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Old 2009-09-27, 06:25   Link #2981
Teleutao
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I always just thought that Hayate ended up in the Royal Garden because it fit the purposes of the plot. I mean, he traveled back in time for one chapter and it didn't even phase him, so I'd say that we can put it under weird stuff just happening to him all the time. I'm sure Hata will give us a story-related explanation but until then I'm just going to leave it at that.

As for a Nagi end, I can see Hayate being her butler (as sad as the implications are) but not in a romantic light. For one thing, Hayate has on many occasions expressed that he does not and will never feel that way. For another, others have commented that it would make him a pedophile "and that would be bad". Besides, character development since those early chapters seems to be putting Hayate and Nagi in a more brother-sister role, which is a REALLY good thing if they actually are related in some way.

I also think I figured out why I don't like Athena. It's actually really simple, while I thought that the End of the World arc was sweet at first, I always picture myself interacting with a character. The thought of me dating Athena is terrifying when I think about it and I would definitely refer to her as my 'psycho ex girlfriend'. Holy crap, I just had a good idea...maybe things end well with Hayate's meeting with Athena, and then the others find out. Now, before they explode they are smart enough to ask why they split up and Hayate tells them, probably in a really abridged manner. Something like "Well, my parents did something bad, so she didn't want me to ever leave the castle again, then I said something stupid and she got really mad at me and attacked me with a lethal weapon and summoned a demon that almost killed me." The looks on all of their faces when they try to imagine why Hayate would want to go back to her would be priceless, and I see a lot of them trying to 'help' him, thinking that Athena might not be so good for him. It wouldn't have to be that way, but I think it would be really funny to see something like that.
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Old 2009-09-27, 07:16   Link #2982
Rah
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Decided to spoiler text everything, cuz it's too long.
Spoiler for GDB1:


Spoiler for Opace1:



Spoiler for aldw1:



Spoiler for Opace2:



Spoiler for Used Can1:



Spoiler for zodanhko1:


Spoiler for Used Can2:



Spoiler for Opace3:



Spoiler for zpdanhko2:


Spoiler for aldw2:



Spoiler for Opace4:



.........
.........

As for the gem, Hayate might have one with him at all times (like speculated). He probably isn't the son of Zeus, or are there any divinities in play (yeah, it's mentioned that they received punishment from god, but I don't think it's meant to be interpreted literally). If his brother is Himegami, he might know some sort of magic to merge it with him for safekeeping (too bad it was before Isumi could purify it). Heh.. who knows?


Teleutao: You just had to post before I concluded this, didn't you? Oh, well...
Spoiler for Teleutao1:


Kay, I'm done! *bows to the audience*


P.S.

I'm not gonna check for mistakes. No wai!

Last edited by Rah; 2009-09-27 at 07:57.
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Old 2009-09-27, 07:31   Link #2983
holyman282
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Dude though have you realised that in the manga Hata is obviously trying to play out Hayate and Nagi's relationship as that of motherly affection. It was even stated by Isumi's mum how similar Hayate looks like Nagi's mother. Even the anime's second season's second OP showed Nagi looking at Hayate and seeing her mother. To me they are trying to play out the fact that Nagi will eventually understand that the love she has for Hayate is merely mother daughter as strange as it may sound.
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Old 2009-09-27, 08:08   Link #2984
Rah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by holyman282 View Post
Dude though have you realised that in the manga Hata is obviously trying to play out Hayate and Nagi's relationship as that of motherly affection. It was even stated by Isumi's mum how similar Hayate looks like Nagi's mother. Even the anime's second season's second OP showed Nagi looking at Hayate and seeing her mother. To me they are trying to play out the fact that Nagi will eventually understand that the love she has for Hayate is merely mother daughter as strange as it may sound.
Certainly it may look that way, but I don't think that Nagi is looking for a replacement. She's not that immature, and knows that it's best to let go and move on. Hayate does resemble her mom to some extent, but just wait a few years till he starts growing a beard.

The anime has nothing to do with the manga. They can conclude it with the next season, and just make up an end, while the manga still continues.

