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Old 2008-03-13, 14:43   Link #21
KholdStare
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorrow-K View Post
No anime I've ever seen is above criticism. Even the two best anime I've ever seen in Laputa: Castle in the Sky (kid's film) and Rurouni Kenshin: Tsuiokuhen (a few pacing issues) have a few minor flaws. Or maybe I'm just a decrepit old man that finds flaw in everything...

Now and Then, Here and There: overly optimistic lead.
Mushishi: not every episode is brilliant... only most.
Monster: a few convenient plot points, "un"-epic ending.
Gankutsuou: pacing issues here and there, sometimes over-the-top.
Honey and Clover II: sometimes can't properly separate comedy and drama.

These are among the best anime I've seen, but they each have a few minor flaws that I recognize. No anime is absolutely perfect, end of story. Nonetheless, some of the anime being brought up in this thread have a list of flaws that you could write a book about. It makes me wonder whether people genuinely can't see such flaws, or are just conveniently ignoring them...
That's because most of us are casual viewers (myself included). Unless there's something obvious that is wrong, if it's very enjoyable, then there's no flaws. It's obvious that no anime is perfect, but it also depends on the level of analysis. I watch anime as a hobby. Many of those anime (KgNE, Elfen Lied) that I've listed as perfect I've written reviews for, and their ratings are not even close to perfect. That's my analysis side, and that's way different. To me, perfection is merely enjoyment value. If you claim that so and so has a pacing problem, the real question is did I notice it? If you say there's a flaw in the plot, the real question is, was it significant enough for me to notice it?

Tsuiokuhen is an example of what I'm talking about. I don't recall any pacing issues, and I've watched it at least 3 times; every time it was enjoyable. To me, it's perfect, but I just don't look at anime the same as you do. Perfect doesn't even mean I enjoy it the most anyways. For example, I rated Moetan a 6/10, but I think it's perfect in every way.

So to answer your question, yes, I genuinely can't see such flaws, but I'm not trying overly hard either, since I watch anime to enjoy it, not to critique it.
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Old 2008-03-13, 14:48   Link #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KholdStare View Post
So to answer your question, yes, I genuinely can't see such flaws, but I'm not trying overly hard either, since I watch anime to enjoy it, not to critique it.
Similar case here, well put

Another fact is that series which people enjoy watching usually do better in helping the viewer "forgive and forget" small flaws littered here and there. It is a lot more easy to crit on something you modestly enjoy than something you really like watching unless you are out there to look for flaws specifically. I tend to fall under the just "enjoy it" group most of the times. Unless it is a series I am passionate about enough to give a detailed summary.
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Old 2008-03-13, 15:31   Link #23
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My top three would be...

1) Cowboy Bebop
2) Elfen Lied
3) Trigun

But I agree with KholdStare, Elfen Lied is one of those hit or miss type of Anime.
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Old 2008-03-13, 15:38   Link #24
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No anime, every anime that I watched I have bit of complaints even my favorite show like GaoGaiGar and Gurren Lagann all have little things that I did not like.
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Old 2008-03-13, 16:40   Link #25
GreatTeacherKen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorrow-K View Post
Nonetheless, some of the anime being brought up in this thread have a list of flaws that you could write a book about. It makes me wonder whether people genuinely can't see such flaws, or are just conveniently ignoring them...
Well I consider flaw to be a very subjective concept. I'll use an example, Furi Kuri is a series I'm not a big fan of. I think it's too over the top and crazy, which incidentally is one of the reasons why many people love it and I respect their opinion. I think treating a concept like 'flaw' as something objective is dangerous because it gets very close to stating opinion as fact.
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Old 2008-03-13, 23:11   Link #26
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I see flaws in every anime but I too subscribe to the school of thought of forgive and forget. It's not that I can't find things to complain about flawed animes that I love, I simply choose not to, since I don't like complaining about shows I enjoy. The ones I love to complain about are those highly-rated series that I didn't enjoy as much. So when I see all those people say how wonderful Seirei no Moribito, Higurashi the second season, or Kaiji is I just have to drop in and ruin the party, sometimes saying only the bad things even though there are plenty of good things I liked about it.
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Old 2008-03-13, 23:24   Link #27
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I wouldn't really call it complaining, but I can always find something where an anime could be better, except maybe one of my favourites, The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya, since there's nothing else of an even similar genre with which to compare it to. I could probably easily find something wrong with it if I tried hard enough.

