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View Poll Results: Kanon - 2006 - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 98 66.67%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 35 23.81%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 11 7.48%
7 out of 10 : Good 1 0.68%
6 out of 10 : Average 0 0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.68%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 0.68%
Voters: 147. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2006-12-23, 18:35   Link #101
Maxon
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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Despite the awesomeness of Sugita's VA-ing, I was ecstatic that Seki got some more time to do some VA-ing. He's my fave VA after Sugita. He can be just as funny as Sugita IMO.

Ah yes. This episode was perfection in my eyes. KyoAni are doing a wonderful job with the animation as always.

Mai's chopping was just so damn moe! Judo Chop!
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Old 2006-12-23, 21:09   Link #102
Ascaloth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenson View Post
Wow... my Astronomy major can actually come to some use! Incredible! LOL

This a Starmap of Tokyo on Jan 15, 2007 at 4:32am looking due east with a telescope on a equatorial stand. (reads... why the image is title to one side)



I think they did a pretty good job comparing the two

The starmap is produce by Stellarium, an incredible planetarium program which I highly recommand
Here's a thought....shouldn't you be checking Jan 15, 1999 instead?
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Old 2006-12-23, 23:00   Link #103
bluemonq
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guuchan View Post
In this episode? Where did you see it?
Around [4:40] you will see the clock saying 5:37, followed by Nayuki and Keropi sitting down and Yuuichi and Ayu behind her. Note that Yuuichi is already dressed for school.

Camera comes back to the clock at around [5:05] showing 7:53. Nayuki and Yuuchi are leaving.
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Old 2006-12-24, 05:26   Link #104
Thelastguardian
...
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenson View Post
Wow... my Astronomy major can actually come to some use! Incredible! LOL

This a Starmap of Tokyo on Jan 15, 2007 at 4:32am looking due east with a telescope on a equatorial stand. (reads... why the image is title to one side)
ooo fancy program. I just use my good old star chart and my 15 year old computer program (SkyGlobe if any1 cares) ^_^;;

I somehow got a different star map using the same setting...


PS. Years doesn't matter (unless you are talking about precession). You see the same constellations in certain month in every year, right?
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Old 2006-12-24, 06:00   Link #105
EtherNEZ
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Join Date: Nov 2003
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Finally got around to catching up to ep12.... just one word sums up my thoughts really.... beautiful.... especially Mai & Sayuri . The timing could not have been better really - but I think that's been mentioned endless times . I award a 9.

Oh, and as to all the interest on the star charts...

@lastguardian - That Stellarium map is roughly correct for the latitude of Tokyo (I checked at Osaka), it's just simply that the program doesn't display the location as a name when you are 'globe' browsing, as I suspect is the case. Something in the sky *will* change it's position significantly though - Saturn is in the scene for 2007 but not 1999 (much further 'east') .

StarGlobe rings a bell..... it wasn't that long ago that I used to use 'ancient' star charts too - though a great deal of the information is outdated now
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Old 2006-12-24, 06:31   Link #106
orion
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Well, this was a hard one to rate for me...

You see I'm also watching Ashita no Nadja, unfortunately.

I mean the scenes were great with the Ayu and Shiori storylines. It was nice to see Ayu in different clothes for a change. Chibi Ayu, Yuichi and Nayuki were great. Shiori's meds were great. It was at level of a "10" for me. But, then came the dance.

The ball itself was great. Then they started dancing.

The only thing I could think was "That's waltzing music. They are not waltzing." Then I started reminiscing about Ashita no Nadja and it went downhill fast. Now those guys can waltz.

So I decided to go about this from the point of view that those 2 choose just didn't choose the right dance for the music given that Yuichi didn't know how to ballroom dance. I think that the closeup shot of Mai and Yuichi doing something that looks like a promenade to waltz was unforgiveable. I think that they need to reanimate that scene (Too much hip movement for what they were doing.)

Mai's reaction to Sayuri at the end couldn't make up for the dancing for me. That was such good waltzing music too.

I think that Kuze may actually have wanted to date Sayuri and Mai is in the way. Sayuri did show up without a male partner and is always seen with Mai at school. Pretty doubtful that a guy could get near Sayuri enough to start a relationship with Mai being there.

Kuze did have a point. People (school, students, their dates) did spend alot of money for that ball. If Mai should ruin it, there should be hell to pay. Heck, I'd be sending in my bill to her in a second for my expenses.
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Old 2006-12-24, 07:05   Link #107
guuchan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluemonq View Post
Around [4:40] you will see the clock saying 5:37, followed by Nayuki and Keropi sitting down and Yuuichi and Ayu behind her. Note that Yuuichi is already dressed for school.

