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Old 2007-05-02, 11:07   Link #1
MugenIchiban
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Suggestions on building comp

Hey. Sorry for making another kind of thread like this, but I'm not too computer savvy and I would like some input on building a system. I'm looking to build a system mainly for doing some photoshop, c4d, maya, video editing and maybe some gaming, but nothing too hardcore. My current comp can hardly handle media player + another program without crashing.

So anyways.. here are some of the stuff that I had been looking at. I'm not too sure if everything would be compatible and about video cards, but any input would be awesome.

Intel Core 2 Duo E6420 (2.13 GHz) Dual-Core Socket 775 Processor

Asus P5N-E SLI - nForce 650i SLI (Core 2 Duo) PCI-E Socket 775 Motherboard
or
Gigabyte GA-965G-DS3 - Intel G965 (Core 2 Duo/Extreme) PCI-E Socket 775 Motherboard

Antec Performance TX1050B Black SOHO Tower Case w/Front USB, Audio, Firewire comes with SP-500 Power Supply

OCZ DDR2 OCZ2N800SR2GK PC2-6400 SLI-Ready Dual Channel - 2.0GB

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 500GB - SATA 3Gb/s Hard Drive
Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 320GB - SATA 3Gb/s Hard Drive

I'm still deciding whether I should build an AMD system since it would be cheaper or spend a few extra bucks and get a better performing comp.


Thanks,
Mugen
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Old 2007-05-02, 21:16   Link #2
toru310
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I'm no technician but if don't want to burn your motherboard due to heavy gaming go with AMD dual core or if you want to save energy and spend a couple of bucks go with core 2 duo. It says so in this video.http://youtube.com/watch?v=n1K274L3f68

If you want to have a cool pc with every thing go with this http://youtube.com/watch?v=e4VtxVIO3p8 I think that costs a lot

Last edited by toru310; 2007-05-02 at 22:48.
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Old 2007-05-02, 22:01   Link #3
ImClueless
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Migufuchi Fusutsu View Post
I'm no technician but if don't want to burn your motherboard due to heavy gaming go with AMD dual core or if you want to save energy and spend a couple of bucks go with core 2 duo. It says so in this video.http://youtube.com/watch?v=n1K274L3f68

That youtube video noloonger applies, the new Intel chips don't run any hotter than AMD now and doesn't suck maasive power anymore.

All those specs are fine for the purposes that you stated, but you forgot to include the video card which is important for gaming and I think Maya, although someone more knowledgable should comment on that part.
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Old 2007-05-02, 22:44   Link #4
toru310
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Well I'm just giving my opinion I apologize for offending you if I ever did.

And yeah without a video card you can't get best performance in gaming I think.
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Old 2007-05-02, 23:31   Link #5
ImClueless
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Migufuchi Fusutsu View Post
Well I'm just giving my opinion I apologize for offending you if I ever did.
lol I wasn't offended at all, just wanted to provide correct info thats all.
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Old 2007-05-03, 00:41   Link #6
Kurz
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There have been some issues with 680i boards,
The intel 965 should be pretty good and cooler than the 680i boards.

Wait a few more weeks till ATI's new cards come out (DirectX10) cards.
May 15 about (when there are benches)

Which OS are you planning on getting?
If you want to get any OS get an OEM from www.newegg.com
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Old 2007-05-03, 00:41   Link #7
Ledgem
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Since you're doing heavy media work, focus more heavily on the RAM. If you can, get a motherboard that will let you exceed 4 GB (there are many PC motherboards that have a limit of 4 GB, even on 64-bit systems; but that aside, it's hard enough to find a board with enough slots to go above 4 GB). Whether you go with a Core2Duo or an Athlon X2 you should be set pretty nicely, but that RAM could be the bottleneck factor.

The graphics card should largely only be considered for gaming; it contributes very little to rendering, unless they've managed to pipe it into the rendering processes more recently (the GPU is often wasted).
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Old 2007-05-03, 00:49   Link #8
Kurz
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Ledgem at least in gaming I never need more than 2 Gigs of ram.
Are you suggesting he needs 4 Gigs or more?

Frankly just get 2 gigs of ram for now Mugen,
Perhaps you could give us a budget help you out with.
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Old 2007-05-03, 00:59   Link #9
WanderingKnight
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Quote:
Ledgem at least in gaming I never need more than 2 Gigs of ram.
Are you suggesting he needs 4 Gigs or more?
I think he suggested getting a motherboard that can support future +4GB RAM additions... At the rate games are advancing, it'd be a wise decision, I think.

