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Old 2012-04-07, 07:54   Link #22141
Shinso Tsukune
Moka X Tsukune
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Out getting ice cream with Moka and Akasha.
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Originally Posted by Chris38 View Post
Yeah, I agree Kenji, Tsukune is quite lucky, although on the other hand he is also in a pretty difficult situation.

Regarding Tsukune's physical appearance, well I think that it would pretty strange if he stayed the same, after everything he went through - although part of his upgrade to a bishie, is due to the vampire blood within him.

And honestly speaking, after everything that Tsukune did to stay with Moka, I doubt Akua has much to say about the growing relationship between him and Moka - well, it's not like Akua would listen to reason, once she becomes aware of how significant Tsukune is, which is going to be the last mistake she has made...

Not to mention that it's kind of ironic that Akua has been the one who brought Tsukune and Moka together, since after all if she hadn't revealed the existence of Alucard to the little Moka, or tried to take Akasha's Shinso blood, things could turn out a little different, and Moka and Tsukune could never meet each other...

Although, I'm kind of wondering if the promise that Akua made with Akasha is going to be brought up, during her fight with Tsukune, since based upon what I know, the contents of that promise haven't been revealed yet, and let's be honest the fight between Tsukune and Akua is most likely going to be the last moment where Ikeda could reveal the contents of that promise, since personally speaking, I doubt we will see her in the future arcs.
Its as Tenmei Mikogami says "The time has finally come...How frightening fate is..."

Spoiler for Omote-Moka YAY!:
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Old 2012-04-07, 08:12   Link #22142
Redeyes260
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^ what a lovely sight to behold. I don't think that there are really any other possible conclusions as to what had happened? Judging by the way Ikeda has gone with the entire thing, as theorized by most people Kumuru created an illusion and is unharmed. And that when Tsukune comes Alucard will be very near to being awoken. (I've been keeping with the thread since page 998 ;P) So I haven't seen anyone suggest that maybe Alucard will *SEMI* wake up, but that Tsukune will seal him away with his own shinso blood? I mean if you think about it Akasha sacrificed herself, but she had sealed him away prior without the sealing of herself with it. That's my hypithesis .. I mean.. After Tsukune comes in and kicks Akua's ass from Bejing, China all the way to Chinatown, New York and back.
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Old 2012-04-07, 09:06   Link #22143
Chris38
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^ what a lovely sight to behold. I don't think that there are really any other possible conclusions as to what had happened? Judging by the way Ikeda has gone with the entire thing, as theorized by most people Kumuru created an illusion and is unharmed. And that when Tsukune comes Alucard will be very near to being awoken. (I've been keeping with the thread since page 998 ;P) So I haven't seen anyone suggest that maybe Alucard will *SEMI* wake up, but that Tsukune will seal him away with his own shinso blood? I mean if you think about it Akasha sacrificed herself, but she had sealed him away prior without the sealing of herself with it. That's my hypithesis .. I mean.. After Tsukune comes in and kicks Akua's ass from Bejing, China all the way to Chinatown, New York and back.
I doubt it's possible for Tsukune to reseal Alucard, if he awakens, since:

1.) In the first place there isn't anything suggesting that he even knows how to do that, since considering the fact that Tohou Fuhai had tried to kill Tsukune once he realized that his aura is similar to Alucard's, I doubt he knows how to achieve that either.

2.) Judging from what Akasha did in the flashback to Moka's past, to reseal Alucard you need to let him consume you and then somehow crawl out from within his body, which is most likely pretty difficult to achieve, considering the fact that Akasha didn't manage to come back from within him, for the second time, and has most likely spent the last 6 years trapped within Alucard's body.

Furthermore, even if it was possible for Tsukune or Moka to reseal Alucard, what doing that would achieve ?

Just as sealing Alucard by the 3 Dark Lords has done, it just delays the problem for the future generations to resolve, since at this point, it's quite apparent that even if Akasha didn't mean to burden Moka with the responsibility of keeping Alucard sealed, she basically has done that, due to Moka having her Shinso blood, and as long as Alucard is alive, anyone who inherits Moka's or Tsukune's Shinso blood will eventually be faced with the same burden, since there will always be some ayashi, like the Fairy Tale organization who would want to use Alucard's power to achieve their own objectives.
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Old 2012-04-07, 09:14   Link #22144
Redeyes260
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Just because there wasn't any sign he hasn't learned something like that doesnt mean he hasn't. Besides, sealing Alucard up (without being devoured himself) would allow for more relationship development ^_^. I want Akua to join the Harem, mainly. But I really doubt it'll happen.
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Old 2012-04-07, 09:31   Link #22145
Shinso Tsukune
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Originally Posted by Chris38 View Post
I doubt it's possible for Tsukune to reseal Alucard, if he awakens, since:

1.) In the first place there isn't anything suggesting that he even knows how to do that, since considering the fact that Tohou Fuhai had tried to kill Tsukune once he realized that his aura is similar to Alucard's, I doubt he knows how to achieve that either.