And if I'm wrong, and she does want Hayate to act that role to somehow fill that hole in her heart, then let it be so. She will realize it's not right when she grows a little more, and end up in a different way (time skip Nagi-kun x Hayata-tan ending).

But besides any signs that she might look at him as the replacement for her mother, she does look at him as a man, and as a potential boyfriend / husband. Can't deny that.

Guess in the end it comes down to personal opinions...

Can't conclude this due to the lack of evidence.

Case closed.
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Old 2009-09-27, 09:43   Link #2985
Opace
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Nice replies to today's discussion, Rah. Do I win for getting 4 spoiler replies from you? ;D

I agree with Rah, I don't think Nagi loves Hayate for the reason that he resembles something of a family figure to her. Also, someone above stated above that Nagi truely believes that Hayate loves her (can't remember who said it, my apologies). Whilst this may be true, I think she does or will explore the possibility that this may not be the case soon enough (especially when she hears about Hayate's declaration of love for Athena; I would LOVE to see her reactions, along with everyone else's).

Oh the drama; I love it.
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Old 2009-09-27, 09:50   Link #2986
zodanhko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teleutao View Post
I also think I figured out why I don't like Athena.
At least, you finally admit yourself instead of proclaimed that you were once Maria and Athena's fan and switched to Hinagiku which humanly is very...unnatural by nature.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rah View Post
Multiple Archetype Disorder. Hitagi is a self declared tsundere, and she definitely doesn't act like one, since she openly declared her love without a moment of hesitation, or embarrassment.
Well, Hitagi at first wanted to make Koyomi to confess but she failed and confessed to him instead. Both Athena and Hitagi have no trouble declaring their love but they have an altitude of being unapproachable, and they don't openly show their love easily after the confession which make them tsundere. Hitagi is more yandere than tsundere and Athena is more tsundere than yandere but their personalities are very interesting and unique.

Last edited by zodanhko; 2009-09-27 at 10:31.
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Old 2009-09-27, 11:51   Link #2987
cheongzewei
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Yo

my second post here, since NO ONE here though of what i though of what will happen next.

Athena CONFRONTS HAYATE!

Hayate goes, A-tan.

Athena goes What do you want Hayate, and goes You took the power didn't you?

Then they will fight over the stone (with Athena not explaining why)

And then Hayate will use his butler killing blow (seeming to aim at Athena but is instead aiming towards the exit,) and runs away. Leaving him more depressed and with more questions then answers.
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Old 2009-09-27, 13:52   Link #2988
Rah
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opace View Post
Nice replies to today's discussion, Rah. Do I win for getting 4 spoiler replies from you? ;D
*ground trembles, sky darkens*

You, whom have gathered the 4 spoiler tags get 1 wish.

You have 5 seconds to reply.

*BLEEP*
*BLEEP*
*BLEEP*
*BLEEP*
*BLEEP*

*wakes up* Oh, god damn alarm clock! *throws pillow*


Quote:
Originally Posted by Opace View Post
I agree with Rah, I don't think Nagi loves Hayate for the reason that he resembles something of a family figure to her. Also, someone above stated above that Nagi truely believes that Hayate loves her (can't remember who said it, my apologies). Whilst this may be true, I think she does or will explore the possibility that this may not be the case soon enough (especially when she hears about Hayate's declaration of love for Athena; I would LOVE to see her reactions, along with everyone else's).

Oh the drama; I love it.

Either she shatters on the inside, feeling totally betrayed, or she says that she understands, and she picked up the hints that he doesn't love her over time (actually she might be just confirming her fears & doubts)..