Besides, he wasn't talking about gaming, but about media work.
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Old 2007-05-03, 01:23   Link #10
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Regarding video cards, it fully depends on what type of games and 3D rendering programs you'll be using. ATI has always been great for first person shooter games, but they tend to wear down faster with MMORPGs. nVidia is somewhat a flip around. Of course, I've tried both types of video cards and it seems nVidia lasts the longest out of the two. There's other video cards out there with different name brands and such, so it won't be easy to pick through.
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Old 2007-05-03, 01:30   Link #11
Kurz
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Errr... What kind of thinking is that Phantom (ATI better for FPS and Nvidia better for MMO's)? Both are great companies, it just depends on which card you get. Do note some games just run better on ATI cards and some on Nvidia cards. Halflife 2 for example loves ATI cards for some reason.

The other video card brands are simply re badged ATI and Nvidia chipsets.
Since ATI and Nvidia can't supply the whole world with graphic cards they sell their chips for other companies to help them in doing so.

Meh I still think 2GB is plenty I doubt he'll run apps taking up 1.5gigs of RAM.
Oh I know Ledgem is just saying He might need more RAM later, I've never heard of people who use Maya need more than 2 gigs.
I could be wrong though.
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Old 2007-05-03, 01:41   Link #12
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It's observational thinking. That's what I've observed and learned through experiencing both types of graphics cards. ATI dies faster when you run MMORPGs often. I've ran this testing and observation in four different types of computers (only one belonging to me, so different specs and makes). Two of them were custom built and the other two were right out of the factory. They all came up with the same results. Considering we tested the ATI X1950XTX and and PNY GeForce 7950GT for all four computers, (yes, we have a the money to spare, plus the warranties helped) we came up with these types of results. The reason being is that FPS and MMORPGs tend to depend heavily upon the graphics cards. Other games out there don't as much, though I suppose I should refer to RPGs in general instead of MMORPGs.
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Old 2007-05-03, 01:43   Link #13
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Quote:
Halflife 2 for example loves ATI cards for some reason.
Half life 2 is built for ATi. It's like when you get those little Nvidia advertising videos before the main menu in some games? Gaming companies make contracts with Nvidia or ATi from time to time.

And I'd definitely suggest an Nvidia card. From what I've heard and experienced with my dad's X800XT, (yeah, my dad is more of a gamer than me lol) ATi is well behind in today's hi-end graphical experience.
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Old 2007-05-03, 02:04   Link #14
theDarkHorse
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Definitely the nVidia cards. Though the latest 8600GTS and 8500GT seem underpowered. Or at least that's what Anandtech thinks.

You know, the GPU can be really useful for rendering acceleration. You mentioned Maya; nVidia has a plugin/renderer for its GPUs called Gelato; it uses the GPU to accelerate rendering and AFAIK it's compatible with all nV cards from the GeForce FX series up.

Link: http://www.nvidia.com/page/gz_home.html

Yeah, the 4GB RAM is pretty useful too.

From your usage, a Quadro would be most useful...but if your budget can't extend that far a GeForce will still do the job. In fact, they use the same core; it's just some BIOS settings that make the difference I think.
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Old 2007-05-03, 02:28   Link #15
Kurz
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If you are going to use 4GB of Ram you are going to need a 64bit OS.
Just making sure the OP knows that.

ATI cards are still Pretty damn good, it all depends are your usage.
However in his case with Maya rendering I guess Nvidia wins in this situation.
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Old 2007-05-03, 03:17   Link #16
MugenIchiban
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Thanks for all the input guys. I appreciate all the help I could get as you all seem to know your stuff.

The max I'm willing to spend is about 2k, but I'd like to keep it below that if possible.

I was thinking of just sticking with 2GB of ram and 32bit OS, because my cousin said that 64bit OS has lots compatibility issues. Is that true?

How would this video card handle EVGA e-GeForce 7300GT 256MB PCI-Express or should put down a bit of extra cash and get the EVGA e-GeForce 8500 GT 256MB PCI-Express?

Anyone got any recommendations on what mobo and type of ram to get? I'd like to do some overclocking and I was thinking about getting this ram and one of the 3 mobos below.