2.) Judging from what Akasha did in the flashback to Moka's past, to reseal Alucard you need to let him consume you and then somehow crawl out from within his body, which is most likely pretty difficult to achieve, considering the fact that Akasha didn't manage to come back from within him, for the second time, and has most likely spent the last 6 years trapped within Alucard's body.

Furthermore, even if it was possible for Tsukune or Moka to reseal Alucard, what doing that would achieve ?

Just as sealing Alucard by the 3 Dark Lords has done, it just delays the problem for the future generations to resolve, since at this point, it's quite apparent that even if Akasha didn't mean to burden Moka with the responsibility of keeping Alucard sealed, she basically has done that, due to Moka having her Shinso blood, and as long as Alucard is alive, anyone who inherits Moka's or Tsukune's Shinso blood will eventually be faced with the same burden, since there will always be some ayashi, like the Fairy Tale organization who would want to use Alucard's power to achieve their own objectives.
This is why Alucard must be destroyed, as long as that colossal monster exists, the world will never truly be safe. Akasha burdened herself to watch over Alucard to ensure the world wouldn't be in danger, which was fine since shes immortal and could continue to watch over from generation to generation, until Akua interfered, setting fate in motion for Moka Akashiya and Tsukune Aono.

If Alucard continues to be sealed away, than the day will come when Alucard would awaken again and by that time, no one around would be capable of stopping that monster and then it will destroy the world, which would also mean that everything Akasha, Tenmei and Touhou, as well as Tsukune and co. did, would have all been in vain.

The three Dark Lords fought and sealed Alucard away over 200 years ago, now here we are in the present, where that monster threatens the world once again. We have Moka Akashiya the daughter of Akasha Bloodriver and Tsukune Aono, a product of the 3 Dark Lords. Moka and Tsukune bound by fate will have to finish what the Dark Lords started, those two along with friends and allies will be the ones to finish off Alucard for good.
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Old 2012-04-07, 10:18   Link #22146
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Well, before Alucard would be destroyed, I think our protagonists would need to find a way to separate Akasha from Alucard, which let's be honest won't be easy.

After all, let's face it, I doubt that Moka would want to kill her own mother, so if it's possible (and I believe the chance of that exists), to separate her from Alucard, Moka is going to do everything she can to achieve that.

I mean, personally I doubt Ikeda would introduce Akasha's character and make her the leader of the three dark lords, and not have any role to play, apart from letting herself be consumed by Alucard to reseal him and save her only child Moka.

Furthermore, I believe that Akasha still needs to meet Tsukune, to complete the pattern that the other girls in Tsukune's harem had (at least those, who's parents are still alive).
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Old 2012-04-07, 10:35   Link #22147
Soji
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Well, before Alucard would be destroyed, I think our protagonists would need to find a way to separate Akasha from Alucard, which let's be honest won't be easy.

After all, let's face it, I doubt that Moka would want to kill her own mother, so if it's possible (and I believe the chance of that exists), to separate her from Alucard, Moka is going to do everything she can to achieve that.

I mean, personally I doubt Ikeda would introduce Akasha's character and make her the leader of the three dark lords, and not have any role to play, apart from letting herself be consumed by Alucard to reseal him and save her only child Moka.

Furthermore, I believe that Akasha still needs to meet Tsukune, to complete the pattern that the other girls in Tsukune's harem had (at least those, who's parents are still alive).
Agree,No to mention ,I'm sure Akasha would love to see Moka destined one.Plus I think Moka need to have her mother back.

Last edited by Soji; 2012-04-07 at 13:18.
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Old 2012-04-07, 11:04   Link #22148
Chris38
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Not to mention the fact that Akasha might resolve the plot point of Outer Moka being an artificial personality in a way that would satisfy most readers of this manga.

After all, she's the one responsible for sealing Moka in the first place, so she might know of a way to resolve the matter of Moka's split personalities, in some reasonable manner.

Of course, I'm quite confident that Tsukune is going to be a required component as well, since he's Moka's destined one, and the only person who can "safely" remove the Rosario.
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Old 2012-04-07, 13:16   Link #22149
Shinso Tsukune
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Akasha definitely needs to make her return, sadly, I believe this won't be possible until the battle with Alucard.

