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View Poll Results: Shakugan no Shana II - Episode 9 Rating
Perfect 10 19 20.21%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 44 46.81%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 22 23.40%
7 out of 10 : Good 7 7.45%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 2.13%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 94. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-12-02, 16:38   Link #41
Anh_Minh
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Not very important question: What happened to Valac? Did she just lose a Flame Haze, or did she die along with Yuri?


More importantly: what's the connection between Yuji and Silver? Can a Tomogara become a Torch? Without even knowing?
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Old 2007-12-02, 17:05   Link #42
endlezz
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Good episode. Too bad Yuri died, but I liked the last line of him and Valac. I believe Valac didnt die, just returned back to Guze.

And I liked how Yuji managed to cast a Fuzetsu, it kinda looked cool how the grass moved, the music stopped and suddenly switched to a dramatc one with silver flames shooting of the ground.
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Old 2007-12-02, 17:16   Link #43
Algent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
More importantly: what's the connection between Yuji and Silver? Can a Tomogara become a Torch? Without even knowing?
I don't think he is Silver but silver must have done something with the reiji maigo, maybe he put a part of him inside

by the way if someone could explain me what is this "keeper" thing it would be great
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Old 2007-12-02, 18:52   Link #44
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Fine, Marjorie don't want to risk her life fighting Sydonay, so she should just take Yuri out of there and escape, even though Yuri will disagree with her idea. That way, Yuri will survive and will not be killed.

About Satou becoming a Flame Haze, it is being dropped by now as it seems. But, it should have some effect on the story. If not, why bother mentioning it? We still don't know whether Satou still want to help Marjorie to fight Silver. It was only shown that he is still deep in his thoughts. Hopefully, he is given bigger role in the future.

I wonder whether Valac is still available for contact. Satou can have a contact with Valac to become a Flame Haze. Imagine, Satou as a flame Haze fighting alongside Marjorie. Just my thoughts.
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Old 2007-12-02, 19:21   Link #45
blewin
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awww, only one episode and then Yuri's gone! but it's great to see that a flame haze can live by reasons other than killing Tomogara. I was quite surprised that he didn't feel betrayed when Margery didn't save him but threw in another fireball. Yuri's definitely a very interesting character with heaps of potential.. if only he wasn't killed so early!
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Old 2007-12-02, 19:52   Link #46
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No matter the result Yuri really was a good guy who followed his beliefs until the end. Margery's own beliefs lead to that result as well. She can't back out from a fight. Yuri gave an option for the battle to be a draw and Metamorphosis could escape. Mergery didn't give up on the fight the other guy just took an advantage to escape.

Do hope that the Satou becoming a Flame Haze situation is just put off for a while and not dropped entirely. Don't think he's the type to give up entirely after hearing that story. At the very least he has a lot to think about. Would be interesting if Valac turned up down the road. I'm sure it's not the first time Valac has lost a Flame Haze.
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Old 2007-12-02, 20:00   Link #47
Aquifina
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I gave it a 10, even though it isn't really "perfect." But compared to the slow start, this was a great ep--it gave both strong backstory Margery, explained better the attitudes of Flame Haze, and most of all, it gave real plot advancement with the end.
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Old 2007-12-02, 20:15   Link #48
DX HBK
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It's unlike Margery to shed tears in her sleep at the end. Makes her a bit too human for a Flame Haze of her caliber.
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Old 2007-12-02, 21:02   Link #49
ashlay
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Originally Posted by DX HBK View Post
It's unlike Margery to shed tears in her sleep at the end. Makes her a bit too human for a Flame Haze of her caliber.
well, that's a little unfair.

Wilhelmina has a weakness for Shana, otherwise she'd still be trying to Kill Yuji right now, Shana has a weakness for Yuji, and so on. Flame hazes are far from inhuman.
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Old 2007-12-02, 21:18   Link #50
DX HBK
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Perhaps I was a bit unfair.