OCZ Platinum XTC REV.2 PC2-6400 2GB 2X1GB DDR2-800 CL4-4-4-15 240PIN DIMM Dual Channel Memory Kit

- ASUS P5B ATX LGA775 Conroe 965P DDR2 PCI-E16 3PCI-E1 3PCI 6 SATA2 Sound Motherboard

- Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3 ATX LGA775 Conroe P965 DDR2 PCI-E16 3PCI-E1 3PCI SATA2 GBLAN Audio Motherboard

- ASUS P5N-E SLI Nforce 650I SLI LGA775 Conroe ATX 2PCI-E16 1PCI-E1 2PCI SATA2 Sound GBLAN Motherboard
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Old 2007-05-03, 07:19   Link #17
theDarkHorse
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64-bit has heaps of driver problems right now. I'd stick to the 32-bit version.

2GB of RAM is certainly adequate right now, but you have to think forward: whether it'd still be enough one year from now (it's quite likely that it won't).

For overclocking, the nForce 650i series are a good bet. They still have lots of functionality, without the crazy price tag of the 680i boards. If you're lucky, you might be able to find an Intel 975 based board for a decent price too.

In terms of graphics cards, depends on whether you're willing to upgrade later on. If you are, something small like a 7300GT would be okay, then maybe an upgrade to an 8800GTS or something in six months' time. The 8500GT isn't really worth it, IMHO. Maybe the 8600GTS is good, but since the 8800GTS runs on the G80 core, I think there's a lot of overclocking ability on the higher-end models.

If only they made the new GeForce 8600 cards as revolutionary as the 6600GT when it came out. Damn, that was great.

Oh, and a DX10 card won't be much real use until games/software/patches are released to utilise it.

p.s. For anyone into the overclocking business, would RivaTuner's function for unlocking pixel and vertex pipelines on DX9 cards work for unlocking shader units on DX10?

-edit- The GPU, due to its very nature, speeds up the rendering time a LOT. I've used Blender (open source 3D modelling program) for a bit of arty stuff before. By my assessment, a GeForce 6600GT using Gelato along with a Pentium 4 Prescott 3.0Ghz renders scenes in about half the time the CPU did alone. With today's graphics cards, I think the performance increase can be even better.

Last edited by theDarkHorse; 2007-05-03 at 07:30.
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Old 2007-05-03, 07:39   Link #18
Jinto
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Concerning 3D and 3D rendering with either Maya/3DS Max/AutoCAD...

much RAM (the more the better)
decent CPU
nVidia GPU (because of 2 important things... 1st rendering with e.g. accelerators/render engines like gelato, 2nd using D3D for mesh display and work space rendering in the apps (impacts application performance in a very positive way)... afaik nVidia D3D is more stable with the programs mentioned aboth) Unless ofcourse you buy an insanely expensive graphics device with full hardware OpenGL abilities, then stick with the OpenGL stuff (and renderers/accelrators) e.g. the already mentioned Quadro 4 cards are such devices.

in general I'ld recommend Core Duo 2
you don't need DX10 unless you are going to use Vista... which would be performance throttler for your 3D app most likely. (despite the new DX10 cards are too slow for the serious DX10 stuff anyway)

Quote:
Originally Posted by theDarkHorse View Post
p.s. For anyone into the overclocking business, would RivaTuner's function for unlocking pixel and vertex pipelines on DX9 cards work for unlocking shader units on DX10?
Hm, depends... the new shaders most likely not, pixel and vertex shaders... maybe. But if they really build a 100% true DX10 card, there is no longer such things like vertex or pixel shaders, all that remains is a unified shader, that can do all the stuff that vertex, pixel + the new shader functions. Since this is appears as one shader, RivaTuner's function for unlocking pixel and vertex pipelines on DX9 cards, obviously wouldn't work. However, the G80 chips have dis-unified shaders, so pixel, vertex and new shaders are still separate... thus it might be possible to tweak those seperately.

Last edited by Jinto; 2007-05-03 at 07:50.
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Old 2007-05-03, 11:24   Link #19
Kurz
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Ummm... G80 chips are unified shaders.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130078

Specs Stream Processors 128

I still say p965 is one of the better Motherboards.
Doesn't run as hot as 680i or a 650i.
965 Overclocks a bit more than Nvidia's chipset.

There have been cases of nvidia motherboards killing RAM, EVGA is one of the few that says there is a problem.
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Old 2007-05-03, 11:38   Link #20
Jinto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurz View Post
Ummm... G80 chips are unified shaders.
Oh my bad, my information was outdated. In that case tweaking the shaders like with DX9 cards won't work.
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