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Old 2007-02-09, 21:03   Link #1
Terrestrial Dream
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Mobile Suit in actual battle useful or not?

In gundam universe tanks and airplanes are now replaced by mobile suit, now in real life would it work?
Pro for Mobile suit would be able to change weapon for different situation unlike tanks, it will be able to be use in different type of terrain mountain, desert, space, and etc unlike tanks.
Cons would be expansive as hell, way too big and easy target, slow mobility(maybe).
And don't think using mobile suit is dumb idea, remember that in world war 1 tank were useless, but now it is one of the main weapon in war. Maybe they could make it smaller to make it more efficient.
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Old 2007-02-09, 22:10   Link #2
Syn13
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I don't think I wanna ever see such things in real life made for war. Probably in the future long long time from now.
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Old 2007-02-09, 22:19   Link #3
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperlion
In gundam universe tanks and airplanes are now replaced by mobile suit, now in real life would it work?
Probably not. The reason tanks and airplanes are so weak compared to mobile suits in Gundam is because mobile suits are arbitrarily given a massive technological advantage. If conventional vehicles were to be given access to equivalent technologies, then they would dominate mobile suits.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperlion
Pro for Mobile suit would be able to change weapon for different situation unlike tanks, it will be able to be use in different type of terrain mountain, desert, space, and etc unlike tanks.
It's trivial to design a modular turret to handle a multitude of different weapons. Tanks are every bit as capable (if not more so) than mobile suits would be in the environments listed. Moreover, dedicated vehicles designed for specific environments are generally greatly superior to a general-purpose platform.

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Originally Posted by hyperlion
Cons would be expansive as hell, way too big and easy target, slow mobility(maybe).
Add a lack of stability, an incapability to handle tank-sized weapons, difficulty of maintenance, and inferior armor. Also, while it's not necessarily a problem of mobile suits per se, a machine with multiple crew members is generally much more capable than one that has only a single pilot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperlion
And don't think using mobile suit is dumb idea, remember that in world war 1 tank were useless, but now it is one of the main weapon in war. Maybe they could make it smaller to make it more efficient.
Tanks weren't useless in World War I at all. In fact, they were seen as having a vital strategic role that allowed an attacker to break the trench deadlock. The only things truly lacking in even early tanks was proper operational support and sufficient reliability. Unlike mobile suits, there wasn't anything in military inventories that could replicate the ability of tanks.
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Old 2007-02-09, 22:41   Link #4
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maybe they can dominate the battle feild but not for many many years as technology isnt good enuff to make it practical. sure theyre big but give it enuff mobility then its fast and agile. it would be able to change tactics easily enuff given enuff skill.
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Old 2007-02-09, 22:43   Link #5
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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
It's trivial to design a modular turret to handle a multitude of different weapons. Tanks are every bit as capable (if not more so) than mobile suits would be in the environments listed. Moreover, dedicated vehicles designed for specific environments are generally greatly superior to a general-purpose platform.
Couple things you can improve upon those mobile suits. First, they need not to be so large. Of course, as you and I are both aware, they are sizes of skyscrapers, but I doubt its necessary. I've often toyed with the idea of a more compact, agile mobile suit that relies on speed and firepower rather than armor. It could be useful, given the maneuverability of many mechas in fiction.


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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
Add a lack of stability, an incapability to handle tank-sized weapons, difficulty of maintenance, and inferior armor. Also, while it's not necessarily a problem of mobile suits per se, a machine with multiple crew members is generally much more capable than one that has only a single pilot.
That is because despite the advancement of mobile suits, they still rely on old-school piloting technology. I fail to comprehend how that would work, and I am sure you can point out many tech-holes by just observing how pilots pilot their Gundams.

I'd think, by the xx century, they would have developed neurotechonology by then. You know, the idea of linking a warmachine directly to human conscious is an intriguing idea.

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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
Tanks weren't useless in World War I at all. In fact, they were seen as having a vital strategic role that allowed an attacker to break the trench deadlock. The only things truly lacking in even early tanks was proper operational support and sufficient reliability. Unlike mobile suits, there wasn't anything in military inventories that could replicate the ability of tanks.
Not exactly. Tanks weren't as cut up as they were advertised. After the Germans gotten through the initial shock, they soon found the tanks excessive in size, but completely lacking teeth. You know, 7.9mm bullets often penetrated tank armor of that era. Soon, Germans developed effective anti-tank weaponry against those mechanical abominations.