*After Nagi learns about their relationship. It's evening, and they're on a cliff similar to where her mom is buried, basking in the sunset*
Hayate: Ojou-sama, I...
Nagi: *turns her back towards him* I know, Hayate. And it's ok... you may go. From this moment on you are free from your duties as a Sanzen'in butler.
Nagi: *starts walking away...*
Spoiler for Ending 1:


Spoiler for Ending 2:



Quote:
Originally Posted by zodanhko View Post
Well, Hitagi at first wanted to make Koyomi to confess but she failed and confessed to him instead. Both Athena and Hitagi have no trouble declaring their love but they have an altitude of being unapproachable, and they don't openly show their love easily after the confession which make them tsundere. Hitagi is more yandere than tsundere and Athena is more tsundere than yandere but their personalities are very interesting and unique.
We need more archetypes. Someone invent something from this mix, if it doesn't exist already! xD


Quote:
Originally Posted by cheongzewei View Post
Yo

my second post here, since NO ONE here though of what i though of what will happen next.

Athena CONFRONTS HAYATE!

Hayate goes, A-tan.

Athena goes What do you want Hayate, and goes You took the power didn't you?

Then they will fight over the stone (with Athena not explaining why)

And then Hayate will use his butler killing blow (seeming to aim at Athena but is instead aiming towards the exit,) and runs away. Leaving him more depressed and with more questions then answers.

That would totally discard all the buildup through all these chapters to this moment. What would be the point of the Hina date then? What meaning would all the things he went through have then?

I don't voice my personal opinion as an argument point often, but absolutely not! That can't happen, not in a thousand years!
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Old 2009-09-27, 15:04   Link #2989
Used Can
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opace View Post
Mostly because animated girls are modelled after an archetype, multiple archetypes, or a combination of archetypes as they appeal to a certain part of the audience. Hayate no Gotoku is quite good at this I reckon, Hata has multiple girls with different [mixed personalities]. This is seen in the Hayate no Gotoku popularity contest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rah View Post
That's how it works. Throw in a bunch of girls with different archetypes, and one will surely please you. Thus, just because of that one girl it will appeal to you, and make you buy the product.
I wasn't talking about the author, but about the fans. I don't think Athena has displayed any personality trait that would make her either a tsundere, yandere or any other of those *deres. I'm sure there must be an archetype, or a set of archetypes she must fall into, but I don't think she strongly represents any. Say, unlike Hina and Nagi who display blatant tsundere traits, I don't think Athena has displayed any sort of behaviour that would make her be classified under particular archetype.
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Old 2009-09-27, 15:11   Link #2990
NaweG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rah View Post
Spoiler for Ending 2... edited for brevity:
And what were those words?

Spoiler for Stop Now if You Know What's Good for You:
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Old 2009-09-27, 15:20   Link #2991
Rah
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*completely edits post*


Tch.. nobody cared to reply to the pun I made.

Fine, fine, I'll get serious again, without any Spartans involved.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NaweG View Post
And what were those words?
I felt that they would lose value if they were written down. Listen to the song I suggested, and it should be enough.


Ah, so much free time, so little to do.... *sigh*

I hate weekends.

Last edited by Rah; 2009-09-27 at 16:02.
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Old 2009-09-27, 16:14   Link #2992
Used Can
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That Sparta pic was funny, though.
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Old 2009-09-27, 19:25   Link #2993
Opace
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@Rah:

That 2nd "ending" with Nagi will basically push Hayate into Nagi's ending without giving the other heroines a chance. On top of that, Hata will have a hard time getting Nagi and the rest of the heroines to go back to the Slice of Life/Comedy chapters once more, which is what a lot of fans want.

I actually wouldn't want that. There's still Hinagiku's, Maria's, Izumi's, Ayumu's past lives to be explored for their Romantic interest in Hayate. By pushing Hayate to Nagi, that'll probably destroy all of that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Used Can View Post
I wasn't talking about the author, but about the fans. I don't think Athena has displayed any personality trait that would make her either a tsundere, yandere or any other of those *deres. I'm sure there must be an archetype, or a set of archetypes she must fall into, but I don't think she strongly represents any. Say, unlike Hina and Nagi who display blatant tsundere traits, I don't think Athena has displayed any sort of behaviour that would make her be classified under particular archetype.
She doesn't strongly represent most archetypes. That said, she's not a weak mix of some either; her personality is quite unique, naturally formed through her past with Hayate and her current situation. The fact that she has so much pull in the story at the moment AND her unique personality causes some fans to dislike her and this arc. But I love those unique personalities, and I think that it's not sudden that she became the centre of attention for a while.

