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Old 2007-06-28, 11:42   Link #61
Ulquiorra
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5 View Post
Ok wait a minute...i started thinking.

Itachi HAD to use MS in order to survive Deidara's attack. Can we say....
if Sasuke is able to defeat Deidara then he is ready for Itachi??

Or he is close to Itachi's level? Because Itachi had to use MS and without it...he wouldnt be able to defeat Deidara.
That's what this fight is all about. Showing that Sasuke is close in ability to Itachi. Deidara is just the tool(fodder) being used. See you later Deidara. How you have fun in Akatsuki heaven.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice Knight View Post
i seriously hope that sasuke will lose this battle too,Akatsuki has nvr won any battle since we saw them [stupid asuma] .All the best for Deidara...
The Akatsuki have won plenty of fights. They’ve defeated 7 of the 9 jin/biju with ease. Kankuro got his butt kicked. Hidan and Kakuzu went through a bunch of monks, including one that was close to Asuma in ability. They killed Asuma and Gaara. Should have killed Naruto, Kakashi, Kurenai, Gai, etc.

Now compare that to the Konoha ninja. Even important ones like Shika who hadn’t won a fight since Kin until Hidan. Or Rock Lee whose record is awful.
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:00   Link #62
Kotengu
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That dog with sakrua is still pissing me off! It's not like you can walk into an airport with even a fingernail of crack before a dog is after you, but this dog walks right past sasuke's sent all over some chick right next to him? It's not a game of hot cold kishi. . . .
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:02   Link #63
Bari_Phillis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5 View Post
I agree..Akatsuki should win.

Everyone out of team Snake can die except Sasuke & the lady.
Suigetsu seems ok actually but i dont mind if both of those guys die.


i agree that akatsuki should win. but suigetsu is not going to die. The reason saskue got him was to fight kisame.


eh, i hope tobi does something.
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:03   Link #64
ragnos007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justice Knight View Post
speaking of team snake ,what are the rest doing?

i seriously hope that sasuke will lose this battle too,Akatsuki has nvr won any battle since we saw them [stupid asuma] .All the best for Deidara...
what do you mean they havent won a battle since asuma - Kisame got the 4 tailed Jinchuriki after Naruto and Co defeated Kakuzu and Hidan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulquiorra View Post
That's what this fight is all about. Showing that Sasuke is close in ability to Itachi. Deidara is just the tool(fodder) being used. See you later Deidara. How you have fun in Akatsuki heaven.
The fact is is that MS is still in Itachis arsenal and with it he easily defeated Deidara despite how shit he felt afterwards. It was clear that Sasuke couldnt defend himelf against Deidaras final and greatest art let alone defeat it with ease. The fact that Suigetsu had to jump in and protect Sasuke would show that Sasuke isnt ready - if Suigetsu didnt jump in then Tobi would have got to see Sasukes limbs detached from his body. and dont say that sasuke was gonna do something because he was contemplating on running and when suigetsu saved him he thanked him - if he didnt need help he would have said so. I have made my decision on saying that Sasuke isnt ready perhaps he should have summoned manda or something or another snake to coil around him oh wait - he cant do ninjutsu.

Last edited by Hunter; 2007-06-28 at 12:27. Reason: Do not triple post
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:26   Link #65
Hunter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5 View Post
Ok wait a minute...i started thinking.

Itachi HAD to use MS in order to survive Deidara's attack. Can we say....
if Sasuke is able to defeat Deidara then he is ready for Itachi??

Or he is close to Itachi's level? Because Itachi had to use MS and without it...he wouldnt be able to defeat Deidara.
What? Itachi didn't use MS at all against Deidara.
Both you and ragnos007 are refering to a fake spoiler.
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:28   Link #66
tatami
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so the spoilers confirmed huh?
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:41   Link #67
Kowai
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anyone who thinks "the whole fight is genjustu".... why would sasuke waste 3 chapters of my life? xD
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:59   Link #68
ChojinLocke
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Which one is the confirmed one? The genjutsu backstabbing one? Hmmmm seems to me all this fight turns out to be a genjutsu. (from the moment Deidara looks at Sasuke and the flashback starts until the end). Could be wrong.
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Old 2007-06-28, 12:59   Link #69
Mr. Johnny 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hunter View Post
What? Itachi didn't use MS at all against Deidara.
Both you and ragnos007 are refering to a fake spoiler.
Oh that's right....
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:05   Link #70
Kowai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChojinLocke View Post
Which one is the confirmed one? The genjutsu backstabbing one? Hmmmm seems to me all this fight turns out to be a genjutsu. (from the moment Deidara looks at Sasuke and the flashback starts until the end). Could be wrong.
thats a logical place for the genjutsu to start, but when he looks into his eyes hes pretty far away it seems... no distance limit?
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:22   Link #71
ChojinLocke
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Well Deidara came in contact with Sharighan in that scene and it is obviously confirmed by himself as well -->'those eyes'. After this Deidara triggers another jutsu (very powerful) and because genjutsu actually use the casters chakra against them this whole technique will backfire back to Deidara. Furthermore the more chakra Deidara uses (katsu) will be used against him or even sustain the genjutsu (you only can break a genjutsu if you stop your chakra flow). Sasuke cannot die within the genjutsu because it is not the real Sasuke but rather a projection of himself in Deidara's mind (an illusion). When Deidara funally realises that he will be totally drained of chakra and Sasuke might as well slaughter him. Of course that's just what I think right now and I havent seen the pictures but it kinda makes sense to me.

