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Old 2007-06-27, 21:23   Link #381
MakubeX2
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Join Date: Oct 2004
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As requested :-

Before :-


After :-


Of course, there's her racy comments about comparing Aoki's manhood to Reiji's and her masturbating to that.
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Old 2007-06-27, 21:29   Link #382
Vexx
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As suspected, it looks a LOT different in context.
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Old 2007-06-28, 00:30   Link #383
Thany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Thany, the only thing you accomplish with that sort of black'n'white stance is to end up standing all by yourself. Opinions are on a spectrum, not two boxes. Kyuusei sees the value of the story but wonders why the odd bits of sexualized imagery which seems incongruous with the core story. You're basically telling people to shut up and go away who are interested in the story.
I don't see how what I said was wrong, after all he's not forced to read the manga and I'm just inviting him to stop reading the manga if the nudity disturbs his mind so much
In general, if something in a manga trouble you that much, you're always welcome to not read it and stop bitching about the nudity, because we've had had almost one page only off that (well I'm also a bit responsible for replying to him, but it just annoys me).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx
You're being as knee-jerk as the ANN crowd when the KnJ appreciation tent has room for a variety of interests.
You failed yet again.
All he did was dramawhore about the loli nudity, it's kinda annoying and it causes drama most of the time and thanks god, the whole thread didn't become another 'what's loli?' thread because of the consecutives posts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx
People complained about Kanon having H-scenes that detracted from the core story as well.
Didn't watch Kanon, but I still believe they weren't right and when I see that there are peoples who go as far as make an all age version patch for the PC game, I'm feeling kind of sad: if you don't like the H, skip it (Control?) or buy the PS All Ages version

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyuusai
to dismiss it so simply as "just fanservice, plain and simple"
Well I didn't go as far as to mean that, it could have hidden meanings of course, but it also happens to be fanservice, like the famous transformation scene in Nanoha that seemed to make some peoples bitch in the anime thread about it ^^

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyuusai
It's that sort of oversimplification that caused the ANN community reaction in the first place
Well what's funny is that it only caused it in ANN, so the problems comes from ANN and not anywhere else, so if ANN didn't exist, even this oversimplification wouldn't have changed anything of the sale or not

@MakubeX2's image
It's totally obvious it would have been something like this
And it's totally obvious when the scanlation of this chapter comes out you'll see peoples posting this image out of context anyway, but even out of context it's kind of obvious the teacher isn't the one at fault anyway.
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:25   Link #384
FatPianoBoy
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What Vexx was saying, Thany, was that the only real difference between you and the ANN crowd is the side of the fence; you both just go through passionate rants that ultimately don't hold water.
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:30   Link #385
Thany
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Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy View Post
What Vexx was saying, Thany, was that the only real difference between you and the ANN crowd is the side of the fence; you both just go through passionate rants that ultimately don't hold water.
Well my rant hold more waters than theirs, it's called 'if you don't like it, don't read it' and I wasn't really passionate like Hayumi was, I'm just telling some peoples to stop ranting everytime they see nudity, it's annoying to see a thread filled with that.
Well it's not basically a rant though, the only ones ranting are the one whinning because of the nudity that was there.
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:31   Link #386
Vexx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thany View Post
I don't see how what I said was wrong, after all he's not forced to read the manga and I'm just inviting him to stop reading the manga if the nudity disturbs his mind so much
You're intentionally misrepresenting what he posted and you have an odd way of 'inviting' people to go away. But people can read what he wrote.

Quote:
You failed yet again.
All he did was dramawhore about the loli nudity, it's kinda annoying and it causes drama most of the time and thanks god, the whole thread didn't become another 'what's loli?' thread because of the consecutives posts.
This kind of response is why you end up pissing off people who might otherwise agree with you. I say it is you who are failing, repeatedly, by antagonizing people trying to discuss the story (merits and flaws). Virtually everyone here supports the series and yet you spend your time focusing on anything less than totally pure in your eyes. It smacks of zealotry and it antithetical to amiable discussion. Stop for a second to consider what they say and explain things so that they no longer misunderstand. The ANN crowd and then SSE started taking the stance that *anyone* who defended KnJ was a pedophile in a blatant attempt to stop any debate on the subject. In the reverse way, labeling someone as "part of the ANN crowd" does the same thing.