Personally, I think Nagi and Hinagiku are different types of tsunderes, due to their characteristics.
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Old 2009-09-27, 20:24   Link #2994
Rah
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Originally Posted by Opace View Post
@Rah:

That 2nd "ending" with Nagi will basically push Hayate into Nagi's ending without giving the other heroines a chance. On top of that, Hata will have a hard time getting Nagi and the rest of the heroines to go back to the Slice of Life/Comedy chapters once more, which is what a lot of fans want.

I actually wouldn't want that. There's still Hinagiku's, Maria's, Izumi's, Ayumu's past lives to be explored for their Romantic interest in Hayate. By pushing Hayate to Nagi, that'll probably destroy all of that.

Yeah, I'm someone who likes things "in the moment". If the current arc were to abruptly end, that would be my Nagi ending. I'll write an Izumi or Hina end some other time, perhaps after a few chapters progress, or when I get into the mood for it. IMHO I don't want it to go back to what it was. I'd rather for it to stay as it is, or for the current arc to expand into multiple conclusive ones, ending possible love relations with the girls one after another. Of course each gets a solid amount of chapters to say her "goodbyes".. well, in terms of a Hayate love candidate.

Hmmm, perhaps that's too planned out like a blueprint, so it might be better to just mix everybody together in a huge event, or many smaller events with a big impact / significance.

Anyway, my point is that the comedy in HnG isn't what's attractive, but the relationships are.

I simply want more emotions displayed....


*Forgive the lack of a better term, but I'm sort of drowsy at the moment ^_^

Kay, Night~
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Old 2009-09-27, 21:04   Link #2995
Opace
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On the topic of possible heroine endings, how many chapters do you think Hayate no Gotoku will reach, undisturbed, before it starts on its final arc with the decided Hayate X Heroine pair?

I think it'll reach something along the lines of ~380-420 chapters.
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Old 2009-09-27, 21:44   Link #2996
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Old 2009-09-27, 22:00   Link #2997
zodanhko
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Really nice.

Can't make one for myself...
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Old 2009-09-27, 22:16   Link #2998
qwertyman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Used Can View Post
I wasn't talking about the author, but about the fans. I don't think Athena has displayed any personality trait that would make her either a tsundere, yandere or any other of those *deres. I'm sure there must be an archetype, or a set of archetypes she must fall into, but I don't think she strongly represents any. Say, unlike Hina and Nagi who display blatant tsundere traits, I don't think Athena has displayed any sort of behaviour that would make her be classified under particular archetype.
Really? Not even with her first real appearance in the End of the World arc, where she went from "kiss me, Hayate!" to "I'M GOING TO KILL YOU!" in the span of a couple chapters?

Seems pretty yandere to me.
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Old 2009-09-27, 22:25   Link #2999
zodanhko
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Really? Not even with her first real appearance in the End of the World arc, where she went from "kiss me, Hayate!" to "I'M GOING TO KILL YOU!" in the span of a couple chapters?

Seems pretty yandere to me.
She had her reasons for being angry logically (harsh, but not to the extent of wanting him dead) unlike a typical yandere whom reason is only because of great obsession.
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Old 2009-09-27, 22:29   Link #3000
Used Can
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Originally Posted by Opace View Post
Personally, I think Nagi and Hinagiku are different types of tsunderes, due to their characteristics.
Ah... indeed. None of them are the hardcore type of tsundere either, since both of them are usually nice.

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Nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertyman View Post
Really? Not even with her first real appearance in the End of the World arc, where she went from "kiss me, Hayate!" to "I'M GOING TO KILL YOU!" in the span of a couple chapters?
She was certainly angry, and she did go overboard, but that doesn't turn her into a yandere. To begin with, a yandere never let go of their love interest. They are obsessive. Athena and Hayate parted ways for about 10 years. That would never have happened had Athena been a yandere.
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