps of the anime, so I don't really know what goes in the anime.

But here's a little summary of the premise for the game.
Spoiler for game spoilers:
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 18:45   Link #171
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by taelrak View Post
Interesting. Thanks for the summary! Whatever happened to Reitos and Aleindus?
Erm, here's more background info.

Spoiler for more game spoilers:
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-23, 19:21   Link #172
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
Erm, here's more background info.

Spoiler for more game spoilers:
Thanks. I really wish the anime would've gotten into any of that at all - that would've made it a story worth telling. I guess being geared towards people who already played the games, the isolated side-story episodes would've been a nice "extra" since they didn't interfere with the plot at all, but still...
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 03:15   Link #173
jtrog
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Texas
Age: 51
The anime series of this opened a few new doors with-in the mind. The stark beauty Corti gave out and with the story of how humans and spirits had joined to work together sparked the interest and allowed for the story to continue. The concept of the small music player and phorons surround sound motorcycle sticks in the mind too. .

I bought a japanese ps2, this video novel and playing the game took a while to listen to them all but I did finish it. At one point towards the end something happened between Corti and a ratcoon-bear like 'creature spirit' that was for me really funny. I do not however know what it was since I cannot read it. I do know that I spent about 2 days making a story in my mind about what exactly happened at that moment however. ROFL.

I really enjoyed both the game and the animated show.
__________________
Whatever you do.... don't sit in the last seat by the window in class in Japan or you will become a Anime lead character!
jtrog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 09:57   Link #174
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Well here're some in-game screenshots and some crappy scans i made from the official fanbook.

As the book was kinda thick, I could only scan whatever I could without trying to destroy my precious book :P

Also may Not be Safe For Work.

Spoiler for some NSFW pics:
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 11:03   Link #175
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
So how much of a spirit's power comes from their own innate abilities, and how much from the Dantist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
Well here're some in-game screenshots and some crappy scans i made from the official fanbook.

As the book was kinda thick, I could only scan whatever I could without trying to destroy my precious book :P

Also may Not be Safe For Work.

Spoiler for some NSFW pics:
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 20:16   Link #176
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by taelrak View Post
So how much of a spirit's power comes from their own innate abilities, and how much from the Dantist?
Hmm alright, I'll talk a little bit about the concept behind spirits. This is from whatever I can remember and some help from the Japanese Wiki.

Spirits are part of the natural world that are capable of possessing intelligence. They are usually referred to as "Humanity's Kind Neighbors". The names they have come in 3 parts: Name, Pillar Name and Spiritual Name. For example Corti's full name is Corticarte (Name) Aba (Pillar) Lagranges (Spirit).

They come in all sorts of sizes and shapes, but they all have pairs of wings. Thus spirits are categorized according to the number of wings they possess.
Spirits with 2 wings are Lower Class Spirits, 4 wings are Middle Class Spirits and 6 Wings are Upper Class Spirits. However the class does not equate to strength as spirits in each class come under a broad spectrum of strength and ability. Spirits also can hide their wings whenever they want, so there are many spirits who live amongst the humans.

There are also general categories of spirits according to the form in which they appear. Humanoid spirits are termed as "Humanbic", Animal type spirits are called "Berst" and spirits that are half human, half beast in form are termed "Lycantra". So Corti is under the Humanbic category.

Finally there are the "Ancestor Spirits". These 8 spirits possess the powers of creation and were said to be created when the God of Creation "Souseigami" created the world. These "God Spirits" come in the form of 6-winged females but they each possess far more power than the normal Upper Class spirits. Apparently the eight god spirits are identified by colors, like Corti is "Crimson", Aleindus is "Emerald" and Snow Drop is "White". Ancestor Spirits that have not died since the beginning are called "Originals" as they are the origins of spirits. Corti is known to be an "Original", in fact she could be the only one. Snow Drop is not an "Original" as she is the 2nd "White Goddess". I'm not sure about Aleindus.

