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Old 2010-08-22, 07:09   Link #2321
Arkeus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
Well, the entry for the Warring Ages on the same page says something about Belkans expanding their territory by invading other countries (presumably on their own homeworld) and worlds. Looks like an empire to me. Of course, when Belka itself was lost, the empire probably fell apart and the never-ending reunification war began, which Olivie stopped by getting herself killed and hiding away the Cradle.
Well, Ixpelia was then post-homeworld?

Because it sounded like she was just 'one' of many kings of her era.
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Old 2010-08-22, 07:11   Link #2322
Anh_Minh
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Many? I thought there were a Big Three. And possibly countless warlords.
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Old 2010-08-22, 07:48   Link #2323
Koveras Alvane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkeus View Post
Well, Ixpelia was then post-homeworld?

Because it sounded like she was just 'one' of many kings of her era.
Well, as she explains herself, she was never actually a ruler, despite her titles. It is possible that the Galeans invented the Mariage system, crowned Ixy their Dark King, started a rebellion, and rampaged around until the Belkans found a way to put Ixy to sleep. Such rebellions probably happened every few years within a sufficiently large empire.

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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Many? I thought there were a Big Three. And possibly countless warlords.
Well, empires often have so-called "client kings", who remain sovereigns in their own lands as long as they submit to the metropoly. Though Invgalt probably wasn't one, since Shutra by the end of the Belkan era is described as an ally of Belka powerful enough to demand political hostages.

Also, it does confuse the hell out of me that Carim lists Ingvalt, Olivie, and Ixpellia in the same sentence. Einhart says in ViVid that Ingvalt (and Olivie, of course), lived about a hundred years before present (which roughly corresponds to the current length of the Mid-Childan calender). On the other hand, Ixy claims in SSX to be over 1000 years old (disc 2, track 19), which means that she first ruled Galea before the Belkan Empire was established (before the time of the Kaisers and while Al-Hazard was still accessible, see disc 2, track 3). Unless she "ruled" continuously, or awakened sporadically during these thousand years (or awakened briefly during Olivie's lifetime), she couldn't have possibly occupied the same timeslot as the other two. And IF that were the case, you'd think that there would be more info on Ixpellia and Mariage than just a brief note in the Infinity Library, considering how the story of Olivie and Ingvalt is practically taught in schools...
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Old 2010-08-22, 08:26   Link #2324
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Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
Well, as she explains herself, she was never actually a ruler, despite her titles. It is possible that the Galeans invented the Mariage system, crowned Ixy their Dark King, started a rebellion, and rampaged around until the Belkans found a way to put Ixy to sleep. Such rebellions probably happened every few years within a sufficiently large empire.
possibly, though the way i understood it she was just one of many doing such 'rebellions', so i think be suprised if there was never any real 'over-ruler' for more than a few decades

Quote:

Also, it does confuse the hell out of me that Carim lists Ingvalt, Olivie, and Ixpellia in the same sentence. Einhart says in ViVid that Ingvalt (and Olivie, of course), lived about a hundred years before present (which roughly corresponds to the current length of the Mid-Childan calender). On the other hand, Ixy claims in SSX to be over 1000 years old (disc 2, track 19), which means that she first ruled Galea before the Belkan Empire was established (before the time of the Kaisers and while Al-Hazard was still accessible, see disc 2, track 3). Unless she "ruled" continuously, or awakened sporadically during these thousand years (or awakened briefly during Olivie's lifetime), she couldn't have possibly occupied the same timeslot as the other two. And IF that were the case, you'd think that there would be more info on Ixpellia and Mariage than just a brief note in the Infinity Library, considering how the story of Olivie and Ingvalt is practically taught in schools...
IX and Marriage were implied to wake up again and again no?

In fact, IX flat out said she was before Vivio's time.

Also, keep in mind that Einhart's phrase of 'one century of regret' can as well mean 'Ingvalt regretted that for almost a century (while alive), especially when you remember Olivie was flat out said to have died 300 years ago in StrikerS.
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Old 2010-08-22, 09:06   Link #2325
Koveras Alvane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkeus View Post
possibly, though the way i understood it she was just one of many doing such 'rebellions', so i think be suprised if there was never any real 'over-ruler' for more than a few decades
Well, the Sankt Kaisers may have been the formal rulers of the Empire but it actually consisted of many small kingdoms, like the Holy Roman Empire, or something. Though AFAIK HRE was more preoccupied with defending itself from outside threats (which Belkans didn't have, as far as we know) than internal struggles. I am no expert on European history, though.

