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Old 2009-02-11, 18:27   Link #1561
LaceNFrills
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by klowny View Post
As do i when the Catholic, Christians,Jehovah's Witness people knock on my door telling me i need help and this is the way i can get it.

Its very annoying and a waste of paper because i throw it in the garbage. This happens about every 2 weeks
Well, not so much as trying to convert, I think it's more like they try to get you guys to notice their new church or event. They try to get more people to know about their religion.

And you should recycle those paper >.>

Quote:
Its a bit weird for my condition because the front door needs a key and i don't know how they are getting in, maybe they have a key or something @.@
LOL! I'm imagining people in professional suits climbing fences.
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:28   Link #1562
LaceNFrills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klowny View Post
Its a bit weird for my condition because the front door needs a key and i don't know how they are getting in, maybe they have a key or something @.@



Okay, lets say it was an Atheist knocking on your door trying to convert you to their religion would you not be annoyed?
That's the point. They don't have a religion.
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:30   Link #1563
Echoes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post

Okay for example, religious people owns garden of flowers. Each religious represent different flowers for instant, and the Atheist are the people who doesn't own a garden. The religious people try to convince others to join their garden. Do you see where I'm going..?
That's merely your perception. To me, religions are offering poisoned apples to their victims, and irreligion holds the cure.
Quote:
my opinion on Athiest is that they don't care about religions because they don't really believe in it.
I speak for no one but myself, but I care about the harmful effects of religion, regardless of how unbelievable the actual dogma might be. I don't believe in homeopathy either, but that doesn't mean that I think it's alright for people to be scammed.

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And I don't count the people who call themselves Atheist who "believe" in science that tries to convert religious people because that's like disrespecting their religion to me, saying that your Lord doesn't exist and that you should join us.
Yet you think it's perfectly alright for religious people to convert nonbelievers and insist that your Lord does in fact exist. (And wants to torment me if I don't submit to his divine will in many cases.) I find that very hypocritical.
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:37   Link #1564
Vexx
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@Lace: Respect does not equal silence...

There's a huge difference between "forcing" or "peer pressure" and a civil discussion about different viewpoints.

Hypothetical: you encounter a religion that promotes racism and slavery, promotes the idea they are superior to non-believers and its ok to treat them poorly.

Do you "respect" that religion? If so, what actions constitute "respect"?

Oh, and atheists and agnostics believe they have gardens too... you're just not seeing them (just like they may not see your garden).
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:39   Link #1565
klowny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
Well, not so much as trying to convert, I think it's more like they try to get you guys to notice their new church or event. They try to get more people to know about their religion.

And you should recycle those paper >.>
That church is just across the street and it has been there since my parents moved into the apartment building so i don't think it's a new church, There's another one down the block and another one 4 blocks away and so on and so on.

what i don't get is why is there so many churches because i thought one or two would be enough to satisfy everyone

i'm called an atheist because that is what people are called if they don't believe in something, If this is a religion then shouldn't we have a church ourselves? but i think about it and say that we don't need a church or anything of the sort

i recycle the paper... into a crumbled paper ball for my cat to play with
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:43   Link #1566
LaceNFrills
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I don't know the viewpoints of Atheist, so I'll try to stop saying stupid things. So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
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Old 2009-02-11, 18:51   Link #1567
Vexx
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I'll recommend you read up on atheistic thought before you dismiss it. Start with the Wiki on atheism. If you have a strong stomach you might try some writings by evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins (though he's pretty staunch and pointed - he has turned into an evangelist of sorts in response to anti-science fundamentalism).
More people are actually "agnostic" as in they don't see any way to know the Big Picture or about an afterlife.

This thread is supposed to be more about expressing beliefs than attacking other beliefs. .... so just to keep things open, I'll repeat an earlier post:
I practice a pragmatic sort of Buddhism and find Shinto's animism an amusing comfortable way to view the world though its really just window-dressing for an underlying analytical science protocol. At this point, some people get confused and just label me a 'humanist' or a 'pagan' so they can stop thinking about it.

