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Old 2008-02-23, 20:46   Link #61
boggart
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
As much as I like the BD format, can I continue to whinge about the region coding and hope that someone higher up reads this and decides to eradicate region coding altogether?

Maybe it's all wishful thinking...
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Old 2008-02-24, 02:26   Link #62
aohige
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere, between the sacred silence and sleep
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoSanninWa View Post
That's because now the internet is for porn.
Grab your dick and double click!

Don't make me sing the song.
http://jp.youtube.com/watch?v=eWEjvCRPrCo
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Old 2008-02-24, 03:08   Link #63
hobbes_fan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bayoab View Post
The lowest xbox that could play it was the arcade which was only $279. By the time the arcade was out, the HD-DVD addon was already down to $180. The lowest Blu-ray capable PS3 is 400 USD. The reason the addon was $200 was MS was not interested in taking a hit in order for HD-DVD to win.

There is one thing you misinterpreted which is by bundle, I meant actually physically putting the drive in, but that was my poor choice of words. If they had actually thrown the HD-DVD drive inside the 360 or bundled it, it would not have added $200 to the price. When you bundle something or put something like that in the hardware, it does not add its MSRP onto it. If they had added the HD-DVD drive to the already expensive elite model, there wouldn't be noise about it since there were still the two cheap SKUs and people who were buying that clearly didn't care about the price to begin with.
Realistically what was the lowest that M$ would be willing to add the HDDVD drive - at cost would be reasonable. cost price for consumer electronics is anything between 25%-50% of RRP.

Now you also fail to acknowledge that by integrating the HDDVD drive a whole new design of the that poorly engineered POS called the 360 would be required. It's not just sticking an HD DVD drive in there without taking stock of the additional power, cooling and noise issues. Adds more to the cost of R & D and baseline production costs.

Quote:
Well, MS could have taken a hit or part of it if they had actually wanted to try and make HD win like Sony was. Sony was losing money on every console. MS could easily have lost money on the player to try and and push it harder. But as MS said when Toshiba gave up, 'Our system actually has games to play on it and HD media to download, not a glorified HD player.'
And that half-assed attitude is why HD DVD is dead. Sony mortgaged their future for market dominance. They took the risks. Now they stand to make trillions of $$ because each and every BD device and related item has to be licensed through them. THey invested in their product. Had M$ done the same thing we'd be trumpeting HDDVD instead of BD. It's a business high risk = high reward. M$ didn't want to commit so they only get the game sector. Sony committed so they got the entirely more profitable and bigger market of the home entertainment sector. And I'd also guess we'll see Sony use the fact that the Ps3 will sell more and more units to eventually establish dominance or at least parity in the gaming sector again. Toshiba is the real loser here - they chose to build a partnership with a company who wasn't willing to go as far as they were.

Quote:
The issue is that blu-ray was shoving it down the consumers throats while HD-DVD was waving their hands in the background. Want a PS3 back then? Sure, then you get upwards of 10 free blu-ray discs! This is why blu-ray won.

The HD-DVD addon counted. And removing the PS3 from the equation, HD-DVD actually sold more hardware (this even counts if you remove the HD-DVD addon). Therefore, counting the "not-everyone is getting it as a blu-ray player but it is also the cheapest blu-ray player on the market" PS3 is technically a gimmick. However that's just nit picking. BD actual disc sales on the other hand, were a gimmick. When you offer BOGO and count both as a sale or 10 free discs with a PS3 and count all of them as sales, those are gimmicks and those are how BD won. By making it appear that it was selling a lot better than it actually was, you convince people that it is actually doing better than it actually is. BD Disc sales should have dropped off dramatically after all the BOGO and the free disc offers went away.
Why is this even an issue? Losers cry about this. It's a perfectly legit marketing tactic. Was money exchanged for these products? Yes. They count as sales. Whether a profit is made on each sale is irrelevant. By that reasoning none of the HDDVD special offers don't count either. Again it's marketing-Sony used every little trick in the book - yes that is correct. BUT, none of these tricks were illegal or falsified. Blame M$'s marketing and promotions team if you want to blame anybody for HD DVD's loss.
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Before you ask "How do I convert fansubs to...." see the following
MP4 - http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=47693
Convert AVI/MKV/MP4 to DVD
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?t=26308

Last edited by hobbes_fan; 2008-02-24 at 03:28.
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Old 2008-02-24, 10:31   Link #64
bayoab
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Join Date: Nov 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by hobbes_fan View Post
Now you also fail to acknowledge that by integrating the HDDVD drive a whole new design of the that poorly engineered POS called the 360 would be required. It's not just sticking an HD DVD drive in there without taking stock of the additional power, cooling and noise issues. Adds more to the cost of R & D and baseline production costs.
Somehow, I would bet MS did a cost analysis and R&D on putting it in the machine prior to deciding to go with an external. It's not like MS just went "Hmm... we want people to go for digital downloads in the end. Let's go with an external!" (Aka, the Michael Bay conspiracy theory.)

Quote:
And that half-assed attitude is why HD DVD is dead. <snip> Had M$ done the same thing we'd be trumpeting HDDVD instead of BD. It's a business high risk = high reward. M$ didn't want to commit so they only get the game sector.
MS isn't the only company involved in the big equation. There were other companies that were being equally lax in the background. This isn't just MS's fault. It's just MS is the easiest one to play pin-the-tail on.

Quote:
And I'd also guess we'll see Sony use the fact that the Ps3 will sell more and more units to eventually establish dominance or at least parity in the gaming sector again. Toshiba is the real loser here - they chose to build a partnership with a company who wasn't willing to go as far as they were.
Well, Toshiba just won the chip factory for the PS3. So they didn't completely lose. Also, the PS3 is no longer the cheapest player on the market.

Quote:
Why is this even an issue? Losers cry about this. It's a perfectly legit marketing tactic. Was money exchanged for these products? Yes. They count as sales. Whether a profit is made on each sale is irrelevant. By that reasoning none of the HDDVD special offers don't count either. Again it's marketing-Sony used every little trick in the book - yes that is correct. BUT, none of these tricks were illegal or falsified. Blame M$'s marketing and promotions team if you want to blame anybody for HD DVD's loss.
Right. It's not illegal, it's legit "marketing". In the end it is all statistical manipulation. HD-DVD did the same sales trick, but nowhere on the factor of Blu-ray. You saw the BD camp claiming to have X:1 sales when you could get that X by paying the price for only 2-3 discs while the HD-DVD was actually buying 1 disc and getting a few free. Whoever did the HD press release math was really lousy at his statistical manipulation (or maybe just honest). So in the end, the point is the consumer didn't actually decide it. A bunch of cheap early adopters did.

(Probably should add a note that I am not for pro-BR or pro-HD. I couldn't less who actually won as long as they don't go trumpeting statistical manipulation as facts.)
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