It's just that Margery seems to be the type to kill those who get caught in the crossfire of her vengeance. She's going after the Silver and won't hesitate to sacrifice or kill anyone that is unfortunate enough to wander onto her path. Usually, people like that don't shed tears on how many lives they've taken in the pursuit of revenge and they don't feel guilty about it either.

(Margery killed Yuri to survive for another day and, once she falls alseep after telling the story, she's shedding tears?)
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Old 2007-12-02, 21:42   Link #51
puretsundere
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Great episode. It's kinda sad to see Yuri killed after appearing in only two episodes. He was a really great character and with just his actions in this one episode showed how brave he is. It nice to see a Flame Haze who stands by his own beliefs and who isn't completely obsessed with killing denizens.

I don't know if it's been asked (and if has been, I'm sorry), but does Margery wear glasses because of Yuri? I know she's not wearing Yuri's glasses, but I kind of thought that maybe since she didn't wear glasses in the past that she wears the glasses in the present as a reminder of Yuri. Am I wrong?
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Old 2007-12-02, 21:51   Link #52
ashlay
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Originally Posted by bmkharuhiism View Post
I don't know if it's been asked (and if has been, I'm sorry), but does Margery wear glasses because of Yuri? I know she's not wearing Yuri's glasses, but I kind of thought that maybe since she didn't wear glasses in the past that she wears the glasses in the present as a reminder of Yuri. Am I wrong?
doubt you're ever going to hear about it again. feel free to believe it if you'd like.
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Old 2007-12-02, 21:59   Link #53
Aquifina
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Great episode. It's kinda sad to see Yuri killed after appearing in only two episodes. He was a really great character and with just his actions in this one episode showed how brave he is. It nice to see a Flame Haze who stands by his own beliefs and who isn't completely obsessed with killing denizens.

I don't know if it's been asked (and if has been, I'm sorry), but does Margery wear glasses because of Yuri? I know she's not wearing Yuri's glasses, but I kind of thought that maybe since she didn't wear glasses in the past that she wears the glasses in the present as a reminder of Yuri. Am I wrong?
Maybe the novels make it more clear (I wouldn't know), but my assumption is that Margery wears glasses in memory of Yuri. It's clear that his sacrifice affected her, although I'm pretty sure she would do the same thing again.

Margery is a deeply ambiguous character; capable, and not completely unfeeling, but as Satou realized, she isn't really admirable in any conventional sense of the term. Her anger at Silver seems to be focused entirely on being deprived of the chance of taking revenge herself on whatever enemies were involved; presumably she had a real grudge to work out, but transferring her animosity in such a single-minded way to Silver seems, how should I put it?, a bit much.

The point I took from the story she told her young disciples was that she wasn't really all that admirable, and if they followed her, she'd sacrifice them, if necessary, just as she had done so with Yuri. I actually am not entirely sure she would do the exact same thing with her two amigos, but who knows, really?
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Old 2007-12-02, 22:09   Link #54
holyman282
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Wow this was surprisingly a good ep considering I don't really like Margery Daw that much. I don't watch Shana mainly for the action but I can understand why some would. The fight scenes were amazing this ep.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DX HBK View Post
Perhaps I was a bit unfair.

It's just that Margery seems to be the type to kill those who get caught in the crossfire of her vengeance. She's going after the Silver and won't hesitate to sacrifice or kill anyone that is unfortunate enough to wander onto her path. Usually, people like that don't shed tears on how many lives they've taken in the pursuit of revenge and they don't feel guilty about it either.
I think it's in character for Margery Daw to show some emotions, you're taking things on face value too much to consider that Margery didn't feel anything after he killed Yuri. I'm almost certain that she regretted her actions, it's just that finding and killing Silver has become so much of an obsession, that she'll do anything to kill him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DX HBK View Post
(Margery killed Yuri to survive for another day and, once she falls alseep after telling the story, she's shedding tears?)
Well considering that Margery Daw probably told the story in order to protect Satou, in order to stop him from being a Flame Haze. I mean why else did you think she decided to tell that story? She's warning him that if he becomes a Flame Haze and works with her, she won't hesitate to kill him in order to survive and obviously she doesn't want to choose between that.

