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Old 2013-04-09, 00:21   Link #10101
Kurohane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avvesione View Post
Say, just a quick general question to throw out since it's been kinda quiet lately...

Back in Chapter 74, during the beginning of the Eve's Story arc, we saw Ishiyama stand on the ceiling of Eve's room and then proceed to walk down the walls. Given that we know Ishiyama is likely an Adam with multiple fragments, it's likely that he was using a powered-up form of Gravity (I must admit, that's an awesome way to introduce the Stigmata-level of Gravity in the manga).

The question is, how did he obtain Gravity and at such a high level? You never see Ishiyama meet up with Seth or anyone really until that point nor do they show clones of Seth being used to learn the fragment from her. I'm really curious on how Ishiyama obtained that fragment before meeting with Blade and everyone in the Underground City.
Maybe Set is also working with Simeon or specifically Saten. With Gido being head of Tiple 6, anything is possible. It goes along with my theory of Set and Solva are still alive and the ones thrown to Arclight were duplicates. Set is the only one who could convince Solva to switch sides.

Another possibility is watching Fake Arclight use it at one time. Arclight did learn it from Blade during the reverse rejection reaction. That's plenty of time between Arclight's recovery and the meeting at the hospital in the underground city.
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Old 2013-04-09, 02:07   Link #10102
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Well, clone maturation seems to be capable of accelerated growth. Teruyama was a full blown adult in the time between Simeon's explosion and the City arc. That's pretty quick. If you weren't worried about higher brain functions and such, you could probably clone just the body very quickly, but even then the scientists were talking about how you could download yourself into a new body.

So if/when Set and Solva appear again, there's a lot of ways it could be explained without retconning the narrative. I'm sure they were defeated off panel precisely for that reason, just in case the writer wanted to bring them back into the story.

If Uten, Kafka, and others can be brought back, there's no reason why Arca, Set, and Solva couldn't be brought back either. There just has to be a good narrative reason for it. We've already seen that you don't need to consume a person to gain their stigmata, so there needs to be a reason why the writer decided to kill off Set and Solva so easily.
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Old 2013-04-09, 17:45   Link #10103
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Old 2013-04-10, 04:59   Link #10104
Randrak42
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And this is where Neon Genesis Evangelion.
Needless was a prequel all along dun dun DUUUUN!
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Old 2013-04-10, 05:14   Link #10105
erapath
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace View Post
Well, clone maturation seems to be capable of accelerated growth. Teruyama was a full blown adult in the time between Simeon's explosion and the City arc. That's pretty quick. If you weren't worried about higher brain functions and such, you could probably clone just the body very quickly, but even then the scientists were talking about how you could download yourself into a new body.

So if/when Set and Solva appear again, there's a lot of ways it could be explained without retconning the narrative. I'm sure they were defeated off panel precisely for that reason, just in case the writer wanted to bring them back into the story.

If Uten, Kafka, and others can be brought back, there's no reason why Arca, Set, and Solva couldn't be brought back either. There just has to be a good narrative reason for it. We've already seen that you don't need to consume a person to gain their stigmata, so there needs to be a reason why the writer decided to kill off Set and Solva so easily.
Can you accept clones to be their selves? Clone have memories from originals, but that memories aren't true, because they belong to the original. Memories isn't ownself, Anatta in Bhudist terminology. If Set or Solva appear again, that isn't original themselves anymore.
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Old 2013-04-10, 08:39   Link #10106
thor94
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Originally Posted by Randrak42 View Post
And this is where Neon Genesis Evangelion.
Needless was a prequel all along dun dun DUUUUN!
Yep, blade and saten are responsible for second impact .
The angel looks more like a demonic monster than a real angel.

But another chapter where cruz is completely useless (his highlighted will have been really brief )
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Old 2013-04-10, 11:04   Link #10107
Kurohane
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Originally Posted by erapath View Post
Can you accept clones to be their selves? Clone have memories from originals, but that memories aren't true, because they belong to the original. Memories isn't ownself, Anatta in Bhudist terminology. If Set or Solva appear again, that isn't original themselves anymore.
Your thinking the same as Cruz, and I agree, but Solace is just listing the possbilities of explanation could be used to explain how Set and Solva could return. As I said, I believe clones were thrown to fake Arclight with the real ones still being alive somewhere. Another possibility is the Set and Solva we know were clones all along, and the real ones haven't shown themselves yet.
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Old 2013-04-10, 11:54   Link #10108
K. Shiruto
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Quite the irony that Arclight wanted to save humanity even if it was at the cost of 93,4% world population.

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But another chapter where cruz is completely useless (his highlighted will have been really brief )
Still trying to convince yourself? His uselessness disappeared long ago, but I suppose we are not reading the same series
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Old 2013-04-10, 14:11   Link #10109
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^ Well to be honest we've seen Yamada do little more than just stare in awe the last few chapters. I'm sure he'll make a wonderful comeback in terms of actually doing stuff soon enough though.