Each Ancestor Spirit has a guardian spirit called the "Saint Beast". Saint Beasts usually are in the "Berst" form but they can transform into the "Humanbic" Male form. They are able to die and reincarnate with their previous lives' memories. This is so that they can forever guard their Ancestor Spirits. Blanca is the Saint Beast of Snow Drop. However Corti does not seem to have a Saint Beast, and I can't recall why.

The God of Creation "Souseigami" is also known as "Genesist". He/she is portrayed as a four headed, 8 armed being with 8 wings. According to legends, Souseigami and his 8 Ancestor Spirits created the world with the World Instruments. It was also said when an Ancestor Spirit, the World Instruments and the "Commandia of Creation" are gathered, the world can be "re-tuned". And this legend is the premise for the game.

And finally, the relationship between Dantist and Spirit.
Commandia was originally the symphony that the God of Creation used to created the world with music. Nowadays it's referred to as the music Dantists play to provide their spirits with energy.
The playing of Commandia is the way of conversing between Dantist and Spirit. How the Dantist conveys his emotions and feelings to the Spirit depends on how he performs his Commandia.

Unfortunately, spirits originally do not need Dantists nor Commandia. But ever since the first human played his first tune, the spirits found something that touched their hearts and souls. Music is like an addiction to spirits. Although a Commandia allows spirits to be energized, causes spirits to be ecstatic, but it does not come without side effects. As with all addictions, spirits cannot live without supplementing their being with music. Once that source of addiction is gone, the Commandia starved Spirit will go berserk and eventually fade out of existence. Low level spirits are attracted to any good Commandia but the higher level spirits are picky and they prefer to stick to one Dantist and his Commandia.

Man that was a long post... anyway I can't really give u a straight answer but I think u can deduce from above.
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 20:30   Link #177
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
Hmm alright, I'll talk a little bit about the concept behind spirits. This is from whatever I can remember and some help from the Japanese Wiki.

Spirits are part of the natural world that are capable of possessing intelligence. They are usually referred to as "Humanity's Kind Neighbors". The names they have come in 3 parts: Name, Pillar Name and Spiritual Name. For example Corti's full name is Corticarte (Name) Aba (Pillar) Lagranges (Spirit).

They come in all sorts of sizes and shapes, but they all have pairs of wings. Thus spirits are categorized according to the number of wings they possess.
Spirits with 2 wings are Lower Class Spirits, 4 wings are Middle Class Spirits and 6 Wings are Upper Class Spirits. However the class does not equate to strength as spirits in each class come under a broad spectrum of strength and ability. Spirits also can hide their wings whenever they want, so there are many spirits who live amongst the humans.

There are also general categories of spirits according to the form in which they appear. Humanoid spirits are termed as "Humanbic", Animal type spirits are called "Berst" and spirits that are half human, half beast in form are termed "Lycantra". So Corti is under the Humanbic category.

Finally there are the "Ancestor Spirits". These 8 spirits possess the powers of creation and were said to be created when the God of Creation "Souseigami" created the world. These "God Spirits" come in the form of 6-winged females but they each possess far more power than the normal Upper Class spirits. Apparently the eight god spirits are identified by colors, like Corti is "Crimson", Aleindus is "Emerald" and Snow Drop is "White". Ancestor Spirits that have not died since the beginning are called "Originals" as they are the origins of spirits. Corti is known to be an "Original", in fact she could be the only one. Snow Drop is not an "Original" as she is the 2nd "White Goddess". I'm not sure about Aleindus.

Each Ancestor Spirit has a guardian spirit called the "Saint Beast". Saint Beasts usually are in the "Berst" form but they can transform into the "Humanbic" Male form. They are able to die and reincarnate with their previous lives' memories. This is so that they can forever guard their Ancestor Spirits. Blanca is the Saint Beast of Snow Drop. However Corti does not seem to have a Saint Beast, and I can't recall why.

The God of Creation "Souseigami" is also known as "Genesist". He/she is portrayed as a four headed, 8 armed being with 8 wings. According to legends, Souseigami and his 8 Ancestor Spirits created the world with the World Instruments. It was also said when an Ancestor Spirit, the World Instruments and the "Commandia of Creation" are gathered, the world can be "re-tuned". And this legend is the premise for the game.