Tanks also did little to change trench warfare. Fact is, by 1918, at the end of the war, 1 million German soldiers, intact, still occupied half of French territory. While the British Expedition Forces and the French Army had all but melted away... If not for the US-entry (without tanks), well, history could be very different.

- Tak (But we can discuss World War I privately, ja?)
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Old 2007-02-09, 23:35   Link #6
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At this point in time, they would merely be like land battleships...big targets for faster-moving vehicles. Only real advantage with big guns and armor, which is usually gotten around anyways.
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Old 2007-02-09, 23:42   Link #7
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Originally Posted by Tak
Couple things you can improve upon those mobile suits. First, they need not to be so large. Of course, as you and I are both aware, they are sizes of skyscrapers, but I doubt its necessary. I've often toyed with the idea of a more compact, agile mobile suit that relies on speed and firepower rather than armor. It could be useful, given the maneuverability of many mechas in fiction.
While legged mecha the size of Heavy Gears would be an interesting complement to conventional arsenals; realistically, any thing much larger than battlesuits, which are worn more than piloted, wouldn't have much of a role on the battle field. It isn't utterly impossible to find a situation where such a unit would be more effective than anything else, but such situations would be few and far in between. Note that the depiction of mecha in fiction is in no way representative of how they would perform in real life. A small mobile suit wouldn't really be any faster than equivalent wheeled/tracked/hover vehicles, and they certainly wouldn't mount either as much firepower or armor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
I'd think, by the xx century, they would have developed neurotechonology by then. You know, the idea of linking a warmachine directly to human conscious is an intriguing idea.
Even then, multiple crew members would still be more capable than a single pilot. The problem is that the modern battlefield provides too much stimuli for a single person to process. This problem is greatly alleviated by a delegation of duties that a larger crew provides. As an added bonus, extra crew also means extra hands to help out when something breaks down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
Not exactly. Tanks weren't as cut up as they were advertised. After the Germans gotten through the initial shock, they soon found the tanks excessive in size, but completely lacking teeth. You know, 7.9mm bullets often penetrated tank armor of that era. Soon, Germans developed effective anti-tank weaponry against those mechanical abominations.
I wouldn't exactly say that tanks were a war-winning weapon in World War I; rather, I was just countering the claim that they were useless during that conflict. The rest is rather outside the purview of this thread, so I'll put it in a PM (eventually ).

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Originally Posted by RX-78GP04G Gerbera View Post
At this point in time, they would merely be like land battleships...big targets for faster-moving vehicles. Only real advantage with big guns and armor, which is usually gotten around anyways.
Right now, we can't build anything even remotely resembling legged mecha that would have the slightest application on the battlefield. It would be a minor miracle to construct something that could walk short distances without falling over.
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Old 2007-02-10, 01:41   Link #8
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Personally, I am an advocate of the idea that mecha are impractical with the current socio-political situation and level of technology and won't be either possible or practical for some time (if at all), while still maintaining the idea that Mobile Suits make a reasonable amount of sense for the UC universe under which they were developed and envisioned, though. History has often shown that technology that may seem impractical in one era can be entirely practical to produce in another under vastly different and unexpected circumstances.

Mecha, in the UC Gundam universe make a reasonable amount of sense when coupled with the development of space technology, exploration and warfare. The worker machines from which they originated (essentially, exo-skeleton like worker suits... or very early low level construction "Mobile Suits") were vastly helpful for the process of doing complicated tasks in space on a larger scale. From there, technology continued to advance until someone decided to attempt to use them for warfare. They were only produced in limited scale amounts until the beginning of the one year War where Zeon hoped to use their maneuverability to trump the weaker armored federation space fighters of the era. The success of the MS meant they would be used during the ground operations as well, but it's debatable if they actually made much of a difference on the earth. Indeed, early on in the war we see that even Zeon still frequently used fighters and tanks to counter their Federation opponents. The escalation of the war itself and the need to counter these machines led to the rapid advancement of these war machines... but even then, the Federation... or the majority of the earth sphere only used MS on a limited scale compared to their other resources to fight the war.

In other words, Mobile Suits, even in Gundam, were fairly rare during the original One Year War until the last few months where the arms race forced the Federation to attempt MS development of their own in order to counter Zeon's strategy. This would probably be one of the ONLY "hard-science" scenarios I can really recall where they truly became practical in warfare.