A bit off topic: I really wonder if there's some sort of way to identify a simeon clone from the original if the clone itself doesn't know he's a clone. Naturally old scars etc won't be present when it's a clone, but in a lot of fiction with clones they usually have some sort of number or other sign tattooed in a place you normally wouldn't look. I could imagine Simeon doing something like that.
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Old 2013-04-10, 14:48   Link #10110
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^ I don't think a marker is necesssary, since for all we''ve seen, Simeon only puts a clone to service after the original is dead.
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Old 2013-04-10, 14:53   Link #10111
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^Besides we already see what happen to the clone if Saten/Simeon want.(explode)
So there is really no need of mark or thing like this.

Quote:
Well to be honest we've seen Yamada do little more than just stare in awe the last few chapters. I'm sure he'll make a wonderful comeback in terms of actually doing stuff soon enough though.
We really can't blame him for that,I mean with everything that happen so far ,I'm surprised that he is still conscious.
But like you ,I'm pretty sure he will do something good soon.(maybe in the ch of this month).
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Old 2013-04-10, 15:15   Link #10112
K. Shiruto
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The real question here should be if Yamada can do something to at least give everybody hope to survive this already far beyond hopeless situation they were put in.

At this point their only prospect is the angel that just came out from the other side. As we can see, it's wounded, and the behaviour of an angel when injured is to either hibernate or find a more conventional method that is fuse with an individual.

Saten is already godlike and he probably has no interest in an angel that isn't in good shape.
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Old 2013-04-10, 15:30   Link #10113
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Kurusu-Shirudo@ Run toward the angel?
Besides we know that a angel want Yamada alive and AnN(?) already show herslef to him once.
There is many thing that can happen and like I say , I can totally see Yamada run toward the angel in the hope to do something to help his friend (maybe something like with the 2Christ?)

Anyway, whatever thing happen will probally happen in the next ch.
Also I can see Saten let Yamada do whatever he want just to see what happen next XD
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Old 2013-04-10, 15:32   Link #10114
Ynot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurohane View Post
^ I don't think a marker is necesssary, since for all we''ve seen, Simeon only puts a clone to service after the original is dead.
True. I was thinking along the lines of all of the Aruka clones we saw earlier. Are they just all the exact same or would they have "names" like A01 etc. which could be found on their body somewhere(like a tattoo I mentioned). Arclight and Blade did have a sign(the number on their choker) but I was wondering whether the other clones had something like it too but less obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soji View Post
Kurusu-Shirudo@ Run toward the angel?
Besides we know that a angel want Yamada alive and AnN(?) already show herslef to him once.
There is many thing that can happen and like I say , I can totally see Yamada run toward the angel in the hope to do something to help his friend (maybe something like with the 2Christ?)

Anyway, whatever thing happen will probally happen in the next ch.
Also I can see Saten let Yamada do whatever he want just to see what happen next XD
We've already seen Yamada take pity on the creatures Mengroze created so I could also imagine Yamada at some point protecting the angel(as strange as it may seem) He is afterall compassionate and has already shown he can look past the appearance of "monsters".
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Old 2013-04-10, 15:50   Link #10115
Soji
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Ynot@ Good point,I have not thought this.
I can totally see something like this happen and ,I have to admit would be really interesting see what would happen from something like this.
How the Angel would react ?
How his(Yamada) friends would react?
How Saten and Gido would react ?

Now I really want this to happen.
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Old 2013-04-10, 15:59   Link #10116
Kurohane
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^ True, it is within Cruz's character. However, protect it from who is the question? If Saten has no intention of absrobing it, that leaves . . .
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Old 2013-04-10, 16:12   Link #10117
K. Shiruto
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Originally Posted by Kurohane View Post
^ True, it is within Cruz's character. However, protect it from who is the question? If Saten has no intention of absrobing it, that leaves . . .
Yep. Saten won't get in the way, and Gido has no interest too. That leaves Blade, and the thought of Yamada confronting him to protect the angel is no less than thrilling. How Eve would react at such development? She and everybody there know Yamada has zero chance to even push back Blade a little, and whenever someone gets hin his way, Blade won't hesitate to beat that person to a bloody pulp, even if it means to kill.
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Old 2013-04-10, 16:31   Link #10118
Ynot
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You know, this obviously is all very speculative to say the least, but wouldn't it be the ultimate character development for Cruz? Standing up against Blade(his "Father" )
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Old 2013-04-10, 17:04   Link #10119
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If this happens it will be interesting too see how Saten reacts.
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Old 2013-04-10, 17:35   Link #10120
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That makes me think back to those pages right after the explosion at the Simeon Blackspot HQ, where Cruz and Blade have an interlude. I've always thought that was a little odd to just randomly be there.
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