Hmmm as for the range you asked...I think the range is the eyesight contact for this sharighan genjutsu.
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:30   Link #72
othafa
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Genjutsu uses the target's chakra to cause an illusion, the affects of which are controlled by the caster. It never said that any chakra used by the target is turned against them. All it means is that as long as there is chakra flowing at all, the illusion is maintained. Where did you get the "backfire" notion? I agree with all the other stuff you said...
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:32   Link #73
Sazelyt
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Sasuke was using genjutsu on Deidara, but, if he was using the genjutsu on the clone, then Sasuke should have noticed some problems. And, if the original was caught by genjutsu, Sasuke should have tracked the original, before getting caught by the clone. Really strange.
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:37   Link #74
ChojinLocke
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Quote:
Originally Posted by othafa View Post
Genjutsu uses the target's chakra to cause an illusion, the affects of which are controlled by the caster. It never said that any chakra used by the target is turned against them. All it means is that as long as there is chakra flowing at all, the illusion is maintained. Where did you get the "backfire" notion? I agree with all the other stuff you said...
Of course it turns against them since by definition the illusion can be detrimental to the target. Also where did I get the backfire part? From the flashback in the last chapter. That's what happened and how Deidara would die.

Last edited by ChojinLocke; 2007-06-28 at 13:38. Reason: correction
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:44   Link #75
Syaoran
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OMG O.o
Have you seen the pictures [cut] ?

It looks like scenes from Gantz in Naruto.... Gore >_<
And this better doesn't mean Kishi's gonna kill of Sasuke!
I want a happy sasunaru ending!

Last edited by Hunter; 2007-06-28 at 13:59. Reason: You should know better than posting a whole bunch of pages from a chapter by now
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:44   Link #76
Kowai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sazelyt View Post
Sasuke was using genjutsu on Deidara, but, if he was using the genjutsu on the clone, then Sasuke should have noticed some problems. And, if the original was caught by genjutsu, Sasuke should have tracked the original, before getting caught by the clone. Really strange.
Yes i agree strange... if it is just a big clone fest then sasuke should have noticed as itachi did when he was burning the paper kakashi.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChojinLocke View Post
Of course it turns against them since by definition the illusion can be detrimental to the target. Also where did I get the backfire part? From the flashback in the last chapter. That's what happened and how Deidara would die.
Im not sure about this turns against them... i think its more along the lines of if you continue to use chakra the illusion continues. the flashback he did not backfire his chakra he backfired the attack because of the illusion.
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Old 2007-06-28, 13:50   Link #77
othafa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChojinLocke View Post
Of course it turns against them since by definition the illusion can be detrimental to the target. Also where did I get the backfire part? From the flashback in the last chapter. That's what happened and how Deidara would die.
No, what happened in the last chapter was that Itachi took control over Deidara's senses using his own chakra. He did this to trick Deidara into wrapping himself in his own jutsu. The chakra used in the jutsu would not "backfire" and somehow blow him up. The jutsu itself would have blown him up because he used it on himself without knowing. Is that what you meant by "backfire"? When I think of the term backfire (as it is used in terms of combustion engines, the origin of the term) it is more like what happened to Zaku, where the chakra itself caused him harm. That would not have been the case with Deidara, he was just momentarily inept at targetting his own jutsu.

Edit: Also, what he says I think is the same thing, but maybe worded a little better than mine ^^
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Old 2007-06-28, 14:00   Link #78
ChojinLocke
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Where did i say the chakra backfires kowai? The chakra he uses turns against them in the form of its physical manifestation (chakra is something like energy) {via the illusion} which is the technique (the jutsu) that's what i posted. Plz read what I type.

Basically the illusion is something that distacts the mind (the senses) so that the target uses energy to fight it but because it is in his mind the illusion is still there. And the victim only attacks himself since the illusion is in his mind.

So if chakra sustains the illusion and the illusion is responsible for the victim to attack himself how exactly does using chakra to form jutsus not backfire to the victim indirectly?

I never said chakra backfires - the technique backfires.
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Old 2007-06-28, 14:03   Link #79
Hunter
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Genjutsu do work on clone, in the other hand side effect like torture are useless since they aren't the real thing.
Here it seems Sasuke only altered the clone's perception to make him believe the "spore-bombs" were destroying his body from the inside.
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Old 2007-06-28, 14:08   Link #80
othafa
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Well, the technique can only "backfire" if it is capable of targetting the user. For example, Deidara dropping non-guided bombs from the air cannot possibly backfire on him. Once he creates them and drops them, gravity takes over and they're out of his control until he pops them. Unless Sasuke was able to catch the bombs that Deidara was making (while in an illusion) and place them back next to Deidara, they won't hurt him. The reason Itachi's trick worked was because the bomb itself was guided by Deidara's chakra, which means Itachi was able to control where it was going without Deidara realizing.
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