I do encourage following those links. You really can't disagree with something unless you have some knowledge of it.

Last edited by Vexx; 2009-02-11 at 19:06.
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Old 2009-02-11, 19:10   Link #1568
Daniel E.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
I don't know the viewpoints of Atheist, so I'll try to stop saying stupid things. So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
You do not need religion to have those things.

I have a loth of faith in my family and friends; And I also happen to have hopes and dreams for the future.

And yes, I also have a garden of flowers in front of my house.
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Old 2009-02-11, 19:16   Link #1569
0utf0xZer0
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I personally don't believe in god, although I don't think the question is provable either way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
Honestly... no. =/ Because like.. my opinion on Athiest is that they don't care about religions because they don't really believe in it. They don't really have anything to offer and try to convert other people, while religious do have stuff to offer and convince them to join their religion.
Don't have anything to offer? Personally, I find not stressing out over meeting ethical standards I have major disagreements with to be extremely beneficial.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Echoes
To me, religions are offering poisoned apples to their victims, and irreligion holds the cure.
I don't try to deconvert people because I feel most are probably happy the way they are, but I wish there was something I could do to counter the crowd that makes fire and brimstone speeches to kids and insecure teens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills
I don't know the viewpoints of Atheist, so I'll try to stop saying stupid things. So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
I don't typically believe in miracles or karma, although I sometimes do enjoy watching people get what they deserve. I have faith in some things, but not in God. I have hopes and dreams just like anyone else.
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Old 2009-02-11, 19:47   Link #1570
Clarste
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Atheists have the exact same thing that religious people have: the truth. They have a way of interpreting the world. It just happens to not involve any gods. Or maybe I'm just completely misunderstanding the point of religion. That's very possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills
I don't know the viewpoints of Atheist, so I'll try to stop saying stupid things. So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
I can't speak for all atheists, but I believe in people. I have faith that people can learn from their mistakes. I have hope that the future will be better than the past. I don't believe in karma as a force, and miracles have never been proven (coincidences are coincidences, not miracles). 'Dream' is an ambiguous word meaning either the hallucinatory experiences one has while sleeping or one's desires for the future. Both of those empirically exist.

Oh yeah, this thread is so long that I can't remember if I've said this before, but I'm agnostic leaning heavily towards atheist. You can't really disprove God (yet!) so I'm open to the possibility, but it strikes me as rather unlikely.
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Old 2009-02-11, 19:59   Link #1571
Echoes
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
I don't know the viewpoints of Atheist, so I'll try to stop saying stupid things. So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
Vexx already did a great job and went to a lot of trouble telling you where to find out more about the subject, but I'll just add this.

Atheism is a lack of belief, or disbelief in deities. It doesn't address anything else. You can believe in aliens, miracles, bigfoot, clairvoyance, karma or anything you feel like and still call yourself an atheist, so long as you don't hold a belief in god(s). Personally, I'm a skeptic/naturalist, but that doesn't apply to all atheists by any stretch of the imagination.
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Old 2009-02-11, 21:22   Link #1572
NDK
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Barlogian. They will come to your homes and attack your wives. Be warned even if you're a straight woman, they know your fantasies...
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Old 2009-02-11, 22:12   Link #1573
Vinak
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@LaceNFrills.

We have hopes and dreams just like everybody else. and just like everybody else, our reasons for our belief or lack their of vary between each individual person.

Please try to remember Atheist's are human, we are just like everybody else except we don't go to church or believe in a higher being.
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Old 2009-02-11, 22:48   Link #1574
LaceNFrills
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Originally Posted by Vinak View Post
@LaceNFrills.

We have hopes and dreams just like everybody else. and just like everybody else, our reasons for our belief or lack their of vary between each individual person.

Please try to remember Atheist's are human, we are just like everybody else except we don't go to church or believe in a higher being.
When did I say that you guys are not human? Seriously I have carefully word my words so it didn't come off as mean to anyone. Mkay?
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Old 2009-02-11, 23:26   Link #1575
Sugetsu
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Every single human being has a belief system, a philosophy of life, regardless of who they are. Sometimes, even science itself becomes its own religion as well. Religion to me is not a belief in God or a higher being, but rather the manifestation of our consciousness. Our beliefs shape the way we live and the way we perceive the universe.