Without any kind of similar arms race and somewhat unusual circumstances, mecha would probably never be mainline within warfare. I honestly do feel that Gundam did a fairly good job of rationalizing their existence, though. I suppose weather or not they were practical in the other AU series is debatable, though. I suspect their origins were similar in G, Wing, and X, but we're not extensively given the details behind their origins and uses in these universes... and they're presented in somewhat less "realistic" fashions then they are in the other series. C.E. did a fairly decent job of rationalizing their existence as well, though... but it all kind of starts to get shakey towards the end of the first SEED.

Edit: Having said all this, MS IGLOO episode 2 is actually a pretty excellent example of how Mobile Suits could compare to battle tanks in a more realisitc and balanced battle. They "CAN" be overpowered fairly easily with good battle tactics, but they're hardly useless if used correctly either. Infact, the YTM-05 Mobile Tank "Hildolfr" would probably be an excellent example of a more realisitc combination of tank and mecha techology. I fail to see why Zeon simply tossed it aside.
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Old 2007-02-10, 02:21   Link #9
Demongod86
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I say bullshit on MSes, period. Know why? Because why the hell would we want a huge slow walking target, with critical weakpoints (knees, shoulder joints)?

Put it this way: you are a target the size of a skyscraper and show up on every backwater radar for miles around. A stealth fighter launches several missiles at you from beyond visual range. You are completely assraped.

As much as I love the S. Freedom and Infinite Justice and the extension of Her Holy Pinkness's beautiul armaments, that's a bunch of fiction and you know it. In reality, mobile suits would be these big lumbering hulking machines that would be lucky to float, let alone make the top superfighters of today look like a big LOL like the freedom does.

As someone mentioned, if you put the funding for what goes into MSes into existing fighter jets, well, just take the scariest thing you can find in the ace combat series of games and multiply its efficiency by around 10-30x.

And also, when you're trying to hunt guerillas in buildings or in caves, the last thing you need is a giant multibillion dollar piece of junk plodding around.
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Old 2007-02-10, 02:33   Link #10
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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
While legged mecha the size of Heavy Gears would be an interesting complement to conventional arsenals; realistically, any thing much larger than battlesuits, which are worn more than piloted, wouldn't have much of a role on the battle field. It isn't utterly impossible to find a situation where such a unit would be more effective than anything else, but such situations would be few and far in between. Note that the depiction of mecha in fiction is in no way representative of how they would perform in real life. A small mobile suit wouldn't really be any faster than equivalent wheeled/tracked/hover vehicles, and they certainly wouldn't mount either as much firepower or armor.
And only 60 years ago, carriers weren't thought to be efficient weapons. When countries centered around the idea of big battleships, only two nations, Japan and the United States, maintained a carrier task force.

And while the US did maintain a carrier task force, it was Japan that pioneered carrier warfare. Likewise, we don't know what will happen in the future. Maybe they'd develop synthetic muscles more flexible and durable than iron and steel. We will never know.

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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
Even then, multiple crew members would still be more capable than a single pilot. The problem is that the modern battlefield provides too much stimuli for a single person to process. This problem is greatly alleviated by a delegation of duties that a larger crew provides. As an added bonus, extra crew also means extra hands to help out when something breaks down.
That highly depends. Not only should neuro-technology create machines that can link to humans' consciousnesses, but they should also enhance them. You know, modern tanks today, despite their 'efficiency' on selected battlefields, would have been almost worthless in urban scenarios. Not to mention, most modern tanks' emphasis are no longer on armor, but speed and firepower. That is why powered-suits, or mecha (if we ever develop one) would come in handy. You don't need multiple personnel to make something effective, what you need is compact firepower.

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Old 2007-02-10, 03:15   Link #11
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HEDGESMFG
In other words, Mobile Suits, even in Gundam, were fairly rare during the original One Year War until the last few months where the arms race forced the Federation to attempt MS development of their own in order to counter Zeon's strategy. This would probably be one of the ONLY "hard-science" scenarios I can really recall where they truly became practical in warfare.
Save for the sheer speed of their development in the One Year War, mobile suits aren't treated too badly in UC Gundam. However, their capabilities are still vastly overstated compared to other machines, or to reality for that matter.

