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View Poll Results: True Tears - Episode 13 Rating
Perfect 10 106 40.93%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 63 24.32%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 32 12.36%
7 out of 10 : Good 16 6.18%
6 out of 10 : Average 14 5.41%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 6 2.32%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 0.39%
3 out of 10 : Bad 4 1.54%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 17 6.56%
Voters: 259. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2008-03-31, 12:55   Link #261
golthin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
Did anyone eles burst out laughing when Shin starting crying and singing the cockroach song?or was it just me. I just couldnt help it i know it was suppose to be a serious part but I couldnt hold back my laughter.
I didn't laugh, but I found it hard to watch! gave me goose bumps of embarrasement!
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Old 2008-03-31, 13:02   Link #262
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Originally Posted by mikesince83 View Post
I'm glad you brought it up. This is one of my favorite scenes in the series, and a defining moment for Hiromi's character. It really is the last and ultimate obstacle she faced in becoming a truly eligible companion for Shin. The way she dealt with the realization of her inappropriate behavior, and her subsequent resolve speaks volumes.
Interesting observations. It occurs to me, also, that Shin - despite his naivete - was probably not unaware of what Hiromi was trying to do there, and we've seen first-hand evidence that he's not above temptation in his thoughts for Hiromi. Yet he reacted by pulling back - that whole "do things properly" theme again. The good boy wanting to put everything in it's proper order so he can finally be with the girl he loves unfettered by loose ends and guilt.
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Old 2008-03-31, 13:33   Link #263
FuzzyWuzzy
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My only big disappointment in this series is that, Hiromi and Shin needed more childhood moments. They only had the festival and slippers thing. They need 1-2 more. Childhood moments make good anime. LOL I just remembered that genshiken episode.

Edit:

We all knew that Shin would end up with Hiromi. Just because childhood moments > everything else in anime. It's like Ai yori aoshi or something like that.
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Old 2008-03-31, 14:28   Link #264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FuzzyWuzzy View Post
My only big disappointment in this series is that, Hiromi and Shin needed more childhood moments. They only had the festival and slippers thing. They need 1-2 more. Childhood moments make good anime. LOL I just remembered that genshiken episode.

Edit:

We all knew that Shin would end up with Hiromi. Just because childhood moments > everything else in anime. It's like Ai yori aoshi or something like that.
I think they focused on the festival memory most because it was the real beginning of when their feelings started. Their other childhood memories probably would not have made as big an impact as that one did and also didnt want the viewers minds to get clouded with things that werent important. That flash back was one of the most important scenes in the series. We also see some of the fears Hiromi had about being left behind. Im sure their other childhood memories are probably more of their parents spending time together and such.
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Old 2008-03-31, 15:00   Link #265
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I seriously don't know what rating to give this show. Maybe a 9, maybe an 8. It was pretty excellent, in any case. Subtle emotions and great animation.

I loved the scene where Shin sang the song and cried. It said to me that he actually did love Noe -- but just nowhere near as much as he loved Hiromi, for good or ill. He knew he had to leve her, but it really broke him up to do it. Good work by the seiyuu, Ishii Makoto, to show himself moved to near-incoherence.

One of the things that endeared me to Hiromi was her harsh self-protective weakness, so similar to that of Shin's mother. It was hard for Shinmother to wait for Shinfather to choose her, as it was for Hiromi to wait for Shin to choose her. Hiromi will stop at nothing to get him, and I have no probem with that. It's life and life only. She's not a bad person at all, just tough and lonely and confused.

Did I miss something, or do we never actually see Noe's tears? Noe now is all alone, even without her brother. But she apparently has become better able to make friends. A sequel coming, with a new love interest? She was a great character, in my opinion. This show's most interesting creation.