AKASHA NEEDS TO RETURN!!!

Spoiler for Akasha:
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Old 2012-04-08, 00:05   Link #22150
Chris38
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On another topic, do you think the definition provided about Tsukune in chapter 52 is accurate ?

That he is a human with the powers of a vampire...

Since, in my opinion, while that definition is partially true, but at the same time, it's also true that the vampire blood within Tsukune is changing more then just Tsukune's appearance - naturally he needed some help, for his body to become more compatible with the Shinso blood in his veins, but it's quite obvious from Tsukune's latest berserk form that, in the physical sense, there isn't much humanity remaining inside Tsukune's body.

Not to mention that, while this hasn't been brought up in the series, I'm quite sure that Tsukune's lifespan has been increased as well, since I'm quite sure that any ayashi spices can live longer then a normal human, especially a naturally born vampire like Moka, and I would speculate that after Tsukune has underwent the human modification ritual and his current fight with Kuyou - which, in my opinion, has caused some changes to occur within Tsukune as well, since the latest chapter wouldn't be called "Transformation" (unless it means generally the subject of Tsukune's change, caused by Moka's vampire blood injections), if Tsukune stayed the same as he has been, before the fight with Kuyou took place.

Furthermore, I think the comparisons between Tsukune and Alucard mean something, and I would say that Alucard is pretty far away from what I would consider "human".
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Old 2012-04-08, 06:29   Link #22151
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I will curse Ikeda if Kurumu died like this for good *.*

And the second group battling Gyokuro? 5 vs 1 seems bad to me...
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:09   Link #22152
Tempest35
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On another topic, do you think the definition provided about Tsukune in chapter 52 is accurate ?

That he is a human with the powers of a vampire...

Since, in my opinion, while that definition is partially true, but at the same time, it's also true that the vampire blood within Tsukune is changing more then just Tsukune's appearance - naturally he needed some help, for his body to become more compatible with the Shinso blood in his veins, but it's quite obvious from Tsukune's latest berserk form that, in the physical sense, there isn't much humanity remaining inside Tsukune's body.

Not to mention that, while this hasn't been brought up in the series, I'm quite sure that Tsukune's lifespan has been increased as well, since I'm quite sure that any ayashi spices can live longer then a normal human, especially a naturally born vampire like Moka, and I would speculate that after Tsukune has underwent the human modification ritual and his current fight with Kuyou - which, in my opinion, has caused some changes to occur within Tsukune as well, since the latest chapter wouldn't be called "Transformation" (unless it means generally the subject of Tsukune's change, caused by Moka's vampire blood injections), if Tsukune stayed the same as he has been, before the fight with Kuyou took place.

Furthermore, I think the comparisons between Tsukune and Alucard mean something, and I would say that Alucard is pretty far away from what I would consider "human".
"I Think, Therefore I Am."

As long as Tsukune's perception of himself is of 'a human with vampire powers', I doubt if he'll turn into Alucard 2.0. Once he stops caring about that, I think that's when he'll finally end 'being a human'. In the fight with Kuyou, it appeared from the dialogue that Tsukune had some mental trauma inflicted on him due to FireFox, which I admit, I don't quite follow. Why would it show up just for Kuyou - hasn't Tsukune gotten over that with his training with Ura? He's come close to death so many times after that fight...

But the chapter serves to reiterate the same thing - Tsukune will willingly throw himself in harm's way to protect his friends, be it external or internal. Will he make the decision to throw away his humanity to gain the power to protect them?
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:18   Link #22153
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Tempest35@ About Tsukune truma...it's a psychological thing even if seem he overcome the trauma with all he go trough see again the one that cause that trauma ...well let's just say mister fox make the trauma come back again. If something cause you a trauma like this and extreme fear and you meet the person /thing that make this truama born in the first place you will always take over from that fear again the only way to get over a trauma like this is deal with the one that make this trauma born. Like Tsukune did in this ch,because he found something worse he gain the courage to overcome the trauma and defeat his own demon or at least this is what i think.
But i agree with you that as long Tsukune see himself of human with vampire power he will stay himself and not turn into Alucard 2.0 (like you call him).
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:23   Link #22154
Shinso Tsukune
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In chapter 52 when it talked about Tsukune being "a human with vampire powers", it was referring to the first time he obtained vampire/Shinso powers, its obvious now that it no longer applies to Tsukune, since he has gone through several phases of evolution.