Camera comes back to the clock at around [5:05] showing 7:53. Nayuki and Yuuchi are leaving.
Yep, found it. I'm not sure about it either, but maybe it's not U1 who woke her up. After all, Nayuki sets her own alarms(s)(s)(s). I guess they take huge breakfast so they need 2 hours to finish it? (even though from what I know, Nanase family usually has bread as breakfast)
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Old 2006-12-24, 07:20   Link #108
Ascaloth
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Originally Posted by guuchan View Post
Yep, found it. I'm not sure about it either, but maybe it's not U1 who woke her up. After all, Nayuki sets her own alarms(s)(s)(s). I guess they take huge breakfast so they need 2 hours to finish it? (even though from what I know, Nanase family usually has bread as breakfast)
Actually, my thoughts on that is that Nayuki takes 2 hours to even wake up properly, so that she at least looks open-eyed enough for school.
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Old 2006-12-24, 07:21   Link #109
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Maybe they're busy making the obentous and stuff, along with breakfast?
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Old 2006-12-24, 07:27   Link #110
guuchan
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Originally Posted by Ascaloth View Post
Actually, my thoughts on that is that Nayuki takes 2 hours to even wake up properly, so that she at least looks open-eyed enough for school.
Haha, that's possible too, but that doesn't explain why U1 also gets up so early though.

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Originally Posted by npal View Post
Maybe they're busy making the obentous and stuff, along with the breakfast?
Hm, I doubt. Nayuki and U1 usually have their lunch at the school cafeteria.
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Old 2006-12-24, 08:21   Link #111
orion
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Maybe it's so that he doesn't have to hear the alarm clocks ringing.
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Old 2006-12-24, 08:48   Link #112
Mentar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
The only thing I could think was "That's waltzing music. They are not waltzing." Then I started reminiscing about Ashita no Nadja and it went downhill fast. Now those guys can waltz.
*grins*

Okay, so I wasn't quite alone in this observation.

Quote:
So I decided to go about this from the point of view that those 2 choose just didn't choose the right dance for the music given that Yuichi didn't know how to ballroom dance. I think that the closeup shot of Mai and Yuichi doing something that looks like a promenade to waltz was unforgiveable. I think that they need to reanimate that scene (Too much hip movement for what they were doing.)
It was a mixed bag. Vienna waltz at very high levels (after 2-3 years of training) has alot of promenade figures, and a couple of those were actually animated. So, parts of the animation were genuine and good. Nevertheless, the basic step of a waltz isn't a wiggle, it's a spin. And this was missing indeed.

The promenade with the hip movement indeed didn't belong there. It looked like a promenade figure from a Samba (which is latin-style), not vienna waltz (which is classic-style).

Still, I think you were a bit overly harsh. Around 2/3rd of the dance _was_ vienna waltz, even though it was only special figures and no basic step. 1/3rd didn't belong there

Oh, and if you want to be irritated at waltzing animation, watch OtoBoku 12. I wanted to tear my hair out.
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Old 2006-12-24, 09:06   Link #113
Nightengale
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Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
The promenade with the hip movement indeed didn't belong there. It looked like a promenade figure from a Samba (which is latin-style), not vienna waltz (which is classic-style).
That was the dirty dance, lambada. I'm sure most of you had heard of it...

And heh, I wouldn't take it too far to cite such outlooks into dancing in anime, especially when half the dance looked like it was there for the sparkles. Otherwise, I've would've been complaining how no one else was dancing and the whole everyone was looking at the pair before and during seemed weird. I guess Kyoto Animation blew everything into the dance and made it as if it was so awe-inspiring everyone else was shooked still.
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Old 2006-12-24, 10:30   Link #114
Ascaloth
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Originally Posted by guuchan View Post
Haha, that's possible too, but that doesn't explain why U1 also gets up so early though.
Because if he doesn't, who's going to wake Nayuki up at 5am in the morning so she could wake up properly in time for school? You think those alarms she set are of any use? And besides, only he can dedicate the time to harassing her until she gets up; Akiko-san has to do the cooking.
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Old 2006-12-24, 10:45   Link #115
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Speaking from the perspective of someone who has done a bit of formal ballroom dancing (although admittedly a loooong time ago ) - I'm not about to criticize the things that were out of place for a waltz, though the wiggling action was really strange to see. My critique would be that they were entirely too good for beginners. Take two people who have no ballroom training, who have never danced with each other, give them music in 3/4 time, and then have them manage as well on the first try as Yuuichi and Mai did? Not in the real world! But from a story standpoint - hey, it's a classic situation that has been used in more films than I can imagine, and it works....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nightengale View Post
Otherwise, I've would've been complaining how no one else was dancing and the whole everyone was looking at the pair before and during seemed weird. I guess Kyoto Animation blew everything into the dance and made it as if it was so awe-inspiring everyone else was shooked still.
I doubt it was laziness or penny-pinching on Kyo-ani's part. The main couple takes the floor and the other people in attendence clear away to watch them in amazement, shock, delight, or what have you. It's just another classic scene that has been used in films, plays, and operas for longer that any one of us has been alive. Come to think of it, given the music used it is likely that it was, at least in part, a homage to the dance scene at the end of Walt Disney's "Sleeping Beauty".
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Old 2006-12-24, 11:06   Link #116
Richard 23
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So orion is having fuzzy thoughts for Kuze? Oh, ye be damned! If you know the story behind Sayuri and Kuze from the game and still give the student council the time of day you surely must be locked securely behind bars. Sinner!

