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View Poll Results: Code Geass Episode 21 Rating
Perfect 10 35 29.41%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 40 33.61%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 21 17.65%
7 out of 10 : Good 10 8.40%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 6.72%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 1.68%
4 out of 10 : Poor 2 1.68%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 0.84%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 119. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-03-16, 16:20   Link #161
Klashikari
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meh, you misunderstood him^^"
he suggest you to check the speculation and spoiler thread ^^"
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Old 2007-03-16, 16:20   Link #162
lade
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Euphemia reminds me of mahou shoujo characters beliveing in purity and justice like sailor moon, also incredibly naive and innocent, but they have an edge euphemia doesn't they wielded a metaphysical bigger stick in one form or another than all their opposition, so they could follow through with their goals even when they shouldn't have worked because they were MORE POWERFUL than everyone else, i.e crystal tokyo e.tc.

Euphemia has no such advantage and is going to wish she was a magica girl before this is over.
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Old 2007-03-16, 16:22   Link #163
zalem
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Originally Posted by Klashikari View Post
meh, you misunderstood him^^"
he suggest you to check the speculation and spoiler thread ^^"
Oh I've seen that thread too. But thanks for the link anyway.
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Old 2007-03-16, 18:52   Link #164
Malintex_Terek
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Originally Posted by Juvyniled View Post
I defined it as someone who expected the show to be strictly a certain way and anything else that would steer the anime off course would immediately destroy all their expectations of the show. I really didn't mean much in the "experienced" label since many of you guys have seen a wide variety of anime series; I was simply using the label he described himself with.
I would have to say I wouldn't exactly qualify under that definition; sure, I had a strong idea of what to expect from Geass from eps. 1~11, but I recognized that there would be some moments when the "epic" plot was deviated from simply from the existance of the Ashford Academy. That was apparent early from the capsulated episode involving Refrain, but the show didn't lose its sense of direction from there.

However, Geass isn't just looking at some "other highlights" to the show, it feels like there's been a whole paradigm shift; instead of focusing on conquest of Japan, we're being subjected to conquest of sticky emotional situations, romantic entanglements and ideological differences. The "undertonal themes" of the show became central, with the revolution subserviant and contingent on the resolution of the relatively insignificant daily struggles of maintaining "double lives". In a grossly exaggerated euphemism, it's like each half of the series (almost literally) were written by two entirely different authors.

I think that had Geass maintained its "formula" from before, that is, predominantly examining Lelouch's struggle with occasional deviances from the main plot (to use GITS: SAC terminolgy, "stand alone" or "complex" episodes were "stand alone" episodes are not necessarily contained to a single episode) instead of jumping from arc to arc (id est, 'Mao Arc', 'Suzaku Arc', 'Euphie Arc') people wouldn't be quite as frustrated with it.

Also, the "contrived conspiracy" ret-cons are a major vice as well (that is, where many of the secondary characters somehow get connected to the main plot; I'm looking at Villette, Millay, and even Sayoko). That's also one of my bigger gripes with One Piece right now too.

Of course, there is still a lot of leg-room for Geass; who knows, in the next few episodes I could end up swallowing some of my words! But I still think the show has, for the most part, "jumped the shark", if the last seven aired episodes are any indicator of the next four.

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I refer to him as extreme because everyone else seems to be ok with harem-like cast and what not. Though that was not what I expected, it doesn't 'destroy' the whole series for me or even disappoint me really, is what I'm trying to say.
To clarify, the what you're identifying in Geass isn't really what I see as a vice, provided of course that those elements were not the nucleus of the story. More and more, it feels as if CG was a story that had high ambitions but settled for far less than it was capable of in a single season.

Last edited by Malintex_Terek; 2007-03-16 at 20:59. Reason: fix'd.
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Old 2007-03-16, 18:56   Link #165
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C.C. expression to the wasted giant pie dough = priceless!

And then once again we are reminded of the quote "Kindness born from madness and madness born from kindness"
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Old 2007-03-16, 19:11   Link #166
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Originally Posted by tritoch View Post
C.C. expression to the wasted giant pie dough = priceless!

