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Old 2009-05-25, 05:05   Link #1321
xiaoamy
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Is Jail Scaglietti an idiot? or is he just mad? He laughs like in every scene until he got knocked out Fate...
Plus should his army be more magical? instead of using useless flying robots he could have used more cyborgs in the Battle for Vivio...making the story longer...
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Old 2009-05-25, 05:13   Link #1322
Keroko
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Jail is a mad scientists. For them not to laugh is like asking someone not to breathe.

And Jail's entire warfare is all about working against magic, so making his army more magical would be quite counterproductive. Cyborgs take time to make, so he was limited in their numbers. His Drones could be stamped out factory style via the Cradle.
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Old 2009-05-25, 05:53   Link #1323
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It was about time that a foil to magic appeared in the series. The Cyborgs provided that foil. Besides, if Jail-kun managed to make enough Cyborgs and then employed a powerful-enough AMF, he would have been able to cripple the Bureau pretty badly. If, and only if, he had the resources to do that.

Thus the JS Incident. It's like one big trial test of the Cyborgs' combat ability and one helluva marketing scheme to get influential parties to invest. More funds = more resources to perfect the tech and (semi)mass-produce. You employ a high-density AMF that'll cripple even the Aces and THEN bring in your Cyborgs that run on Other-Power(TM) to flatten them. By anime storyline standards, that's a pretty good strategy already. Sure, not CLAMP or Geass standard KEIKAKU DOORI, but if Jail had enough to work with, his masterpiece would have been completed.
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Old 2009-05-25, 07:08   Link #1324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Jail is a mad scientists. For them not to laugh is like asking someone not to breathe.

And Jail's entire warfare is all about working against magic, so making his army more magical would be quite counterproductive. Cyborgs take time to make, so he was limited in their numbers. His Drones could be stamped out factory style via the Cradle.
What if he more cyborgs in preparation of kidnapping Vivio would it change?
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Old 2009-05-25, 07:38   Link #1325
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Assuming it was possible, then he might have succeeded in fending them off. However, this is by no means a certainty. Quantity often goes at the cost of quality.
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Old 2009-05-25, 17:59   Link #1326
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On top of that, there's a command and control issue as well.

Jail is not a great charismatic leader. His army consists entirely of cyborgs he's made and raised himself, plus one zombie, plus one little girl he's manipulating into helping him. And even with a dozen cyborgs, he still has to have an "inner cadre"; the implication is that the others wouldn't sign on to the Full Jail Plan, as opposed to the warrior mythos he's fed them. To the extent that Dieci or Cinque aren't 100% approving of the Doc's plans, that's a weakness.

With more cyborgs, this problem gets bigger. He's got cyborgs he can't fully trust even with a dozen. If he had two dozen, that's half as much face time, and the new cyborgs mostly being raised by the old ones, and what happens if one of them decides that they're better off on their own? (Jail's working covert, so if one cyborg gets out of his base and falls into the TSAB's hands, the whole plan is blown.) Alternately, what if a bunch of them get together and decide that maybe Jail's not the best man to have in charge? The entire point of making cyborgs in the first place is that they can kick Jail's personal butt; a few of them could very possibly get away with a coup de main before the "loyal" cyborgs reacted.

He has the ability to control the cyborgs more directly (Ginga), but it doesn't seem to do much for their combat competence - Ginga beats Subaru in practice, but Subaru beat improved-Ginga in actual combat, once she turned off the emo. At best, Jail wasn't getting 100% out of her. The implication is that doing that with his other, less-reliable cyborgs would drop their own combat abilities...
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Old 2009-05-25, 18:11   Link #1327
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Originally Posted by Avatar_notADV View Post
He has the ability to control the cyborgs more directly (Ginga), but it doesn't seem to do much for their combat competence - Ginga beats Subaru in practice, but Subaru beat improved-Ginga in actual combat, once she turned off the emo. At best, Jail wasn't getting 100% out of her. The implication is that doing that with his other, less-reliable cyborgs would drop their own combat abilities...
That fight is the whole 'why robots cannot defeat humans' in a nutshell. Shutting down her emotions and free will makes her no better than a robot. Efficient at following orders, but when no orders are given fighting abilities go down the drain. Knocking out a persons free will means knocking out the ability for that person to think creatively.
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Old 2009-05-26, 04:20   Link #1328
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Originally Posted by Avatar_notADV View Post
On top of that, there's a command and control issue as well.

