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Old 2010-12-21, 15:12   Link #6101
Sekirei07
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Spoiler for Insanely tough Cruz:
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Old 2010-12-21, 16:44   Link #6102
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Originally Posted by Sekirei07 View Post
Spoiler for Insanely tough Cruz:
At that point in the story, everyone should see Cruz is no longer human.
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Old 2010-12-21, 17:29   Link #6103
Magin
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See, him surviving that fall wasn't just for comedic purposes...
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Old 2010-12-22, 01:42   Link #6104
Avvesione
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Originally Posted by Sekirei07 View Post
Spoiler for Insanely tough Cruz:
Cruz has always been taking a beating throughout Needless, it seems. Kafka, Mio, Setsuna, Aruka, Arclight, Hatfield, Voras, Toria Monster, etc. have all harmed him directly. Even in the gags he's picked on, especially by Eve and Blade.

You know, I can't honestly think of anyone in the series who's been a 'true' friend to Cruz. Everyone's seemed to beret him, insult him, or hurt him in some way.... Well, the only ones I can think of right now are Saten (I wouldn't count kicking Kurumi into him as hurting him) and Black Madam. Isn't that sad that one of them is one of the most evil/mysterious characters? Can anyone else think of anyone that's never been mean to Cruz?
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Old 2010-12-22, 01:56   Link #6105
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The problem is that early on, Cruz was the comedic relief... and the comedic relief gets picked on by EVERYONE. Once the focus shifted towards Cruz being the main character (i.e., post PFzero), then he made some good friends... namely the PGS trio. Although if you want to get technical, I don't believe that Shounen Blade has picked on Cruz...

As for Saten... remember, after he saw what Cruz did with Kurumi, I think he decided Cruz was too valuable to do anything to
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Old 2010-12-22, 09:25   Link #6106
Soji
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Well, as Magin pointed out Cruz was initially the comedic relief.
But from what I remember Seto and Solva were never bad with Cruz.
Anyway as Blade end Eve they pick on Cruz the most,but in realty they are the ones that care the most about him....I mean just look at their reaction when Cruz dies during the third shelter and if we want to be totally honest Eve is the one that care the most to him, despite their first meeting.
I mean..
-During the fight against Uten goaded him into doing something and he start using his intelligence from that moment onwards.
-During disk the Informant arc she trades places with Cruz and the process is kidnapped by PGS in his place and was also made to brainwash.
-During the third shelter against Saten she was angry from what I remember and always during the third shelter when she resurrects Cruz she takes a strong shock from the medical device to disk.
-During the faling girl arc Eve was trying to get Cruz to let her go because he was not strong enough to pull her up.
In fact, she lie to him and she knew if she falling that time was very probably to dying that time and she could not know that disk was coming with a testament.
And we know what happened next...I must admit that Cruz surprised me a lot that time.
Now that I think about this ... how did cruz know/remember that he was revived by Eve and his arm was reattached always by her?
I mean, during that event, Cruz must have been dead or at least unconscious
But I must say that another has shown to care a lot about Cruz is Mio.

Last edited by Soji; 2010-12-22 at 13:33.
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Old 2010-12-22, 15:28   Link #6107
Ynot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avvesione View Post
Can anyone else think of anyone that's never been mean to Cruz?
Perhaps Gido? I can't remember him being mean to Cruz.

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Originally Posted by Magin View Post
Although if you want to get technical, I don't believe that Shounen Blade has picked on Cruz...
Hmm, shounen blade did call Saten and Yamada a "stalker couple" while laughing out loud. But it sure looked like Saten was more bothered by that than Yamada



On a sidenote, I think Imai Kami does an excellent job of slowly turning Yamada into a more courageous/assertive person. No sudden, jerky character changes. It's all going very fluidlike. For now I like Yamada better without a fragment but if he's going to get one, he has to be "leveled up" characterwise first.
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Old 2010-12-22, 15:32   Link #6108
Avvesione
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^
Yeah, I forgot about Seto and Solva. Great find!