The current Tsukune we all know and love today is a cross between a modified-human and a Shinso vampire, however, Tsukune will always remain human at heart which is very important, especially to him, theres nothing that can change that, no matter how much Tsukune changes on the outside.
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:29   Link #22155
Tempest35
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^ I'm just saying that on a personal level, I don't follow it the trauma aspect because (1) it happened so freaking long ago and (2) he's faced other life-or-death situations that I would think it would have been taken care of by now. That's why he's been training for, at least, that's my take on it.

It's the one thing that I tend to dislike about protagonist types like Tsukune who are meek and mild-mannered but given access to crazy power - they really don't have the mindset to use it, even after training's been done. Those are the ones who are tempted more to 'fall'/become dark - not the ones who already have a bad disposition to begin with, like Yusuke Uramenshi.
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:32   Link #22156
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But the chapter serves to reiterate the same thing - Tsukune will willingly throw himself in harm's way to protect his friends, be it external or internal. Will he make the decision to throw away his humanity to gain the power to protect them?
I think that the previous chapters, have given quite a lot of evidence, of what would Tsukune's answer be - at least when it comes to Moka, after all I think that you haven't forgotten that Tsukune willingly agreed to undergo the human modification ritual, despite Kurumu's protests, because it has given him the chance to save Moka, and that has just been the most recent example of how stubborn Tsukune can be on this matter...

Although, another thing that is worth pointing out is, will the girls let Tsukune turn into Alucard 2.0, especially Moka - who is after all, feeling quite responsible for Tsukune's transformation, and I believe she, along with the other girls, will do everything she can to not let Tsukune turn into a second Alucard, once she realizes how dangerous her blood can be (which, I believe is going to occur soon).

@Shinso Tsukune

Well, I agree that Tsukune is going to do everything he can to keep his human sanity, despite the changes that his body undergoes, but the question is, what he is going to need to sacrifice to achieve that, after all based upon what Tsukune underwent so far, Moka's Shinso blood is quite dangerous to him, and honestly speaking Tsukune has been quite lucky to make it to the current point of his transformation.
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Old 2012-04-08, 08:59   Link #22157
Shinso Tsukune
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@Shinso Tsukune

Well, I agree that Tsukune is going to do everything he can to keep his human sanity, despite the changes that his body undergoes, but the question is, what he is going to need to sacrifice to achieve that, after all based upon what Tsukune underwent so far, Moka's Shinso blood is quite dangerous to him, and honestly speaking Tsukune has been quite lucky to make it to the current point of his transformation.
This is the power of Tsukune's overwhelming will, in order to completely conquer the Shinso blood in his veins, he needs a strong enough will, these recent developements in chapter 52 shows that he is making excellent progress. I really loved the part where he was able to easily KO a fully powered Kuyou with a single attack, despite being an S-class youkai, yet at the same time Tsukune was calm and well composed, the Shinso power really is terrifying, and Tsukune only released a fraction of that power when he undid the first seal of the Holy Lock.
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Old 2012-04-08, 09:47   Link #22158
Merilyn Mensola
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Originally Posted by Shinso Tsukune View Post
Akasha definitely needs to make her return, sadly, I believe this won't be possible until the battle with Alucard.

AKASHA NEEDS TO RETURN!!!

Spoiler for Akasha:
......she is beautiful..maybe..more than Moka..well..she look like her...

I wonder when she will meet Tsukune...would be funny to see her tease Tsukune..and see Moka reaction

ho, and i agree with the fact of Tsukune Heart..this would never change..

hope Kurumu has learn something in the training..and the last page was just troll...
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Old 2012-04-08, 10:26   Link #22159
Chris38
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Regarding the Shinso powers potential, considering how powerful Tsukune is, with only a small portion of it under his control, think how powerful Inner Moka would be, if she was capable of using it.

It points out, why up till now, Inner Moka hadn't got any noticeable power-ups, since if she would be capable of using a larger portion of her Shinso powers, then she could be a really frightening opponent, and unlike Tsukune she probably wouldn't have as much problems as Tsukune does in keeping her powers in check, since she has been born as an vampire.

Although, I'm kind of thinking that, the fact that Inner Moka hadn't received any noticeable power-ups is slowly going to change, once the current arc is over.
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Old 2012-04-08, 11:25   Link #22160
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I'll check back later in the manga but I believe that the seal is only allowing a fraction of her power out - the bulk of which is still being held back by the personality seal. I think that as long as Outer Moka and the rosary seal exists, Inner Moka can't utilize her full power. Of course, full powered Moka = fully awaken and hungry Alucard so it's definitely a no-win situation.
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