In all seriousness, Yuuichi and Mai had no idea how to present themselves at a formal dance. I would never have gone to a school dance myself if it required understanding how to do the waltz (or even a polka)! So give them a break. And as for Kuze, he deserves nothing less than the back of your hand.

Kuze, here, meet the back of my hand. POKA! ITAI!
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Old 2006-12-24, 11:09   Link #117
orion
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Originally Posted by Furudanuki View Post
Speaking from the perspective of someone who has done a bit of formal ballroom dancing (although admittedly a loooong time ago ) - I'm not about to criticize the things that were out of place for a waltz, though the wiggling action was really strange to see. My critique would be that they were entirely too good for beginners. Take two people who have no ballroom training, who have never danced with each other, give them music in 3/4 time, and then have them manage as well on the first try as Yuuichi and Mai did? Not in the real world! But from a story standpoint - hey, it's a classic situation that has been used in more films than I can imagine, and it works....

I doubt it was laziness or penny-pinching on Kyo-ani's part. The main couple takes the floor and the other people in attendence clear away to watch them in amazement, shock, delight, or what have you. It's just another classic scene that has been used in films, plays, and operas for longer that any one of us has been alive. Come to think of it, given the music used it is likely that it was, at least in part, a homage to the dance scene at the end of Walt Disney's "Sleeping Beauty".
You're too kind. If you're going to a ball, you need to know a few steps. At their age, they should have had some practice. Just like for weddings, those who know that they are going to do a special dance take classes. Somehow I doubt that a school that does a yearly ball won't have classes for ballroom dancing.

The couple in Sleeping Beauty had their dancing act together. Even Nadja (age 13) had her act together and her background was from a orphanage.

Excessive pelvic movements have no place during a waltz imo.

They could have had a few more couples on the floor, esp. since the current couple's dancing wasn't anything to write home about. They probably wanted the spotlight on Mai and Yuichi, instead. They probably weren't thinking that people would be critiquing the waltz animation sequence.
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Old 2006-12-24, 11:20   Link #118
orion
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Originally Posted by Richard 23 View Post
So orion is having fuzzy thoughts for Kuze? Oh, ye be damned! If you know the story behind Sayuri and Kuze from the game and still give the student council the time of day you surely must be locked securely behind bars. Sinner!

In all seriousness, Yuuichi and Mai had no idea how to present themselves at a formal dance. I would never have gone to a school dance myself if it required understanding how to do the waltz (or even a polka)! So give them a break. And as for Kuze, he deserves nothing less than the back of your hand.

Kuze, here, meet the back of my hand. POKA! ITAI!

Okay, okay I'll give them a break...How many pieces do you want them in?

Not familiar at all with their (Sayuri's and Kuze's) story. It just seems from this one episode, he's ticked at Mai and there is a history besides the school property destruction. You know guys, she would have been tossed out ages ago in reality. Sayuri's family has to be pulling some strings for that girl imo.

Looks like Ayu gets to meet Mai in the next episode's preview. She's doing the girlfriend thing. "Where in the hell are you sneaking off to at this time of the night, Yuichi?"
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Old 2006-12-24, 11:55   Link #119
MakubeX2
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Seems that KyoAni is making Ayu out to be the central character that connects everyone together.

Well, she is the culprit behind everything in Kanon in the first place.
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Old 2006-12-24, 12:06   Link #120
Ascaloth
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Originally Posted by orion View Post
You're too kind. If you're going to a ball, you need to know a few steps. At their age, they should have had some practice.
Kawasumi Mai doesn't seem like the type of person who has ever gone to a ball before this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
Just like for weddings, those who know that they are going to do a special dance take classes.
Yes, and Sayuri, Mai, and Yuuichi knew they were going to the ball...when? Two days before the ball itself? I hardly think there's enough time for classes

Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
Somehow I doubt that a school that does a yearly ball won't have classes for ballroom dancing.
And like I said before, does Kawasumi Mai strike you as the type of person to go for ballroom dance lessons?

Sayuri might very well have, judging from her background. Heck, from the fairly competent way he led a beginner, Yuuichi might have, as well. But Mai, I simply don't think so. Besides, I think they were just winging it. Of course it had to look awkward somewhere. So I'll give them props for trying, at the very least.

Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
Looks like Ayu gets to meet Mai in the next episode's preview. She's doing the girlfriend thing. "Where in the hell are you sneaking off to at this time of the night, Yuichi?"
At least Ayu's sharper than a certain Minase girl...
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