Quote:
Didn't watch Kanon, but I still believe they weren't right and when I see that there are peoples who go as far as make an all age version patch for the PC game, I'm feeling kind of sad: if you don't like the H, skip it (Control?) or buy the PS All Ages version
I was referring to the original game. And its the software maker that later produced an all-ages PC version to increase sales. Since you're not familiar with the storyline though, your 'belief' is kind of irrelevant, eh? Most lovers of the game seem to think the game's H content was a marketeering decision as it doesn't really fit into the stories. You're deciding its okay without having seen it... ... ... ...

Quote:
Well I didn't go as far as to mean that, it could have hidden meanings of course, but it also happens to be fanservice, like the famous transformation scene in Nanoha that seemed to make some peoples bitch in the anime thread about it ^^
<shrug> Nanoha is a magical girl show, of course there's going to be a transformation. The nice thing about that series is that they don't waste half of every episode on it and instead actually tell a story.

Quote:
Well what's funny is that it only caused it in ANN, so the problems comes from ANN and not anywhere else, so if ANN didn't exist, even this oversimplification wouldn't have changed anything of the sale or not
Here's something we pretty much agree on.... it was ANN's intentional misrepresentation that started this ball rolling. Then (speculation) the CEO screwed up by overblowing the situation to the distributors, who naturally shied away from any potential risk. Then SSE had to cover their ass with some rather pathetic assertions, leaving one to wonder that maybe though they may 'read' japanese, they don't *READ* literature well.

Quote:
@MakubeX2's image
It's totally obvious it would have been something like this
And it's totally obvious when the scanlation of this chapter comes out you'll see peoples posting this image out of context anyway, but even out of context it's kind of obvious the teacher isn't the one at fault anyway.
The only thing that had me suspicious that it might be a doujinshi or something off-base was that last frame and the onomatopeia. And once he provided the source (so I knew it was real) and the context -- yes, it'll be another image which makes sense in context but can be used to scare someone or shut them up.
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:48   Link #387
Risaa
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I am SICK of hearing "well this" "well that" statements. Arguing back is just contributing to the rant that you're trying to stop -- if you had just not replied, then none of this would be happening.

Now, PLEASE STOP ARGUING, FOR GODS SAKE. I'm SICK OF IT.
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:51   Link #388
Thany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
You're intentionally misrepresenting what he posted and you have an odd way of 'inviting' people to go away. But people can read what he wrote.
I'm not doing it intentionally, it's what it looks like to me. I dunno to the others but to me it sounded like a rant at some point inside his posts, not all of them, but some of them seemed so to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
This kind of response is why you end up pissing off people who might otherwise agree with you. I say it is you who are failing, repeatedly, by antagonizing people trying to discuss the story (merits and flaws).
You obviously failed to see my point. I'm not trying to make leave peoples, just trying to make them understand that it's not all white (and/or dark) and that it'd be nice if we could have less 'omg child nudity' and more discussion on the story without having the need to bait peoples like XXX and YYY to create a new loli flamwar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I was referring to the original game. Since you're not familiar with it, your 'belief' is kind of irrelevant, eh? Most lovers of the game seem to think the game's H content was a marketeering decision as it doesn't really fit into the stories. You're deciding its okay without having seen it... ... ... ...
You don't see my point: the point is it's there, what can they do about it? Nothing. All they can to is get the PS version which was made specially for the peoples who didn't want the H (plus I heard it has more than the PC version too), so why do they have to keep pestering about something they don't need to see, it was after all an erogame therefore had ero content.
It was the choice of the company to make it at first 18+ while it is also their choice to make their next game All Ages (also I'd react the same way if I were to see peoples crying about the fact that Little Busters is All Ages).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
The only thing that had me suspicious that it might be a doujinshi or something off-base was that last frame and the onomatopeia. And once he provided the source (so I knew it was real) and the context -- yes, it'll be another image which makes sense in context but is used to scare someone.
True it could have been a doujin too, but somehow given the look of the teacher and the artstyle I could guess it was from the original^^
And these sort of single images are usually used to shock, I've seen plenty single images like that, it's like a 'let's take the funny part and show them off out of context to make peoples interpret'.
Of course, if you know the manga and you know it's from the manga for sure, you can't really misinterpret it, since the story has always been following this kind of pace anyway

Quote:
Originally Posted by Risaa
I am SICK of hearing "well this" "well that" statements. Arguing back is just contributing to the rant that you're trying to stop -- if you had just not replied, then none of this would be happening.