And then once again we are reminded of the quote "Kindness born from madness and madness born from kindness"
it wasnt pie dough...it was pizza!!! comon we all know how crazy CC is for pizza...and to her that act of soiling a perfectly good pizza was criminal!

on another note...how many cheeze kuns does CC have? i count 3 so far
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Old 2007-03-16, 19:23   Link #167
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Originally Posted by Malintex_Terek
However, Geass isn't just looking at some "other highlights" to the show, it feels like there's been a whole paradigm shift; instead of focusing on conquest of Japan, we're being subjected to conquest of sticky emotional situations, romantic entanglements and ideological differences. The "undertonal themes" of the show became central, with the revolution subserviant and contingent on the resolution of the relatively insignificant daily life events of maintaining "double lives". In a grossly exaggerated euphemism, it's like each half of the series (almost literally) were written by two entirely different authors.
The conquest of Japan is really just a side-effect of Lelouch's ambition; the real thing that should be examined is the fall of the empire. If and when Japan is liberated won't change a thing except reducing one extra stronghold for the Britannian empire. Though the ruins inhabiting Japan make that country much more important that it really is.

I understand that you feel that the direction is drifiting from Lelouch's epic, but there are other 'players' involved in this story. I'd feel more perturbed if suddenly the characters begin to change face/personality without a hint as to why. Which is why they sometimes have to focus on the emotional aspects of other characters. Examining the whole Refrain and Kallen subplot, she really changed her personality after discovering how much her mother cared for her despite the discrimination and lowly stature that she is subjected to. If all of sudden we remove that episode, what is to explain Kallen's sudden "determination and dedication" to her cause? That is why it is sometimes necessary to include details unrelated to the protagonist; because it affects the situation and outcome.
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Old 2007-03-16, 20:29   Link #168
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Old 2007-03-16, 20:33   Link #169
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[QUOTE=Deathkillz;865111]it wasnt pie dough...it was pizza!!! comon we all know how crazy CC is for pizza...and to her that act of soiling a perfectly good pizza was criminal!
QUOTE]

I'm assuming they mean't pie in the context of the work "pizza pie" which I've seen a few places refer to their pizzas as.
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Old 2007-03-16, 20:43   Link #170
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Originally Posted by Deathkillz View Post
it wasnt pie dough...it was pizza!!! comon we all know how crazy CC is for pizza...and to her that act of soiling a perfectly good pizza was criminal!
I expect Suzaku will get another mind rape by CC as punishment of his careless action that waste that pizza
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Old 2007-03-16, 20:44   Link #171
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Although it wouldn't likely be as interesting if say someone like Schneizel enacted that himself. Too suspicious, though Euphemia's character can be manipulated to do so. How else would you have designed this scenario otherwise? And it's within Euphemia's nature to be impulsive (remember the hasty and out-of-the-blue confession?). Not to mention, it's more interesting since someone who hasn't been a real threat to Lelouch is now causing major problems for him. Besides, Euphemia won't be so innocent after this plays out, so it's also a good way to develop her character (or kill her off).
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Old 2007-03-16, 20:55   Link #172
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Although it wouldn't likely be as interesting if say someone like Schneizel enacted that himself. Too suspicious, though Euphemia's character can be manipulated to do so. How else would you have designed this scenario otherwise? And it's within Euphemia's nature to be impulsive (remember the hasty and out-of-the-blue confession?). Not to mention, it's more interesting since someone who hasn't been a real threat to Lelouch is now causing major problems for him. Besides, Euphemia won't be so innocent after this plays out, so it's also a good way to develop her character (or kill her off).
Killing her off seems a little too much Poor Suzaku will go crazy if that kind of thing would happen
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Old 2007-03-16, 21:00   Link #173
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Killing her off seems a little too much Poor Suzaku will go crazy if that kind of thing would happen
I suppose But it'd could infinitely extend the conflict between Suzaku and Zero. And then if Suzaku figures out his identity.... Oh boy
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Old 2007-03-16, 21:15   Link #174
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Originally Posted by Juvyniled View Post
The conquest of Japan is really just a side-effect of Lelouch's ambition; the real thing that should be examined is the fall of the empire. If and when Japan is liberated won't change a thing except reducing one extra stronghold for the Britannian empire. Though the ruins inhabiting Japan make that country much more important that it really is.
I wouldn't call it a exclusively a side-effect, but an essential means to that end of toppling Britannia and killing the King. If Japan's economy skyrocketed as a result of Lelouch, I'd call that a side-effect/externality.

