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Old 2010-05-25, 05:54   Link #1401
Darknemo2000
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Tsunderes are the best. Most girls just cannot match them, and naturally tsunderes are becoming more dominant in anime because they show some class and are much better character to build romance and keep it tensed.

Soft, perfect waifu types are just way too boring.
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Old 2010-05-25, 11:18   Link #1402
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Hmm, I don't think it's a matter of Tsuderes being better or worse than another character type, it's just that some Tsuderes are better than others. Tsundere is fine to use as a base, but if you don't build anything on top of that they can get annoying. Which is pretty much the case with any character type. An example of a good Tsudere would be someone like Kuro, who is a decently developed character who has some Tsundere tendencies.
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Old 2010-05-25, 13:08   Link #1403
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Kuro isn't a tsundere.
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Old 2010-05-25, 13:23   Link #1404
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CantQuiteGuess View Post
Hmm, I don't think it's a matter of Tsuderes being better or worse than another character type, it's just that some Tsuderes are better than others. Tsundere is fine to use as a base, but if you don't build anything on top of that they can get annoying. Which is pretty much the case with any character type. An example of a good Tsudere would be someone like Kuro, who is a decently developed character who has some Tsundere tendencies.
Kuro is hard to call a tsundere. I would call Horo or Hitagi a tsundere, but kuro dont know... And I would prefer Louise as a well build tsundere she seemed shallow at first but as volumes went buy she developed quite nicely and is adorable in volume 18. Of course in Anime she was a horrible character but again anime screwed up everything in general to begin with.

Horo would be another not annoying tsundere. In fact the only tsunderes that I could not stand were Suzuka, Taiga and that girl from Lock On... those are the ones I could not stand no matter how I tried.

For me the tsundere basis still works better than most characters. If anything it at least gives a strong character.
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Old 2010-05-25, 21:23   Link #1405
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for me only a few Tsundere is acceptable, one is Mikoto Misaka...the other? just like them....childish.

And may be because my Hitman training (to infiltrate without attract attention) I didn't like "currently popular" things including Tsundere.
That's why even when there's a bunch of popular Tsundere fans in some thread, I oppose them..

List of Detestable Tsundere IMO:
- Hinagiku Katsura (Hayate no Gotoku)
- Yui Kotegawa (I call her Bukkakegawa Yuri) to LOVE ru
- Serizawa Fumino (Mayoi neko Overrun!)
- Louise the Zero (Zero no Tsukaima)
- Kampfer Akane Mishima (Kampfer)
- etc (you can add all Tsundere name you know)
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Old 2010-05-26, 03:20   Link #1406
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Akane Mishima is hardly a tsundere just like Kuro in here and you made a list of characters I like (apart from Akane). Obviously you never read Zero No Tsukaima you just watched Zero No Tsukaima alternative (aka anime) so it is understandable, well anyways I find the soft, genki characters much more detestable than anything you have on your list.
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Old 2010-05-26, 03:26   Link #1407
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edited. I really needa read recent posts lol.

the problem is 'tsundere' is so overused these days that it is rather stereotyped and categorised now. the general meaning is 'stuck up chick who softens up over course of story' but there are many variations as people try and break away form the mould. most

wait wth you listed Hinagiku as tsundere DETESTABLE???? RAEG11@1
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Old 2010-05-26, 04:58   Link #1408
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
Kuro is hard to call a tsundere. I would call Horo or Hitagi a tsundere, but kuro dont know... And I would prefer Louise as a well build tsundere she seemed shallow at first but as volumes went buy she developed quite nicely and is adorable in volume 18. Of course in Anime she was a horrible character but again anime screwed up everything in general to begin with.

Horo would be another not annoying tsundere. In fact the only tsunderes that I could not stand were Suzuka, Taiga and that girl from Lock On... those are the ones I could not stand no matter how I tried.

For me the tsundere basis still works better than most characters. If anything it at least gives a strong character.
I only mentioned Kuro to try and keep this thread on topic lol. I personally would flip Louise and Taiga in tsunderes I liked. While Louise was more developed in the novel, her and every other character seems to have to sacrifice something to keep the harem aspect alive, even though the story would do much better without it. Whereas I felt Taiga broke through the tsundere cliche, partly because she had a crush on someone other then the male lead for most of the series, and because once she realized who she really liked she was never really deredere about it. As for her violent personality, that just added to the interplay between her and Ryuji. More than being a likeable tsundere, I found Taiga to be a likeable character.
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Old 2010-05-26, 06:57   Link #1409
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seitsuki View Post

wait wth you listed Hinagiku as tsundere DETESTABLE???? RAEG11@1
well..I wonder my self.............
like I said before Tsundere (except a few of them) is DETESTABLE
and Tsundere + Pettan is more than DETESTABLE to me.....like Hinagiku Katsura to Hayate...including Kuro-chan to Aoki in this manga.

I'd prefer Tsundere+normal Boobs like Maria+Hayate than Tsundere+Pettan like Hayate + Hinagiku, but even that pair is no match to Hayate+Athena Tennos (one of few Tsundere I like)

and .....
In this manga I like Tsundere Shiro+Oyajima
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Old 2010-05-26, 10:53   Link #1410
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Maria is not a tsundere. Just a girl with attitude.

Horo, Sheryl or Hitagi. though some doubt them being a tsunderes (though I think they are, they are just using teasing and smirk as their methods instead of usual tsundere anger and physical damage methods) are much more tsunderess than Maria .

