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Old 2008-01-18, 01:57   Link #421
Valduran
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Ehm...don't really think this is the appropriate thread to rant about why something else is better than Claymore. If it was, I'd explain to you how all those things you mentioned aren't important to Claymore because the story Claymore is telling has nothing to do with realism and politics.

Berserk isn't better or worse, it's just different. 'nuff said.
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Old 2008-01-18, 02:22   Link #422
Twisted Reality
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Valduran View Post
Ehm...don't really think this is the appropriate thread to rant about why something else is better than Claymore. If it was, I'd explain to you how all those things you mentioned aren't important to Claymore because the story Claymore is telling has nothing to do with realism and politics.

Berserk isn't better or worse, it's just different. 'nuff said.
Actually, you're wrong on both counts. Here's why:

-This is a Q&A thread. The question asked why we make comparisons for Berserk and Claymore. My reason is that they are both more or less the same genre, except that Claymore is a bit more shounen-ish. Still they both essentially tackle the same themes. They both want to hit that high-note about human suffering, aspiration and all that jazz. They work with similar tropes. (Guts kills big demon with big swords. Clare kills big demons with big swords.) I am also pointing out that just because the asker in question doesn't understand the comparison because he didn't like Berserk doesn't mean that they can't be compared. Even with Berserk coming ahead more favorably. I have done so. In torturous detail more appropriate for an essay than a forum.

-Storytelling is about suspension of disbelief. So yes, the illusion of realism and complexity does matter. You can kill good drama by bad writing. It doesn't mean Claymore isn't entertaining, just not as entertaining as I would have hoped. It's a lot of missed opportunities. Some of us also enjoy a sense greater sense of awe or drama.

The question is, why don't *you* care?

Sure you could accuse me of being a humorless old goat with too much time on his hands. But meh. I mean, what are we supposed to be doing here? If my rant is not to your taste, go read something else.
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Old 2008-01-18, 02:32   Link #423
chibamonster
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Bah, I'd like to respond but whenever I do in this thread my posts get deleted so it's not worth it.

Does anyone know of any interviews with Yagi about the creation of Claymore? I've read stuff in the back of Angel Densetsu that talked about his work with that series but I don't know much about his work with Claymore.
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Old 2008-01-18, 03:05   Link #424
Valduran
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I'd love to take you up on this somewhere more appropriate, but meh...it's all difference of opinion. There would be no satisfying resolution to the arguement, and I really don't enjoy trading hostile words with people who like to take the intellectual high ground. It's such a waste of time. Berserk is quite decent, but for those of us who aren't so grounded in the real world and have an easier time suspending our disbelief, Claymore has alot more of interest to offer.

@Chiba: Unfortunately not. I've been unable to find anything so far
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Old 2008-01-18, 04:19   Link #425
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That's quite enough on the subject of Berserk vs Claymore. The question was WHY comparisons were made and the question was answered. Nobody asked if Berserk was better than Claymore. Even if they had, it wouldn't belong here.

Discussion over.
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Old 2008-01-22, 13:22   Link #426
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Was it anywhere mentioned that Claymores DO age after being hybridized until they reach a certain age and then stop or the moment they transform they stop aging?

Knowing the answer to this could spark a new discussion regarding something that has been bothering me for some time
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Old 2008-01-22, 13:48   Link #427
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Originally Posted by Anima View Post
Was it anywhere mentioned that Claymores DO age after being hybridized until they reach a certain age and then stop or the moment they transform they stop aging?

Knowing the answer to this could spark a new discussion regarding something that has been bothering me for some time
Irene says that they mature, but don't grow old.
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Old 2008-01-22, 13:54   Link #428
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Forgive my lack of English skills, but does that mean they undergo some physical changes (getting taller, developing bosoms, etc) even after they are hybridized to a certain point then stop?
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Old 2008-01-22, 14:22   Link #429
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Not sure if my answer qualifies as speculation, but Alicia and Beth were both taken as infants when made into hybrids. They look like adults now. Teresa changed from when she was a trainee when she met Raphaela and so did Clare since her extra chapter. I have no idea how being a hybrid effects their growth though; whether it speeds up or slows down. It seems they mature and then stop at some point.

Fun question. I hadn't thought about it before. Maybe Miata will eventually grow up then?
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Old 2008-01-22, 14:40   Link #430
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The only reason I asked this was to challenge the databooks of stating that the Zemas were hybridized when they were infants (since I believed claymores don't age so how come baby claymores grow up?) to further prove its poor authenticity but brining the Teresa/Clare while trainees DOES prove that they do age up to a certain point since they both aged/matured. Rafaela (being the oldest Claymore we know of up to now) look the same even after all those years so they stop at one point

Thanks for the inspiration
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Old 2008-01-22, 15:17   Link #431
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Forgive my lack of English skills, but does that mean they undergo some physical changes (getting taller, developing bosoms, etc) even after they are hybridized to a certain point then stop?
That is exactly what it means.
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Old 2008-01-22, 15:58   Link #432
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I think Claymores stop ageing when they reach their top, it can be the mature age or earlier. Probably Im wrong, but this is my opinion. ( Sorry for my bad english )
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Old 2008-01-22, 17:29   Link #433
chibamonster
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It would make sense that Claymores do mature until a point because Clare was surprised by Irene looking exactly the same as she did during Teresa's time. It seemed like new information to her indicating that she had grown up quite a bit and not realized that claymores don't age after they mature.

