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Old 2008-03-27, 20:01   Link #181
Tatiana Razajev
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
All right, I'm betting my left arm that Noe wins.
Hopefully you can get by with just the right arm. I mean Noe's chanced looked decent early on, but as the show progressed it became clearer and clearer that Shin can only see Hiromi. In other words his dedication is too strong in my view. Okay maybe dedication isn't the right word here, but still the point is this. Noe lost before she even met Shin. It's hard to tell with Aiko because I'm not sure how long Shin knew her compared to Hiromi.
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Old 2008-03-27, 22:38   Link #182
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Frankly I think both female leads have seperate character issues that need to be resolved next episode, regardless of who Shin ends up with at the end. The story about Noe is obvious regarding her "true tears", which is an ongoing plot which needs a good resolution. I also think that there has to be some resolution to what seems like Hiromi's fear of being alone and living in the past. This is very directly manifested in the scene where she takes off her sandal in episode 12. It would be disappointing if they used a Hiromi ending to essentially make viewers forget about this without any resolution.
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Last edited by Theowne; 2008-03-27 at 22:53.
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Old 2008-03-27, 23:13   Link #183
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Originally Posted by Theowne View Post
It would be disappointing if they used a Hiromi ending to essentially make viewers forget about this without any resolution.
Actually I get the feeling a Hiromi Ending and a resolution to the sandal/lonely issue will end up being directly intertwined.
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Old 2008-03-27, 23:26   Link #184
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Well clearly a Hiromi end would resolve the immediate effect of it (since she won't be alone anymore), but having that be an end on it's own without some sort of character development scene to free her character from it, would be like having a Noe ending without resolving the issue of her tears/being unable to cry, etc. I think there were some scenes in the preview where Hiromi was by herself, so maybe those scenes will be used as sort of a separate development moment regardless of what the final pairing is.
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:09   Link #185
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Well, yeah, truth be told, I don't think either the Noe or Hiromi stories necessarily depend on romance to resolve their issues. They're almost seperate issues entirely in some senses.

Hiromi: She either a) needs to gain some confidence in Shinichirou's feeling towards her so she won't be so insecure and vulnerable, b) needs to find the strength to be able to face the world using her own strength, so that she can stop being jealous and vindictive or, c) all of the above. (If it's both, it seems logical that b) would come before a).)

Noe: She needs to find the strength to accept the sad things in her life and be able to cry properly so that she can regain a bit of sympathy, interact with others, and look to the future. She's obviously going to get to that point in this next episode no matter what.

I think where people are getting thrown for a loop a bit is that the show seemed to shift in episode 12 towards resolving Noe's issues, which they have to resolve in addition to Hiromi's issues in order to stay true to the show's theme/premise. But what episode 12 doesn't necessarily suggest is that this storytelling shift represents a change in Shinichirou's feelings. That's really where the "wiggle room" is in terms of how you interpret the plot, I think. To some it indicates a huge shift, to others it does not.
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:30   Link #186
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Well all I'm hoping is that next episode not many people will be like

"LOLZ I R Predixting Bttr Than JUZ"


And yea, I can do without my left arm, if I was confident I'd bet my right.

Like Relentless said though, we'll get both girl's feelings resolved next episode regardless of the end, which is the best I could've hoped for.

Like someone else said though, I forgot who, you definitely don't want to be the first girl to be talked to in the episode.
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:38   Link #187
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I wish there was a Poll to see who the majority of the people want to Win......

and I REALLY REALLY want a Shin and Hiromi ending. because I just dont see a resolution with Hiromi otherwise.
if Shin doesn't pick her.....will they even remain friends or will she just go her seperate way? <--if that happened i'd be in true tears

but deep down, I FEAR a Noe ending. While I dont like Noe a ton, she's ok. but I fear it because I think it might happen.

The way Shin just blew off Hiromi so many times in episode 12.....just makes me uneasy
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:42   Link #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MercFH View Post
I wish there was a Poll to see who the majority of the people want to Win......
Personally, I think polls like that attract shippers and campaigning more than anything else. I'd rather see people make a reasoned justification for what they feel will actually happen in the story, rather than focusing on "who they want to win".

Besides, it isn't all about the final score anyway.
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:45   Link #189
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this is true. ep 12 just reeked of desperation for Hiromi though.
at the VERY least even if Hiromi doesn't "win" i'd like to see her and Shin remain friends. I dont think i could be happy with the show if they just "parted ways"....that'd be too much

honestly though Aiko was my favorite. and she got BIGTIME denied in this show. i hope she at least gets SOME conclusive ending. the episodes with her were my favorite anyways...