But I agree that the last 2-3 eps took a long time to get us where we expected we were going anyway. I still enjoyed the ride.
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Last edited by Kaoru Chujo; 2008-03-31 at 15:11.
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Old 2008-03-31, 15:09   Link #266
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Did I miss something, or do we never actually see Noe's tears?
You missed the last seconds after the credits rolled, I guess?
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Old 2008-03-31, 15:55   Link #267
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An interesting question - is Noe now living on her own? While in Hiromi's case it seems perfectly natural (not to mention convenient as a nookie-den) Noe seems so immature that one fears for her ability to take care of herself.
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Old 2008-03-31, 16:00   Link #268
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
An interesting question - is Noe now living on her own? While in Hiromi's case it seems perfectly natural (not to mention convenient as a nookie-den) Noe seems so immature that one fears for her ability to take care of herself.
she and her brother were never living alone. They live with their mom, but she works and they never showed her to us. She is one of those parents that are never shown because they will get on the way of the story.
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Old 2008-03-31, 16:07   Link #269
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Oh, is that the case? I don't remember that mentioned. Well, that's a good thing for Noe!
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Old 2008-03-31, 16:41   Link #270
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Originally Posted by apr View Post

No one's mentioned the insanely powerful scene with the hot coffee either. From the moment Hiromi invites him over at school, through the way she urges him on in the staircase, and sits down to take his hands along with the cup, and sips the coffee, there's a roaring sexual tension. Then she goes and says "ii yo", which most likely should be interpreted as consent for having sex. She's basically so anxious to keep Shin with her that she'll throw herself at him. Luckily Shin sees through her madness and stops it, resulting in Hiromi feeling ashamed and sending him off, because it's not like her to be so ... nasty. The situation with Shin's mother has changed her, and all of Shin's affection is based on a lifetime of knowing and loving her before she moves into his home.
Interesting. I didn't really see it that way, I thought she was just telling Shin to do what he wants--oh wait, I guess I'm dense afterall.

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Originally Posted by relentlessflame View Post
His heart ached when he was with her because of all this, but "wavers" implies too strongly that it was lessening his feelings for Hiromi, which the show (it seems to me) has never otherwise suggested. I think the feelings Shinichirou had for Noe were strong and powerful, but different than those he had for Hiromi. But, him being torn between these two seperate sets of emotions was causing pain for both girls; he couldn't have both. This is why he could still rightfully say that Hiromi was the one he's always loved, but Noe was the one who inspired him to draw, dance, and "fly". This also ties into why I felt the confession scene after the farewell made sense. Perhaps all this is just arguing semantics, but it seems to me that the distinction is important, again in that small, subtle way that defines a lot of the show's message.

Of course, that's all just my own interpretation/opinion, and everyone's free to disagree. Whatever works for you.
This reminds me of the "Koibito" translation from FF7 love triangle, well anyway lol I did a little researching too and the word that I always see come up is "tremble". It's just like what Rembr defined. ^_^ Therefore, I'm going to have to go with the subbers because I trust them and that's basically consistent from what I saw in Shin's behavior. It's the reason why I thought he'd really throw us a curve ball, but alas, he stayed true to his resolve.

In episode 12, people are hating Shin because of his dull actions and jerk-ish attitude towards Hiromi. I mean, he already had Hiromi but the girl he wanted to see most was Noe. The debates were all going on how he just really wanted to show the picturebook to her, but it didn't really seem that that was all. For me, episode 13 just brought light as to why Shin had to act the way he did during the festival. His feelings wavered. His "Hiromi 4ever" conviction 'trembles' whenever he looks at Noe.

"I'm in love with Hiromi, but the reason I was able to draw was because of you. I was able to dance because you were there."
"I'm in love with Hiromi, but when I look at you, my heart 'trembles/shakes'"

If Shin's romantic affection towards Noe was too subtle to see compared to Hiromi's then this by far is the strongest. It came from his own mouth. This is why I agree with the subbers when they used the word "waver". It was the best word to describe what he felt. Why would he feel the need to chant desperately that he loves Hiromi when he was watching Noe walk away? Let's admit it, he basically cried true tears. He was wavering and keeping himself from chasing Noe. Funny or not. That's all it is. For a girl who opened up his shell, something Hiromi didn't manage to do, it's not inconsistent for him to be that attached to Noe--enough to waver his (he's been loving her forever) feelings for Hiromi. In my opinion, that's what the writers want to tell us about Noe and Shin's relationship. They didn't end up together but the way they impacted each other was beautiful. Just like an angel and a human if you want to romanticize it. Bittersweet.


Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
Episode 10 should have been the ending! In comparison, Episode 13 lacked the "natural high" that Episode 10 provided. Coming immediately after the surprising turn of events in Episode 12, the concluding episode of True Tears felt somewhat anti-climatic.
They didn't choose to end the show with another scene from the final pairing because this show's not just about Shin and Hiromi getting together. Instead, the focus of the aftermath, other than the casts' character development, was Shin's how to cry true tears monologue and Noe's demonstration. It was fresh and well done. It stayed true to the show's theme.

But I think I get what you mean. If I were a huge fan of HiromixShin, I would've wanted an end like that of episode 10 regardless of what the writers want to impose on us.

Last edited by ani_d; 2008-03-31 at 16:51.
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Old 2008-03-31, 16:44   Link #271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TinyRedLeaf View Post
Episode 10 should have been the ending! In comparison, Episode 13 lacked the "natural high" that Episode 10 provided. Coming immediately after the surprising turn of events in Episode 12, the concluding episode of True Tears felt somewhat anti-climatic.
That is pretty much how I feel. True Tears is a good anime romance-wise, but the drama ended a long time ago. I still enjoyed it to the very end, but it wasn't perfect, and the ending felt very anti-climatic.
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Old 2008-03-31, 16:49   Link #272
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
It occurs to me, also, that Shin - despite his naivete - was probably not unaware of what Hiromi was trying to do there, and we've seen first-hand evidence that he's not above temptation in his thoughts for Hiromi. Yet he reacted by pulling back - that whole "do things properly" theme again.
It's hard to say if his reaction was self restraint driven by genuine concern for Hiromi, or the response of an emotionally confused and inexperienced teen. For my part, I'd like to think it's the former since it makes him a considerably stronger and discerning character.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FuzzyWuzzy View Post
My only big disappointment in this series is that, Hiromi and Shin needed more childhood moments.
As Sinestra mentioned, that particular flashback was necessary to reveal some of the internal conflict Hiromi was dealing with. The directors need to be careful not to include too much about Shin and Hiromi's past together in order to maintain a balance between her and Noe. You seemed to have a clear understanding of the final outcome from just the one scene linking the two as childhood friends. Imagine how much more revealing multiple occurrences would have been.

ani_d, I like your interpretation of the "waver" translation and it's application to Shin's circumstances. As for his particularly distanced behavior towards Hiromi in episode 12, considering how things turned out, I would attribute that simply to the writer’s final attempt to redirect viewers from the impending Hiromi and Shin pairing.

Last edited by mikesince83; 2008-03-31 at 17:04. Reason: responded to ani_d.
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Old 2008-03-31, 18:35   Link #273
dosser
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Thanks to everyone with their insight on this series. It answers a lot of my questions and made sense of why this series was called "True Tears". It's actually a lot deeper than your mere high-school romance series. Thx.
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Old 2008-03-31, 19:05   Link #274
golthin
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Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo View Post
Oh, is that the case? I don't remember that mentioned. Well, that's a good thing for Noe!
Jun told it to Hiromi during one of their talks!


Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_d View Post

"I'm in love with Hiromi, but the reason I was able to draw was because of you. I was able to dance because you were there."
"I'm in love with Hiromi, but when I look at you, my heart 'trembles/shakes'"

If Shin's romantic affection towards Noe was too subtle to see compared to Hiromi's then this by far is the strongest. It came from his own mouth. This is why I agree with the subbers when they used the word "waver". It was the best word to describe what he felt. Why would he feel the need to chant desperately that he loves Hiromi when he was watching Noe walk away? Let's admit it, he basically cried true tears. He was wavering and keeping himself from chasing Noe. Funny or not. That's all it is. For a girl who opened up his shell, something Hiromi didn't manage to do, it's not inconsistent for him to be that attached to Noe--enough to waver his (he's been loving her forever) feelings for Hiromi. In my opinion, that's what the writers want to tell us about Noe and Shin's relationship. They didn't end up together but the way they impacted each other was beautiful. Just like an angel and a human if you want to romanticize it. Bittersweet.
Very good! Like I said I can summarize what you just said, Shin's love for Hiromi is the romantic love he longed for so long. Shin's love for Noe is a passionate love. It is hard to walk away from something you have wanted for so long[Hiromi], even though Noe's feeling made him so alive. Shin chose love over passion.