But the point of my post was just to show that Cruz is picked on (for real or for fun) by virtually everyone. We all know how Blade, Eve, and Cruz all deeply care for each other, as seen with their actions throughout the series. And of course personalities change. Mio isn't crushing Cruz's arms with her bunny and punching him in the stomach and Setsuna isn't mocking him and trying to kill him either. But I'd be cautious to say they're 'true' friends just yet.

I kinda got this idea looking at the 2nd page of Chapter 86, 3rd panel with Cruz wanting to throw that monster to the ground. Just looking at his facial expression... do you ever remember a scene where Cruz was that determined to inflict harm on someone else? I remember him during the Hatfield fight but I don't know if he expected to harm him at all. Other than that, I don't remember a time when Cruz was actually attacking something. Then I kinda reversed my thinking on who's attacked Cruz... then it became a game of trying to find out who HASN'T attacked Cruz lol.

Also, shounen Blade tried to punch Cruz when he was spying outside the church. Gido called him Yamada for a while back before Iron Mountain. That isn't really picking on him though...
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Old 2010-12-24, 17:29   Link #6109
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Well, it's not like anyone had much of a reason to like Cruz at first. At first he was nothing but a powerless kid who was only useful as a damsel in distress. In the Black Spot, that doesn't cut it, at least not when you're at the front lines of battles and the target of Simeon. Everyone fighting for their lives had the right to resent the kid who just appeared to be standing there. It says a lot about Blade and Eve that they were willing to protect him, even if they picked on him a lot while doing so. As the series has gone on, Cruz has become more assertive and has earned the respect of others by showcasing what his deductive abilities can accomplish in lieu of pure offensive power.

I wouldn't hesitate to include the PGS among Cruz's good friends now. Especially Mio, she's gone through a lot to protect him even if possible ulterior motives are taken into consideration. They may end up on opposite sides of a conflict once again, but in that case I think the dynamic will be vastly different from what we saw in the first parts of the series, before Cruz got on friendly terms with the girls.

Also, in a series with as much slapstick and physical comedy featuring super powered beings as Needless, there isn't any real meaning behind such things as who has and hasn't laid hands on Cruz. I suggest trying to not think about it too much.

Last edited by Kefit; 2010-12-24 at 18:13.
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Old 2010-12-24, 17:47   Link #6110
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The problem with Cruz is that at the very beginning, he was a whiny, cowardly brat who was always calling for his sister, and just happened to get saved by Blade. I believe that the only reason he went along with the group into Simeon HQ was because he felt owed a debt to Blade. Then, once inside Third Shelter specifically, his intelligence went to work, and once learning that Aruka was one of the Four Strongest, and more specifically, after she killed him... that's when he started becoming his own man
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Old 2010-12-25, 11:03   Link #6111
shadowii
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Originally Posted by _kurusu_ View Post
My thoughts:

Spoiler for spoiler:


That's all. In the end Sayo had a very good point
Spoiler for dont agree:
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Old 2010-12-25, 18:10   Link #6112
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Spoiler for Cruz:
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Old 2010-12-26, 22:27   Link #6113
Om Nerabdator
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Anyone think the reason that blade turns into a huge pervert is because of yamada im thinking yamadas gonna do something incredibly moe at the end of this ark and blade will break lol
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Old 2010-12-27, 15:48   Link #6114
Robotech Master
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So are we a few chapters behind in scanlation and everyone here is discussing the raws, or is Mangafox not updated?
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Old 2010-12-27, 16:37   Link #6115
Soji
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^Yes, but it was explained a few pages behind why Chapter 85 has not been translated yet.
In any case, the last chapter released is 86 if you look a few post back you can find the summary made by J06.
Quote:
On a sidenote, I think Imai Kami does an excellent job of slowly turning Yamada into a more courageous/assertive person. No sudden, jerky character changes. It's all going very fluidlike. For now I like Yamada better without a fragment but if he's going to get one, he has to be "leveled up" characterwise first.
Ynot...I agree with what you said.
The only thing I disagree is with respect to fragment, I think this is the moment that Cruz must earn a fragment.
Beacuse he should grow with the fragment in its use and learn to use it against others Needless.
If you think about it, probably will not start to use it well and probably will get tired or I think he have other problems like Mio she known how to use her fragment but not enough to exploit it fully, so I think something similar will happen when Cruz will acquire a fragment or whatever.
after all Cruz started to evolving after it was struck by pfzero with the Eden cell (Appel of eden)within themselves that he obtained by Eve during the process of his resurrection.