But srsly it seems like Hiromi is just trying to Make Shin not realize Noe. Even though SHE realizes herself that his eyes are on her (heck u even see her in Shins eye)

I'd hate to see Hiromi fall like this, going from passive to desperate, and not even getting the one she loves?
But maybe she's more afraid of Noe taking away Shin as a "Person" and not neccesarily a Lover. But what gets me is Noe doesn't really ever seem to "try" as much as hiromi when it comes to their "relationships", so it makes me wonder if Noe even really knows what love is. I dont "hate" noe. but Im a sucker for the "best friends to lovers type ending" although I fear they may just be that ......friends

if anyone can post a counter-argument to what i just said PLZ do.^^ (srsly I want my fear gone lol)
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:52   Link #190
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If I was a girl I wouldn't want shin as my boyfriend, are we sure the one he chooses is the "winner" here?
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Old 2008-03-28, 01:58   Link #191
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Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
Im not in favor of Hiromi over Noe since i was Aiko fan but i do think she deserves it more than Noe i think shes going to pull off the win. Also, i think Shins mom is going to surprise us all in the final episode. Not to mention looks like theres a talk between Shin and Jun i cant see it very well but it looks like Jun
The picture is Jun, I'm hoping this conversation between Hiromi and Shin's mother is an indication that she wins. Hopefully Shin's mother is giving her blessing to the Hiromi/Shin relationship as well as explaining why she hated Hiromi's mother. Maybe we will see how Shin's parents and Hiromi's mother kinda went through the same things as Shin, Hiromi and Noe are right now. So she might be telling her not to make the same mistakes she did and not be insecure which is one of the things Hiromi has to get over. In addition to Shin helping Noe fly I believe this will tie things up nicely but I'll see what happens next Sunday/Monday.. I plan to avoid AS and MAL until I see 13 subbed... of course in saying that you will probably see me post on the first page of the episode 13 thread...

Quote:
at the VERY least even if Hiromi doesn't "win" i'd like to see her and Shin remain friends. I dont think i could be happy with the show if they just "parted ways"....that'd be too much
Unlike their counterparts in ef I really can't see them remaining friends which is why I think they will be the final pairing. Even if Shin passes over Hiromi can you really see Hiromi giving up on something she has wanted for a long time? I can see Noe and Jun remaining/becoming friends with the Shin and Hiromi couple but I can't see Hiromi and Jun repressing their emotions for Shin and Noe respectively.
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Old 2008-03-28, 02:01   Link #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
Personally, I think polls like that attract shippers and campaigning more than anything else. I'd rather see people make a reasoned justification for what they feel will actually happen in the story, rather than focusing on "who they want to win".

Besides, it isn't all about the final score anyway.
well, I wanted Aiko, but it is pretty obvious that is not going to happen.
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Old 2008-03-28, 02:12   Link #193
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People, I'd like to remind you that it's still a show. Don't take it too darn seriously.

I know at least one person who mutilated himself when Aerith died in FF7 and I know someone who is still in terminal depression because his Harry Potter shipping didn't go the way she wanted it to.

It's not pretty.

So stop saying things like I'll bet my arm, ect, ect.
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Old 2008-03-28, 02:42   Link #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Key Board View Post
I know at least one person who mutilated himself when Aerith died in FF7 and I know someone who is still in terminal depression because his Harry Potter shipping didn't go the way she wanted it to.

It's not pretty.
I can't say I won't be disappointed if it doesn't go my way but those two examples are just lols. There's so much awesome stuff about to come out in April I'll be able to put any disappointment behind me instantly.
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Old 2008-03-28, 03:40   Link #195
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Originally Posted by MercFH View Post
this is true. ep 12 just reeked of desperation for Hiromi though.
at the VERY least even if Hiromi doesn't "win" i'd like to see her and Shin remain friends. I dont think i could be happy with the show if they just "parted ways"....that'd be too much

honestly though Aiko was my favorite. and she got BIGTIME denied in this show. i hope she at least gets SOME conclusive ending. the episodes with her were my favorite anyways...

But srsly it seems like Hiromi is just trying to Make Shin not realize Noe. Even though SHE realizes herself that his eyes are on her (heck u even see her in Shins eye)

I'd hate to see Hiromi fall like this, going from passive to desperate, and not even getting the one she loves?
But maybe she's more afraid of Noe taking away Shin as a "Person" and not neccesarily a Lover. But what gets me is Noe doesn't really ever seem to "try" as much as hiromi when it comes to their "relationships", so it makes me wonder if Noe even really knows what love is. I dont "hate" noe. but Im a sucker for the "best friends to lovers type ending" although I fear they may just be that ......friends

if anyone can post a counter-argument to what i just said PLZ do.^^ (srsly I want my fear gone lol)