Quote:
IX and Marriage were implied to wake up again and again no?
Yes, but you'd think someone recorded an army of zombies rivaling the combined might of the Belkan knights, if they actually appeared... However, the only references to Mariage that Vivio finds in the Infiinity library are from 1000 years ago and Toredia's involvement with them.

Quote:
Also, keep in mind that Einhart's phrase of 'one century of regret' can as well mean 'Ingvalt regretted that for almost a century (while alive), especially when you remember Olivie was flat out said to have died 300 years ago in StrikerS.
Episode number and time in, please?
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Old 2010-08-22, 09:14   Link #2326
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
Also, it does confuse the hell out of me that Carim lists Ingvalt, Olivie, and Ixpellia in the same sentence. Einhart says in ViVid that Ingvalt (and Olivie, of course), lived about a hundred years before present (which roughly corresponds to the current length of the Mid-Childan calender). On the other hand, Ixy claims in SSX to be over 1000 years old (disc 2, track 19), which means that she first ruled Galea before the Belkan Empire was established (before the time of the Kaisers and while Al-Hazard was still accessible, see disc 2, track 3). Unless she "ruled" continuously, or awakened sporadically during these thousand years (or awakened briefly during Olivie's lifetime), she couldn't have possibly occupied the same timeslot as the other two. And IF that were the case, you'd think that there would be more info on Ixpellia and Mariage than just a brief note in the Infinity Library, considering how the story of Olivie and Ingvalt is practically taught in schools...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkeus View Post
IX and Marriage were implied to wake up again and again no?

In fact, IX flat out said she was before Vivio's time.

Also, keep in mind that Einhart's phrase of 'one century of regret' can as well mean 'Ingvalt regretted that for almost a century (while alive), especially when you remember Olivie was flat out said to have died 300 years ago in StrikerS.
Yeah... the most likely explanation that comes to me is that the Galeans created Ix and the Mariage system 1,000 years ago, but probably kept Ixpellia in suspended animation except when they actually had a war to fight. The Mariage were nigh-uncontrollable, right? They would almost certainly turn on the Galeans if they didn't have a more obvious enemy to deal with.

As for why they used Ixpellia during the Unification War and not to prevent being conquered by the Belkans in the first place... a few thoughts come to mind. Maybe Belka originally conquered them before the system was discovered, and they didn't see the point of using it in a revolution until the Empire was fragmented enough that they had a reasonable shot at gaining independence. Or the original Belkan Empire conquered them in spite of Ixpellia, being an interstellar empire vs. one world.
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Old 2010-08-22, 23:15   Link #2327
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Maybe it's time to move this out of the QA thread.
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Old 2010-08-22, 23:26   Link #2328
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Question: During SSX, Disc 2, Track 7 when Ginga and Cinque visited Jail, did they do so in person or was it some sort of video phone conversation?

Also, if someone could clarify that the jailed Numbers and Jail himself stayed in the same prison building (different cells obviously), that would be appreciated.
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Old 2010-08-23, 00:22   Link #2329
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i believe there were a few prisons and they were split up to some degree, but i forget just what is what. hmm might be 5 pages back or so, search this thread for prison

http://s30.photobucket.com/albums/c3...current=02.jpg

found it. Hmm, havn't checked, but this should be on the nanowiki or should be hmm
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Old 2010-08-23, 01:58   Link #2330
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@Yasanagi: From my understanding they visited the prison personally. Though, whether it was a video link in that building or not I'm unsure of. The quality of the transmission in that case isn't any different from normal speech so I'd deem that improbable.

And they were probably in different cells. I say this due to StrikerS ending and the way the conversation goes in SSX.
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Old 2010-08-23, 05:25   Link #2331
Tiresias
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Originally Posted by Moczo View Post
Is there a difference? I think the entire TSAB is the military; they're not actually the government of their member worlds, they're a police force sponsored by the governments of their member worlds.