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Originally Posted by HEDGESMFG
I fail to see why Zeon simply tossed it aside.
The main reason seems to be that Zeon designed really bad tanks, and that this taint was carried over to their tank-hybrids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demongod86
As much as I love the S. Freedom and Infinite Justice and the extension of Her Holy Pinkness's beautiul armaments, that's a bunch of fiction and you know it. In reality, mobile suits would be these big lumbering hulking machines that would be lucky to float, let alone make the top superfighters of today look like a big LOL like the freedom does.
That's absolutely right. Mecha look cool, and they're rather neat concept-wise, but they're also very impractical.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
And only 60 years ago, carriers weren't thought to be efficient weapons. When countries centered around the idea of big battleships, only two nations, Japan and the United States, maintained a carrier task force.
That's not correct. If I remember correctly, the British was the very first navy to field an aircraft carrier, and they maintained a few of them throughout World War II. In addition, Italy fielded a couple, and even France and Germany toyed with the idea (I'm not sure if they ever got past the planning stage). While the usefulness of aircraft carriers was not fully understood until the actual war, naval officers tended to maintain a lot of interest in their potential almost from the very beginning.

The reason why aircraft carriers can have a very effective role whereas mecha cannot is that the former occupy a niche that's impossible for any other machine to share. There's no way to substitute for the power projection capabilities that an aircraft carrier gives you, while the very point of mecha is to substitute for existing war machines. Therefore, their practicality can be determined by how well they perform compared to their competitor. For land warfare, this would be the tank. As I stated earlier, tanks enjoy all sorts of advantages over mecha and very few disadvantages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
And while the US did maintain a carrier task force, it was Japan that pioneered carrier warfare. Likewise, we don't know what will happen in the future. Maybe they'd develop synthetic muscles more flexible and durable than iron and steel. We will never know.
If they develop such muscles, they'd also be able to put them into tanks. And tanks will always enjoy a ton-for-ton advantage in armor, firepower, target profile, and ease of maintenance over mecha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
That highly depends. Not only should neuro-technology create machines that can link to humans' consciousnesses, but they should also enhance them. You know, modern tanks today, despite their 'efficiency' on selected battlefields, would have been almost worthless in urban scenarios. Not to mention, most modern tanks' emphasis are no longer on armor, but speed and firepower. That is why powered-suits, or mecha (if we ever develop one) would come in handy. You don't need multiple personnel to make something effective, what you need is compact firepower.
Untrue. There's always a use for multiple personnel - the only exception would be if there were certain weight or volume constraints that don't allow for extra crew members. Even if a human being's thought processes could somehow be enhanced, it would still be beneficial to have multiple personnel. There are five (and a half) major tasks that tankers have to take care of simultaneously in combat situations. It's simply too much work for an individual to tackle by himself - the French learned this to their dismay in 1940. We're going a little afield here since there's nothing to constrain a mecha from having multiple crew.

On the other hand, powered-armor would always come in handy, as a supplement to infantry if nothing else.

As a side note, provided they are given proper infantry support, modern tanks have proven to be absolutely devastating in urban combat. Moreover, while tanks are always a balance of tradeoffs between protection, firepower and mobility, modern main battle tanks are dedicated to protection first and foremost. It would be the light tanks and IFVs which favor firepower or mobility over protection.
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Old 2007-02-10, 03:48   Link #12
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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
The reason why aircraft carriers can have a very effective role whereas mecha cannot is that the former occupy a niche that's impossible for any other machine to share. There's no way to substitute for the power projection capabilities that an aircraft carrier gives you, while the very point of mecha is to substitute for existing war machines. Therefore, their practicality can be determined by how well they perform compared to their competitor. For land warfare, this would be the tank. As I stated earlier, tanks enjoy all sorts of advantages over mecha and very few disadvantages.
While GB maintained carriers, they never used them effectively. Germany toyed with the idea, but the funds went to build the Bismarck instead, which was a bad. America learned carrier tactics the hard way, and I am confident that many Americans weren't prepared for the shock that came in the form of carrier warfare. Kimmel himself actually expected the old-school, battleship vs. battleship warfare, too bad for him, that never came.

- - -

I wouldn't confine the idea of a combat mecha to that of a tank though. I'd expect something much more. Think Xenosaga.

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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
If they develop such muscles, they'd also be able to put them into tanks. And tanks will always enjoy a ton-for-ton advantage in armor, firepower, target profile, and ease of maintenance over mecha.
Yes, but it'd be next to worthless in a tank, because while the tank may inherit its durability, it would never make use of its flexibility. And don't think Mechas should only 'walk'. A lot of things can be implemented to them in order to enhance their capabilities.