Last edited by Soji; 2010-12-27 at 18:43.
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Old 2010-12-28, 13:35   Link #6116
Ynot
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I don't think Yamada has it in him at the moment to use a fragment he gets against others. I'm mainly talking about offensive fragments like solar ray. For example you've never seen him use/carry a weapon before like a knife or a gun and the black spot isn't a place you'd traverse unarmed. He's still depending on others for his protection. That's slowly changing, but we aren't there yet.

A unoffensive fragment is something he could use, but in my mind he already has an excellent unoffensive power, his brain and perhaps his amazing resilience against falling off of cliffs etc.
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Old 2010-12-28, 16:35   Link #6117
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I have trouble seeing Cruz with any type of offensive fragment. For one thing, if we have been seeing hints of Cruz's emerging powers, there hasn't been any sign that these powers would be offensive. It's hard to decide what his emerging powers are but there has been no indication of any new offensive abilities. Additionally, it's not in his personality to attack others. He's always been a timid, weak person, so having him develop an offensive fragment would be contradictory to his character.

I'm also pretty certain that Cruz's developments will not be brain related either. Cruz is already one of the most intelligent people in the series, so an improvement there wouldn't really change anything. The only thing where I can see an improvement in this area is that Cruz can become more knowledgeable, which is kinda the role of people like Gido, Disk, and Saten.
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Old 2010-12-28, 17:07   Link #6118
Soji
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Originally Posted by Avvesione View Post
I have trouble seeing Cruz with any type of offensive fragment. For one thing, if we have been seeing hints of Cruz's emerging powers, there hasn't been any sign that these powers would be offensive. It's hard to decide what his emerging powers are but there has been no indication of any new offensive abilities. Additionally, it's not in his personality to attack others. He's always been a timid, weak person, so having him develop an offensive fragment would be contradictory to his character.
Honestly I think its will be offensive type
That is why I told that he should grow up with the fragment (or whatever it gets).
And that is why he has to learn that sometimes the offensive should be used especially if you want to protect those you love, I am sure that while Cruz got an offensive power would not change that much, it would use only for self-defense when is necessarily.
but I'm sure he will have to pass many difficulties( especially emotional) before accepting this power (or whatever he get).
Or at least thats what I think about this.

Last edited by Soji; 2010-12-29 at 06:55.
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Old 2010-12-29, 02:14   Link #6119
Kon the Magnificent
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avvesione View Post
I have trouble seeing Cruz with any type of offensive fragment. For one thing, if we have been seeing hints of Cruz's emerging powers, there hasn't been any sign that these powers would be offensive. It's hard to decide what his emerging powers are but there has been no indication of any new offensive abilities. Additionally, it's not in his personality to attack others. He's always been a timid, weak person, so having him develop an offensive fragment would be contradictory to his character.

I'm also pretty certain that Cruz's developments will not be brain related either. Cruz is already one of the most intelligent people in the series, so an improvement there wouldn't really change anything. The only thing where I can see an improvement in this area is that Cruz can become more knowledgeable, which is kinda the role of people like Gido, Disk, and Saten.
Y'know, maybe Cruz's fragment isn't what we think (if he has one), maybe it's something self destructive in nature. I don't know, maybe something similar to a nuke going off or something
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Old 2010-12-29, 06:59   Link #6120
Soji
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^I hope not, he has already died once, it lacks only he get a self-destructive power.
O well, I hope they return soon in the real world I want to see the situation in the future.
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