I completely hate Taiga and Suzuka. Taiga didnt broke any tsundere standarts but being a moe-blob at the end. She was just as shallow at the end though, besides she didnt even like Ryuji up until the end so her tsun made her not a tsundere but quite simply a grumpy bitch or a parasite living off the kindness of others.

Louise at least was able to develop behind her noble upbringings to value the friendship and love more than her noble tittles and ritches. She was never afraid to die for Saito or go up against her family, even country and the queen for his sake as well.

Besides lets not forget that Louise's partner is Saito - a dumb pervert who hardly has any good features but having a constant hard on and willing to fuck everything that moves.

Ryuji on the other hand is a decent guy - not a retard, has some freaky issues about cleanness but you really cannot compare to the shit that Saito pulls. So pair up Louise with him and you would see even better Louise. And pair up Taiga with Saito and you would see that the way Louise treats him is actually nice compared to what Taiga would do in such situation (Louise is pretty nice girl when she is not provoked, and Ryouji almost never provoked or did anything wrong to Taiga, while Saito just keeps screwing up with other girls or doing wrong to Louise for the most part).

Taiga just felt bland compared to Louise, she hardly ever was a tsundere, for the most part she was just egoistical bitch and then switched to cute sugar moe-blob. Really Taiga is one of those rare tsundere's that I completely and utterly dislike.

Kuro in Kodomo No Jikan is hardly a tsundere as well though lately she does show some promise to be a tsundere, but it would take time and more tsun-and-especially-dere scenes for me to consider her as one.
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Old 2010-05-26, 11:09   Link #1411
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@Darknemo - All's I can say to that is I completely disagree about Taiga, we obviously have two very different outlooks on her character. Gotta ask if you've read the novel though, as you can't really compare novel Louise to anime Taiga.

As far as ZnT goes, I do know how horrible of a character Saito is. I'd say his being such a horrible character hurts Louise in the long run, as he always gives her reasons to resort the her old abusive ways and it got to a point where it just became to repetitive. My biggest gripe with the novel is while the author is good at writing a nice fantasy story, he's not that good at portraying interpersonal relationships between characters.
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Old 2010-05-26, 12:36   Link #1412
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Horo and Hitagi are what I call 'ijideres'. Not really that tsun, IMO.

But keeping this on topic, I think Shiro-chan counts as a tsundere... though she has nearly zero experience unleashing the dere side.
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Old 2010-05-26, 14:22   Link #1413
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tsun means being aloof and certainly Horo is like that with Lawrence from time to time, sure it is just a jabbing calling him a fool and similar stuff, but it is still a tsun method (it is called a smirk) even though it lacks the usual aggressiveness like your usual one. Thats why I cannot understand the poeple who start creating new terms like kuudere or others because basically it is still a tsundere just with not usual tsun but is still tsun and you can hide your feelings behind flirt just as well as behind the anger.

I did read Toradora novels but was not able to finish them, not because I did not like the plot or characters but because I hated the writing style itself, I always had to fight with myself to read another page because I hated the sentences structure and words she used when she wrote the novel so eventually I juts dropped it.

Once Shiro-chan starts showing her dere side more them maybe. But you have to remember for a person to be a tsundere you need to be both tsun and dere in a same relationship (towards the same person) or else if you are tsun to one person and dere to another then you are just a bitch to one person and nice to another.
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Old 2010-05-26, 16:37   Link #1414
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Without going into who fits what label, I like women who tease the guy they like, like Horo or Hitagi. They make life interesting. OTOH, I consider women who cover up their embarrassment by being physically abusive with their partner as not worth anyone's time.
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Old 2010-05-27, 10:36   Link #1415
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I really LOLED at this chapter at the look on Kuro's face when Oyajima just picked her up instead of being shocked by her panty flash.

Spoiler for Kuro FAIL!!:

Quote:
If we look past our desire to relate to Aoki as a lolicon, you can actually see he's a pretty normal guy and INCREDIBLY attracted to Houin-sensei. He's shy so he's subtle about doing anything, but clearly into it.
You think? o_o It seems to me like he barely notices her nowadays.
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Old 2010-05-27, 16:23   Link #1416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiibi View Post
I really LOLED at this chapter at the look on Kuro's face when Oyajima just picked her up instead of being shocked by her panty flash.

Spoiler for Kuro FAIL!!:



You think? o_o It seems to me like he barely notices her nowadays.
Well I would say it's because he's a pretty damn big KY. I mean come on, this guy wouldn't catch the mood if he walked into a bar with all the women flirting with him.
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Old 2010-05-30, 22:00   Link #1417
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A ravished Shirai is fine, too. She was at the complete opposite end of the spectrum this chapter; very cute.

Houin wants it so bad...
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Old 2010-06-23, 15:58   Link #1418
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Spoiler for Chapter 62:
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Old 2010-06-23, 16:40   Link #1419
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The last page..... mark incoming disaster....... from strict Megane-Shiro pan...I mean Shirai-chan

Rin line: "You're next kuro-chan" sent some chill to the back of my neck...Rin sure a perfect example of Masegaki - Loli
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Old 2010-06-23, 17:00   Link #1420
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I got to page 9 and stopped for awhile...

The whole Aoki and Reiji interaction thing is starting to be a little.......disturbing...
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