And finally, the relationship between Dantist and Spirit.
Commandia was originally the symphony that the God of Creation used to created the world with music. Nowadays it's referred to as the music Dantists play to provide their spirits with energy.
The playing of Commandia is the way of conversing between Dantist and Spirit. How the Dantist conveys his emotions and feelings to the Spirit depends on how he performs his Commandia.

Unfortunately, spirits originally do not need Dantists nor Commandia. But ever since the first human played his first tune, the spirits found something that touched their hearts and souls. Music is like an addiction to spirits. Although a Commandia allows spirits to be energized, causes spirits to be ecstatic, but it does not come without side effects. As with all addictions, spirits cannot live without supplementing their being with music. Once that source of addiction is gone, the Commandia starved Spirit will go berserk and eventually fade out of existence. Low level spirits are attracted to any good Commandia but the higher level spirits are picky and they prefer to stick to one Dantist and his Commandia.

Man that was a long post... anyway I can't really give u a straight answer but I think u can deduce from above.
So in theory, if you created a dissonant enough Commandia, you could basically repel or really mess up the spirits? Sounds fun

So I wonder if you can rehabilitate Spirits then? Obviously from the above, stopping cold turkey doesn't seem to work, but if you lower the dosage little by little?

Or on the other hand, what if you flood them with it excessively and increase their tolerance? Can you OD them?
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 20:35   Link #178
relentlessflame
 
*Administrator
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Age: 32
Thanks for all the information by the way, musashiken. It confirms what I've always felt about this show -- the concept and mythology is very interesting, and the biggest regret about the TV series is quite simply that it's too short to get into it in detail. It gives you a taste of the world and story, and introduces you to the characters (who I really liked), but mostly makes me interested in reading the novels and/or playing the visual novels so I can learn more. It's a good show and concept, but needs to be about 4 times as long to flesh it out.
relentlessflame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 20:40   Link #179
musashiken
ニア ☆ 命
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by taelrak View Post
So in theory, if you created a dissonant enough Commandia, you could basically repel or really mess up the spirits? Sounds fun

So I wonder if you can rehabilitate Spirits then? Obviously from the above, stopping cold turkey doesn't seem to work, but if you lower the dosage little by little?

Or on the other hand, what if you flood them with it excessively and increase their tolerance? Can you OD them?
Well, that's why people can fight wars with spirits. By creating Commandia for battle. But too dissonant, and the spirit will probably ignore you or will not be in sync with your feelings. Too create a dissonant tune, the Dantist must be able to convey his true dissonant feelings to his spirit. So a Dantist who's crazy and actually talented enough to produce whacked up Commandias can probably cause his spirit to go bonkers... that is if there's a spirit that actually wants to contract with him in the first place.

I believe spirits can't die with overdosage or anything. They are still long living beings. So they can live on 'crack' forever until the Dantist dies or something. Then they need to worry about an alternative source for their 'crack'
__________________
musashiken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2007-10-24, 20:51   Link #180
taelrak
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
Well, that's why people can fight wars with spirits. By creating Commandia for battle. But too dissonant, and the spirit will probably ignore you or will not be in sync with your feelings. Too create a dissonant tune, the Dantist must be able to convey his true dissonant feelings to his spirit. So a Dantist who's crazy and actually talented enough to produce whacked up Commandias can probably cause his spirit to go bonkers... that is if there's a spirit that actually wants to contract with him in the first place.

I believe spirits can't die with overdosage or anything. They are still long living beings. So they can live on 'crack' forever until the Dantist dies or something. Then they need to worry about an alternative source for their 'crack'
Great, now I think of spirits as drug-addicts

Same sentiments as the poster above - thanks for giving all that info musashiken. It really helps a lot with the background.

One of these days I should learn Japanese ...

Incidentally, is THAT why Corti's always in chibi-form? As the oldest spirit alive, she probably just wants to look young again?
taelrak is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
adventure, comedy, fantasy, ginga-ya, ocelot, romance, seinen, shounen, supernatural

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 20:41.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.