Jail is not a great charismatic leader. His army consists entirely of cyborgs he's made and raised himself, plus one zombie, plus one little girl he's manipulating into helping him. And even with a dozen cyborgs, he still has to have an "inner cadre"; the implication is that the others wouldn't sign on to the Full Jail Plan, as opposed to the warrior mythos he's fed them. To the extent that Dieci or Cinque aren't 100% approving of the Doc's plans, that's a weakness.

With more cyborgs, this problem gets bigger. He's got cyborgs he can't fully trust even with a dozen. If he had two dozen, that's half as much face time, and the new cyborgs mostly being raised by the old ones, and what happens if one of them decides that they're better off on their own? (Jail's working covert, so if one cyborg gets out of his base and falls into the TSAB's hands, the whole plan is blown.) Alternately, what if a bunch of them get together and decide that maybe Jail's not the best man to have in charge? The entire point of making cyborgs in the first place is that they can kick Jail's personal butt; a few of them could very possibly get away with a coup de main before the "loyal" cyborgs reacted.

He has the ability to control the cyborgs more directly (Ginga), but it doesn't seem to do much for their combat competence - Ginga beats Subaru in practice, but Subaru beat improved-Ginga in actual combat, once she turned off the emo. At best, Jail wasn't getting 100% out of her. The implication is that doing that with his other, less-reliable cyborgs would drop their own combat abilities...
One Zombie??
And yeah they can think creatively which makes them far superior than droids...I mean cyborgs
Asking another question, Can there be anyone that is pure evil and cannot be converted? Like all the other Nanoha's almost, all enemies are shown to be working with the protagonist.
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Old 2009-05-26, 04:24   Link #1329
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One Zombie??
Zest Grangaitz (he has been killed by Cinque some years ago).
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Old 2009-05-26, 05:14   Link #1330
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One Zombie??
And yeah they can think creatively which makes them far superior than droids...I mean cyborgs
Asking another question, Can there be anyone that is pure evil and cannot be converted? Like all the other Nanoha's almost, all enemies are shown to be working with the protagonist.
Jail, Uno, Tre and Quattro are still evil. Sette is a questionable case, she's in prison because she refused rehabilitation. There's also one in SSX.
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Old 2009-05-26, 09:54   Link #1331
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Zest Grangaitz (he has been killed by Cinque some years ago).
Well, we're not exactly sure if it was Cinque, it could be any of the numbers actually, they never especified who killed Zest.
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Old 2009-05-26, 10:25   Link #1332
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Well, we're not exactly sure if it was Cinque, it could be any of the numbers actually, they never especified who killed Zest.
Wiki has it as confirmed that Cinque defeated Zest prior to the start of StrikerS, so it's at least believed that she killed Zest who had been critically injured prior to fighting her.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_(Nanoha)#Cinque
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Old 2009-05-26, 12:17   Link #1333
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Originally Posted by The Guy Named Zeo View Post
Wiki has it as confirmed that Cinque defeated Zest prior to the start of StrikerS, so it's at least believed that she killed Zest who had been critically injured prior to fighting her.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_(Nanoha)#Cinque
Its Wikipedia, and there's no citation, so there's no confirmation. Its implied she defeated him, yes, but its not outright stated, leaving room for doubt and alternative interpretation.
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Old 2009-05-26, 12:28   Link #1334
Miles Teg
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In episode 24, Jail say (about the combat cyborgs) "One-on-One, they took down an S-ranked Knight". It looks like the combat cyborg have taken turns fighting Zest
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Old 2009-05-27, 05:20   Link #1335
xiaoamy
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There is a new chapter on Nanoha StrikerS Chapter 12 I believe
About the some "peaceful" like preparations Jail's small cyborg attack, and a brief training which Signum and Schach beat the crap out of Mobile Section 6 plus Ginga.
And still it didn't answer whether or not Otto is a boy or girl. (The twins kept it a secret) damn...and also his/her's costume looks like Kite's from the .hack games
Oops I believe that I only looked at Mangafox...sorry nothing new..
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Last edited by xiaoamy; 2009-05-27 at 05:44.
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Old 2009-05-27, 05:41   Link #1336
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All Numbers shown thus far are female.
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Old 2009-05-29, 05:21   Link #1337
xiaoamy
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Alright all of them is a girl but it is odd that Otto is wearing boys clothes....probably a tomboy wouldn't you guys agree?
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Old 2009-05-29, 07:26   Link #1338
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Jail covers his bases you know... and he knows that there are people who like their boyish reverse tra-

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Old 2009-05-29, 07:49   Link #1339
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Also, Quatro told Otto to keep her gender a secret and dressing like a boy helps her to do that.
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Old 2009-05-29, 08:27   Link #1340
Nya~n
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any show that has too many girls is bound to have a reverse trap show up somewhere, sometime.
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