*Although if they awaken at any point they seem stuck at that stage of development like Riful or the former single digit Ophelia killed.
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Last edited by chibamonster; 2008-01-22 at 21:50.
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Old 2008-01-24, 06:35   Link #434
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*Although if they awaken at any point they seem stuck at that stage of development like Riful or the former single digit Ophelia killed.
not always; seems like its by choice; Priscilla seems younger than when she awakened; or atleast looks different somehow
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Old 2008-01-24, 06:57   Link #435
chibamonster
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Could be attributed to a change in hair color and mannerisms. Although Priscilla does seem shorter. As best I remember we have never seen a claymore awaken and then go to their non-awakened humanoid form to compare to their previous state except Priscilla. Maybe there is some deeper meaning yet to be revealed?

Jean achieved a full awakening but she returned to her previous claymore form before we could see what her power saving mode was (colored hair + eyebrows?). Alicia and Beth don't qualify as they are special. Priscilla is the only one and her changes might also be because of changes in Yagi's art style over the years or hair color etc. The part of Ophelia's body that was human looked just like her Claymore form but I wouldn't say she really turned off her awakened form either. An awakened beings human appearance changing would bring up a lot of speculation and it is certainly possible, but I'll leave that for a different thread.
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Old 2008-01-24, 10:05   Link #436
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Originally Posted by chibamonster View Post
Could be attributed to a change in hair color and mannerisms. Although Priscilla does seem shorter. As best I remember we have never seen a claymore awaken and then go to their non-awakened humanoid form to compare to their previous state except Priscilla. Maybe there is some deeper meaning yet to be revealed?

Jean achieved a full awakening but she returned to her previous claymore form before we could see what her power saving mode was (colored hair + eyebrows?). Alicia and Beth don't qualify as they are special. Priscilla is the only one and her changes might also be because of changes in Yagi's art style over the years or hair color etc. The part of Ophelia's body that was human looked just like her Claymore form but I wouldn't say she really turned off her awakened form either. An awakened beings human appearance changing would bring up a lot of speculation and it is certainly possible, but I'll leave that for a different thread.

prehaps i guess its possible that it would be harder for say Riful to use an adult human form because she awakened before she became an Adult (so she hasn't really got a form to compare to ; since she never reached adulthood in the first place)

while for Isley; it would be of no benefit to him to appear as a teenager; and being a commander and all suits him being his normal appearance of around 20

Priscilla's state represents her mind i guess, being she thinks she's a kid, she appears somewhat kid like

its probably not something we will ever get the answer on anyway
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Old 2008-01-29, 17:48   Link #437
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Reading the Statics, powlvl, theroies theard 2 question conceived in my mind...
1st. Why the Org couldnt find any way to solve that male claymore problem( I mean they come up with that soul link thing but they couldnt made any stable male warrior so how is that?)
2nd. Why youmas prefer human meat? I mean meat~meat why they dont eat animals? Im sure they would made less stir with eating animals. Sorry if these questions are already put up.
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Old 2008-01-29, 18:10   Link #438
Anima
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1. It's not that the creation of males was a failure technically. It's just that males couldn't resist the pleasure of using yoma power and hence awakened quickly. It was the warriors own problem not the Org's. As for soul link, if you mean using soul link as making all male claymores in pairs, then that's a bit overdoing it since females can do just fine alone and are as powerful as males. It is still under experiment and even on females it's still dangerous so why risk it?

2. Ah, you have to ask the ABs themselves xD Seriously tho, it's their nature. Like vampires can't live on anything but human blood (altho in some variations they do, but it doesn't give them the ecstasy and energy they could get from human blood). If they could, I don't think claymores would have detested the idea of awakening since they can live as human and only feed on animals.
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Old 2008-01-29, 22:49   Link #439
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1. Soul linking is a "recent" technological breakthrough. You don't expect them to stop producing Claymores while they do their research, do you. Anyway, i don't think twins are all that common anyway. Who knows how many twins have died in the creation of Alicia and Beth.

2. Thats why i feel that Yoma are closely linked to humans just like the vampire and humans example given above.
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Old 2008-01-30, 05:47   Link #440
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Anima, first thank you for the info. I feel that thing strange that they cant reach any positive results with male Claymores. If I think of Emita's(?) talk with Galatea he said male claymores are not failures, they are success and compared to soul link I think it was a half success ( think of Raphaela and Luciea ) but they didnt stoped with the attempts of makeing soul link successful. If I think over IMO male Claymores probably would be better warriors than females.

Last edited by koffy; 2008-01-30 at 08:12.
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