Now, PLEASE STOP ARGUING, FOR GODS SAKE. I'm SICK OF IT.
Well at least the argument kinda changed of way if you ask me, but it's usually really hard for someone to just not quote back if they think there is something else to say about it or not
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Old 2007-06-28, 01:54   Link #389
Vexx
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Aye.... Risaa, sorry about any contribution I made to a derail.
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Old 2007-06-28, 02:11   Link #390
Risaa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thany View Post
Well at least the argument kinda changed of way if you ask me, but it's usually really hard for someone to just not quote back if they think there is something else to say about it or not
I know the feeling, but it's kind of like... have you ever had a sibling who just won't shut up? Everything you say gets a "no you" out of them, and it drives you crazy? The best thing to do is just ignore them, no matter how insane they make you. And then they stop. (And just start kicking you or something, but that's a different matter.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Aye.... Risaa, sorry about any contribution I made to a derail.
Ah.. no worries. Here, take a RL cookie as a token of friendship. *now goes off feeling guilty* ;_;

Even though I'm not following the story, I like to hang out in this thread for the discussion. So... this argument is really getting to me because nothing is getting accomplished, and especially because people are no longer discussion the story but rather the morality of scenes from the manga.

Ok.. I'm sorry I lost my head a few posts up.
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Last edited by Risaa; 2007-06-28 at 02:13. Reason: Actually I'd say I went more of a "snapped Mai" on you guys (she goes berserk). Not that I think anyone here is into Mai-HiME
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Old 2007-06-28, 02:34   Link #391
Thany
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Originally Posted by Risaa View Post
Even though I'm not following the story, I like to hang out in this thread for the discussion. So... this argument is really getting to me because nothing is getting accomplished, and especially because people are no longer discussion the story but rather the morality of scenes from the manga.
So far about 2 pages have been completly out of the story discussion and I'm still wondering why is Aoki still Rin's teacher in 4th grade
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Old 2007-06-28, 02:46   Link #392
Vexx
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Actually, I'm wondering if this is some special kind of school for problem children. They don't have a uniform and they seem to have a lot of other unusual practices. It may be that a teacher is assigned to a group and follows them. I haven't found any examples of 'problem children' schools though by googling about school practices in Japan.

I'm still trying to figure out the brunette teacher and what she's got stuck up her craw. I parse that she's a parallel to Kuro (like Rin is to Hoin) -- angry and dark clouds go with her. But I've not gotten to the end of volume 3 translating to see what she says to freak everyone out.
No don't tell me, I'll get there. I don't think that was terribly spoilerish since I've no idea what she's ranting about (and she rants a lot throughout the volumes).
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Old 2007-06-28, 02:57   Link #393
FatPianoBoy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
Actually, I'm wondering if this is some special kind of school for problem children. They don't have a uniform and they seem to have a lot of other unusual practices. It may be that a teacher is assigned to a group and follows them. I haven't found any examples of 'problem children' schools though by googling about school practices in Japan.
Kids in elementary school don't wear uniforms. The kids from Kyou no Go no ni didn't, either.
I may be wrong, but I believe the teachers visit classes of students in Japan rather than students visiting a teacher's class in America. Also, the homeroom teachers are not grade-specific like in American elementary schools. Yukari followed the Azumanga crew for three years, after all...
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Old 2007-06-28, 03:07   Link #394
Risaa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I'm still trying to figure out the brunette teacher and what she's got stuck up her craw. I parse that she's a parallel to Kuro (like Rin is to Hoin) -- angry and dark clouds go with her. But I've not gotten to the end of volume 3 translating to see what she says to freak everyone out.
No don't tell me, I'll get there. I don't think that was terribly spoilerish since I've no idea what she's ranting about (and she rants a lot throughout the volumes).
I'm curious about her as well... She's just screaming "I have a tragic story to tell".