Last edited by golthin; 2008-03-31 at 21:29.
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Old 2008-03-31, 20:20   Link #275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
If Shin's romantic affection towards Noe was too subtle to see compared to Hiromi's then this by far is the strongest. It came from his own mouth. This is why I agree with the subbers when they used the word "waver". It was the best word to describe what he felt. Why would he feel the need to chant desperately that he loves Hiromi when he was watching Noe walk away? Let's admit it, he basically cried true tears. He was wavering and keeping himself from chasing Noe. Funny or not. That's all it is. For a girl who opened up his shell, something Hiromi didn't manage to do, it's not inconsistent for him to be that attached to Noe--enough to waver his (he's been loving her forever) feelings for Hiromi. In my opinion, that's what the writers want to tell us about Noe and Shin's relationship. They didn't end up together but the way they impacted each other was beautiful. Just like an angel and a human if you want to romanticize it. Bittersweet.
Exactly my thoughts as well. Everything which happened surrounding that scene, including the sentence said by his father, including the comparison drawn between this generation and the previous, including his need to basically scream at himself that he loves Hiromi, including his practically breaking down outside, all of it makes sense and has the fullest impact when you interpret it as his statement that his heart wavers romantically, and makes very little sense if you believe it as brotherly love. What Shin said was that he loves Hiromi, and has loved her for a long time, but seeing and thinking about Noe makes his heart waver, makes him start to doubt. That's why he has to completely let go of Noe in order to have a real relationship. To get rid of the doubt which has been making him indecisive.
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Old 2008-03-31, 20:39   Link #276
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That's why he has to completely let go of Noe in order to have a real relationship. To get rid of the doubt which has been making him indecisive.
The emotions of these characters are so strong that doesn't leave room for half hearted break ups. Shin had to stop going to Aiko's shop and Aiko had to stop going to Shin's dancing practices to do a clean breakup. IT is obvious that Shin doesn't socialize with Aiko and nobuse outside of school, and the same goes for Noe and Shin. It is sad, but sometime this kind of break ups are necessary.
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Old 2008-03-31, 20:50   Link #277
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Originally Posted by golthin View Post
Jun told it to Hiromi during one of their talks!

Very good! Like I said I can summarize what you just said, Shin's love for Hiromi is the romantic love he longed for so long. Shin's love for Noe is a pationate love. It is hard to walk away from something you have wanted for so long[Hiromi], even though Noe's feeling made him so alive. Shin chose love over passion.
A small quibble - I don't think I would choose "passionate" to describe Shin's love for Noe, as it implies a strong sexual attraction. While I don't deny there might have been some interest I recall no signs, really, of any physical attraction from Shin towards Noe. What meager physical contact there was was all instigated by her. In fact, the only libidinous thoughts or deeds by Shin were directed towards Hiromi.

What would be a better word for Shin's love for Noe? Compassionate springs to mind.
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Old 2008-03-31, 21:05   Link #278
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"Compassionate" means out of feelings of sympathy or sorrow for the person, and a desire to stop whatever suffering that person experiences. Shin never mentions anything like this when he is thinking of or breaking up with Noe, especially his exact words in that bus stop. Even his desire to "wipe the tears from your face" towards Hiromi seems to echo this description more than anything he's said to Noe.
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Old 2008-03-31, 21:07   Link #279
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I have to admit that, as much as I liked Noe's character, I would have been surprised if Shin chose her. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think he had ever showed any romantic feelings for her at all during the series. One thing I have issue with which bothers me was the scene where Noe asked him if he likes her to the point of writing it down using rocks. I've lied to girls before but not about that. It's despicable. If he did lie for the purpose of an arrangement with Jun then that shows a very weak character.
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Old 2008-03-31, 21:34   Link #280
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"Compassionate" means out of feelings of sympathy or sorrow for the person, and a desire to stop whatever suffering that person experiences. Shin never mentions anything like this when he is thinking of or breaking up with Noe, especially his exact words in that bus stop. Even his desire to "wipe the tears from your face" towards Hiromi seems to echo this description more than anything he's said to Noe.
exactly, I think Shin has more Compassion for Hiromi than Noe. Noe is the one that make him feel alive, Hiromi is the one that Makes him want to protect and nurture.
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