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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
Untrue. There's always a use for multiple personnel - the only exception would be if there were certain weight or volume constraints that don't allow for extra crew members. Even if a human being's thought processes could somehow be enhanced, it would still be beneficial to have multiple personnel. There are five (and a half) major tasks that tankers have to take care of simultaneously in combat situations. It's simply too much work for an individual to tackle by himself - the French learned this to their dismay in 1940. We're going a little afield here since there's nothing to constrain a mecha from having multiple crew.
As I said, don't restrain yourself in a tank. The French learned the hard way not because they lacked better weapons, but because they were simply not very imaginative when it comes to tactics.

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Originally Posted by 4Tran View Post
As a side note, provided they are given proper infantry support, modern tanks have proven to be absolutely devastating in urban combat. Moreover, while tanks are always a balance of tradeoffs between protection, firepower and mobility, modern main battle tanks are dedicated to protection first and foremost. It would be the light tanks and IFVs which favor firepower or mobility over protection.
So far, the urban combat we have engaged were against enemies with absolutely little to no counter against our war-machines. Not exactly something I'd be too proud of. Instead, I am backtracking. Thinking of World War II. You and I both know what happened to those poor Russian tanks when they faced Panzerfaust all over Berlin.

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Old 2007-02-10, 04:04   Link #13
4Tran
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
I wouldn't confine the idea of a combat mecha to that of a tank though. I'd expect something much more. Think Xenosaga.
Tanks are the best comparison to mecha because it's obvious that humanoid shapes are a worthless idea in flight, underwater and in space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
Yes, but it'd be next to worthless in a tank, because while the tank may inherit its durability, it would never make use of its flexibility. And don't think Mechas should only 'walk'. A lot of things can be implemented to them in order to enhance their capabilities.
Not quite. A material that's stronger than steel will always find an application in both armor and drivetrain designs. Moreover, it wouldn't really reduce any of the mecha's disadvantages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
As I said, don't restrain yourself in a tank. The French learned the hard way not because they lacked better weapons, but because they were simply not very imaginative when it comes to tactics.
I'm specifically referring to the weakness of the French one-man turrets. Other than this, French tanks like the Somua were better than the German counterpart. Remember that even with this and other drawbacks, French tanks managed to acquit themselves quite well on occasion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
So far, the urban combat we have engaged were against enemies with absolutely little to no counter against our war-machines. Not exactly something I'd be too proud of. Instead, I am backtracking. Thinking of World War II. You and I both know what happened to those poor Russian tanks when they faced Panzerfaust all over Berlin.
Soviet recklessness was more to blame for their losses in the battle of Berlin than the inherent weakness of tanks in urban environments. Keep in mind that they lost a lot of tanks because they failed to provide proper infantry support.
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Old 2007-02-10, 12:15   Link #14
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Like most of you have said, Gundams as they are portrayed in Anime are utterly impossible to implement in the modern battlefield or in the forseeable future. However, there is real development in bipedal mechanized "exoskeletons." These are worn by an individual and detect electrical impulses from the nerves associated with various muscles, and then the joints move according to these impulses. I've seen a prototype in Popular Science, and it allows the user to lift loads of significant weight, while retaining the mobility of a humanoid form. The article wrote that it was being designed for construction applications, but the military was interested as well. Rather than being the "tanks" of the battlefield, armored exoskeleton-wearing soldiers would act as fast strike forces, being able to run faster and carry bigger loads than conventional infantry. Kinda cool i think.
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Old 2007-02-10, 21:12   Link #15
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Well, there is a Gundam Musou Game going to release for PS3 (I think is Japanese version), develop by Koei and it is just like Dynasty Warrior, instead of men fighting it switch to Gundam fighting on a map, the game has many mecha in it (some say they even have Turn A in it.). I tink it give you some idea of what might look like in real battle. But i hope no G gundam in this game since they are too powerful (these gundams are all for Kung fu purpose.).

However in UC 0079, the EF actually have tanks fighting in certain battles, and Zeon also put ground soldiers on the field (soldiers with guns) too. I saw the a collection of Zeon soldier figures.
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Old 2007-02-10, 21:42   Link #16
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Couple things you can improve upon those mobile suits. First, they need not to be so large. Of course, as you and I are both aware, they are sizes of skyscrapers, but I doubt its necessary.
You have absolutely no sense of scale. For reference, the F22 is longer than a Zaku is tall. Your average OYW mobile suit can comfortably hide(Visually) in most forests and in any urban area with average sized apartment buildings.