Oh, and I guess that I probably haven't complained about 99% of the anime I haven't seen. There's a couple that I've found flaws with without having to see it, though.
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Old 2008-03-13, 23:32   Link #28
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Quote:
Nonetheless, some of the anime being brought up in this thread have a list of flaws that you could write a book about. It makes me wonder whether people genuinely can't see such flaws, or are just conveniently ignoring them...
Things like these have a lot to do with taste. There's no such thing as "conveniently ignoring" flaws a show would have. Everyone is, you want it or not, a fanboy in some way or the other, and there's no escaping that. No attempt at rationalizing any form of art will succeed in making you completely detached of your feelings towards a particular piece of art. None.
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Old 2008-03-13, 23:34   Link #29
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Originally Posted by ZeosX View Post
My top three would be...

1) Cowboy Bebop
2) Elfen Lied
3) Trigun

But I agree with KholdStare, Elfen Lied is one of those hit or miss type of Anime.
I agree with that...Cowboy bebop and Trigun are two animes that some people had criticism going on for the endings and such but ive always thought they were best because of it. as for Elfen Lied I loved it like no other dont get me wrong but i have so many complaints about that one
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Old 2008-03-13, 23:46   Link #30
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I think Cowboy Bebop is one of the best anime ever made, but I can understand those who criticize it by stating that it is too episodic and does not have a cohesive storyline, with the central plot of Julia and Spike being buried under an avalanche of randomness. The same can be said about Samurai Champloo, which, not coincidentally, has the same creator. I guess that's just how he likes making anime.

In so far as an anime that can be considered flawless, one that comes to mind, at least to me, is Monster. It is hard for me to envision someone not liking the series based on a question of merit or because of some technical fault it has. People might not like it because it's just not their cup of tea, whether the style, subject matter, or something of that nature, but to critique it outside of that is mighty difficult as I see it.
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Old 2008-03-14, 00:06   Link #31
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On the subject of pure and perfect series, that really have no faults...

Yes, nothing really is exactly perfect in this world, but I believe that things can get very close to perfection, almost to the point where a distinction between the two is so minuscule that it doesn't even matter.

For example lets take the movie "Perfect Blue" as a model.

Some points of this movie were alienation and jealously, and we got to see this through the character Nina. I never saw the movie drop in quality, it depicted exactly what it was supposed to depict, and it was very clear and concise. The story material may have not been that interesting to some people, but it really had nothing wrong with it. People could nit pick a thing here or there, but did it really matter?

Bah, what ever.

Anyhow the following series literally had no faults, I never complained during them:

Monster
Paranoia Agent
Cowboy Bebop
Tokyo Godfathers
Perfect Blue
Paprika
Samurai X: Trust and Betrayal
The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya
---

I know some more other than that, but those are just some notable ones.

Also just to note, being flawless doesn't always make a series the most enjoyable. I like series like Death Note and Code Geass more than Paprika. My favorite anime ever is Neon Genesis Evangelion, and well it had some huge quality (Mainly budget cuts with animation, like use of still with talking behind a coffee mug) issues due to Gainax being complete bastards.
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Old 2008-03-14, 01:28   Link #32
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I don't think anybody was cruel enough to complain about Potemayo before.
-------------------

But really, there is no "perfect" anime. Just like how nothing is ever perfect, you can always find fault within something.
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Old 2008-03-17, 19:10   Link #33
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I always complain about the anime I watch. Maybe it's because I usually read the comic too. Compare to the comic, the anime just not good enough.

Let's say Bokonano, some ppl think it's really good, but for those ppl who also read the comic, the anime just not good. They changed the store so much and it was not "dark" enough.