The problem about Hiromi is that, she depends too much on Shinichiro. Losing Shin equates to her losing her way, like in her childhood memory. All throughout the show, Shin is the one who's always supporting her. Shin wanted to "wipe those tears" from her eyes to the point that he neglected his own issues. Now that Shin has started to move forward, Hiromi feels like he's leaving her and becomes desperate. I don't think the writers are gonna be too mean to portray Hiromi as clingy from start to finish of the show. She'll probably realize this next episode. If Noe has some growing up to do, then it's the same for Hiromi. Hiromi needs to get Shin to open up to her and reverse the flow of support between them for a change. I think her problems have kept her from seeing Shin's own struggles. She can start from there.
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Old 2008-03-28, 04:21   Link #196
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Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
The problem about Hiromi is that, she depends too much on Shinichiro. Losing Shin equates to her losing her way, like in her childhood memory. All throughout the show, Shin is the one who's always supporting her. Shin wanted to "wipe those tears" from her eyes to the point that he neglected his own issues. Now that Shin has started to move forward, Hiromi feels like he's leaving her and becomes desperate. I don't think the writers are gonna be too mean to portray Hiromi as clingy from start to finish of the show. She'll probably realize this next episode. If Noe has some growing up to do, then it's the same for Hiromi. Hiromi needs to get Shin to open up to her and reverse the flow of support between them for a change. I think her problems have kept her from seeing Shin's own struggles. She can start from there.
I'm more inclined to believe that Shin is her goal, not that she's really dependent on Shin. For the past episodes, once the siblings issue got cleared out, and Hiromi realized Shin's longing for her (by a hug after the accident), you can see that she's changed from a passive person to quite an active one. Out of all 4 of them (Shin, Jun, Noe, and her), she's the most active at cleaning up all this relationship mess. In fact, even when we look at Noe, though she did indeed helped Shin realized himself, she still hasn't contributed anything to directly address this relationship mess yet.

And don't forget that Hiromi's taken actions all on her own, without being wishy washy, without asking anyone what to do. She did break up with Jun despite his protests. She moved out just so that she'll be independent and be able to approach Shin as an 'outsider' (i.e., not as part of Shin's family). She even did the kiss so that Shin will know how she feels. To me, all of that undeniably show how strong she can be once she broke free from her emotional deadlock.

So, what I'm trying to say is, she did all she can already. On the other hand, though he promised to "do things properly", Shin hasn't resolved anything yet. That might be the main reason why she became frustrated enough to make her final move: a straight talk with Noe that she won't lose Shin to Noe now that he made a promise with her.

Just think about it, if you did all you can but the guy still couldn't behave in a way that can assure you (in fact, all he did was to avoid talking directly about the matter, and still haven't acted out his own feelings/intentions), would you feel insecure? I think what we need the most (for Hiromi's part) isn't about Hiromi becomes less reliant on Shin. Rather, it should be about Shin finally makes a step toward her, since Hiromi has made every single darn step on her side already. It's definitely time for him to make a move; whether to accept or reject Hiromi, the next episode should be about Shin taking actions.

Last edited by b0nyb0y; 2008-03-28 at 06:12.
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Old 2008-03-28, 20:31   Link #197
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It's interesting to see talk about it's impossible to resolve Hiromi without her ending up with Shin. Now don't get me wrong, I do feel Shin will end up with Hiromi. However to be honest part of me thinks the idea of a girl having to be chosen by default in order to have a proper conclusion is almost like cheating. Then again I think every anime girl involved in a love triangle or larger has fans that will say "Choosing her is the only way to properly wrap up her story"
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Old 2008-03-28, 22:32   Link #198
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Quote:
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Just think about it, if you did all you can but the guy still couldn't behave in a way that can assure you (in fact, all he did was to avoid talking directly about the matter, and still haven't acted out his own feelings/intentions), would you feel insecure? I think what we need the most (for Hiromi's part) isn't about Hiromi becomes less reliant on Shin. Rather, it should be about Shin finally makes a step toward her, since Hiromi has made every single darn step on her side already. It's definitely time for him to make a move; whether to accept or reject Hiromi, the next episode should be about Shin taking actions.

Whether Shin accepts or rejects her, it will still have to come down to Hiromi becoming strong for herself. Like you said, she is starting to become more and more independent. I give her that. All that's needed is for her to overcome her insecurities and her character development will be complete. I, for one, want to atleast want to see Hiromi redeem herself after episode 12.

As for Shin, whatever he meant by doing things properly, that's his own issue like how Hiromi has hers. Can't wait till this show is over. -_-
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Old 2008-03-29, 07:47   Link #199
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If we're lucky neither choice will boil down to "Waaaaaaaaaaaah", "I choose you!", "Yaaaaaaaaaaaaay!". Granted both paths have almost trapped themselves in that regard making it very easy for either side to see it that way. Still I have to wonder. Will Hiromi just stand there or will she chase after him? Not sure which will be the more positive sign. The former will show confidence in Shin. The latter will show her willing to take action. So both can be taken as positive and negative.

In any case the two choices boil down to this. In the case of Hiromi it's Shin finally getting together with a long term desire. Which is the key, she has to turn out to be a true desire and not something he wanted just because he couldn't have it. In the case of Noe it's the question of what does she truly mean to him? Is she just some random girl he met or something more?
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Old 2008-03-29, 07:54   Link #200
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I have to agree with b0nyb0y that Hiromi has taken a lot of action since episode 9, probably more than the rest of the cast combined. I'm really hoping for Shin to step up this episode no matter which way it goes.
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