I think. This is just the impression I got, so if I'm wrong somebody correct me...
Hmm, so I guess there was never any mention on who the TSAB answers to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
Well, the Sankt Kaisers may have been the formal rulers of the Empire but it actually consisted of many small kingdoms, like the Holy Roman Empire, or something. Though AFAIK HRE was more preoccupied with defending itself from outside threats (which Belkans didn't have, as far as we know) than internal struggles. I am no expert on European history, though.
Yeah, I was also reminded on the Holy Roman Empire at first. However, when/if you guys decides to expand this discussion in the speculation thread, do note that the writer is Japanese, and probably based any (scarce) mention of the Belkan Empire on the Japan's own history. I'm guessing the Warring States Period.

New question: Was "Sankt Kaiser" a title Olivia held since the beginning, or did the Belkan Church added the Saint part after her sacrifice?

PS: What does Kaiser actually translates to, Emperor or King?
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Old 2010-08-23, 05:29   Link #2332
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As it looks for me they visited Jail personally, but made video-links to other Numbers.

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Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
PS: What does Kaiser actually translates to, Emperor or King?
Kaiser = Caesar. So emperor.
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Old 2010-08-23, 10:52   Link #2333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
New question: Was "Sankt Kaiser" a title Olivia held since the beginning, or did the Belkan Church added the Saint part after her sacrifice?
There is circumstancial evidence that the rulers of Belka were known as Saint Kings since at least the beginning of the Saint King Unification War, since that is when the Saint's Cradle became important as de facto mobile capital of Belkan State, several hundred years ago, according to the SSX booklet. Thus, long before Olivie's time. The same booklet, however, also refers to the Kaisers simply as "Ou" (王, "King") in the time of 1000 years BP, though that could refer to all rulers of the era, rather than just Belkan ones.
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Old 2010-08-23, 12:18   Link #2334
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Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
There is circumstancial evidence that the rulers of Belka were known as Saint Kings since at least the beginning of the Saint King Unification War, since that is when the Saint's Cradle became important as de facto mobile capital of Belkan State, several hundred years ago, according to the SSX booklet. Thus, long before Olivie's time. The same booklet, however, also refers to the Kaisers simply as "Ou" (王, "King") in the time of 1000 years BP, though that could refer to all rulers of the era, rather than just Belkan ones.
Is it possible that what the writer really meant was Divine Emperor or something? Also, has there been any confirmation on exactly what sacrifice did Olivie do to end the war?
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Old 2010-08-23, 12:32   Link #2335
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nope, none at all :3
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Old 2010-08-23, 12:33   Link #2336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiresias View Post
Is it possible that what the writer really meant was Divine Emperor or something?
The official runes are "聖王", which literally means "sacred, holy, pure, Saint" and "king, ruler, sovereign, monarch", so yeah, the common translation is very accurate.

Quote:
Also, has there been any confirmation on exactly what sacrifice did Olivie do to end the war?
Not thus far. However, a StrikerS DVD packaging mentions that the Saint Church is based around her "teachings", which she compiled during her days as a "prophet". My guess is that she first abdicated, became a wandering prophet, then got herself killed to make sure the Sankt Kaiser line ends with her. The latter part can be inferred from that one flashback in ViVid, where she bids farewell to the wounded Ingvalt, apparently going off to die.
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Old 2010-08-23, 17:52   Link #2337
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Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane View Post
There is circumstancial evidence that the rulers of Belka were known as Saint Kings since at least the beginning of the Saint King Unification War, since that is when the Saint's Cradle became important as de facto mobile capital of Belkan State, several hundred years ago, according to the SSX booklet. Thus, long before Olivie's time. The same booklet, however, also refers to the Kaisers simply as "Ou" (王, "King") in the time of 1000 years BP, though that could refer to all rulers of the era, rather than just Belkan ones.
Is it possible those names were tacked on after it was over?
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Old 2010-08-24, 16:24   Link #2338
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Is it possible those names were tacked on after it was over?
But why would they translate them to Belkan, then?
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Old 2010-08-25, 00:51   Link #2339
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Old 2010-08-25, 04:13   Link #2340
Tiresias
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But why would they translate them to Belkan, then?
Maybe it was given by the Church to honor their deeds? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that how the Catholic Church made someone a Saint?

...perhaps further speculation should be brought to the proper thread...

Question: Exactly how did Alicia died?
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