For those anime that was originally from ADV game, I always think that it's not complete at all. I always complain about they only have 1 store line, just like Fate stay/night. Why don't they make UBW and heaven feel too?
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Old 2008-03-17, 20:56   Link #34
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I complain about the anime I like. If I can't find something to complain about it's because I don't care enough about the show to complain.
The show I can find least complaint with are probably PitaTen and Sugar Sugar Rune. This is mainly because PitaTen is good but not good enough to activly think about when your not watching it. For Sugar Sugar Rune I think it's mainly that I've forgotten alot of it.
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Old 2008-03-17, 21:10   Link #35
siber222000
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azumanga daioh
seto no hanayome
school rumble series
ah my goddess
clannad *so far*
lucky star
haruhi suzumiya
zero no tsukaima (sort of)
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Old 2008-03-18, 18:08   Link #36
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Great topic! It made me think very hard.

After REALLY careful consideration....I've come up with two.

....TWO!?

They are Pretear and Petite Princess Yucie. No animation faults, no "off" days with the artwork, I loved all the main characters (nobody got on my nerves), my favorite couples got together, loved the music, no bad seiyuu or mismatched voices, no bad HAIRCUTS, good plots, and the endings satisfied me. Completely.

...wow. two....two freakin titles....XD
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Old 2008-03-19, 10:15   Link #37
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To be honest I don't find anything wrong with Lucky Star, Chobits or Higurashi. ^^;
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Last edited by Nemu; 2008-03-19 at 13:38. Reason: Adding Chobits
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Old 2008-03-19, 11:48   Link #38
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-Lucky Star
-Higurashi
-Chobits
-Onegai Teacher.
-Shakugan No Shana

Never complained about these animes, they are perfet in my opinion
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Old 2008-03-19, 16:55   Link #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
-Lucky Star
-Higurashi
-Chobits
-Onegai Teacher.
-Shakugan No Shana

Never complained about these animes, they are perfet in my opinion
Onegai Teacher is good! I almost forget that!
But my only complain for it is I can't find the last episode about others find out their relationship. Is it on DVD speical only?
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Old 2008-03-19, 19:07   Link #40
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Of the ones I've seen or seen partially:
Quote:
Originally Posted by siber222000 View Post
school rumble series Apparently, the second season wasn't as good as the first. Tenma and Haruma get absolutely nowhere with their "relationships" during both seasons.
clannad *so far* Things following Fuko's arc weren't explained. Tomoyo's arc was a bit rushed. Kyou's arc doesn't exist.
Spoiler for Fukostuff:

Also, Fuko needs more reappearances for me to Gif.

lucky star The six and a half minute conversation about food, however legendary, really wasn't that great. They overdid the loli-ness a bit; 18-year-olds looked like they were 8. Haruhi and Full Metal Panic! references were a bit overplayed. It moved too slowly at times. Not enough deredere from Kagami-sama.
haruhi suzumiya Sci-fi psychobabble. Ordering of episodes. Controversy surrounding "God" figures and whatnot. Grossly overhyped.
zero no tsukaima (sort of) Lacks a good deal of character development, it overplays its harem at times. Louise' actions are a bit overexaggerated. Pacing problems. The second seasons' whole middle arc.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pancake-pie View Post
To be honest I don't find anything wrong with Lucky Star, Chobits or Higurashi. ^^;
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miko Miko View Post
-Lucky Star See above.
-Higurashi Killer lolis are always controversial. The animation wasn't great at times. Its first season was confusing for a good many people. Some people dislike that level of violence. Rika beat Nagi in Saimoe 2007 because Higurashi was much more well-known than Hayate no Gotoku.
-Shakugan No Shana Its explanation of the early events was a bit cloudy. It strayed from the source a bit (a medium amount). It's not one of the most original ideas. Not enough Hecate. Its development sporadically changed in pacing.

Never complained about these animes, they are perfet in my opinion
Ah, I'm a bitch.
Keep in mind these are all anime that I've really liked except Zero no Tsukaima, which I just liked, and School Rumble, which I have not finished.
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