As for their usefullness on the ground during the OYW, they failed miserably against conventional armor and aircraft in the open, however held on into the last days of the war in less friendly terrain like the jungles of Southeast Asia or mountains like those in Afghanistan that chewed up the great mechanized army of the Soviet Union and spat it out.
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Old 2007-02-10, 22:51   Link #17
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Originally Posted by Fome
These are worn by an individual and detect electrical impulses from the nerves associated with various muscles, and then the joints move according to these impulses. I've seen a prototype in Popular Science, and it allows the user to lift loads of significant weight, while retaining the mobility of a humanoid form. The article wrote that it was being designed for construction applications, but the military was interested as well.
I'd normally take Popular Science articles with a grain of salt as they have a tendency for undue optimism. However, exoskeleton designs are a fascinating idea, and may well see some sort of application in the near future. The question is going to be whether they'll turn out to offer advantages over forklifts and the like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fome
Rather than being the "tanks" of the battlefield, armored exoskeleton-wearing soldiers would act as fast strike forces, being able to run faster and carry bigger loads than conventional infantry. Kinda cool i think.
This is pretty much what Tak and I brought up. I think that power-armored infantry would be a good supplement to standard infantry: their biggest advantage would be to mount heavier armor and heavier weapons. I don't think that they could act like a fast-strike unit because of the inherent slowness of legged drivetrains.

Quote:
Originally Posted by krzglue2
Well, there is a Gundam Musou Game going to release for PS3 (I think is Japanese version), develop by Koei and it is just like Dynasty Warrior, instead of men fighting it switch to Gundam fighting on a map, the game has many mecha in it (some say they even have Turn A in it.). I tink it give you some idea of what might look like in real battle.
Gundam games and shows are not at all indicative of how a real battle with mecha would look. While I like the Musou series of games, they make absolutely no attempt to be realistic.

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Originally Posted by Commander 598
You have absolutely no sense of scale. For reference, the F22 is longer than a Zaku is tall. Your average OYW mobile suit can comfortably hide(Visually) in most forests and in any urban area with average sized apartment buildings.
I'm afraid that you're the one with no sense of scale. Comparing the dimensions of ground vehicles to aircraft is misleading because the target profile of aircraft is fairly irrelevant. Here's a reference picture that works a little better:


The tank in the picture is a M1 Abrams, and yes, it's about as small a target (from the front) as a Zaku II's foot. If we take an average storey to be about 8' tall, a Zaku II will be over 7 storeys tall. Good luck hiding something like that anywhere aside from skyscrapers or apartment complexes. While it wouldn't be impossible to hide a mobile suit in a forest and the like, it's still a lot easier to spot one than to spot something like a tank.

Offtopic:
It's probably worth noting that the F-22 has about the same dimensions (and incidentally the same mass) as a B-17 bomber from World War II.
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Old 2007-02-10, 22:55   Link #18
krzglue2
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I am just suggesting. But they does show stats of how a MS against a tank in 0079, there is why the EF create MS for Operation V
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Old 2007-02-10, 23:32   Link #19
M_Flores
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I was also thinking... how would Gundam battleships fare in real life? Like White Base, Albion, Archangel etc.?
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Old 2007-02-10, 23:50   Link #20
Commander 598
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Quote:
The tank in the picture is a M1 Abrams, and yes, it's about as small a target (from the front) as a Zaku II's foot. If we take an average storey to be about 8' tall, a Zaku II will be over 7 storeys tall. Good luck hiding something like that anywhere aside from skyscrapers or apartment complexes. While it wouldn't be impossible to hide a mobile suit in a forest and the like, it's still a lot easier to spot one than to spot something like a tank.
They can crouch you know, though that would make it pretty immobile, and the Magella is way too small. I saw model boxart for the Hildolfr that had a Magella at almost crotch level with a Zaku which is about right considering how close one was to the Ez8.

Stats for the F22:
Length 62.08 feet, 18.90 meters
Height 16.67 feet, 5.08 meters
Wingspan 44.5 feet, 13.56 meters

According to Wikipedia, a meter is equal to 3.281 feet. Doing the math (height in meters X 3.281) a Zaku II is 57.4175 feet tall. By your calculations of 8 feet per storey we get 7.1771875. So your right...

But my point is that mobile suits are often made out to be outright ludicrous in size and sitting ducks because of it when they can find cover without much trouble.(Igloo Ep 2, and that was open terrain!)

What's interesting to note is that all the images of the F22 certainly don't make it out to be as big as it actually is...either that or your Abrams is out of scale on that pic.

Didn't know that about the B17...
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