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Originally Posted by Juvyniled View Post
I understand that you feel that the direction is drifiting from Lelouch's epic, but there are other 'players' involved in this story. I'd feel more perturbed if suddenly the characters begin to change face/personality without a hint as to why. Which is why they sometimes have to focus on the emotional aspects of other characters. Examining the whole Refrain and Kallen subplot, she really changed her personality after discovering how much her mother cared for her despite the discrimination and lowly stature that she is subjected to. If all of sudden we remove that episode, what is to explain Kallen's sudden "determination and dedication" to her cause? That is why it is sometimes necessary to include details unrelated to the protagonist; because it affects the situation and outcome.
True enough, but Geass has focused a lot on Euphemia and Suzaku without much change in their personality; Kallen underwent a change in the Refrain episode and she's been slowly becoming a Zero fan over the course of a couple episodes. In contrast...well, Euphie's getting some development; if she doesn't die in the future she'll likely be permanently "scarred" as it were, but in comparison to Kallen she hasn't had much happen to her.

And Suzaku, who has had more focus, is immutable. He hasn't changed at all and, rather, he's just reaffirmed his "ideals" through the justification of killing his father. I mean, in front of Lelouch he went berserk but he casually admitted the murder to Kallen and Euphemia like (as the Yotsuba joke goes) it was a pick-up line.

Last edited by Malintex_Terek; 2007-03-17 at 02:20. Reason: Terek hates laptops. :|
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Old 2007-03-16, 21:40   Link #175
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Originally Posted by Malintex_Terek
I wouldn't call it a exclusively a side-effect, but an essential means to that end of toppling Britannia and killing the King. If Japan's economy skyrocketd as a result of Lelouch, I'd call that a side-effect/externality.
Is it truly essential? What defines the existence of the empire? And did he really intend to kill his father? If that was all that was necessary, killing the king to bring down the empire, then all that had to be done was Geass people like Suzaku or Euphemia or others into assassins, and it could've been done easily. But that isn't Lelouch's nature, at least not the totality of it. How far can Lelouch really take his Order? They can't take on the empire in a war, and I doubt the Japanese want anything beyond peace once their nation is liberated.

Quote:
True enough, but Geass has focused a lot on Euphemia and Suzaku without much change in their personality; Kallen underwent a change in the Refrain episode and she's been slowly becoming a Zero fan over the course of a couple episodes.
I can say that Euphemia hasn't had much improvement if any. But Suzaku seems to be getting off his high horse a bit. Still somewhat arrogant but he is becoming more tolerant of Zero. And revealing his once hidden and stowed away past is quite a development. It's not a friend that he's revealing it to, but an ENEMY of all people. Is it rational? No. Is it development? Could be argued either way, but it appears that Suzaku is coming to terms with the fact he cannot run away forever. Although I describe Kallen as being "obsessed", she's finally got someone that she can look up to in Zero to help her and the rebels acquire freedom for their people.
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Old 2007-03-16, 21:50   Link #176
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now now. lets not sell euphie short here. she's definitely undergoing character development. Euphie of episode 5 wouldn't be doing what Euphie of episode 21 just did.

one shouldn't confuse changes in the character that are in directions we don't like with no change at all. ^_^
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Old 2007-03-16, 21:57   Link #177
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Euphie of episode 5 wouldn't be doing what Euphie of episode 21 just did.
I can't see any un-development :/ She's still as impulsive as ever, considering how she jumped down from the upper floors of that building. And she hasn't really matured either. She wanted to visit the ghettos, and as a princess, if she was ever kidnapped, it could compromise her family's position and that would definitely not bode well. Even as of now, she isn't considering the possible consequences, even when she got the 'chance' to taste Schneizel's destructive nature. So she is still the way she is, although I do believe she will undergo a true change as a result of this.
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Old 2007-03-16, 22:43   Link #178
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although I do believe she will undergo a true change as a result of this.
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Old 2007-03-16, 22:54   Link #179
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Old 2007-03-16, 23:18   Link #180
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Killing her off seems a little too much Poor Suzaku will go crazy if that kind of thing would happen
No, Suzaku will get pissed if Euphemia dies, he will go crazy if thanks to Lelouch's Geass, Suzaku chooses to save himself instead of protecting Euphemia.
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