Every human being has a consciousness, and that consciousness is enclosed by a mold. Some molds are more rigid than others, some are very malleable, and some are solid as a rock. That mold is made of ego; depending on how strong that ego is so is the mold that holds your consciousness.

To answer the question of the topic, I don't really fit into any category, but the closest would be that I am an agnostic. I consider that having any system of belief, such as religion, money, science, astrology... etc, will only limit the growth of the self. Balance is the key.

A belief is like a lit house in the middle of darkness; how well built and lit that house is is only relative to how expandable the mold that holds it is.

There are very few people who refuse to build a house to shield themselves from darkness. Most of us seek security and certainty, this is why pray, we study and we struggle. However, security and certainty are only illusions. This is why some individuals choose to navigate through the darkness to nothing to hold on to but a candle.

We should all replace beliefs for convictions, only then we can leave our egos behind and accelerate the growth of our consciousness.


------

Enough rant, but I hope I got my point across while staying on topic

Last edited by Sugetsu; 2009-02-12 at 01:29.
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Old 2009-02-12, 01:01   Link #1576
David_The_Gnome
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
So Atheist only believe in science and reality? No faith, hope, karma, miracle, dream or what so ever?
I think that's a shallow view that you're looking at it from.

Simply put. Atheism is a logical conclusion that a person arrives at there is no deity (no its not a religion). Its a nonbelief rather than a disbelief in your particular version of God.

And that's all there is to it.

Most of the negative stigma people have on atheists are just woo woo.
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Old 2009-02-12, 01:18   Link #1577
LeoXiao
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Quote:
Most of the negative stigma people have on atheists are just woo woo.
Or because the atheists they meet are jerks. Therefore, "most of the negative stigma people have on [religious people] are just woo woo," since religious people can be jerks as well.
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Old 2009-02-12, 01:44   Link #1578
LaceNFrills
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Originally Posted by David_The_Gnome View Post
I think that's a shallow view that you're looking at it from.

Simply put. Atheism is a logical conclusion that a person arrives at there is no deity (no its not a religion). Its a nonbelief rather than a disbelief in your particular version of God.
Oh, thank you for pointing it out then. I just thought they don't believe in anything supernatural and spiritual altogether. I seriously am not trying to be shallow or what soever.

Honestly, most of the Atheist that I've met and heard of from my acquaintance are rude who think they're right and cocky about their view of Gods, but they're teenangers so they're immature I guess.
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Old 2009-02-12, 01:58   Link #1579
Reckoner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David_The_Gnome View Post
I think that's a shallow view that you're looking at it from.

Simply put. Atheism is a logical conclusion that a person arrives at there is no deity (no its not a religion). Its a nonbelief rather than a disbelief in your particular version of God.

And that's all there is to it.

Most of the negative stigma people have on atheists are just woo woo.
Well, to be fair, there is quite a bit debate about the true definition of atheism. To me, it is an actual disbelief in any conventional God, or supernatural force. That is why I consider myself agnostic, I can't know whether such things do or do not exist. In this sense, atheism really is like a religion by putting faith in the idea that God does not exist (Without any proof).
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Old 2009-02-12, 02:22   Link #1580
0utf0xZer0
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaceNFrills View Post
Honestly, most of the Atheist that I've met and heard of from my acquaintance are rude who think they're right and cocky about their view of Gods, but they're teenangers so they're immature I guess.
My question here would be how you even know they're atheists. Most of them don't exactly go around advertising it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RECKONER
Well, to be fair, there is quite a bit debate about the true definition of atheism. To me, it is an actual disbelief in any conventional God, or supernatural force. That is why I consider myself agnostic, I can't know whether such things do or do not exist. In this sense, atheism really is like a religion by putting faith in the idea that God does not exist (Without any proof).
If I think that the evidence shows that the religions I've been exposed to are man made and therefore I don't believe in God, where am I exhibiting "faith"?
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