Quote:
Originally Posted by FatPianoBoy View Post
Kids in elementary school don't wear uniforms. The kids from Kyou no Go no ni didn't, either.
I may be wrong, but I believe the teachers visit classes of students in Japan rather than students visiting a teacher's class in America. Also, the homeroom teachers are not grade-specific like in American elementary schools. Yukari followed the Azumanga crew for three years, after all...
You're right about the teachers moving between the classes instead of the students. Really cuts down on some of the problems that are here in the U.S. (kids use the time between classes to escape and skip class is the big one). It's the same in Korea.

I wasn't aware elementary school kids didn't have uniforms.... I thought they all wore little yellow hats and yellow jackety-things. Now I need to find a picture to refer to so you won't think I'm crazy.

Edit: Aah... found this on Answers.com (I've been having trouble with Wikipedia all day):
Quote:
In many areas, elementary school students do not need to wear a uniform to school. Where uniforms are required, many boys wear white shirts, shorts, and caps. The uniform codes may change depending on the season to work with the environment and occasion; young boys often dress more formally in their class picture than if they were in a class in the normal time of the school year. Girls' uniforms might include a grey pleated skirt and white blouse. Both boys and girls wear brightly coloured caps to prevent traffic accidents.
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Old 2007-06-28, 03:13   Link #395
Vexx
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Ah... I'm completely unfamiliar with how the elementary grades are handled. Yeah, the teacher shifting instead of students sounds like a lot more sense

Everytime I've seen elem kids they've had those yellow duck clothes but it may be that they just wear those for outings.
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Old 2007-06-28, 03:47   Link #396
bleakessence
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Quote:
You're right about the teachers moving between the classes instead of the students. Really cuts down on some of the problems that are here in the U.S. (kids use the time between classes to escape and skip class is the big one). It's the same in Korea.
Hey... that's how things are done in our country as well. Elementary and high-school students (we skip junior-high ) usually sit in one classroom and wait for the teacher to move between the classes. It's in college that the students get up and move to the assigned classroom for the next subject... teachers don't get their own rooms
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Old 2007-06-28, 04:05   Link #397
Risaa
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Originally Posted by bleakessence View Post
Hey... that's how things are done in our country as well.
What country is that?

It just makes a whole lot more sense, actually. I wish it were done like that here too.
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Old 2007-06-28, 04:20   Link #398
Anh_Minh
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In France, we're fair. The teachers don't get a room, the classes don't get a room, everybody moves around.
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Old 2007-06-28, 07:18   Link #399
bleakessence
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@Risaa
Quote:
What country is that?
The Philippines ... we're a remote and obscure collection of islands just a stone's throw from Japan and Korea. (A REALLY long stone's throw, though XD )

@Anh_Minh
That's the system most commonly used for our tertiary-level/college-level schooling... although the school assigns the rooms for specific subjects at specific times of the day.

----
I'm just curious... how old is the usual age-bracket of Japanese high-schools? Sometimes, HS students as portrayed in some anime seem older... almost around 17-20 years old. Other times, they seem pretty young: around 13-16 years old.
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Old 2007-06-28, 08:44   Link #400
mdauben
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Originally Posted by bleakessence View Post
I'm just curious... how old is the usual age-bracket of Japanese high-schools?
I believe that both junior high and high school in Japan are three years long. So, junior high corsponds to grades 7-8-9, and high school coresponds to grades 10-11-12. (In other words, a first year HS student in Japan is the same age as a HS Sophomore in the US) So, high school students would normally be around 16 in their first year of high school, and 18 in their last year.

Quote:
Sometimes, HS students as portrayed in some anime seem older... almost around 17-20 years old. Other times, they seem pretty young: around 13-16 years old.
Eh, that's just anime. If they want to make the characters more cute and innocent, they will look younger than normal HS student. if they want to make them more sexy and mature, they will look older. It's just about impossible to accuratly judge an anime character's age based on their appearance.

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Originally Posted by Vexx View Post
I parse that she's a parallel to Kuro (like Rin is to Hoin)
I actually thought of Hoin as more of an adult parallel to Usa. Overdeveloped but shy and rather innocent. Other than the fact that both Hoin and Rin are "interested" in Aoki, they really don't have much in common, do they?
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