Seriously don't take actions on face value, Shakugan no Shana is a good anime because every character has a level of depth.

It's interesting also that we learned more about Margery's history with Silver. From season 1 I always thought that Silver killed people special to her, but it appears that Silver killed the people Margery wanted to kill? So now she wants to kill him who killed the people she wanted to kill so that it'll feel like she killed the people she wanted to kill? (very confusing..)
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Old 2007-12-02, 23:00   Link #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by holyman282 View Post
It's interesting also that we learned more about Margery's history with Silver. From season 1 I always thought that Silver killed people special to her, but it appears that Silver killed the people Margery wanted to kill? So now she wants to kill him who killed the people she wanted to kill so that it'll feel like she killed the people she wanted to kill? (very confusing..)
Indeed that was interesting, though didn't she say that she wanted to kill Silver because he basically took away everything from her ? Such as her reason to live and I am just guessing is that her reason to live was to kill those people and she wants to kill Silver out of revenge.
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Old 2007-12-02, 23:24   Link #56
Kristen
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9. Getting back to what made season 1 so great is really good.

And yay! Yuji can finally cast a Fuzetsu, even though they've been talking about it all season!
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Old 2007-12-02, 23:58   Link #57
s[H]sIkuA
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Next episode : "Someone who returns home" ? Lol

Spoiler:


Great episode, we got to know a lot of Margery and also a lot of fighting, I was like lol'ed in the ep8 , a flashback inside a flashback

And the Fuzetsu part definitely makes me can't wait for the next episode.
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Old 2007-12-03, 01:00   Link #58
kimchipride
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It wasn't bad! 8/10
Now we know where her glasses are from as well
Good animation quality
and the ending when Yuuji casts ______, it was nicely executed.
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Old 2007-12-03, 01:03   Link #59
plzd0ntkeelme
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Great ep, less talk more actions.

Margerie is actually more powerful than i thought. Despite the injury, she could still give a fair fight against Sydonay, compared to Yuri who can't block Sydonay's attack at all. If Yuri could just counter it a little bit, i'm sure Sydonay will be dead right there with Margery could still unleash fireball and all. The one who killed Yuri is not Margerie, but Sydonay. If she did not unleash another fireball to block Sydonay's, the city could be leveled and millions turn into torches. I'm sure that action is what Yuri preferred as well.

Too bad Yuri died in his first battle. He died for a good cause, tho'. By saving Margery, he helped preserving one of the only adult women in this series lmao Without her, this series will have ridiculous unfair amount of loli. Although, instead of at the least providing us fanservice, she just gets drunk all day.
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Old 2007-12-03, 03:59   Link #60
grey_moon
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I really enjoyed this epi. I felt it a shame that Yuri bumped into Margery instead of... errr actually I can't really think which Flame Haze we have met would have been able to help him grow, instead of getting burnt up like a moth to flame.

This really does highlight the issue that the Flame Hazes suffer from. It been stated that they fight alone, but so far we have seen quite a lot of collaboration, but if they are not used to it, then they must trample on each others toes a lot when they are forced to work together. Balle Masque shows that the evil ones are quite capable of working together (well apart from the secret little plans).

Yuji's silver flames are pretty interesting for the Margery element, but also raises the question "what the Dango is he?". General categorisation is he is a torch or a mistes. But they burn out, and Yuji doesn't as he get replenished every night. He has the capacity of a Crimson Lord and now is able to cast spells. Crimson lords from what I gather need a human host to function and Yuji doesn't so does that make him more like a tomogara?

For example lets say that black hole boy gets down with all this casting stuff and gets good at it. Then lets say he looses the Reiji Maigo. His existence is huge so he won't burn out quickly, so what is to stop him from using a unrestricted spell, or a hougu from devouring the existence of others? In essence he would be a tomogara.... Of course I haven't taken into account his personality would most probably stop him from taken such action.
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